Relationships between Members of the British Royal Family

[MRSJ]

I thought Prince William was really fond of the Queen and vica versa and real close to both grandparents?

 

[ghost_night554]

Are you joking me? First off can anyone clarify for me doesn't the Royal Family usually take the bill for the weddings anyways? If so I can't see how that proves William expects his father to pay for everything do we know if maybe his father offered? Secondly he is a 28 year old man...do you really expect to see him with his father that often? Also the Middletons do not have daily engagements to attend to hence why they probably saw William more often. We have no clue if maybe he and his father do other things in private. Didn't Charles get hurt a few years back maybe he prefers to not go skiing anymore to prevent further injury maybe he and his sons have thought of something better they could do in their private life. Honestly we don't know what goes on behind closed doors all we see is what they and/or the press want us to see so we really cannot pass judgments. I mean the same thing applied years ago when Diana was alive we were led to believe Charles didn't spend any time with his children when really he did...just in private as he much preferred in comparison with Diana.

 

[Tyger]

What I do imagine happened is that when the report came out that the Queen and Prince Charles were informed only hours before the engagement announcement was just that.. hours before the ANNOUNCEMENT of the engagement to the public was to take place. I would well imagine that William would have consulted the Queen prior to even proposing to Kate in Kenya and getting her consent first. Also, I would think he would have talked to both Charles and Camilla and feel them out about how they felt about him using his mother's ring for proposing. And the ring... He stated that he was carrying it around with him for 3 weeks in Africa. Do we really believe that until then he kept it in his underwear drawer somewhere? This was well planned out I think before he even proposed.

I honestly think William is quite close with both his grandmother and Charles, Camilla and closest of all to Harry. I would be willing to bet anything that all of them knew of William's intentions before he even popped the question.

This is what I thought, too. I can't imagine something as big as this for the family hasn't been discussed a lot in the immediate family. One can hear him saying - 'Well, Dad, Grandmother, I'm going to ask her this week' - and the response comes back - 'Sounds good, Son, just be sure to call to say how it went. Let us know when the announcement will be going out'.

As for the ring, like mentioned, William would have had to get Diana's ring from the Queen's vault or wherever it was kept. He couldn't do that without 'telling'. Dates for the wedding - all the logistics - the sheer scale of the preparations demand prior discussion. They were secretly engaged anyway, I read, since 2007. I read that somewhere, that William had told Catherine in 2007 that she was 'the one' but he wasn't ready for marriage and he needed her to wait and was she willing and she said okay she would wait.

Are you joking me? First off can anyone clarify for me doesn't the Royal Family usually take the bill for the weddings anyways? If so I can't see how that proves William expects his father to pay for everything do we know if maybe his father offered? Secondly he is a 28 year old man...do you really expect to see him with his father that often? Also the Middletons do not have daily engagements to attend to hence why they probably saw William more often. We have no clue if maybe he and his father do other things in private. Didn't Charles get hurt a few years back maybe he prefers to not go skiing anymore to prevent further injury maybe he and his sons have thought of something better they could do in their private life. Honestly we don't know what goes on behind closed doors all we see is what they and/or the press want us to see so we really cannot pass judgments. I mean the same thing applied years ago when Diana was alive we were led to believe Charles didn't spend any time with his children when really he did...just in private as he much preferred in comparison with Diana.

Totally agree. William is spreading his wings. (No pun!) If there is any lesson to be learned about Charles from the Diana years is that Charles does not 'show' his private life to the public. There is simply no way to know what is happening.

However, its an arresting thought that Iluvbertie brings up that stimulates scenarios. Its going to be interesting - a different world now. William is marrying someone from outside the aristocracy. Catherine has been living at her family's house and William would have been there a lot. All the evidence is that William gets along very well with his soon-to-be In-Laws, even calls Mr Middleton 'Dad'. William is going to have his own life - as he already has - and apparently with more distance from the rythmns of the Queen's family. Catherine says that she is very close to her family, they are very important to her - so in this instance - the woman will be bringing the Royal into her family more strongly than the Royal is setting the agenda with his family. A new world - a definite shift in the 'Royal Life'.

