Relationships between Members of the British Royal Family

[Denville]

Well my guess is that Meghan (now HRH the Duchess of Sussex) can actually charm anyone, including Princess Margaret if she was still alive. I also think that some of the portrayals and characterizations of Princess Margaret's peccadillos and personality do not take into account her positive attributes and her vulnerabilities.

That's a mater of opinion. Meghan hasn't charmed everyone, she certainly does not charm me.. and Margaret was fitful with people and erratic.. so I think its quite possible that Marg would find Meghan amusing one day and go sour on her the next..

 

[royal_enthusiast]

Does Sarah, Duchess of York still keep in contact with The Queen? I know she tends to visit Balmoral over the summer. I don’t know if it’s a close relationship or if they just see each other occasionally.

 

[MaiaMia_53]

That's a mater of opinion. Meghan hasn't charmed everyone, she certainly does not charm me.. and Margaret was fitful with people and erratic.. so I think its quite possible that Marg would find Meghan amusing one day and go sour on her the next..

As you say, a matter of opinion. And in the case of Princess Margaret being charmed by the Duchess of Sussex, we'll never know for sure. That would take some miraculous bit of charming, beyond the grave. ?

 

[Curryong]

I wouldn't be surprised if Sarah sees the Queen every now and again besides the little Balmoral holidays. She was annoyed by Sarah's antics over the years, I'm sure, but I think she's always enjoyed her bouncy and cheerful nature. I don't know of course whether the Queen is a regular visitor to Royal Lodge to see her son and granddaughters. If she is then she probably sees Sarah several times a year.

 

[Denville]

As you say, a matter of opinion. And in the case of Princess Margaret being charmed by the Duchess of Sussex, we'll never know for sure. That would take some miraculous bit of charming, beyond the grave. ?

obviously we are tlakng about her actually meeting Meghan. Its not beyond the rrealm of possibility that Margo could have still been around now and met her.. but I think on her record, she found people amusing at times and cooled on them and was haughty and arrogant. So I am not at all sure she'd approve of a senior royal marrying an actress...

I wouldn't be surprised if Sarah sees the Queen every now and again besides the little Balmoral holidays. She was annoyed by Sarah's antics over the years, I'm sure, but I think she's always enjoyed her bouncy and cheerful nature. I don't know of course whether the Queen is a regular visitor to Royal Lodge to see her son and granddaughters. If she is then she probably sees Sarah several times a year.

If Sarah is there, and not off on her business trips. I think that the queen has forgiven Sarah, because she does not want alienation from her favourite son's ex and the mother of her grandchildren. But I doubt if Philip has accepted her ever again. I Don't think, in short htat the queen is best friends with Sarah, nowadays but she's friendly for the sake of her son and grand daughters..

 

[O-H Anglophile]

obviously we are tlakng about her actually meeting Meghan. Its not beyond the rrealm of possibility that Margo could have still been around now and met her.. but I think on her record, she found people amusing at times and cooled on them and was haughty and arrogant. So I am not at all sure she'd approve of a senior royal marrying an actress...

But her daughter married an actor....
I realize Sarah Chatto is not technically royal, much less a senior royal but still.

 

[Denville]

She is not a senior royal. She's a private individual. Harry is a senior royal and a working one..

 

[Lady Nimue]

To see them as grown men now is terrific and one of the sweetest moments in Harry and Meghan's wedding was Harry saying "thanks Pa" as [Charles] went to take his seat after escorting Meghan through the Quire.

Wasn't it, though? I agree. We are seeing mature relationships, forged through fire, and it's a relief (for this member of the public) after so many years of purported misalliance.

It's a curious sense of 'relief' to see Harry so well matched (transformed by love) and 'married off'. ? Charles has to be relieved that his sons are doing well after the turmoil of the past.

 

[MaiaMia_53]

But her daughter married an actor....
I realize Sarah Chatto is not technically royal, much less a senior royal but still.

I think you make an excellent point, as Princess Margaret herself had many artist and actor friends. It's also been said that Princess Margaret was an excellent mimic who had the talent to have pursued an acting career herself had she not been prevented that possibilty because of her royal status.

