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  #741  
Old 06-23-2012, 11:07 AM
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So, Black Caviar won the Diamond Jubilee Stakes in unconvincing fashion. We've been led to believe that this horse would leave the opposition for dead, but if that race had been 3 feet longer it'd probably have finished 3rd.

The Queen's looking lovely in green and blue today.
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  #742  
Old 06-23-2012, 11:37 AM
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Spletnik -Royal Ascot 2012- Day IV

Tatler.ru - Royal Ascot-2012: Hats galore

Wildest Royal Ascot Hats On Royals And Commoners Alike (PHOTOS)
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  #743  
Old 06-23-2012, 11:39 AM
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- The Queen and Prince Philip
- Queen Elizabeth and Prince Philip
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- The Queen 1
- The Queen 2
- The Duke of Edinburgh

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  #744  
Old 06-23-2012, 12:10 PM
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Celebrated Australian filly Black Caviar has won the Diamond Jubilee Stakes, making this her 22nd consecutive win. She raced at 12:45 AEST.

A very close race but a wonderful achievement nonetheless.

I liked that her trainer Peter Moody made comment about there being 'two Queen's of Australia'. My sentiments exactly!

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So, Black Caviar won the Diamond Jubilee Stakes in unconvincing fashion. We've been led to believe that this horse would leave the opposition for dead, but if that race had been 3 feet longer it'd probably have finished 3rd.
If? Seems rather pointless talking of 'if'. She won, she is a champion and I fail to see any reason to undermine the achievement. Yes it was an exceptionally close race and her rider went on to elaborate that he failed to adequately gage the track. As a jockey, I believe he was dissapointed in his performance.
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  #745  
Old 06-23-2012, 12:53 PM
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I'm not undermining the achievement. Merely pointing out that the horse was losing ground to its competitors fast, most of whom had been fancied by no-one. Black Caviar just didn't look like the greatest horse that ever lived today. Of course his camp will make excuses for his disappointing run to try and maintain their very lucrative brand, but this was its big opportunity on the world stage to really wow an international audience, and it didn't really happen. I think all the hype about how many lengths she would win by, with some saying it would be at least 5 or 6, didn't exactly help.

Frankel has been the star of a truly memorable Royal Ascot this year. He not only won the Queen Anne, but he completely obliterated the field winning a top quality contest by eleven lengths. That's why he's the highest-rated racehorse in the world.
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  #746  
Old 06-23-2012, 01:05 PM
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According to DM, this was Black Caviar's 22nd consecutive victory which sounds pretty impressive to me. Black Caviar has been odds-on favourite in every one of her races since she won on début at Flemington in April, 2009. She is also the second-highest-rated thoroughbred in the world behind Frankel (the winner of the Queen Anne Stakes on Tuesday). The jockey did make a mistake at the end of the race - but the horse was still magnificent.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/rac...ee-Stakes.html
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  #747  
Old 06-23-2012, 01:29 PM
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One of the commentators mentioned seeing Princess Eugenie caught up in the crush of people rushing to the winner's enclosure to see Black Caviar. I'm taking that with a grain of salt since A) I haven't yet seen pictures of Eugenie at Royal Ascot today and B) these are the same commentators who said the Duchess of Cornwall isn't really royal since she's "just a duchess."

But if it's true, it's interesting to see that Eugenie is attending nearly every day of the meet and seems to have inherited her granny's interest in horses.
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  #748  
Old 06-23-2012, 02:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Artemisia View Post

According to DM, this was Black Caviar's 22nd consecutive victory which sounds pretty impressive to me. Black Caviar has been odds-on favourite in every one of her races since she won on début at Flemington in April, 2009. She is also the second-highest-rated thoroughbred in the world behind Frankel (the winner of the Queen Anne Stakes on Tuesday). The jockey did make a mistake at the end of the race - but the horse was still magnificent.
Royal Ascot 2012: Black Caviar wins Diamond Jubilee Stakes | Mail Online
Winning 22 successive races is impressive, no doubt about that. But, the way people talked about this horse was as if it would win the Diamond Jubilee at a canter and that just didn't happen. We saw all kinds of predictions from the British and Australian press suggesting that she would win without breaking a sweat, that she wouldn't need to use top gear, that none of the other horses would even get close. The BBC commentators said before hand that Black Caviar hadn't come to just win the race, but to dominate the competition.

It won the race fair and square; but I certainly didn't feel watching it that this was the greatest racehorse ever, as we were led to believe. Just that it was a good horse, marginally better than the others.
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  #749  
Old 06-23-2012, 02:44 PM
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Winning 22 successive races is impressive, no doubt about that. But, the way people talked about this horse was as if it would win the Diamond Jubilee at a canter and that just didn't happen. We saw all kinds of predictions from the British and Australian press suggesting that she would win without breaking a sweat, that she wouldn't need to use top gear, that none of the other horses would even get close. The BBC commentators said before hand that Black Caviar hadn't come to just win the race, but to dominate the competition.

