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  #701  
Old 12-13-2014, 10:07 AM
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How many European Royals went to Charles and Camilla wedding? I don't remember any of them being polite like so many in this thread claim and going.

Royals not going to a future British Royal funerals wouldn't create any outrage with the British public. Simply b/c a) they don't know who they are and b)there would be enough politicians and British public figure that the Continental Royals won't even rate.

People were complaining about how the British TV didn't show any of the European Royals that went.
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  #702  
Old 12-13-2014, 10:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Alondra View Post
It's a storm in a teacup until they are on the receiving end. Would be interesting to watch future british royal funerals attended only by European ambassadors.


That´s exactly the point: WOULD be interesting to watch, but we all know this won´t happen! Even if so, all I´d do is regret that I didn´t see my favourite royals from Norway or Greece. But that´s that.
As I stated before, the Royals themselves don´t seem to mind, it´s always the "watchers" to do so.
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  #703  
Old 12-13-2014, 10:17 AM
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Honestly, the british public wouldn't notice if european royals were absent at a funeral of QEII or PP.

The british public know their own royals and only their own royals. When the old couple dies, there will be a strong emotional reaction and the brits couldn't care less if there was a queen of denmark or a king of spain present. 95% of people don't even know that those countries are kingdoms.

Only because DM posts nice pictures of Mary, Letizia or Maxima doesnt mean the public knows who they are. Royals of other countries are kind of celebrities for them, if at all.
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  #704  
Old 12-13-2014, 10:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post
I am late to this thread and I have to say the only reason for absence that works for me is the political one. I can easily believe that the government for whatever reason advised not to attend and the BRF followed suit.

If not, I would be shocked if the BRF didn't sent a member because they were all busy what it total BS. I can't believe a spokesperson for the BRF confirmed something like that (I hope only to cover the political angle).
Agree with this post, as I am certain the Foreign Office advised not to send a member of the Royal Family (after all, the FO pays the bills for official representation, don't forget!). It was indeed a bad call, but perhaps the choice was between the devil and the deep blue sea. What would Daily Mail readers (for example) have said if Princess Michael or Countess Sophie had attended the funeral (air miles .....)
On another note, several interesting points have been made in this thread about monarchies in the 21st century. Perhaps indeed the British royal family is being positioned for survival in their own country/commonwealth so that the fraternity of monarchy is being laid bare for all to see. After all, the BRF was also notably absent at the death of the Russian tsar and his family.
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  #705  
Old 12-13-2014, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by miche View Post
If you wanted to know the reaction of the British people, the daily mail was not the right place to go
Daily Mail and the comments has been mentioned in this thread a couple of times and that's why I read them.

Do you mean, that negative opinions and criticism of the BRF, which are written in a perfectly civilized, matter-of-fact way, should be dismissed because it's Daily Mail?
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  #706  
Old 12-13-2014, 11:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Lady Marlboro View Post
I was wondering if the UK/EU disagreements had anything to do with this matter. The Palace would have to come up with a tactful reason instead of just being able to say the FO said no. Politicians can be really stupid at times and create more problems just because they are trying to make a point. Wasn't there a situation around one of QEII's jubilees where the Spanish government wouldn't let Queen Sofia go to the luncheon because Edward and Sophie were going to Gibraltar as part of the jubilee celebration?
I personally think that the political problems are a rubbish excuse. It is amusing to see the supposedly enlightened Europeans settling accounts in public. The concept "keep appearances" is alien to them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by miche View Post
How many European Royals went to Charles and Camilla wedding? I don't remember any of them being polite like so many in this thread claim and going.... [snipped]
A fair number of royals attended the wedding of Prince Charles and Lady Diana Spencer. It was the main wedding. They also attended the wedding of Prince William and Ms Catherine Middleton. I do not see any reason for the continental royals to attend the wedding of Prince Charles and his long-term paramour.
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  #707  
Old 12-13-2014, 11:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miche View Post
How many European Royals went to Charles and Camilla wedding? I don't remember any of them being polite like so many in this thread claim and going.

Royals not going to a future British Royal funerals wouldn't create any outrage with the British public. Simply b/c a) they don't know who they are and b)there would be enough politicians and British public figure that the Continental Royals won't even rate.

People were complaining about how the British TV didn't show any of the European Royals that went.
And thereby highlighting the isolationist/elitist/arrogant/ignorant attitude being attributed (whether it's true or not). Also, it's one thing for the British public not to know "who they are", but quite another for the British royals not to.
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  #708  
Old 12-13-2014, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
Well, Royal Norway, I admittedly don't follow the BRF that closely.