 

[Tyger]

I do think that deep down he does despise his father and his father's family for the way they treated Diana.

Why do you think he depises his father? Very strong word. Almost alarming. Your feeling would be stimulated by some event or facts that convey the impression - what are they?

I think they tried to be close after Diana died but since he meet the Middletons he has distanced himself from his father's side of his family.

I have always felt that it was likely that William was his mother's son. In the pictures and the films one can see that Harry - younger, of course - was attached to his father. I am thinking of a video I saw of Charles and Diana with their sons playing, and Harry at 2 years of age kept running to his father, to the extent of leaving his mother's arms to be with 'Poppa'. It was very sweet. (I have always felt that Diana claiming that Charles made rude comments about Harry at his birth was her way of driving a wedge between father and son at some future time when Harry would inevitably hear what she claimed Charles had said).

I do think that Charles would like to be closer to his sons but they don't want to be with him - maybe it is Camilla, maybe it is they are growing older, maybe it is Diana's influence, maybe they have just nothing in common, but it is a feeling. As I said in my original post I can't say why I feel this way I just do. Six months ago I didn't but now I do.

A lot of assumptions in this - Charles wanting to be closer, how do you 'know' that? They may be plenty close as it is. How do we know? Why would you think they don't want to be with him? These two young men need to be separating from Charles and striking out - its going to look very different because the girls these boys are marrying (I think I know who Harry is going to marry) have strong home lives and family ties that will change how the Royal Family socializes. I'm very curious where this all comes from, Iluvbertie. Its so startling - do you think that Catherine has taken William over, the way wives sometimes can? Is that it? Might not be far off there - especially with Wiliiam and what he's looking for. After all, he didn't venture far or wander extensively. He may be 28 but its not been with a lot of experience. interesting.

 

[Lenora]

Princess Michael of Kent and the members of the royal family

I read once that many members of British Royal Family can't stand Princess Michael.Once she said in an interview"There is always anyone who should be guilty",making a point on her foreign origin.
From other side she made inappropriate comments on Kate Middleton before the engagement.Otherwise she seems to be an easy-going person.

 

[Dierna23]

I believe she rather made this comment in regard to the British press than to the royal family. I'm not sure how their relationships are nowadays, but back in the 80s, Marie-Christine was far from being popular among the family. Apparently she snubbed the Queen and Prince Charles several times. A bad relationship she had with Lord Linley for sure, he was mocking her a few times and it had to do with the fact that his mother Margaret didn't like MC either. Her relationship with Diana had been friendly in the last years of her life, from what I know she's even on friendly terms with Sarah Ferguson nowadays.

I, for one, have always wondered how the relationship between her and Prince Philip may be. She definitely had/has her problems with the Windsors but seemed quite close to the Mountbattens (not only to Lord Mountbatten, the Michael Kents and their children spent the holidays with Norton and Penny [Lord and Lady Romsey], too).

 

[Polly]

I understand what IluvBertie is saying. I've had the sense of a growing distance between Charles and his sons, as well. No doubt, it's a common enough development and intimates nothing out of the ordinary. After all, he's a young man who's lived away from home for many years and has enjoyed a level of personal freedom which even his father didn't enjoy.

On the other hand, there's the opinion of ITV's royal correspondent, James Whittaker. On the night of the engagement, he appeared on television in Australia on a program about William and Catherine. After attacking Catherine and her family as not being 'good enough' and stating that William's friends mock Catherine and her family, and that the Queen Mother would have been 'appalled' by the engagement, he claimed that it was common knowledge that William and Harry simply cannot stand the Duchess of Cornwall and tolerate her merely on their father's behalf and that they only make favourable comments about her when asked specifically to do so to quell rumours. Because of the Duchess, he continued, the brothers spend as little time as possible around their father these days. He was very blunt about it, claiming that it was 'known by all' in royal circles. If he's correct, it would explain any loosening of ties between Charles and his sons and makes William's strong and growing attachment to Catherine's family more understandable.

