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  #201  
Old 04-24-2013, 12:56 AM
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I don't think there is anything to stop William from naming a first born female child Princess of Wales in her own right. The Duchy of Cornwall could be a different problem since that would require Parliament to amend the Letters Patent.
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  #202  
Old 04-24-2013, 01:31 AM
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Heirs apparent and heirs presumptive will still exist under the new legislation when it takes effect whenever that will be.

An heir apparent can't be replaced e.g. Charles is the heir apparent.

William is Charles 'heir apparent'.

Harry is William's heir presumptive and will soon drop to being William's child's heir presumptive.

The difference that this legislation makes is that no longer will a child be replaced by a younger sibling but others in the line will still be presumptive heirs as they will still be able to be replaced in the line of succession.

The monarch could name their heir Princess of Wales although when that possibility was raised by George VI the answer back was that the title 'Princess of Wales' is for the wife of the Prince of Wales - not cast in law of course but an interpretation none the less.
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  #203  
Old 04-24-2013, 02:03 AM
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You're right, Bertie. I stand corrected.
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  #204  
Old 04-24-2013, 02:21 AM
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So many interesting issues are arising as a result of this change regarding the succession.

A possibility is for a future male heir to become "The Crown Prince of Wales" allowing for his wife to be made a princess in her own right and known as Princess (blank) of Wales, with a female heir being known as "The Crown Princess of Wales", with her husband being made a prince in his own right and known as Prince (blank) of Wales. Princess (blank) could, all going well, eventually become Princess (blank), The Princess Consort, and Prince (blank) could become Prince (blank), The Prince Consort.
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  #205  
Old 04-24-2013, 10:50 AM
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When Charles becomes King, do William and Catherine become Prince and Princess of Wales?

Case Histories
King Edward VII, King George V were both Prince of Wales before becoming Kings in their own right.
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  #206  
Old 04-24-2013, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by angieuk View Post
When Charles becomes King, do William and Catherine become Prince and Princess of Wales?

Case Histories
King Edward VII, King George V were both Prince of Wales before becoming Kings in their own right.
Its not an automatic thing. It will depend on if Charles wants to create William the Prince of Wales.
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  #207  
Old 04-24-2013, 10:56 AM
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When Charles becomes King, do William and Catherine become Prince and Princess of Wales?

Case Histories
King Edward VII, King George V were both Prince of Wales before becoming Kings in their own right.
It is not automatic but is within the gift of the monarch. William automatically becomes Duke of Cornwall. It is expected that he will become Prince of Wales but, for example, in the case of George V he became PoW after c. 6months.
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  #208  
Old 04-24-2013, 11:07 AM
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Does that mean that William and Catherine will be known as Duke and Duchess of Cornwall when Charles is King?? Where does that leave Cambridge?

King George V Prince of Wales after 6 months automatically? Do you mean 1901 after his father became King Edward VII?

As I remember King Edward VIII having to be created Prince of Wales (1911) but I don't remember George V or Edward VII having any such investiture in Wales?

Sorry, am feeling a bit confused??
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  #209  
Old 04-24-2013, 11:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by angieuk View Post
Does that mean that William and Catherine will be known as Duke and Duchess of Cornwall when Charles is King?? Where does that leave Cambridge?
They will be The Duke and Duchess of Cornwall and Cambridge.

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Originally Posted by angieuk View Post
King George V Prince of Wales after 6 months automatically? Do you mean 1901 after his father became King Edward VII?
In November 1901, George was created Prince of Wales and Earl of Chester.

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Originally Posted by angieuk View Post
As I remember King Edward VIII having to be created Prince of Wales (1911) but I don't remember George V or Edward VII having any such investiture in Wales?
An investiture is not required to become Prince of Wales, it is a title granted by the Monarch and can be done at anytime, anywhere.
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  #210  
Old 04-24-2013, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by angieuk View Post
Does that mean that William and Catherine will be known as Duke and Duchess of Cornwall when Charles is King?? Where does that leave Cambridge?

King George V Prince of Wales after 6 months automatically? Do you mean 1901 after his father became King Edward VII?

As I remember King Edward VIII having to be created Prince of Wales (1911) but I don't remember George V or Edward VII having any such investiture in Wales?

Sorry, am feeling a bit confused??
The title of Prince of Wales is not automatic and neither is an investiture. EVII made George (later GV) PoW after c. 6 months of being King. It is entirely up to the monarch.

The heir to the throne is automatically Duke of Cornwall on the accession to the throne of the monarch. Example is when EVII became King, George became Duke of Cornwall and York (he was previously Duke of York). Rather a long title and he was generally known as Duke of Cornwall.