In any case, talk by posters of truly knowing what Princess Margaret's inner thoughts about Meghan might be are quite fanciful.

Re speculation of any kind as to how Princess Margaret might have interacted with Meghan, I base my opinions on Meghan's warm and generous personality, and on how she's been able to connect with and relate to most members of Harry's immediate and extended family. Again, we'll never know any of the intimate behind-palace-walls details. But from accounts by Prince Harry post Christmas festivities, Meghan has been warmly welcomed by all the royals, and she's fitting in amazingly well. We can see the evidence of how Meghan and the Duchess of Cornwall get along quite well. Indeed Meghan seems to have a relaxed camaraderie with both Camilla and QEII. ?

 

[Denville]

I don't think it is fanciful at all to note that Margaret while she liked arty people, was also very arrogant about her own royal status and that she was notorious for being friendly with people and THEN going "Im the sister of HM the queen" and expecting to be then treated as royal. So I would imagine that she might well be the same with Meghan, thinking her amusing at first and then feeling that she wasn't grand enough to marry into the top of the RF...

 

[_Heather_]

You know, HM is no dummy and she's certainly kept in the loop about public opinion, the impression of the monarchy, etc. and she and her team know how to play the game so I really have to wonder if yesterday's carriage procession at Ascot with the POW and the Duchess of Cornwall sharing a carriage with the Sisters York wasn't a calculated move by HM to help put to rest the rumors of discord between Charles and the Yorks. It would have been a simple matter to shift things around so that Andrew was with his daughters but instead the York girls were with Charles and Camilla and seemed to be having a lovely time of it.

I know that Charles often gets a bad rap when it comes to relationships with his siblings and/or nieces and nephews but I genuinely believe he has a much better relationship with them than we are led by the press to believe. If I'm not mistaken there have been pictures of him sharing a laugh with Peter, Zara, Beatrice, and Eugenie at various times. None that I can recall with Louise and James but I think that might be due more to age difference than anything else. Factor in that Louise was a part of the Cambridge wedding and there were some lovely pictures of the Cambridges and especially Catherine at the Olympics with Louise and I think they might well be closer than we all realize. Even looking at Edward's wedding, Edward was a fully grown, mid-30s age man when he married and could easily have asked only one of his brothers, a friend, or even a cousin (David, maybe) to stand with him but chose instead to ask both of his older brothers who happily filled those roles.

While we'll probably never know exactly what is said and done behind closed doors, I really believe that much of the image of Charles having poor relationships with siblings and their children is fabricated. Anyway, it was lovely to see the York girls and now Peter and Autumn join Charles and Camilla in the carriage procession and judging simply by photographic appearance having a genuinely nice time.

 

[Osipi]

I think it has a lot to do with perspectives also. There's been a lot in the press of Charles disapproving of Andrew because of some of his dealings with people and how he does things but, to me, that is Charles basing a dislike of what Andrew has done on how it affects the "Firm" and the monarchy. Charles may be of the opinion that in the future, as monarch, he'd prefer a slimmed down monarchy but once again, that's looking at the "Firm" and the monarchy and how it should work. Absolutely nothing to do with their relationships in private as a family. For all we know, Charles could look forward immensely to spending time with Andrew because of his gift for wise cracks or practical jokes that we, the public, never hear about.

At Ascot Week, they're all coming together as a family to enjoy the races and its not always related to the "Firm" or protocol or precedence or even solely representing the monarchy but rather just having a grand old time enjoying each other.

 

[_Heather_]

I think it has a lot to do with perspectives also. There's been a lot in the press of Charles disapproving of Andrew because of some of his dealings with people and how he does things but, to me, that is Charles basing a dislike of what Andrew has done on how it affects the "Firm" and the monarchy. Charles may be of the opinion that in the future, as monarch, he'd prefer a slimmed down monarchy but once again, that's looking at the "Firm" and the monarchy and how it should work. Absolutely nothing to do with their relationships in private as a family. For all we know, Charles could look forward immensely to spending time with Andrew because of his gift for wise cracks or practical jokes that we, the public, never hear about.