Whittaker also made the point that Catherine's parents were as nothing in the scheme of things and said that they'd learn this, quickly enough. Even at the wedding, he continued, they'll be less important than nearly everyone else there. Not too many of Catherine's family and friends will be present, he said, as they just won't be welcome. Whether that is the intention or not, I recall William's specific words that his in-laws will be very much a part of his life and not pushed aside (as Mark Phillips' family claims that they were, and Mrs Shand-Kydd, too). I have the distinct impression that William will not permit himself and his wife to be bullied by courtiers as were his mother and the Duchess of York.

It's difficult to know how much of this is true, though Whittaker is in a position to glean most of the gossip, and claims that he only reports what can be proved, and, after all, he was the journalist who 'discovered' and broke the news about Diana's bulimia, to the palace's dismay and to Diana's forever disadvantage.

 

[Zonk]

Thank you for sharing that story Polly.

Frankly, I think that William and Harry did at first just accept Camilla because it made their father happy but over time they have begun to care for her and genuinely like her, but are they besties? Probably not but do they need to be? I didn't have a relationship with my stepmother but as long as she made my father happy than I was happy.

I love it how it all of sudden its all on William on why he is snubbing and being disrespectful to his father because of Diana. This is the man (Charles) who stepped in when Diana died and raised his children. Why would William dislike him? Because the tabloids say he called Charles the day before the engagement was announced? You don't think they talked about it AT ALL before the formal announcement was made?

I noticed something while looking at the old Christmas cards. I really hate to bring it up because really I don't think is the case. But did any notice that once Charles married Camilla, his children were no longer a part of his Christmas card? One could argue that once he married his precious Camilla his kids were no longer a priority.

NOW I am going to go on the record to say, that I don't believe that is the case. I believe William and Harry are just as important to Charles (and vice versa) on the day he married he married Camilla as the day they were born.

My point in opening this can of worms (and yes it is a can) is to show how one can use whatever is available in this internet media to prove a point.

For the record, I believe that Charles has a good relationship with William and Harry. And there is no hidden agenda or reasons on why his children no longer appear on his Christmas card. Tons of grown children don't appear on their parents Christmas cards once they leave the nest.

A lot of the reporting on BRF reminds me of yellow journalism. I found this in the excerpt about William Randolph Hearst on wikipedia where it was suggested that Hearst "routinely invented sensational stories, faked interviews, ran phony pictures and distorted real events."

Reporting of the BRF reminds me of this. And I think that we (the general public) choose to pick and believe what we want based on who we like and don't like. I mean does anyone remember the stories that Camilla was hit with bread when she went to the local market once the story came out when Charles and Diana were married. And it turns out that the story was not true????

Its very clear thru the actions and diaries that the Queen Mother and the Duchess of Windsor didn't care for each other. We have seen nothing like that (even the royal sources) with William and his father.

Just something to think about.

 

[Polly]

Yes, you're right, Zonk. I always consider the source of any story or gossip and one newspaper, in particular, which publishes absurd stories about the BRF, is disgraceful in its pettiness and exaggerations. And so many believe what they read in it, to my utter amazement.

My view about Charles and his relationship with his sons is that few fathers, no matter how much they were under the influence of their wives, would allow a breakdown in their relationship with their children. There is absolutely no evidence that Charles hasn't been and continues to be a supportive father. I don't know what the boys feel about their stepmother, but I do believe that young men in the twenties (one nearly 30) develop separate and independent lives and that this is normal and natural. I can't see that this is in any way remarkable.

As for William's not telling his father and grandparents that he was intending to propose to Catherine, that's arrant nonsense. His future role in the life of the nation would alone have meant that every aspect of his marriage would have been considered: they may not have known that he was going to propose on any specific day, but that's quite another matter.

I was concerned about the Whittaker program, not least because nobody questioned him and his assertions were accepted at face value. An ITV program would have been seen by many, and whereas he's entitled to his views and opinions, responsible reporting also demands a balanced view. These are real people about whom these tales and journalistic flights of fancy are spread, and it irritates me that they're so frequently believed.

