Relationships between Members of the British Royal Family

[O-H Anglophile]

More info about family get togethers from Mike Tindall--

https://people.com/royals/royal-fam...082719&utm_medium=email&utm_source=people.com

 

[MARG]

That sounds like a great way to keep in touch and be able to plan "family" get-togethers. When you think about it there are lots of kids and lots to adults to share the fun and the irritation so let shared by this group.

 

[Dman]

Back in 2016 when Prince Harry issued a statement regarding the mistreatment of Meghan, Prince William issued a statement of support. Has William given any public support for Harry's recent statement on the press he made at the end of his and Meghan's tour?

Nope. We haven’t seen an ounce of support towards Meghan from members of the royal family on the evident smear campaign that’s been launched against her nor any support for Harry’s statement. Which is just sad, IMO.

 

[Iluvbertie]

There maybe a number of reasons for the apparent lack of support:

1. They were blindsided by Harry and Meghan's actions and so by not saying anything are showing that fact

2. They don't believe that the actions are the way to go - remember 'never explain, never complain' has been the Queen's motto for her entire reign

3. They don't actually support Harry and Meghan in their complaints and aren't prepared to lie

4. They believe Harry and Meghan are over-reacting to the same sort of stories that came out about Catherine when she married William - and even before when she was dating him

5. There really is a split in the BRF and Harry and Meghan are becoming loose cannons with which the rest of the family don't want to be connected.

I am sure there could be many other reasons for the lack of support. That lack of support is the loudest evidence of a breakdown in the relationship between Harry and his family since he married Meghan.

 

[Ista]

It's also possible that on a private level everyone is extremely supportive of Harry and Meghan and we just aren't hearing about it. We already know that we only are ever aware of an extremely small proportion of what goes on within the BRF. I don't think the fact that members of the BRF aren't putting out press releases about this means much of anything.

 

[Somebody]

To me the most telling is the publishing of Harry's statement on their private website (including a statement they will personally pay for it) and not through the normal BRF channels. That doesn't sound as if all are in agreement with what's happening (maybe with parts of it but probably not with a full-blown attack on the media including an explanatory letter).

 

[Rudolph]

Back in 2016 reports made it clear Harry consulted with William and both were on the same page. Also it was reported HMQ and Prince Charles were in full support.

This time around we aren’t getting that. We are told the Queen was ‘informed’ about the lawsuit on the night the statement was circulated to the press.

God knows but the tone does seem markedly different.

 

[O-H Anglophile]

Other than maybe the Queen, do we really think every time a member of the British Royal Family has sued a media outlet that they spent public money on lawyers? I would guess absolutely no. I think Harry was being pre-emptive, so that couldn't be a story.

I agree with Ista, it doesn't mean support is not happening just because they don't choose to broadcast their private family affairs all over social media.

 

[duchessrachel]

There maybe a number of reasons for the apparent lack of support:

1. They were blindsided by Harry and Meghan's actions and so by not saying anything are showing that fact

2. They don't believe that the actions are the way to go - remember 'never explain, never complain' has been the Queen's motto for her entire reign

3. They don't actually support Harry and Meghan in their complaints and aren't prepared to lie

4. They believe Harry and Meghan are over-reacting to the same sort of stories that came out about Catherine when she married William - and even before when she was dating him

5. There really is a split in the BRF and Harry and Meghan are becoming loose cannons with which the rest of the family don't want to be connected.

I am sure there could be many other reasons for the lack of support. That lack of support is the loudest evidence of a breakdown in the relationship between Harry and his family since he married Meghan.

I agree with those reasons and feel that what Harry and Meghan did was not the way to go. I think that the silence from the family on Harry's statement, given the blowback to it from the press, is loud and clear that they don't agree with it. I don't believe that Harry and Meghan are going to gain any thing from this approach. Not many people want to hear the highly privileged complain.

 

[Gawin]

I suspect the BRF may support Harry & Meghan up to a point. The lawsuits, yes, but Harry's statement, probably not.

 

[duchessrachel]

I suspect the BRF may support Harry & Meghan up to a point. The lawsuits, yes, but Harry's statement, probably not.

Exactly. Let the lawsuit do the speaking.

 

[Dman]

You know what shocks me? William appear to be very passionate about being against cyberbullying. He even worked with the BBC on an app to help prevent cyberbullying. His sister-in-law has been cyber bullied for months on end and we haven’t heard a peep out of William’s mouth about it.

