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  #581  
Old 03-16-2016, 06:33 PM
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IMO, the Queen expects the women to be devoted to royal life before giving them the RFO or other honors.

Princess Anne was not made Princess Royal until after she gave up her equestrian/jockey career.
She did not receive the RFO until 1969, in her 2nd year doing royal duties.

Sophie did not receive her RFO until she gave up her PR career and then had to wait the 2 years.

Camilla also received the RFO after 2 years of royal duties.

Sarah never received it because throughout her marriage she had a writing career. She never gave up her career so she never received the RFO

Diana received it right away because she never had a career. She is the only one that did not have to wait 2 years. She probably did not receive the GCVO because she was expected to wait 7 years or maybe 9 years to make up for not waiting for the RFO.

Princess Michael never received the RFO, because she too never gave up her career nor was she a 'full time' royal.

Catherine may not have crossed the 'full time' threshold.

There appears to be a pattern of wait after receiving the RFO to receive Dame Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order (GCVO)..

Daughter and Daughter-in-laws
Princess Anne
RFO 1969
GCVO 1974
(5 years)

Camilla
RFO 2007
GCVO 2012
(5 years)

Sophie
RFO 2004
GCVO 2010
(6 years)

Cousin
Princess Alexandra
RFO 1953
GCVO 1960
(7 years)

Cousin-in-law
Katharine
RFO 1961
GCVO 1977
(16 years)

Birgitte
RFO 1973
GCVO 1989
(16 years)

Princess Anne had to wait 13 years for next honor after receiving the GCVO.

Princess Anne had to wait 20 years after receiving the GCVO to receive the Order of the Garter.
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  #582  
Old 03-16-2016, 07:23 PM
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The Queen makes up the time when to give the family an order. I think The Queen wait too long to give out orders though.

I hope she would be the one to give Catherine the GCVO. If not, Catherine will get it before Charles's Coronation.
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  #583  
Old 05-12-2016, 11:30 AM
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With only a few weeks to the Queen's Official birthday, do we think Catherine will get a family order this time? I'm hoping so and think it is likely after the success of the recent tour.
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  #584  
Old 05-12-2016, 12:12 PM
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They don't announced awarding a RFO. Just have to wear it to confirm receiving it


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  #585  
Old 05-12-2016, 12:14 PM
Dman's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elly C View Post
With only a few weeks to the Queen's Official birthday, do we think Catherine will get a family order this time? I'm hoping so and think it is likely after the success of the recent tour.
I do expect that Catherine have recieved the family order. The Royal Family Order of Queen Elizabeth II isn't an knighthood, so we won't get an announcement if she have received it. The only way we know she got it is when she attends at State Banquet and Diplomatic Corps Reception where the family order is worn.

Catherine is the only senior female member of the royal family that's up for a knighthood from The Queen. I hope she will be appointed with the Dame Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order (GCVO), or Dame of Justice Venerable Order of Saint John (DJStJ). She have served The Queen and Royal family for 5 years and provided two heirs to the throne. I think she should be honored as a working senior royal.
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  #586  
Old 05-12-2016, 05:22 PM
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I think it cheapens the award when an Order is given out to a new royal as soon as they get married. The Danes and Swedes, for example, do this all the time and I think it's silly as it really should be something that is earned or it can't mean anything. On the other hand I think Queen Elizabeth does make family wait an unnecessarily long period of time. Charlene Wittstock was married in the same year as Kate and received her order about a year and a half after her marriage which I think was about right.
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  #587  
Old 05-12-2016, 05:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sophie25 View Post
I think it cheapens the award when an Order is given out to a new royal as soon as they get married. The Danes and Swedes, for example, do this all the time and I think it's silly as it really should be something that is earned or it can't mean anything. On the other hand I think Queen Elizabeth does make family wait an unnecessarily long period of time. Charlene Wittstock was married in the same year as Kate and received her order about a year and a half after her marriage which I think was about right.
I see your point, about how it cheapens it. But it does avoid the "they are not worthy" speculations. They litarly become "now you're part of the royal family" which they are and are already working for them so it makes sense.
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  #588  
Old 05-12-2016, 05:35 PM
Iluvbertie's Avatar
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There is nothing planned for the birthday celebrations that would allow us to see whether she has the RFO. We only see whether they have it at things like State Dinners.
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  #589  
Old 05-12-2016, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dman View Post
Catherine is the only senior female member of the royal family that's up for a knighthood from The Queen. I hope she will be appointed with the Dame Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order (GCVO), or Dame of Justice Venerable Order of Saint John (DJStJ). She have served The Queen and Royal family for 5 years and provided two heirs to the throne. I think she should be honored as a working senior royal.
I don't know if she is considered a senior member of the family or not but Princess Michael has not received a knighthood or the family order. I know she is not always well liked but she and her husband have worked on behalf of the queen. It seems she is intentionally being left out when it comes to these things.
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  #590  
Old 05-12-2016, 05:54 PM
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There is a State Visit coming up in the fall, and then there's the Diplomatic Corps reception in December. She should have the RFO, by now though. I think Royal Victorian Order would also be due.