 

[MARG]

As for William's not telling his father and grandparents that he was intending to propose to Catherine, that's arrant nonsense. His future role in the life of the nation would alone have meant that every aspect of his marriage would have been considered: they may not have known that he was going to propose on any specific day, but that's quite another matter.

I think I have already pointed out that the Queen and Charles knew all about the announcement before it happened as there is no way that the arrangements for the photo shoot, obviously kept quiet by the media until the moment, would have gotten through the front, side or back gate of the palace environs without members of the Queen and Charles staff being aware of such plans. And arranging a photo call in Granny's house without asking first is just plain rude! OKay, let's face it, they wouldn't have got in the door unless Granny and charles had given prior approval.

Personally I think it is sick the way the Mail is trying to intimate that suddenly William has woken from a long sleep and decided that he loathes his Father, dispises his Stepmother, merely tolerates his Grandparents and is starting to take up his late mother's cudgels against the rest of the BRF, set up his very own private Court and run his father and stepmother out of the running for the throne and show his grandmother is past it. Sick, sick, sick!

This year is supposed to be the finishing touch to his new adult life, with confidence, self-respect and a real job. The cherry on top is his forthcoming marriage to Catherine, and as such should be a time of joy and expectation. Instead it is being turned into some ghastly travesty of malice in the palace. A vicious soap opera piting various members of the BRF against each other, dramatising a distorted history and ensuring a miserable future.

 

[georgiea]

In my opinion, I think the engagement of Prince William and Ms. Middleton was known prior to the announcement by the Prince's father and grandparent. The timing was left to William and Catherine when to make the engagement announcement. I think the photo shot was set up at the last moment. I think the photographer and press would jump at the chance and drop all other commitments that day.

I too felt that there was something up with Prince Charles and his boys. But thinking about it I came to the conclusion that the boys are mature men on their own now. The only thing that still bothers me is the comment by Prince Charles on the day of the engagement. It sounded strange and I thought something was wrong. Does anyone feel that way?

 

[MRSJ]

I think he was trying to maybe make a joke but he sometimes falls flat when trying to kid around

 

[Zonk]

Frankly I thought that the comment came across as awkward and inappropriate.

Surely, that might have been a thought in your mind, doesn't mean you need to verbalize it.

 

[Mermaid1962]

Yes, I agree. Prince Charles seemed a little bit irritated, in fact.

Frankly I thought that the comment came across as awkward and inappropriate.

 

[Roslyn]

I thought Charles' comment was funny. Uncharacteristically candid, and surprising in the circumstances, but jolly funny nevertheless.

I saw the Whittaker program Poly mentioned, but chose to put it out of my mind till reading these comments now. I decided to ignore what he said, in the hope that it is not true. If it is true, it is a little sad, but I wouldn't be surprised if there were some conflict between William and Charles, who both seem to be determined men. If what Whittaker said about William and Harry not liking Camilla is true, I hope William will remain loyal to his wife and her family, just as I hope Charles remains loyal to his wife and continues to support her. Charles' sons are adults and they live independent lives. All parties just need to be co-operative and civil to one another. As long as there is no outfight, public feuding, promoted by the likes of Whittaker, I don't see a problem.

 

[HM Queen Catherine]

At the very least, the Queen, Prince Philip and Prince Charles all knew about William's engagement well in advance.. it would be ridiculous to believe otherwise when Prince William is required to request the Queen's consent under the Royal Marriages Act of 1772.

Without her consent and declaration in Council, his marriage would be null and void. Granted, he is old enough to marry without her consent, but only after making his intentions known in Privy Council and waiting it out for a year before a marriage takes place.

So of course they knew.

William himself said in the interview after the announcement that he knew he wanted to marry Catherine, it was just a matter of timing. This makes me think the BRF has known for some time about William's intentions.