It won the race fair and square; but I certainly didn't feel watching it that this was the greatest racehorse ever, as we were led to believe. Just that it was a good horse, marginally better than the others.
Regarding the horse discussion - Black Caviar is a mare, 22 wins in a row is sensational, compared to Frankel's 11 (a colt). Black Caviar has won against male opposition more that once. I dont want to take anything away from Frankel, he's great horse, but to travel to Ascot from the other end of the world must be daunting for an animal and she still delivered, on an unknown track and not being used to soft ground. The jockey messed up, too, eased her up too early. And, as an owner, especially as an aussie owner, you really have to have guts to do what he did, possibly getting slandered by the pommies.

Nobody said Black Caviar would crush the opposition (apart from the media) but being bullish is part of the trade.
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  #750  
Old 06-23-2012, 03:11 PM
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Personally Black Caviar's race was more entertaining, it was an actual race where as Frankel just won. No competition at all.
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  #751  
Old 06-23-2012, 03:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post
Regarding the horse discussion - Black Caviar is a mare, 22 wins in a row is sensational, compared to Frankel's 11 (a colt). Black Caviar has won against male opposition more that once. I dont want to take anything away from Frankel, he's great horse, but to travel to Ascot from the other end of the world must be daunting for an animal and she still delivered, on an unknown track and not being used to soft ground. The jockey messed up, too, eased her up too early. And, as an owner, especially as an aussie owner, you really have to have guts to do what he did, possibly getting slandered by the pommies.

Nobody said Black Caviar would crush the opposition (apart from the media) but being bullish is part of the trade.
All of this is true. I am merely giving my impression, as someone who doesn't know a whole lot about horse racing, on Black Caviar during today's race. We don't see any Australian racing on TV here in the UK, so the vast majority of British punters only knew what we'd read about her in the press lately when she was described as light years ahead of every other horse. For whatever reason, whether it be jet lag, jockey error, or the horse got out of the wrong side of bed this morning, the impression given was of a good horse who didn't look a whole lot better than the other horses racing against them.

The owners were clearly coming here to make a statement. Not that their horse is a bit better than the others in the field, but that she's the best racehorse the world has ever seen. The racing community in the UK already knew about Black Caviar; this was about showing the regular punters in the UK/Europe what she could do. My family and I happened to watch the race together today and none of us went away thinking 'I was privileged to see that horse'. Just that it was a bit better than the others.

Frankel was imperious and people were literally gobsmacked about how dominant he was in the Queen Anne. Sometimes you just have to say, that horse is in a league of its own.
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  #752  
Old 06-23-2012, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by EIIR View Post
All of this is true. I am merely giving my impression, as someone who doesn't know a whole lot about horse racing, on Black Caviar during today's race. We don't see any Australian racing on TV here in the UK, so the vast majority of British punters only knew what we'd read about her in the press lately when she was described as light years ahead of every other horse. For whatever reason, whether it be jet lag, jockey error, or the horse got out of the wrong side of bed this morning, the impression given was of a good horse who didn't look a whole lot better than the other horses racing against them.

The owners were clearly coming here to make a statement. Not that their horse is a bit better than the others in the field, but that she's the best racehorse the world has ever seen. The racing community in the UK already knew about Black Caviar; this was about showing the regular punters in the UK/Europe what she could do. My family and I happened to watch the race together today and none of us went away thinking 'I was privileged to see that horse'. Just that it was a bit better than the others.

Frankel was imperious and people were literally gobsmacked about how dominant he was in the Queen Anne. Sometimes you just have to say, that horse is in a league of its own.
I think the whole Black Caviar stunt was a deal, Royal Ascot payed for her to come over to have some positive headlines. These days, horseracing is in desperate need for positive headlines after the whip discussion mess, corrupt or drugged jockeys.
Frankel is a great horse, the best miler in the world, but a bit boring. He always wins by huge lengths, his trainer Henry Cecil doesnt talk much because he burnt his fingers with the media, therefore the aussie superstar just came right, with a team around her that is more than happy to play the media game.
Black caviar arrived in a wet suit, and everything around her was hyped in order to get attention. Aussie racing is very different from English racing in terms of rules or opposition, therefore kudos to the team that they did come and to the horse that she is so adaptable. A failure would have cost a lot of money as an unbeaten record does count when it comes to breeding fees.
Under "normal" circumstances, the owners would have taken her out a long time ago in order to make money and breed, I am sure that this season is Frankel's last season, the aim will be to get him to stud unbeaten and in one piece.
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  #753  
Old 06-23-2012, 04:10 PM
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Sometimes you just have to say, that horse is in a league of its own.
Indeed, one very boring league. Nobody is going to compete with Frankel, nobody can match his speed, so what's the point in trying? Why race with Frankel when you won't win?