I just think it's time for her to have an honor. Why continue to let her attend State events bare of Orders? Don't make much sense to me.
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  #591  
Old 05-12-2016, 05:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Noble Consort Ming View Post
I don't know if she is considered a senior member of the family or not but Princess Michael has not received a knighthood or the family order. I know she is not always well liked but she and her husband have worked on behalf of the queen. It seems she is intentionally being left out when it comes to these things.
As the RFO is exactly what its called, a family order and not ever publicized, perhaps the reason why Princess Michael has never received the RFO are because of the Queen's own personal reasons. We'll never know.
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  #592  
Old 05-13-2016, 07:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dman View Post
There is a State Visit coming up in the fall, and then there's the Diplomatic Corps reception in December. She should have the RFO, by now though. I think Royal Victorian Order would also be due.

I just think it's time for her to have an honor. Why continue to let her attend State events bare of Orders? Don't make much sense to me.
Not sure I see the connection between attending events of state and receiving orders. She will receive the Orders when Hm thinks she has done enough to deserve them.

She could well have received the RFO recently, but I think if will be a while before she receives the RVO. Camilla did not receive hers till her 7th wedding anniversary, and nearly 5-6 years after she had received the RFO.
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  #593  
Old 05-13-2016, 08:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elly C View Post
With only a few weeks to the Queen's Official birthday, do we think Catherine will get a family order this time? I'm hoping so and think it is likely after the success of the recent tour.
How did you measure the "succes" of the recent tour? The Daily Mail being extactic about Kate's dresses while a week earlier she was slashed down as a Duchess Do-Little? Is that a measurement? The RFO seems not connected to anything, not to seniority, not to merits but just to the very personal consideration of the Queen.
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  #594  
Old 05-13-2016, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
How did you measure the "succes" of the recent tour? The Daily Mail being extactic about Kate's dresses while a week earlier she was slashed down as a Duchess Do-Little? Is that a measurement? The RFO seems not connected to anything, not to seniority, not to merits but just to the very personal consideration of the Queen.
I agree. The Queen can give it to whoever she wants whenever she wants but she's the first Monarch to make family members wait for it. In the past existing royal ladies and ladies marrying into the family got it automatically and when a reign changed they got the new monarch's order straight away as well. It was an indicator that you were royal and wasn't seen as something that had to be earned. I wish it was like that again today as the Queen as other orders which can be seen as awards such as the royal victoriana order.

I also think it is a little bit mean of the Queen not to have given it to Princess Michael after almost 40 years in the family. She might have her own career but she's still done a fair bit if work for the family during that time and I'm sure Prince Michael would like to see her have it as well Jmo.
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  #595  
Old 05-13-2016, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by sophie25 View Post
I agree. The Queen can give it to whoever she wants whenever she wants but she's the first Monarch to make family members wait for it. In the past existing royal ladies and ladies marrying into the family got it automatically and when a reign changed they got the new monarch's order straight away as well. It was an indicator that you were royal and wasn't seen as something that had to be earned. I wish it was like that again today as the Queen as other orders which can be seen as awards such as the royal victoriana order.