As far as his relationships within the BRF, I would say that Charles and his sons are as close as they are likely to be now that the boys are grown men with lives of their own. I see nothing wrong in that. If anything, there is one key difference between them.. and that is the fact that Charles has been the heir practically his entire life and has lived under the stress and restrictions that status has imposed upon him.

Things may have been much different for him if George VI had lived and his mother had become Queen much later than she did. As it is, Charles has only known how to live in that fishbowl.. and his sons have been allowed to swim in the river, so to speak. For William and Harry, their father has also been the buffer between them and royal duty.

It certainly cannot have been easy to accept Camilla as a stepmother, knowing her role in the breakup of their parents marriage. But the fact is, they did accept her as far as they are able.. despite whatever personal feelings they may have, the public will never know the full truth of that particular relationship.

 

[Tyger]

Personally I think it is sick the way the Mail is trying to intimate that suddenly William has woken from a long sleep and decided that he loathes his Father...

Agree with you 100%. At first I took it as true and was deciding to swear off the British Royals (fashion sense be 'darned'! ). The last thing I am interested in witnessing is a re-run of the Diana-Years vitriol and drama. Then I considered more.

If true, on first hearing it is a serious disappointment. Yet, as some have pointed out, the role of step-parent is not an easy one even in the best of circumstances. (The evil step-mother in fairy tales is there as a stereotype for a reason). Its just that the dysfunction of the Diana-Years was so extreme and hyjacked all normality in the press that I let out a huge groan, like at the prospect of being tortured in a familiar way. Please lets not have a repeat with her sons being jerks!

Of course the RF (and Charles) knew about the engagement - but potentially not the exact day of the announcement. We now know that there was an understanding for the last 3 years. Catherine had been attending functions in a very 'official looking' way, too.

I, too, found Charles' comment to be funny. I can hear a couple of my own friends saying much the same thing regarding their altar-shy children.

But then there is the larger possibility of a mountain-out-of-a-mole-hill. All children - especially teenagers - have their opinions and voice them. We don't know the context for this 'information', either. But more significantly - good news doesn't sell. If the Royal Family is viewed as getting along its starts looking boring. William starts looking boring - but a conjured conflict - whether of genuine parts or manufactured outright - why, that will start the papers selling, people tuning into the wedding to watch the interactions between the Royals. In the end my cynicism has kicked in - and the old dictum 'follow the money', or as they say in criminal investigations, 'who benefits from the crime?' In this case 'all roads lead to Rome' - to the same place/conclusion - Money! Someone is going to write a book. And the games begin.

 

[wa3kittiees]

I see no evidence of disharmony between Charles & his sons
all 3 have always looked happy & pleased to be with each other ... even at Charles' wedding to Camilla
I think whatever distance people see between Charles & his sons is a simple fact of life
William & Harry are young men making their own lives ... having careers & relationships
all children separate from their parents to some extent ... it is normal

I watched a news program a few weeks ago about William & Harry in Africa; what struck me was how the journalist kept talking about Diana's charity work & William kept stating that his father has done much too for charities around the world; William stated that his father's charity work was as much an influnece as his mother's charity work; I believe this Africa trip was within the past 2 years
doesn't sound like William despises his father ... unless something rather drastic has changed

 

[Tyger]

Thank you for this. Especially regarding William sticking up for his father. I had always seen him do that in interviews. I was entertaining this new twist even though it was so disappointing to me. Usually children of a dysfunctional parent/situation have a pretty good bead on the reality of the situation and I had assumed as much with William and Harry.

 

[Osipi]

Thank you for this. Especially regarding William sticking up for his father. I had always seen him do that in interviews. I was entertaining this new twist even though it was so disappointing to me. Usually children of a dysfunctional parent/situation have a pretty good bead on the reality of the situation and I had assumed as much with William and Harry.

I will say, if Earl Spencer speaks at the wedding, my opinion of William will plummet. Poor judgment.

I don't really recall anyone having someone give a speech during the wedding ceremony itself. It could be that the wording got a bit twisted around and perhaps William and Kate will ask Earl Spencer to do one of the readings during the ceremony similar to what either Beatrice or Eugenie did for Peter and Autumn Phillips wedding.