However, I cannot imagine QEII accepting more than one, perhaps two "I don't wanna go" from other members of the BRF before a request turns into an order.
I'll be more willing to accept a reasoning along these lines: Well, we haven't got someone appropriately senior enough available to attend this funeral, so better to send the ambassador than being represented by a secondary member of the BRF. - To be honest I don't really believe that one either.

But, as you seem to suggest, I believe QEII's advisors let her down on this occasion. Knowing (at least a few days later) that there would be senior representation from all other European monarchies, let alone Japan, they ought to have advised QEII to send a member of the BRF
In hindsight this was a mistake that could and should have easily been avoided.
Depending on the issue and the mood, whether or not QEII is the ultimate decision maker in the BRF changes - sometimes people say ultimately she rules the family (with or without an iron fist), other times people say that she does things democratically.

We don't actually know the reason that there was no representative at the funeral. We have theories, some that make some degree of sense, others that don't, but some of the claims of British arrogance and demands for boycotts and the like are just ridiculous. This was a blunder, I agree, but it's not the end of the world and without any real explanation of why the decision was made we can't really say much.
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  #709  
Old 12-13-2014, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Molly2101 View Post
I think it's quite bad for the BRF to not send anyone but if they are going to use the "political issues" excuse then so be it. It's quite bad to see no one attend considering the amount of royals who came to the Queen Mother's funeral.

As Majesty Magazine said, out of the 15 working British royals only two had engagements...what were the other 13 doing?

I am not surprised it didn't go unnoticed rominet09 and it will likely be mentioned many times in the future as poor show on the British part.
Okay, well let's actually look at who these people are.

The "15 working British royals" are presumably QEII, the DoE, the PoW, the Duchess of Cornwall, the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge, Prince Harry, the Duke of York, the Earl and Countess of Wessex, the Princess Royal, the Duke and Duchess of Gloucester, the Duke of Kent, and Princess Alexandra.

QEII doesn't typically travel anymore. Even when she did travel, she didn't typically attend funerals outside of her immediate family. Times when she's traveled outside of Britain in the last few years or attended a funeral for a non-family member are the exception.

The DoE is 93. While he is still seen traveling a bit, it's still not a lot. However short the flight to Belgium may have been, it may still have been more than the DoE (or his doctors) felt he was up to at this time.

The PoW had engagements. The Duchess of Cornwall doesn't seem to typically represent the BRF at foreign events without her husband. She also tends to make fewer overseas trips as well.

The Duke of Cambridge had engagements. The Duchess of Cambridge is pregnant and may very well have felt unable to make a second overseas trip in a rather short period of time - she did just get back from the US - while pregnant and without her husband. Neither of them are full time royals.

Prince Harry is also not a full time royal and has a job. We don't know that he was able to get the time off from his military responsibilities on such short notice.

The Duke of York didn't have any engagements on the online CC so he could potentially have gone, but the online CC is rather notorious for not updating everything this year. Likewise with the Earl and Countess of Wessex. The Princess Royal, however, did have an engagement according to the CC.

The Duke and Duchess of Gloucester probably could have attended... but let's be honest, if he had been sent people would still be upset about the so-called snubbing of the BRF. Likewise with the Duke of Kent or Princess Alexandra - both who have been cutting down their engagements in recent years due to their health problems.
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  #710  
Old 12-13-2014, 01:53 PM
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Ish,

I would only have been upset with the sending of a "lesser" Royal if it had NOT been made clear that no senior Royal had an engagement that absolutely could not have been rescheduled. Frankly this was not the case. I cannot forget that the PoW cancelled an appearance at Clarence House with one of his charities in Oct 2011 so that he could fly off to the Middle East to attend the obsequies of some minor Saudi prince. He had Kate pinch hit for him. The MIDDLE EAST, mind you not even nearly as close as Brussels is to London.

Since the Gloucesters recently met with King Philippe and Queen Mathilde in London they would have been perfectly acceptable to be sent to Brussels and frankly the Duchess of Cornwall would have been even more acceptable. Why not?

Even the Catholic Lord and Lady Nicholas Windsor would have been a very suitable and appropriate representative of HM if not even one of the engagements of the senior Brit Royals could have been rescheduled.