Now, it may be the fact that the family is showing support for Meghan and Harry behind the scenes, but it would do a world of good if the family showed their support for Meghan more publicly. I believe one of the reasons why the outside forces feel like they’re free to abuse Meghan on the net is because they’re not getting any push back from anyone high up behind the palace walls. They’re not getting a raised eyebrow from The Queen, The Prince of Wales nor The Duke of Cambridge. The same people who would quickly raise an eyebrow if this was happening to Camilla and Catherine. Yes, Camilla and Catherine has had their fair share of criticism from the outside forces, but what Meghan is being hit with is on a total different level. A level that’s begging for someone behind the palace walls to really make a statement about it.

Harry stepped up to the plate, of course. She’s his wife and mother to his son. The love of his life. But where in the hell is Meghan’s in-laws?

 

[Somebody]

So, what would you suggest the other royals exactly do to show their support?

Releasing a video in which both the duke and duchess of Cambridge and of Sussex feature seems a sign that they are (at least on some issues) on the same page.

 

[Dman]

So, what would you suggest the other royals exactly do to show their support?

Releasing a video in which both the duke and duchess of Cambridge and of Sussex feature seems a sign that they are (at least on some issues) on the same page.

Somebody could release a statement. Somebody could have their courtiers make it known to the outside forces that they’re “Not Amused” by this campaign. Somebody could conduct some one-on-one official engagements with their granddaughter-in-law, daughter-in-law and sister-in-law. They can show their support for Meghan publicly by making in known they’re not okay with this ongoing campaign against her and they stand by her. They can do that.

 

[Somebody]

Somebody could release a statement. Somebody could have their courtiers make it known to the outside forces that they’re “Not Amused” by this campaign. Somebody could conduct some one-on-one official engagements with their granddaughter-in-law, daughter-in-law and sister-in-law. They can show their support for Meghan publicly by making in known they’re not okay with this ongoing campaign against her and they stand by her. They can do that.

Thanks!

Let's look at the options:
1. Release a statement seems far-fetched and not realistic. I don't think that was done before nor do I think that would reflect good on H&M.
2. Have the courtiers make it known that... - Seems a realistic option but those message can be misconstrued.
3. Have one-on-one official engagements: Catherine had one during Meghan's maternity leave. They also had an unofficial outing together but there was little interaction between the two families. For the official ones, Meghan only started again very recently and seems mostly focused on her own projects. Nonetheless, the Cambridges did a video message with the Sussexes. So, well done I'd say. Maybe the others can follow suit. The main advantage of this message is that is shows their support without rubbing it in people's faces as if the Sussexes need the family members to help them out.
4. Making it known that - not sure how that differs from 1 and/or 2; as they either speak out themselves (1) or do it indirectly (2).

 

[O-H Anglophile]

Somebody could release a statement. Somebody could have their courtiers make it known to the outside forces that they’re “Not Amused” by this campaign. Somebody could conduct some one-on-one official engagements with their granddaughter-in-law, daughter-in-law and sister-in-law. They can show their support for Meghan publicly by making in known they’re not okay with this ongoing campaign against her and they stand by her. They can do that.

As Meghan has mostly been on maternity leave until very recently, it would have been a little difficult to have had an official engagement with her over the past 6 months or so. Kate & Meghan did attend Wimbledon together one day this summer. If Harry & Meghan had visited Balmoral or Birkhall during the past couple months, they could have been seen with the Queen and/or Charles.

 

[Osipi]

We just saw that Will, Kate, Harry and Meghan worked together on a project for Heads Together.

These lawsuits are a personal thing for the Sussexes and they're handling it how they see fit. They're paying for it. If it was my husband and I doing this, we wouldn't have to get the "approval" of both sides of our family or expect them to issue statements or be "seen" with us.

These lawsuits have absolutely nothing to do with the "Firm" or any of the royal charities and patronages in their public life besides announcing that if the copyright lawsuit is won, monies will go to an anti-bullying campaign.

I just don't see any reason the rest of the BRF needs to go "public" with any kind of support for this. What matters is if they have support privately and that's probably something we're never going to know.

 

[Archduchess Zelia]

You know what shocks me? William appear to be very passionate about being against cyberbullying. He even worked with the BBC on an app to help prevent cyberbullying. His sister-in-law has been cyber bullied for months on end and we haven’t heard a peep out of William’s mouth about it.

Now, it may be the fact that the family is showing support for Meghan and Harry behind the scenes, but it would do a world of good if the family showed their support for Meghan more publicly. I believe one of the reasons why the outside forces feel like they’re free to abuse Meghan on the net is because they’re not getting any push back from anyone high up behind the palace walls. They’re not getting a raised eyebrow from The Queen, The Prince of Wales nor The Duke of Cambridge. The same people who would quickly raise an eyebrow if this was happening to Camilla and Catherine. Yes, Camilla and Catherine has had their fair share of criticism from the outside forces, but what Meghan is being hit with is on a total different level. A level that’s begging for someone behind the palace walls to really make a statement about it.

