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  #381  
Old 12-09-2012, 07:57 AM
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That is perfectly possible unless the various realms all pass the legislation at the same time - and that is only part of what the committee in NZ is working towards - a piece of legislation that can be passed in each realm at the same time so that the possibility of the realms having split monarchs is avoided.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren View Post
I think initially it was announced that male primogeniture would be abolished for those born after October 2011. Now that appears to have been tightened and limited to descendants of Charles only.

I have actually read it the other way round - initially this was only to affect Charles' descendents but now it is to apply to all descendents born after 2011.
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  #382  
Old 12-13-2012, 03:01 PM
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A law fit for a Queen: new succession legislation published:
A law fit for a Queen: new succession legislation published - UK - News - London Evening Standard

Royal succession bill published:
BBC News - Royal succession bill published
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  #383  
Old 12-13-2012, 03:13 PM
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Official version: Succession to the Crown Bill 2012-13 — UK Parliament

The bill is amazingly short and comprehensive. Well done.

Will there be such debate in Parliament over this matter? What's the current thought on dissent about the bill?
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  #384  
Old 12-13-2012, 03:27 PM
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This bill is for the UK only but there will be similiar ones with similiar wording in the other realms.
Politicians can move fast when they have to
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  #385  
Old 12-13-2012, 03:38 PM
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That is much more succinct than I expected! I like that they went for children born after October 28, 2011, as opposed to only the descendants of The Prince of Wales. It's much more tidy this way. So when this is passed, it would mean that Tane Lewis would move below his older sister Sienna, as he was born in 2012.

Also, I assume this means that Prince Michael, The Earl of St Andrews, etc will now be in the line of succession? I think that's great.
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  #386  
Old 12-13-2012, 03:51 PM
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No. This law only covers gender. It doesn't cover the rule that heirs can't marry a Catholic or be a Catholic. Prince Michael married one, as did the Earl of St. Andrews.
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  #387  
Old 12-13-2012, 05:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suztav View Post
No. This law only covers gender. It doesn't cover the rule that heirs can't marry a Catholic or be a Catholic. Prince Michael married one, as did the Earl of St. Andrews.
Section 2 of this bill concerns the "Removal of disqualification arising from marriage to a Roman Catholic" and specifically states that all persons previously excluded from the line of succession due to this disqualification will be reinstated to the line of succession, provided they are still alive. So they both are back in.
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  #388  
Old 12-13-2012, 06:19 PM
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You might want to reread that bill. Papalist are in vogue again. Oh, poor Henry! Rattling in St. George's Chapel tonight.
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  #389  
Old 12-13-2012, 06:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by padams2359 View Post
You might want to reread that bill. Papalist are in vogue again. Oh, poor Henry! Rattling in St. George's Chapel tonight.
Romanists will never be the sovereigns, only the sovereign's consorts
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  #390  
Old 12-13-2012, 06:47 PM
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Yeah, that is what I said.

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Originally Posted by padams2359 View Post
Yeah, that is what I said.
The bill says 'Papalist". Do we need to contact the Vatican?
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  #391  
Old 12-13-2012, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by padams2359 View Post
The bill says 'Papalist". Do we need to contact the Vatican?
Romanist, papalist, they're all the same to me.
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  #392  
Old 12-13-2012, 07:23 PM
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So this means that the monarch's consort or future consort must agree that their child is brought up Anglican , and if they don't that child, as a catholic will be passed over as monarch.

Have I understood it correctly?
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  #393  
Old 12-13-2012, 07:27 PM
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This is my understanding. The sovereign MUST be in communion with the Church of England or Church of Canada as it is over here lol

PM Stephen Harper of Canada said this today and David Cameron was quoted a few months ago stating the King or Queen must be an Anglican

PM Harper will shoot the whole thing down if the catholic exclusion is removed
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  #394  
Old 12-13-2012, 07:42 PM
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The monarch MUST be Anglican - as one of their positins is Supreme Governor of the Church of England. You can't have a Supreme Governor of the Church of England who isn't CoE (it would be like having a Pope who isn't RC).