One thing that bugs me, I feel sorry for Excelebration that horse has come second to Frankel in every race they have ran and he is one stunner off a horse! If Frankel didn't exist we'd be talking about this horse. Willie Carson said something interesting before Frankel ran, he said that when Frankel passes we will understand why he is so good because he cannot be this good without something 'wrong' with him.
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  #754  
Old 06-23-2012, 05:57 PM
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I know this is WAY OT, but I've been a follower of horse racing for over 40 years and know a bit of what I speak. I posted this about Black Caviar on a racing site earlier today:

"Let's see: Six years old. First time on a plane. Shipped half way around the world, going from what would normally be her winter rest (she has her winter coat!) to summer racing at the most prestigious meet in the world. Soft ground due to torrential rain - softer than she's ever raced on before. Uphill undulating track when she's used to a firm, flat, closed oval. Gave several pounds to the runners up - both 3year olds. Jockey error after she cleared the field. Had to restart from her normal "warm down". Still won. Sounds like a champion to me."

Again, sorry for the OT, but I can't stand bashing of a true champion. Frankel is a miraculous miler, maybe more, we shall see, and Black Caviar is one of the finest sprinters ever. Apples and oranges. Both champions.

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  #755  
Old 06-23-2012, 07:12 PM
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Her Majesty the Queen met with the jockey and owner of the Australian horse Black Caviar after its record 22nd win from 22nd start today at Royal Ascot, which is very exciting as an Australian in this Diamond Jubilee year.

Caviar still queen despite Ascot scare - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

I know absolutely nothing about horse racing - like most Australians I only follow the Melbourne Cup every November which is the biggest race here - so I can't comment on how good it is apart from saying 22 undefeated runs is a pretty good record. It was a close finish but she still won. You only have to look at the crowds watching in Melbourne (which would have been absolutely freezing at this time of year) to know that Australians certainly view her as a racing great.
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  #756  
Old 06-23-2012, 11:34 PM
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Black Caviar definitely wasn't at her best at Ascot. I have seen her run many times in Australia and she has left the others for dead and barely broken out of a canter. Not sure why she didn't run well but I suspect the conditions didn't suit her (heavier track than she is used to), she had to travel to the other side of the world and the jockey definitely did misread the situation.

In the jockey's defense though I believe he is under instructions just to win the race and not push her too hard. I think this is what he did but he just misjudged it this time in unfamiliar surroundings. Add to that the fact that she reacted differently under these different conditions and slowed down a lot quicker than usual and the whole thing was nearly botched

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I think the whole Black Caviar stunt was a deal, Royal Ascot payed for her to come over to have some positive headlines. These days, horseracing is in desperate need for positive headlines after the whip discussion mess, corrupt or drugged jockeys.
Frankel is a great horse, the best miler in the world, but a bit boring. He always wins by huge lengths, his trainer Henry Cecil doesnt talk much because he burnt his fingers with the media, therefore the aussie superstar just came right, with a team around her that is more than happy to play the media game.
It wasn't a stunt and Ascot didn't pay for her to go over there. It was said time and again here that she had nothing to gain by going to Ascot other than prestige. The costs were borne by the connections and they didn't do it for the money. The trainer was never keen for her to go but the owners wanted her to run at Ascot so she did. It would have been more profitable to keep running her in Australia.

We have had lots of horses from the UK run in Autralia over the years especially in the Melbourne Cup, some have been successful and some have failed miserably. It's a risk and not every horse copes well with the trip or the different conditions.

This was the first time I had seen Frankel run however, WOW!!! What a horse!!!!! Would love to see him race down here
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Old 06-24-2012, 04:37 AM
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Did we all see Peter and Autumn Phillips in the royal enclosure along with Dave Clark? I don't know if they were in the procession as i was at work! :)
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  #758  
Old 06-24-2012, 04:52 AM
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The Queen patting Black Caviar - Oh so close for Caviar's 22nd win | Black Caviar
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  #759  
Old 06-24-2012, 07:06 AM
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Did we all see Peter and Autumn Phillips in the royal enclosure along with Dave Clark? I don't know if they were in the procession as i was at work! :)
It does look like they were there. Would love to see more pics of the foursome (Autumn, Peter, Dave and Beatrice), but so far we might have to do with picture published in the telegraph that was posted in the Order of Precedence thread by wbenson. Please disregard the article.

The Queen tells the Duchess of Cambridge to curtsy to the 'blood princesses’ - Telegraph
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Old 06-24-2012, 07:53 AM
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Indeed, one very boring league. Nobody is going to compete with Frankel, nobody can match his speed, so what's the point in trying? Why race with Frankel when you won't win?

One thing that bugs me, I feel sorry for Excelebration that horse has come second to Frankel in every race they have ran and he is one stunner off a horse! If Frankel didn't exist we'd be talking about this horse. Willie Carson said something interesting before Frankel ran, he said that when Frankel passes we will understand why he is so good because he cannot be this good without something 'wrong' with him.
The fact that no horse can compare with Frankel isn't Frankel's fault. His races may not be nail biters, but that doesn't make him a boring horse or his races uninteresting. No doubt his competitors are more motivated, wanting to be the one who finally beat Frankel.

The Spanish football team beat just about every team they come across easily, but that doesn't make their matches boring. People watch them because they are so good; people understand that they're one of the best teams of all time and watch their matches for that reason. Watching a truly dominant team or sportsperson, who have essentially re-defined the limits of their sport, is a privilege.
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