Harry stepped up to the plate, of course. She’s his wife and mother to his son. The love of his life. But where in the hell is Meghan’s in-laws?

I think you've hit the nail on the head there. Could be a fear of taking on the tabloids and thus potentially ending up at the same receiving end of the abuse as Meghan (and Harry). Or just a fear of getting involved. (Which wouldn't exactly be new to the BRF who are notoriously vague in most things they do as compared to their European counterparts).

But I really don't understand it either. Aside from the illogicality in seeing a family member receive abuse of the extend Meghan is receiving for her every breath and reacting with silence, it also does nothing but feed the instigators with more ammunition to shoot at someone they (HM, Charles and the Cambridges) supposedly are on the same side as. And it's also a very... interesting stance from a "first they came"-point of view.

Thanks!

Let's look at the options:
1. Release a statement seems far-fetched and not realistic. I don't think that was done before nor do I think that would reflect good on H&M.
2. Have the courtiers make it known that... - Seems a realistic option but those message can be misconstrued.
3. Have one-on-one official engagements: Catherine had one during Meghan's maternity leave. They also had an unofficial outing together but there was little interaction between the two families. For the official ones, Meghan only started again very recently and seems mostly focused on her own projects. Nonetheless, the Cambridges did a video message with the Sussexes. So, well done I'd say. Maybe the others can follow suit. The main advantage of this message is that is shows their support without rubbing it in people's faces as if the Sussexes need the family members to help them out.
4. Making it known that - not sure how that differs from 1 and/or 2; as they either speak out themselves (1) or do it indirectly (2).

#1: How on earth would a statement of support end up reflecting badly on H&M?

#2: If the message is relayed clearly by the courtiers, it'll be misconstrued only by people who wish to misconstrue it. And in my experience, those people are not the ones you'd wanna reach by backing H&M because those people have no real interest in a nuanced view of the world. (The same goes for #1 – to that same crowd, everything involving H&M reflects badly on H&M but they're also not the target of such a statement).

#4: There are many other ways to make their support known than through a statement or through others. Crown Prince Frederik of Denmark's subtle support to his mother when his father decided to abandon their plans to be buried together comes to my mind. "I can only say that in many ways I'm very saddened by my father's decision." That wasn't an outright stab at his father but there was also no doubt about his feelings on the matter. Nothing is stopping HM and perhaps specifically Charles and the Cambridges from making a comment similar in style to that. Or as Dman mentions, an obvious opportunity could be to channel it through the subject of bullying. It really doesn't have to be rocket science.

 

[sndral]

When William and Catherine decided to pursue the Closer suit over the nude pix did any other member of the RF issue a public statement?
When Charles sued over publication of his letters did anyone else issue a statement in support?
I don’t recall any statements in support in similar situations, and more importantly, I don’t recall any hand wringing over their absence.
To me this is just a press gambit trying to stir up more controversy ala ‘see, the important royals agree w/ us.’
When a suit has been filed most lawyers tell their clients to zip it, thus I distinguish William’s support of Harry’s statement regarding dating Meghan as no lawsuit was involved.
The reference to privately funding the suit was most likely to derail claims they were misusing taxpayers’ money.

 

[Curryong]

I also agree with Dman. There are things that the other royals could have done to be much more supportive, and high on the list IMO would be some subtle and not so subtle hints privately to the outside forces to just back off this 'new member of our family'. It's been done successfully in the past, why not now?

Not much point in my view in supporting people privately if you aren't prepared to do something to help one who is under constant attack. A joint engagement or two in the next month might not come amiss either.

 

[Dman]

I’m just stating that the family can show their support for her. Remaining silent and not being seen with Meghan is reinforcing the outside forces narrative that this couple is alone and it’s letting us know (or at least me) that they really don’t care about what Meghan is being put through. That she deserve this campaign launched against her.

So, now that, Meghan, is off of maternity leave, I think we should see some family love around here.

 

[ACO]

So the four of them release a campaign video together and in the same night we have a reporter saying William has "dropped his brother like hot bricks" while also saying Meghan should fix her relationship with her dad but not William with his brother? My head is spinning.

Sorry if I am not quick to believe Palmer as he is the same man who was made to look a fool cause he used Samantha Markle as a source and she purposely lied to prove a point and he fell right for it. Also Palmer has been called out on his errors plenty as of late.

So do I think there is tension with the brothers? Yes but I also think Palmer is looking for clicks and doing what the press does.

 

[Dman]

So the four of them release a campaign video together and in the same night we have a reporter saying William has "dropped his brother like hot bricks" while also saying Meghan should fix her relationship with her dad but not William with his brother? My head is spinning.

Sorry if I am not quick to believe Palmer as he is the same man who was made to look a fool cause he used Samantha Markle as a source and she purposely lied to prove a point and he fell right for it. Also Palmer has been called out on his errors plenty as of late.

