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  #501  
Old 10-14-2010, 01:08 PM
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Unfortunately I think HM is being ill advised on this, the party should go on.
Now I understand both sides, if it was public funds then possibly cancel especially on the heels of asking for assistance with heating expenses. Don't ask for money for heat and then throw a party.

But it was noted that private funds are used for this party. I can see that it would not appear right that the Queen is asking for heating money but spends her own on a party.
So HM is between the rock and the hard place, which way to go?

To me it boils down to why is she cutting back and what she's cutting.
If she want's to join hands in solidarity with the people then she should cut out one of her families personal expenses.
Tell any royals on the payroll no more trips unless you are working dang hard. No photo ops on ski slopes, etc.
Instead HM has been advised to cut a staff event.
The Christmas party isn't for the royals, it's for the staff. Yes those same working class poor HM's advisors are trying to show she's one with.
The household staff I've heard do not make exorbitant salaries look forward to this event. And it only happens every other year.
Part of the mystique of monarchy is the trappings of state, the palaces, the footman, etc. The household is key to what makes monarchy magic.
It's bad form to cut a Christmas party for the staff then have them pack your luggage for your jaunt to one of your estates.
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  #502  
Old 10-14-2010, 01:16 PM
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Thanks much for the article, Al_bina! Sometimes I wonder if the info - or the info's sources - we receive concerning the BRF's finances is/are trustworthy. Normally I don't believe anything I hear or read, in other words.
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  #503  
Old 10-14-2010, 02:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glassary View Post
It's bad form to cut a Christmas party for the staff then have them pack your luggage for your jaunt to one of your estates.
Very nicely put.
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  #504  
Old 10-14-2010, 04:26 PM
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I mean really...are they not getting paid a wage for working?

You make it seem as if the Queen is cutting their salary and than having them pack a bag for her. Its a Christmas party. Not a salary. Its a nice gesture on behalf of the Queen. Its also worth noting that not every business is obligated nor gives a Christmas party for their employees.

I must say I have seen more posts criticizing the Queen about the canceling of the Christmas party as opposed to those who criticized her (or the ministers on her behalf) when they applied for heating aid for Buckingham Palace. Now I certainly don't think the Queen should have shared the blame for that last fiasco, but I think that those who had issues with the application of aid had more of a reason to be upset with the Queen than this. But that is just me.

Christmas Party vs. Aid which can assist the poor as opposed to BP.

ETA: And I believe that the Royal Household has cut down its budget as a result of these economic times and is more sensitive to public perception.
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  #505  
Old 10-14-2010, 04:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
I am willing to bet that HM is saddened to have to cut this Christmas celebration as much as her loyal staff is. To be honest, I think the reasoning why its being canceled is understandable by all. ... [snipped]
I did hear the same justifications from Mr. Gorbachev in 1987-1989. However, the leaders did not alter their lifestyles much while asking usual people to be patient and wait for better times. Some fluid components in a setting can be different, but the ruling class is the more or less same everywhere. Thus, I am both skeptical and cynical in this respect. Once a certain perquisite disappears, it is unlikely to be brought back.
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  #506  
Old 10-14-2010, 04:45 PM
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With all due respect, I don't think we should judge the Queen by other people action other than her own. I wouldn't compare her to Gorbachev, Clinton, any of the Bushes, Obama, or Beatrix of the Netherlands. She is her own woman.

From what I have read from her, while she is a woman of great wealth, she has never flaunted it. Nor do we know everything about the Queen. Contrast to the rest of her family, whose private life has been splashed ALL over the world. We don't know if the Queen gives Christmas bonuses to her employees or how much she donates.

In the US, politicans are required to release their tax returns. So every year we know if they are or not giving to charity. From what i understand, the Queen doesn't have to publicize this information, is that correct? So techinically she should could be as stingy as a kid with a new toy or a very giving woman? We just don't know.
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  #507  
Old 10-14-2010, 04:50 PM
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I am sorry, but ... Given the fact that we judge everything mostly through the lens of our personal experiences and ethos, I see little or no difference between members of the ruling class Her Majesty belongs to. As I have said above, some fluid components in a setting (such as culture, traditions, a geographical location, a current political situation within a particular country) can be different. Overall it is all the same.
That is all I wanted to say on this polarising topic.
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  #508  
Old 10-15-2010, 04:08 AM
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Queen cancels Christmas party for Royal Household at Buckingham Palace | Mail Online

Quote:
The Queen has cancelled this year's Christmas party for her staff because of the 'difficult financial circumstances' facing the country.

The 600 members of the Royal Household had been expecting to attend the lavish celebration, paid for by the monarch, at Buckingham Palace.
Say's it is paid for by the Monarch.
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  #509  
Old 10-15-2010, 04:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Zonk View Post
With all due respect, I don't think we should judge the Queen by other people action other than her own. I wouldn't compare her to Gorbachev, Clinton, any of the Bushes, Obama, or Beatrix of the Netherlands. She is her own woman.

From what I have read from her, while she is a woman of great wealth, she has never flaunted it. Nor do we know everything about the Queen. Contrast to the rest of her family, whose private life has been splashed ALL over the world. We don't know if the Queen gives Christmas bonuses to her employees or how much she donates.