At Ascot Week, they're all coming together as a family to enjoy the races and its not always related to the "Firm" or protocol or precedence or even solely representing the monarchy but rather just having a grand old time enjoying each other.

Fabulous point. And one with which I wholeheartedly agree. I can even see the logic in Charles possibly disapproving of some of Andrew's friendships and dealings as they impact the monarchy. And I think Charles is definitely in tune with public perception of the royal family as all being totally supported by public money, though we know that isn't true. But as for their actual relationships, I just think sometimes Charles gets the short end of the stick in the public perception of his familial relationships when things like carriage rides at Ascot seem to show much more of the truth. As always, just my own views, but I think Charles and Camilla's carriage partners over the last two days might have been HM's subtle way of letting us in on some of those warmer relationships.

 

[tommy100]

Osipi you literally took the words out my mouth. I don't think Charles has to put on a show of liking the York girls, there are his nieces and I'm sure he loves them. That doesn't mean as the next Sovereign he agrees there are roles for them in the working monarchy. That doesn't mean he doesn't like them at all. Its like the boss of any family business - he has to make decisions based on whats best for the "firm" (the monarchy) not the family.

 

[Pranter]

I agree...I think Charles rubs along quite well with the children of his siblings.


LaRae

 

[_Heather_]

I'm very interested to see the interaction between the Duchesses of Cambridge and Sussex on Saturday at Wimbledon. Not that I think they've ever been unfriendly with each other but in the few times we've seen them together there doesn't seem to be much interaction beyond a polite word or smile here and there. It seems like depending on where you look and what you read people have already decided that these two are bosom buddies and closer than sisters or they're at each others throats and out for blood. I'm very much looking forward to seeing them together, just the two of them, this Saturday to see that interaction and have a better idea of whether they're more polite acquaintances or two peas in a pod.

 

[Osipi]

I think it'll be interesting to watch the two of them together too. They've really not had much time to cement any kind of a relationship yet. There was the wedding, the birth of Louis and just all kinds of hectic stuff going on that kept them busy with other things.

One thing I don't think we're ever going to see though is what their relationship is like in private. Right now they have it made in the shade as far as being able to visit between homes privately out of the public eye. For all we know, Harry and Meghan could pop over to the Cambridges' home for dinner now and then or to play with the kids or borrow a cup of sugar even. Meghan seems to like to cook so perhaps its been dinner at Nott Cott while the kids play with Lupo and Guy.

As close as Harry and William are, its hard to believe that Kate and Meghan would just be on "acquaintance" terms. That's just my opinion though. We'll never really know for sure.

 

[Pranter]

What little interaction we've seen previously it has all look fairly relaxed and friendly. I'm pretty confident that they get on well with each other. I just cannot see Harry marrying someone who did not mesh well with his family. Especially William and Kate.


LaRae

 

[_Heather_]

I think it'll be interesting to watch the two of them together too. They've really not had much time to cement any kind of a relationship yet. There was the wedding, the birth of Louis and just all kinds of hectic stuff going on that kept them busy with other things.

One thing I don't think we're ever going to see though is what their relationship is like in private. Right now they have it made in the shade as far as being able to visit between homes privately out of the public eye. For all we know, Harry and Meghan could pop over to the Cambridges' home for dinner now and then or to play with the kids or borrow a cup of sugar even. Meghan seems to like to cook so perhaps its been dinner at Nott Cott while the kids play with Lupo and Guy.

As close as Harry and William are, its hard to believe that Kate and Meghan would just be on "acquaintance" terms. That's just my opinion though. We'll never really know for sure.

All very true. I'm not sure we every really, really get to see what relationships are like behind closed doors but I think we might get a pretty good idea from an outing like this. If they're chatting and laughing and appear to have a lot to say to each other (rather than just the public aspects of speaking with players and ball boys/girls) then I think it's probably a safe bet that they get on well. If they don't exchange many words and tend to stare only at the court then I think we might be seeing some hints of a not so close relationship. But that's really just my two cents worth. I'd hope that with their abilities to spend time together out of the public glare and with the seemingly very close relationship between the Cambridges and Harry that they will have built a very nice relationship by now.

