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  #61  
Old 07-04-2018, 01:23 PM
Aristocracy
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madame Verseau View Post
At this point Kate should have a Royal Family Order.
One theory I've seen about why Kate doesn't have a family order (or at least HMs) is that the Queen's family order (with her picture on it) is produced on ivory which William is vehemently against.

Unless Kate gets a specially made ivory free order I think the status quo, where Kate doesn't have a family order but still gets sentimental jewelry loans like the Queen's wedding gift bracelet to show it isn't a snub, holds until the family order becomes ivory free (likely under Charles or William).
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  #62  
Old 07-04-2018, 01:24 PM
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It does seem a glaring omission when you look at all the orders WA has got and even a little rude esp if the Brits are already have some.

Anyway v excited re the visit. Might get myself to the big smoke for the occasion
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  #63  
Old 07-04-2018, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by An Ard Ri View Post
Any chance of the king being overly generous and giving Princess Michael of Kent her 1st royal order
It is unlikely. The circle seems limited to children of a (future) King. The Earl and Countess of Athlone, full cousine to Queen Wilhelmina had no Dutch Order, I believe.

But George, Elizabeth, Elizabeth II, Philip, Margaret, Charles, Diana, Anne are (were) all sons or daughters of a (future) monarch (or spouses to) and did participate in State Visits.

In Norway, Spain, Belgium, Denmark, Luxembourg all the children of the monarch whom participated in the State Visit by the Dutch monarch have a Dutch Order. Even Ari Behn (but no Grand-Cross for him: he was made a Commander).
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  #64  
Old 07-04-2018, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Zaira View Post
IMO, some traditions should be broken and giving an order to the male consort but not female ones is one of them. Absolutely out of date, but then again, the Queen is IMO (for the most part, please don't pelt me with a history lesson) loathed to change things unless she is forced to so there is that.
No, but I must admit that it's very tempting.

Because she is actually known (also among most British commentators) to be a VERY MODERN monarch who have changed with the times. - So perhaps you should take a look at the post below, or do a bit of research on her:
The Monarchy after Elizabeth II

Quote:
Originally Posted by wartenberg7 View Post
So why the british Queen, and only she, sticks stubbornly to this outdated concept of male preference without any substance to it, is beyond me!
The Queen is a 92-year-old lady whos been on the throne since 1952, so we cannot expect her to be up to date on everything, can we?
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  #65  
Old 07-04-2018, 01:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katymcwaity View Post
It does seem a glaring omission when you look at all the orders WA has got and even a little rude esp if the Brits are already have some.

Anyway v excited re the visit. Might get myself to the big smoke for the occasion
Beatrix got the Royal Victorian Order in 1954, the Royal Victorian Chain in 1982 and finally the Order of the Garter in 1989.

It would surprise me when the King gets the Garter. I expect the Royal Victorian Order first.
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  #66  
Old 07-04-2018, 01:43 PM
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The king will receive the Garter on this visit. He’s the head of state of a traditional British allied country.
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  #67  
Old 07-04-2018, 01:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
It is unlikely. The circle seems limited to children of a (future) King. The Earl and Countess of Athlone, full cousine to Queen Wilhelmina had no Dutch Order, I believe.

But George, Elizabeth, Elizabeth II, Philip, Margaret, Charles, Diana, Anne are (were) all sons or daughters of a (future) monarch (or spouses to) and did participate in State Visits.

In Norway, Spain, Belgium, Denmark, Luxembourg all the children of the monarch whom participated in the State Visit by the Dutch monarch have a Dutch Order. Even Ari Behn (but no Grand-Cross for him: he was made a Commander).
Princess Alexandra of Kent has a Dutch Order but I don't know why she got it.
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  #68  
Old 07-04-2018, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by sophie25 View Post
Princess Alexandra of Kent has a Dutch Order but I don't know why she got it.
Princess Alexandra was an official witness to Princess Beatrix for her wedding in 1966. Queen Beatrix bestowed the House of Orange Order to her in 1982. I think that is sweet. She has not forgotten her dear old bridal staff.
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  #69  
Old 07-04-2018, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
Beatrix got the Royal Victorian Order in 1954, the Royal Victorian Chain in 1982 and finally the Order of the Garter in 1986.

It would surprise me when the King gets the Garter. I expect the Royal Victorian Order first.
It might well be William V granting the Garter if they go at the same pace!
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  #70  
Old 07-04-2018, 02:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudolph View Post
The king will receive the Garter on this visit. He’s the head of state of a traditional British allied country.
That is no automatism. Queen Beatrix got the Garter in 1989. Years after her State Visit in 1982.
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  #71  
Old 07-04-2018, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
That is no automatism. Queen Beatrix got the Garter in 1989. Years after her State Visit in 1982.
But I’m willing to eat my hat if the king doesn’t receive the Garter. Felipe received his order last year and I’m will to wager anything W-A receives his order this year.
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  #72  
Old 07-04-2018, 02:11 PM
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Diana's own handwriting:

https://archief.paleishetloo.nl/wp-c...m-Haartsen.jpg

And wearing it:

https://archief.paleishetloo.nl/wp-c...beelding-1.jpg
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  #73  
Old 07-04-2018, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
I love the piece of tape. Like the rubber band holding Queen Elizabeth's kokoshnik together it shows that they're just like the rest of us and make do with anything that's practical and at hand.
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  #74  
Old 07-04-2018, 03:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wartenberg7 View Post
prefer when it comes to orders!
So why the british Queen, and only she, sticks stubbornly to this outdated concept of male preference without any substance to it, is beyond me!