William will become Duke of Cornwall and Cambridge. But again it's a bit long and will probably just be known as the D of Cornwall. assuming he becomes PoW, Duke of Cornwall will be his secondary title as it is currently with Charles.
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  #211  
Old 04-24-2013, 11:24 AM
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The heir to the throne is automatically Duke of Cornwall on the accession to the throne of the monarch. Example is when EVII became King, George became Duke of Cornwall and York (he was previously Duke of York). Rather a long title and he was generally known as Duke of Cornwall.
The heir to the throne is not always automatically Duke of Cornwall. The Duke of Cornwall is always the monarch's eldest son who is also the heir to the throne. If Charles were to die before his mother then there would be no Duke of Cornwall as the monarch's eldest son would not be the heir to the throne. When the requirements for the title are met then it is automatic.
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  #212  
Old 04-24-2013, 11:29 AM
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The heir to the throne is not always automatically Duke of Cornwall. The Duke of Cornwall is always the monarch's eldest son who is also the heir to the throne. If Charles were to die before his mother then there would be no Duke of Cornwall as the monarch's eldest son would not be the heir to the throne. When the requirements for the title are met then it is automatic.
Thanks for that, but in the natural order of things, it would be as I stated.
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  #213  
Old 04-24-2013, 11:53 AM
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Thanks so much everyone!

Do I take it then that there is no room for doubt that Camilla will be Queen Consort as the wife of King Charles III? Despite what her critics say?
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  #214  
Old 04-24-2013, 11:56 AM
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Thanks so much everyone!

Do I take it then that there is no room for doubt that Camilla will be Queen Consort as the wife of King Charles III? Despite what her critics say?
There is room for doubt. At the time of the wedding, it was reported that Camilla will be Princess Consort. This is the official line according to the FAQ on the Prince of Wales' website.
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  #215  
Old 04-24-2013, 12:01 PM
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Thanks so much everyone!

Do I take it then that there is no room for doubt that Camilla will be Queen Consort as the wife of King Charles III? Despite what her critics say?
Your questions will undoubtedly be moved to the appropriate thread soon, but this topic has been discussed at length in numerous places. Camilla will be the wife of the King therefore it would take an act of Parliament to deprive her of the title Queen.

You may find this thread useful; Questions about British Styles and Titles
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  #216  
Old 04-24-2013, 12:10 PM
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Many thanks!
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  #217  
Old 04-24-2013, 12:35 PM
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So many interesting issues are arising as a result of this change regarding the succession.

A possibility is for a future male heir to become "The Crown Prince of Wales" allowing for his wife to be made a princess in her own right and known as Princess (blank) of Wales, with a female heir being known as "The Crown Princess of Wales", with her husband being made a prince in his own right and known as Prince (blank) of Wales. Princess (blank) could, all going well, eventually become Princess (blank), The Princess Consort, and Prince (blank) could become Prince (blank), The Prince Consort.
There cannot be a Crown Prince of Wales because there is no King/Queen of Wales just like there is no Crown Prince of Scotland because there is no King/Queen of Scotland.
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  #218  
Old 04-24-2013, 01:01 PM
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The title Prince of Wales is reserved for the heir apparent - there is no specification as to gender made, however until now it has always been very unlikely that an heir apparent would be female, and has never actually happened.

Previously there were two forms of heirs in the British system; apparent and presumptive. The heir apparent was someone whose status as heir could not be displaced by the birth of another, the heir presumptive was someone whose status could be displaced by the birth of another. Typically heir apparents would have been the eldest son of the monarch, but it could have also been a grandson or even a granddaughter, in the event of the eldest son of the monarch dying after having children, but before his parent. Heir presumptives were daughters, nieces, nephews, younger siblings, and even cousins or aunts and uncles.

Theoretically, a female heir apparent can be Prince of Wales - much like how a female monarch is Duke of Lancaster. If they wish instead to go with gender appropriate terms, then a female heir apparent could be titled Princess of Wales - we won't know until such a time as there is a female heir apparent, which at the earliest would be when William is king if the Cambridge baby is a girl.
Ummm, I believe QEII was a female heir apparent quite recently, and was not Princess of Wales
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  #219  
Old 04-24-2013, 01:02 PM
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Thanks so much everyone!

Do I take it then that there is no room for doubt that Camilla will be Queen Consort as the wife of King Charles III? Despite what her critics say?
Really? Are you seriously going to stir that hornets nest again ?
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  #220  
Old 04-24-2013, 01:04 PM
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Really? Are you seriously going to stir that hornets nest again ?
I believe AngieUK was asking a genuine question, which it is.
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