The personal relationships really are one of the things about the BRF that I wish we got to see more of. I always so enjoy seeing things like the Swedish RF playing with nieces/nephews in public and being so clearly comfortable with them, even in the Danish RF we get to see a bit of that. I wish we got to see much more of the Aunt Meg and Uncle Harry playing with George, Charlotte, and Louis or the Grandpa Charles and Gran Camilla (yes I know she's the stepgran but few glimpses we've had of interaction with the children are always very sweet so for the purposes of my argument I'm using Gran) vs. the Prince of Wales Charles and Duchess of Cornwall Camilla.

 

[Osipi]

One incident that made me laugh and realize just how close Harry is with the Cambridge children is when the Obamas made a visit and George pipes up with "how come Uncle Harry is being so quiet?". That was before Meghan came along and perhaps the biggest clue was at the holidays when Harry said something along the lines of Meghan now having the family she's never had before. Close family that interacts with each other.

Little clues like this is what gives us a wee bit of an inkling.

 

[_Heather_]

It should be fun to watch. I'm hoping that as time goes on and Harry and Meghan have children we'll get a few of those fun, guard down moments between cousins and aunts/uncles that are always so much fun for us as observers. Moments like we saw between George and Charlotte with Savannah and Isla or Harry playing with Mia are, I realize, off duty moments but they're also very humanizing and it's always nice to catch that human side of our favorite royals.

 

[Betsypaige]

Hi all!

So it's been ages since I've posted here, but I'm a regular lurker as I love the Royals.

I have a soft spot for Prince Charles, so I'm always Googling to see what he's up to .........and today I saw this article:

I'm not sure what to think. I don't take Tom Bower seriously at all since he clearly hates Charles, and Richard Kay seems to be another in a long line of gossip mongerers who love to play up this "Charles was a bad father, his sons hate him" angle.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/inside-the-cold-war-between-prince-charles-and-william-and-harry

I just keep reading different things about their relationship; is any of this true? I thought Harry and Meghan just spent time with Charles and Camilla recently. Regardless, I know that the boys love their father and that he loves them - I refuse to believe otherwise. Even if they don't always agree, does it mean that there's a "cold war" between them? That just seems so dramatic.......

I do read more about Charles/Harry and Meghan than about Charles and William, so I wonder if there's a bit more truth there, but.......overall, it seems like the media still wants to make this a competition with Diana, as if William and Harry loving her means they can't also love their father.

 

[Chloep]

It seems to be the reiteration of the same story - the competition between the two heirs....To push a book, as always, probably filled with nothing but half truths. This reported 'rift/competition' was amplified recently with Charles and William - I don't think I ever saw Harry included in there much, certainly not Meghan. (Probably bc they were touting this book out before they were even engaged and now they are all pretty chummy at every turn).

It is quiet common to put the future monarch and his/her direct heir up against each other. Makes for an established narrative and here with the added Diana factor the possibilities for mindless drivel and half-fiction are endless.

It's better not to give them much credence, imo. Charles and his boys seem to have a good relationship, albeit, one that cannot be compared to regular father-son relationships. Yet, you can still tell how they all respect and care for each other deeply.

 

[Betsypaige]

It seems to be the reiteration of the same story - the competition between the two heirs....To push a book, as always, probably filled with nothing but half truths. This reported 'rift/competition' was amplified recently with Charles and William - I don't think I ever saw Harry included in there much, certainly not Meghan. (Probably bc they were touting this book out before they were even engaged and now they are all pretty chummy at every turn).

It is quiet common to put the future monarch and his/her direct heir up against each other. Makes for an established narrative and here with the added Diana factor the possibilities for mindless drivel and half-fiction are endless.

It's better not to give them much credence, imo. Charles and his boys seem to have a good relationship, albeit, one that cannot be compared to regular father-son relationships. Yet, you can still tell how they all respect and care for each other deeply.