In the US, politicans are required to release their tax returns. So every year we know if they are or not giving to charity. From what i understand, the Queen doesn't have to publicize this information, is that correct? So techinically she should could be as stingy as a kid with a new toy or a very giving woman? We just don't know.
I completely support your view, Zonk. Its all very well to sit on our desks and pontificate on how HM should spend her money and how she should remunerate or what "benefits" HM should offer her employees, without realising the full story, or having all the facts to hand. It may make a nice headline for a tabloid, and offer a lot of interesting material to their readers, but thankfully this country is not headed by the Daily mAIL!
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  #510  
Old 10-15-2010, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
Yes we all have to cut back, and the government is cutting back the country to cover it's mistakes but I doubt the MP's themselves are making any cut backs.
The Queen is making them because she either has to or is being made to, but The Christmas Party and/or presents isn't an obvious choice, this affects her staff, and probably how they view her.
There are better ways of "cutting back" and not affecting the staff.
I don't think the cancellation is wrong or cruel. My firm did this 5 years ago and we've all adjusted and are glad we've been able to keep our jobs. Perhaps everyone will receive a gift instead...it would make sense to do that in any case.
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  #511  
Old 10-15-2010, 07:46 PM
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One thing I learnt from this was that the staff Christmas party is only every second year, already a cutback. So HM's already made a big saving there. Strange how BP should choose this as the big sacrifice when it's not taxpayers' money and the royal family aren't making any sacrifice at all.

It wouldn't need to cost much more than the usual staff evening meal, with the exception that HM and a few royals would be there.
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  #512  
Old 10-15-2010, 08:02 PM
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The party wasn't just a regular evening meal. It is a full dress banquet, dancing, open bar etc. Plus I believe it was catered so no one would need to work at it. Not everyone lives at the Palace either. They wouldn't all have dinner there.

Each employee does get a gift from the Queen.
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  #513  
Old 10-17-2010, 11:54 AM
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It is the type of publicity drive rarely embarked upon by a member of the Royal Family.
First, Prince Charles went on his ‘green tour’ of the UK to promote his work on environmental issues. Then he opened up the gardens of his London home, Clarence House, for a five-day garden party.
Now he has given a rare interview in this month’s edition of American magazine Vanity Fair to promote his green manifesto, Harmony: A New Way Of Looking At Our World.
Described as a ‘blueprint for a more balanced world’, the book bemoans *society’s emphasis on the material and makes an impassioned plea to return to a more natural, less complicated way of life. ...
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  #514  
Old 10-18-2010, 04:58 AM
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He could have 500 employees, as far as I am concerned, as they are paid for by the Duchy of Cornwall and not the public purse!
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  #515  
Old 10-18-2010, 05:30 AM
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Exactly - in fact cutting back these employees at this time would be awful as that would be putting people out of work.
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  #516  
Old 10-18-2010, 05:31 AM
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Originally Posted by muriel View Post
He could have 500 employees, as far as I am concerned, as they are paid for by the Duchy of Cornwall and not the public purse!
If I had to do in a day what either Charles or Camilla do a day, there's NO way in the world I'd make it through without someone that would do them little decisions .. what to wear.. what shoes go with this etc.. Let alone with public engagements all day then to come home and be my own secretary and answer all letters myself? Its just not humanly possible. Trust me.. by that time I'd probably not brush my teeth but fall into bed exhausted..shoes on and all. Having a warm bath drawn and ready wouldn't be a luxury.. it'd be a necessity.

The people in Charles and Camilla's employ have a specific role to fill and they're doing it nicely. They care for specific interests of both Charles and Camilla where they cannot do it themselves.

I remember watching on the History channel once about 'what the (era) did". To actually have the job of the Royal Butt Wiper (and yes there was one back then) one had to be of very high standards and respected member of the aristocracy I believe to wipe his royal butt. But anyways.. Charles and Camilla might employ 124 folks but I bet they are 124 folks that are devoted to what they do.
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  #517  
Old 10-18-2010, 10:20 AM
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Exactly - in fact cutting back these employees at this time would be awful as that would be putting people out of work.
Its good to agree occassionally!
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  #518  
Old 10-18-2010, 07:19 PM
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Express.co.uk - Home of the Daily and Sunday Express | UK News :: Tourist boom gives Queen £2.4m to patch her palaces

A bumper year for tourists at Buckingham Palace and Windsor Castle has given the Queen an extra £2.35million to spend on repairing royal residences.
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  #519  
Old 10-20-2010, 01:34 PM
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Spending Review 2010: The Queen agrees to cut total Royal Household spending - Telegraph

The Queen and the Royal Family will have to live to a budget under changes to the way it is funded by Government, George Osborne, the Chancellor, announced in the Comprehensive Spending Review.

The Queen has agreed to cut total Royal Household spending by 14% in 2012/13, Mr Osborne said, adding that grants will be frozen in cash terms for a year.

After that, the Royal Household will receive a new sovereign support grant linked to a portion of the revenue of the Crown Estate.

BBC News - Spending Review: Royal family to face 14% cuts

The Queen is to play her part in the cuts being made throughout the UK, Chancellor George Osborne has announced in his Spending Review.

He said that, having already accepted a one-year freeze in Civil List pay next year, the Queen had also agreed spending cuts of 14% by the Royal household in 2012-13.

Spending review 2010: Royal family's civil list to be replaced by a single grant | UK news | guardian.co.uk

The royal family faces the largest shakeup in its finances for 250 years following George Osborne's announcement that the civil list, which funds the Queen's official duties, will be replaced from 2013-14 by a "sovereign support grant".

The move means that the current system of a civil list, agreed for a 10 year period, and three different grants-in-aid, providing government funding for specific expenditure on royal palaces, communications and transport for official business, will be replaced by a single grant determined annually.
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  #520  
Old 10-21-2010, 02:12 AM
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Royal 'cuts' could make Charles the richest king in British history - UK Politics, UK - The Independent

The Queen is set to become one of the wealthiest crowned heads in Europe after the future of the British monarchy was secured in a historic deal with the Government that will give the House of Windsor a share of the £210m profits from government estates relinquished by George III.
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