I think both William and Kate are going to make sure that everyone is going to feel equally important in their roles they play for their wedding. I think William would feel it is a necessity that the families of both of his parents play an essential part in their day.

 

[Tyger]

I don't really recall anyone having someone give a speech during the wedding ceremony itself. It could be that the wording got a bit twisted around and perhaps William and Kate will ask Earl Spencer to do one of the readings during the ceremony similar to what either Beatrice or Eugenie did for Peter and Autumn Phillips wedding.

I think both William and Kate are going to make sure that everyone is going to feel equally important in their roles they play for their wedding. I think William would feel it is a necessity that the families of both of his parents play an essential part in their day.

Thank you, Osipi, for the perspective. You are quite right.

 

[casualfan]

Stepmom

I am really curious as to the relationship between William and Harry and their stepmother, Camilla. Considering the baggage of their father's relationships with his present wife, what is the best we could expect?

 

[Lumutqueen]

Apparently they get on very well.

 

[Kataryn]

They "love her to bits" said Harry. It s known she is a very warm-hearted, loving and caring lady who enjoys her family, so I guess William and Harry enjoy being part of her family as well.

 

[rossop7]

I've read that they like her as she makes their father happy so whatever makes him happy, makes them happy.

 

[muriel]

See article below (follow link to Telegraph website). Clearly Camilla has a good relationship with William, but I am sure both the boys and Camilla are mindful of the events of the last few decades and tread carefully.


Royal wedding: Duchess of Cornwall encouraged Prince William to give Kate Middleton time to 'back out' - Telegraph

Royal wedding: Duchess of Cornwall encouraged Prince William to give Kate Middleton time to 'back out'

The Duchess of Cornwall and the Duke of Edinburgh were instrumental in Prince William's strategy for giving Kate Middleton time to "back out" of marrying him


The Prince and Miss Middleton started discussing the possibility of an engagement when they got back together after a brief split in 2007, but the Prince decided he wanted to give his girlfriend plenty of time to get used to the realities of joining the Royal family.

Sources close to the Prince told The Daily Telegraph that while he had regular discussions with his father, the Prince of Wales, about the timing of a marriage proposal, he was also keen to hear the views of his stepmother and his grandfather.

"The Duchess has been an important figure in the planning of the engagement," said one well-placed source.

 

[Hissy]

Of course all of these articles with quotes from "royal insiders" etc. could be pure fiction either way. Yet the feeling I get is Camilla may have expressed something like that even if not asked because she has been in that position many years ago, and then obviously more recently which is somewhat unique.

I can't say for certain if Camilla and William have a great relationship since it must be tough to balance wanting to be loyal to his mother, and pleasing his father/liking Camilla. Yet I haven't seen anything suggesting they aren't nice to each other. Some times when you want advice you will seek it from a source less close to you to get a less biased view.

I don't care much for Kate/Catherine but I have to hope all these senior members of the royal family that the article suggests know what is best for William and that this marriage will be able to work. In as so far as they, or we, can predict that.

A lot of Diana supporters dislike Camilla for her being the "third party" in her marriage, but I'm thinking if she was young and beautiful nobody would have cared too much. They seem to me to have a mature, and suited to each other relationship. There's something sort of romantic about being apart all those years (mostly) and married to others and yet many years later finding their way back together.

 

[Zonk]

We are not going to turn this thread into a retread of the Camilla/Charles/Diana triangle.

 

[Irish Eyes]

Express.co.uk - Home of the Daily and Sunday Express | Columnists :: Why Charles barely talks with Andrew-

Not much brotherly love between the Princes if this is to be believed.

 

[Iluvbertie]

Express.co.uk - Home of the Daily and Sunday Express | Columnists :: Why Charles barely talks with Andrew-

Not much brotherly love between the Princes if this is to be believed.

Watching the body language when the royals are together I get the distinct feeling that most of the Queen's children barely talk to each other but that Andrew is on the outer with all of them - and has been for years.