Anyone who is a RC is still out for this reason but being married to one will be acceptable when this new legislation is eventually past.

It will be interesting to see how long it takes to pass in the UK and then in the other realms as that could be quite interesting if one realm doesn't pass the changes and thus splits the monarchy.

To pass this law it will still have to have the normal proceedings through the Parliament which involves three readings in each house, discussions in committee and has to pass both houses with exactly the same wording. Only one piece of legislation has ever done so in one day and that was the Abdication Act in 1936. This could take a very short period of time or longer, depending on objections and whether or not it leads to raising the debate on becoming a republic.
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  #395  
Old 12-13-2012, 07:45 PM
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Thank you. I didn't know about the Canadian PM proviso. As a secure underpinning, it would be preferable that the 2nd in line ( or as we have now 3rd in line ) made this commitment.

Also please excuse rubbish typing. I'm on an iPad with predictive text and I'm making some classic errors. Just spotted elsewhere the use of levitated insad of alleviated - oops
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  #396  
Old 12-13-2012, 07:53 PM
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Canada blocks Cameron

PM Harper is a true conservative Tory and his heart just isn't in this. He only reluctantly came on board for the very narrow issue of equal primogeniture because of lobbying from New Zealand

However, Canadian Prime Minister Stephen Harper has effectively blocked any reform of the Act of Settlement, which would permit a Roman Catholic to become the head of the Church of England.

In a campaign stop in Yellowknife in the Northwest Territories, Mr. Harper said Canadians were not prepared debate on the Act of Settlement.

In response to constituent’s question about the royal marriage and the succession, Mr. Harper said on April 20 “the successor to the throne is a man. The next successor to the throne is a man.”

“I don’t think Canadians want to open a debate on the monarchy or constitutional matters at this time,” he noted, adding, “that’s our position, and I just don’t see that as a priority for Canadians right now, at all.”

Without Canada’s support, the Act of Settlement cannot be amended
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  #397  
Old 12-13-2012, 08:12 PM
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Duke - if you read the bill - it covers Britain, Scotland and N Ireland. It's the Parliament part of the issue and it does not resolve anything for the rest of the Commonwealth.
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  #398  
Old 12-13-2012, 08:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdmirerUS View Post
Duke - if you read the bill - it covers Britain, Scotland and N Ireland. It's the Parliament part of the issue and it does not resolve anything for the rest of the Commonwealth.
I know but eventually all 16 realms will need to be in agreement or all of this is for nothing and Canada will shoot down the entire show if there is any language allowing Catholics near the throne. Unlike in the UK, Canada has a strong conservative majority government and doesn't need to makes deals with the devil, like Cameron must do

Much work to be done yet
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  #399  
Old 12-13-2012, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Excalibur View Post
Section 2 of this bill concerns the "Removal of disqualification arising from marriage to a Roman Catholic" and specifically states that all persons previously excluded from the line of succession due to this disqualification will be reinstated to the line of succession, provided they are still alive. So they both are back in.
I happily stand corrected. And to the poster who said that "... they are all alike ..." GROW UP! You live in the 21st Century

I wouldn't expect that a Catholic could be the Monarch/Head of the Church of England. Kinda like a Lutheran heading up the Vatican. Everybody needs to calm down, take a breath, and grow up!
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  #400  
Old 12-13-2012, 08:56 PM
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There is no intention to allow a RC to be the monarch, only the spouse.

However if the UK passes this bill and Canada doesn't - and the first child is a girl and then a boy - then the boy will be heir to Canada while the girl will be heir to the UK.

My understanding is that the act won't take effect in one realm until it is passed in all of them but...that mightn't be the case at all and Canada may end up with a different monarch to the rest of the realms.
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