I also think it is a little bit mean of the Queen not to have given it to Princess Michael after almost 40 years in the family. She might have her own career but she's still done a fair bit if work for the family during that time and I'm sure Prince Michael would like to see her have it as well Jmo.
I guess Princess Michael didn't receive it because her husband was excluded from the order of sucession by marrying her. Technically they are not full time working members of the BRF.
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  #596  
Old 05-13-2016, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Nico View Post
I guess Princess Michael didn't receive it because her husband was excluded from the order of sucession by marrying her. Technically they are not full time working members of the BRF.
I don't think so because the Queen has given Prince Michael the royal victorian order amongst other awards. The reality is that if she wanted PM to get it she would give it to her as it is entirely within her personal gift. It's also very possible that she may give one to all of her granddaughters as a keepsake even though they may never wear it. As I said, the Queen can give this order to whoever she wants.
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  #597  
Old 05-13-2016, 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by sophie25 View Post
I think it cheapens the award when an Order is given out to a new royal as soon as they get married. The Danes and Swedes, for example, do this all the time and I think it's silly as it really should be something that is earned or it can't mean anything. On the other hand I think Queen Elizabeth does make family wait an unnecessarily long period of time. Charlene Wittstock was married in the same year as Kate and received her order about a year and a half after her marriage which I think was about right.
I agree. The idea of pinning a sash onto a months old baby is plainly absurd.

Equally, I'm not exactly sure what service Mary Donaldson had performed for Denmark when she got her order before her wedding, let alone that of her father who also got an order.
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  #598  
Old 05-13-2016, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by PetticoatLane View Post
I agree. The idea of pinning a sash onto a months old baby is plainly absurd.

Equally, I'm not exactly sure what service Mary Donaldson had performed for Denmark when she got her order before her wedding, let alone that of her father who also got an order.
It's not for service in those cases. It's a "this person is a member of the royal family" badge. Different ways for different countries. No need to put down one way to lift up another.
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  #599  
Old 05-13-2016, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sophie25 View Post
I think it cheapens the award when an Order is given out to a new royal as soon as they get married. The Danes and Swedes, for example, do this all the time and I think it's silly as it really should be something that is earned or it can't mean anything. On the other hand I think Queen Elizabeth does make family wait an unnecessarily long period of time. Charlene Wittstock was married in the same year as Kate and received her order about a year and a half after her marriage which I think was about right.


Royal Family Orders, different from other orders, are traditionally given as a mark of belonging to a RF, not as a sign of merit. In the old times it meant a special sign of affection of the sovereign towards a royal lady of his/ her house. So it DID mean something, no matter if she did, earned, something for crown and country or not!
The BRF does have some sort of odd order policy in general; I recall King Albert II never receiving the Garter. The Queen Mother only used her british orders at an incoming state visit and obviously turned down the guest´s order. Queen consorts are never awarded with an order by the british Queen while mere Prince consorts are given the Royal Victorian order (only because of being male?!?). Foreign future Kings don´t receive brit. orders as well although the Queen paid a state visit in the country (example: Norway), etc etc etc ......
What I´m trying to say: The british order policy is unlogic and not transparent. A lot of guessing, nobody knows for sure...
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  #600  
Old 05-13-2016, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by hernameispekka View Post
It's not for service in those cases. It's a "this person is a member of the royal family" badge. Different ways for different countries. No need to put down one way to lift up another.
Well her father isn't a member of the royal family and the order of the elephant in Denmark, for example, actually isn't restricted to royals and is given to other people who have served the country with distinction. I think the order of the seraphim isn't exclusively for royals either.
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