But sorry, I just don't believe that was the case here.
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  #711  
Old 12-13-2014, 01:56 PM
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Iv'e just watched some of Queen Fabiola's funeral and it was solemn and dignified as well as moving. If the British had sent someone it would have been the right thing to do but it wouldn't have added anything to the proceedings. The British Royals are the most boring now when it comes to splendour whether it be by chance or design and if I were a European Royal I think I could take them or leave them. The younger generation like Prince William would probably prefer it like that anyway.
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  #712  
Old 12-13-2014, 02:14 PM
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Ok so, in this thread, we've started to denounce the British people as arrogant, ignorant and elitist. Not just the royal family, but the British population as a whole! What a horrible lot we all are!
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  #713  
Old 12-13-2014, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
Ish,

I would only have been upset with the sending of a "lesser" Royal if it had NOT been made clear that no senior Royal had an engagement that absolutely could not have been rescheduled. Frankly this was not the case. I cannot forget that the PoW cancelled an appearance at Clarence House with one of his charities in Oct 2011 so that he could fly off to the Middle East to attend the obsequies of some minor Saudi prince. He had Kate pinch hit for him. The MIDDLE EAST, mind you not even nearly as close as Brussels is to London.

Since the Gloucesters recently met with King Philippe and Queen Mathilde in London they would have been perfectly acceptable to be sent to Brussels and frankly the Duchess of Cornwall would have been even more acceptable. Why not?

Even the Catholic Lord and Lady Nicholas Windsor would have been a very suitable and appropriate representative of HM if not even one of the engagements of the senior Brit Royals could have been rescheduled.

But sorry, I just don't believe that was the case here.
Your observations are very accurate.
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  #714  
Old 12-13-2014, 02:36 PM
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I've stated my view on the non-attendance of British Royals at this occasion earlier in this thread, so I won't reiterate them now, but I would say that as a keen observer of the political scene here, it is INCONCEIVABLE that UKIPs opinion of the EU would have influenced the Foreign Office to forbid a presence at this Funeral. The FO is more than aware that the late Queen held a position in Belgium [the nation State], and NOT in the organisation of individual states that is the EU..
UKIP holds just two seats in Parliament, [and threatens to hold more after June 2015], it simply doesn't have that level of influence on departments of state.
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  #715  
Old 12-13-2014, 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by PetticoatLane View Post
Ok so, in this thread, we've started to denounce the British people as arrogant, ignorant and elitist. Not just the royal family, but the British population as a whole! What a horrible lot we all are!
I don't think so at all, Petticoat Junction. Quite the contrary. Most Brits I have met in person are delightful, hilarious, down to earth folk.

As in most countries however the populace and the people who represent/govern them are not always quite equal to one another.
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  #716  
Old 12-13-2014, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by PetticoatLane View Post
Ok so, in this thread, we've started to denounce the British people as arrogant, ignorant and elitist. Not just the royal family, but the British population as a whole! What a horrible lot we all are!
No, the comment was in response to a specific post stating that the British people don't know who Fabiola was. I stated such attitude gives credit to the impression that… you fill in the rest. Of course not every single person in britain is arrogant, ignorant and elitist. Don't get so alarmed.
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  #717  
Old 12-13-2014, 03:05 PM
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I personally would have liked to have seen Prince Andrew or Prince Edward attend. If you take 4 hours out of the day for attending and travel then if you had another engagement then several days previously it might not be too difficult to shift the time of that engagement to suit.
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  #718  
Old 12-13-2014, 03:10 PM
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Someone upthread mentioned that the Duchess of Cornwall would not have been a logical choice ( doesn't typically go overseas without her husband on these sort of visits). Whyever not? She's the second lady of the land and presumably the next Queen Consort. She would have been the perfect person to send to this royal occasion. I do think she had an event yesterday, though.
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  #719  
Old 12-13-2014, 03:30 PM
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We may or may not find out what the reasons were. It looks like we are going in circles here. I understand that this is a question of great interest and there are many meaningful posts here. But - and this is just my very personal opinion - I would find it out of proportion if the thread on Fabiola`s actual funeral will be shorter than this thread in the end.
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  #720  
Old 12-13-2014, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Chimene View Post
No, the comment was in response to a specific post stating that the British people don't know who Fabiola was. I stated such attitude gives credit to the impression that… you fill in the rest. Of course not every single person in britain is arrogant, ignorant and elitist. Don't get so alarmed.
It's not an "attitude", it's a fact. In the UK the other royal families are simply not known except by a very small minority. They're rarely covered in the media, we don't learn about them at school, they don't affect our lives in any way. There's a reason Margrethe of Denmark and Sofia of Spain apparently go to London every year for Christmas shopping and it's not because the shopping is so much better than in Paris or Madrid or Berlin. It's because they can do so knowing the chances of them being recognised are almost nil.

The UK is one of the most international countries in the world. We've been trading and travelling and engaging with the world for hundreds of years. We don't, however, identify ourselves particularly as 'European'. We don't really see ourselves as having more in common with Belgians or Austrians than we do with Canadians, Australians or even Americans.
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