All good points. I’ve seen many times the implication that Charles is impatient to be King - um, that means he would want his mother to die, which is just...no.
Oh the Diana thing - the poor woman has been dead for 20 years and they still won’t let her Rest In Peace. I feel like the media wants to try and speak for her, with this idea that she’d want William and Harry not to have a good relationship with their father...I was not a particular fan of hers, but I just can’t believe that of her.

You’re right - I shouldn’t even click on those types of articles.

Thanks !

 

[Denville]

I'd certainly avoid them.. as they are probably not at all true.. and are all about revisiting the War of the Waleses, just to create conflict in the present...

 

[TLLK]

Good point Denville. These types of articles often appear around the anniversary of Diana's death and IMHO are a source of quick revenue.

 

[Denville]

Good point Denville. These types of articles often appear around the anniversary of Diana's death and IMHO are a source of quick revenue.

Considering the tragedy of Diana's death, I think it is unpleasant to have these stories pop up around now..to imply that Will and Harry don't care much for their father, at a time when they are problaby feeling sad about their mother's death. It is just a way of using the Diana situation to trump up a story.. and considering that this year Charles not only (as usual) has paid a good deal towards his sons' lifestyle but also made an effort to help wit Harry's wedding..

 

[Betsypaige]

Considering the tragedy of Diana's death, I think it is unpleasant to have these stories pop up around now..to imply that Will and Harry don't care much for their father, at a time when they are problaby feeling sad about their mother's death. It is just a way of using the Diana situation to trump up a story.. and considering that this year Charles not only (as usual) has paid a good deal towards his sons' lifestyle but also made an effort to help wit Harry's wedding..

Yup. I also remember last year that some wondered by William and Harry didn't mention their father at all in their tributes to Diana. Granted, those in the media that did so were squarely on Charles' side - but the way I see it, the boys were trying to honor their mother, period - I don't think they were trying to diminish Charles' influence or their love for him. Even if I thought Charles should have been mentioned (I'm not sure if I do, though it would have been nice), children can be thoughtless; they probably assumed that their dad knows they love him. In this case, I don't think the media was trying to start anything, but ultimately almost subconsciously it seems like some sort of competition between Charles and Diana, even now.

I don't know what Charles' relationship with Kate and her family are, but he clearly loves Meghan - and he was there for her when she (and Harry) needed him, as he walked her (partway) down the aisle. My favorite part of the wedding - that I saw - was Harry's "thank you, pa". Even IF Harry was annoyed as his pa (but I'm still remembering their adorable radio show together), you can bet he melted at the way Charles has been there for his wife, who has gone through hell.

 

[Osipi]

Parents undergo a lot of changes in their children's minds as they grow up and mature. I'm reminded of a quote from Mark Twain that goes: "When I was a boy of fourteen, my father was so ignorant I could hardly stand to have the old man around. But when I got to be twenty-one, I was astonished at how much he had learned in seven years."

I don't think William and Harry were much different than other children in this regard. Their relationship with their father, as well as their mother, is/was a deeply intimate one that only the child can understand with his parents. The boys had their relationship with their mother and they had their relationship with their father. When they spoke out and honored their mother 20 years after her death, she was their focus and they remembered her. Its the general public that still wants to see and focus on the differences between Charles and Diana that occurred all those years ago in the War of the Wales. William and Harry most probably do have thoughts and memories from that horrible time for them but as years passed, they moved on and grew and matured and came to love and respect each parent individually as real people and influences in their lives.

They've also learned not to carry grudges. They shed horribly.

 

[Zaira]

IMO, like with most things, the truth is somewhere in the middle. Families are complicated and few have the extra layers the BRF does. I am sure the relationships between the Wales' Men have had its ups and downs. IMO, Harry has seemed especially close to Charles of late. William is focused on his own beautiful family.

I did giggle at this. As if Charles would care that his son is kind to his staff.

Harry regularly brings in coffee from Starbucks to his staff at Kensington Palace, one insider previously told the Daily Beast, popping out to the street in just a baseball cap pulled low for disguise.