There are actually two ways to see it. On one hand, you may think that the Queen is showing "male preference" when she decorates male consorts, but doesn't hand out orders to female ones. However, from another point of view, you may argue that, on the contrary, the Queen, by doing that, is actually compensating male consorts for the gender discrimination they suffer as mere HRHs who are lower in status than their wives, in contrast to the (equal) HM status of queen consorts. Having experienced that asymmetry herself as a reigning monarch and Prince Philip's wife, the Queen is probably sensitive to that issue,




It is interesting that, in the past, when many orders of knighthood could be awarded to males only, consorts of reigning queens often accepted orders that, otherwise, would normally be given to their wives. That was the justification for example for the Spanish regency under the minority of Isabella II to award the Order of the Golden Fleece to Prince Albert, who was actually serving de facto as a proxy for Queen Victoria.



https://www.royalcollection.org.uk/c...-golden-fleece
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  #75  
Old 07-04-2018, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
According to your predictions, it looks like King Willem-Alexander is very generous in giving out orders !

I am not so sure that the Duke of York or the Wessexes will be decorated, but I agree with your other predictions.
The Dutch are indeed typically very generous (royaal in Dutch). A clear example is Ari Behn's Dutch order when he didn't have a Norwegian one. Quite a contrast with the British, so it will be interesting to see how that will play into his decision.

For clarification for those interested in orders, the house order of Orange includes several orders among which two that include a grand cross distinction: one for nationals (to be seen on Laurentien at Prinsjesdag each year) and the crown order for foreigners (the king's go-to when not awarding the Dutch Lion, the former queen mostly used the Order of Orange-Nassau for less senior members of toyal families on statevisits). Furthermore, it includes 'crosses' and 'medals'.
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  #76  
Old 07-04-2018, 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Somebody View Post
The Dutch are indeed typically very generous (royaal in Dutch). A clear example is Ari Behn's Dutch order when he didn't have a Norwegian one. Quite a contrast with the British, so it will be interesting to see how that will play into his decision.

For clarification for those interested in orders, the house order of Orange includes several orders among which two that include a grand cross distinction: one for nationals (to be seen on Laurentien at Prinsjesdag each year) and the crown order for foreigners (the king's go-to when not awarding the Dutch Lion, the former queen mostly used the Order of Orange-Nassau for less senior members of toyal families on statevisits). Furthermore, it includes 'crosses' and 'medals'.
The heirs always got the Orde van Oranje-Nassau.
Other royals de Huisorde.

The only exception I can remember was the Infanta Doña Elena and the Infanta Doña Cristina. And Jordan royals. They got the honour which is usually given to heirs.

For an example Prince Laurent and Princess Claire got the Huisorde. The same to Prince Joachim and Princess Marie. Why the Infantas and the Jordans got a higher Order? Good question...

Diana got the Huisorde while she ranked as a heir, but I think Queen Beatrix felt she had to make the loophole via the Huisorde because of the British policy regarding female spouses (no reciprocity in state honours).

https://www.anp-archief.nl/image/201...ff2610c%29.jpg

https://www.who2.com/wp-content/uplo...16-730x485.jpg
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  #77  
Old 07-04-2018, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Rudolph View Post
But I’m willing to eat my hat if the king doesn’t receive the Garter. Felipe received his order last year and I’m will to wager anything W-A receives his order this year.
King Felipe already received the Royal Victorian Order in 1988 and the Order of the Garter 2017
King juan Carlos received the Royal Victorian Chain in 1986 and the Order of the Garter 1988. WA has no British order yet so I dont think WA receive the Order of the Garter during this State Visit
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  #78  
Old 07-04-2018, 04:09 PM
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I think Duchess Camilla and Prince William will receive the Dutch "House order". Diana received this order so i guess Camilla will receive it too. Diana received no spanish order in 1986 and the same for Camilla 2017
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  #79  
Old 07-04-2018, 04:37 PM
Majesty
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mary-Rose View Post
King Felipe already received the Royal Victorian Order in 1988 and the Order of the Garter 2017
King juan Carlos received the Royal Victorian Chain in 1986 and the Order of the Garter 1988. WA has no British order yet so I dont think WA receive the Order of the Garter during this State Visit
Felipe received the RVO as heir. The first visit as king he was granted the Garter.

W-A will most definitely receive the Garter on his state visit imo. There’s no way HMQ will bestow a ‘lesser’ order on a King of The Netherlands.
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  #80  
Old 07-04-2018, 05:43 PM
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I suspect the garter will be given but maybe a high level RVO may be fiven, does QE2 still give out the victorian chain?

Hope theres a full in carriage proccession and can’t wait to see what Max pulls out bag!
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