So do I think there is tension with the brothers? Yes but I also think Palmer is looking for clicks and doing what the press does.

I don’t know what’s gotten into that man lately. It’s so unlike him to do what he’s doing.

We should be seeing some family love and less distance; especially during this time. Meghan’s father side of the family have betrayed her. Her mother lives all the way in California. The only family she have near her in the U.K. is Harry, Archie and the royal family. So her in-laws should be rallying around her, instead of remaining so silent and distant in the face of this smear campaign.

 

[Iluvbertie]

She herself dropped her family for some reason ... who knows but there are many rumours.

The BRF welcomed her with open arms but they aren't being supportive of her and Harry, publicly now. Why not? We will probably never know but the fact that not one of them have spoken out in support suggests that she and/or Harry is doing something wrong in their eyes.

Families don't have to support each other all the time. Families fall out all the time, all over the world. Why should be BRF be any different?

If they aren't showing 'love' there will be a reason. They aren't a fairytale - they are real people. They know Meghan and Harry. We don't. We shouldn't try and expect them to behave as if they always are lovey dovey with each other when, like other families, they will argue, fight, support each other etc. When someone stuffs up they will let them know and when someone does something well they will let them know.

I do see the lack of public support as a sign of a lack of private support as well. If the rumours are true that Harry didn't even consult with The Queen, Charles or William then that would explain why they aren't coming out and supporting him now.

 

[ACO]

Meghan had no relationship with her family long before she was in the royal circle. People trying to connect the two is weird to me especially when even now Thomas is talking to the tabloids apparently admitting he hasn't physically seen her since 2015. It is hardly difficult to understand why she keeps her distance. Not all families are close. If you are bless with a stable, loving family then that is amazing. Not all are that lucky.

I remember in 2016 when Harry's first statement came out all the papers proclaiming William did not approve and was against Harry defending his girlfriend. Then William had to release a statement in support. I don't see that happening now other than Palmer's random quote. But I would imagine Palmer is trying to provoke another reaction from either William or Charles.

We shall see how it plays out but it appears the media are trying to pit the family against each other. Definitely will sell more papers this way. I expect a lot more of this Harry vs William to come since Meghan vs Kate has fallen flat.

 

[MARG]

I also agree with Dman. There are things that the other royals could have done to be much more supportive, and high on the list IMO would be some subtle and not so subtle hints privately to the outside forces to just back off this 'new member of our family'. It's been done successfully in the past, why not now?

Not much point in my view in supporting people privately if you aren't prepared to do something to help one who is under constant attack. A joint engagement or two in the next month might not come amiss either.

I totally agree and am actually starting to believe to gossip about
William not being too keen on Harry and Her and if so, his opinion hasn't changed as he has done absolutely nothing to give the appearance that he even likes her let alone approves. Especially when you look at how Harry went out of his way to let everyone see he liked and approved of his brother's choice.
Ah but there are already clips online stating the Yorks don't want the Sussexes anywhere near Beatrice's wedding . . . yada, yada, yada.

I’m just stating that the family can show their support for her. Remaining silent and not being seen with Meghan is reinforcing the outside forces narrative that this couple is alone and it’s letting us know (or at least me) that they really don’t care about what Meghan is being put through. That she deserves this campaign launched against her.

So, now that, Meghan, is off of maternity leave, I think we should see some family love around here.

I am definitely disappointed in the younger generation. HM and even Prince Charles and Princess Anne for that matter are generational of the never complain, never explain and it works for that generation. They write letters and even though Camilla has lightened Charles up and he smiles very genuinely at Meghan and Harry, there just aren't enough occasions when we see them all together.

The younger generation know how it is done via media, pics at the polo or the horse show, etc. But they have made no move to share that private/public time with Harry and Meghan and now they are starting on Meghan "stealing Eugenie's thunder" because of her pregnancy. To me it seems they are definitely on their own.

 

[Osipi]

There's another way to look at this too. When we look at the lawsuits, themselves, what jumps out at us is that these lawsuits are aimed at one aspect of their public life. The press. The royal reporters, such as Richard Palmer, work for said press.

I've seen over and over where a lot of people believe that the Queen, Charles, William among others should somehow show their support for what Harry and Meghan are now going through by releasing some kind of statement of support. Now, think about it. Should these people issue a statement, who is going to pick up on it and deliver it to the general public. The press and the royal reporters that work for said press. Perhaps the BRF solidarity is not giving the press and inch to make a mile with as they've been proven to do.

Other than the announcement of the lawsuit against the Mail On Sunday and Harry's heartfelt statement, there has been *nothing* whatsoever that is coming out from the palaces, the personal and public social media accounts or even a statement dropped here or there regarding this. The press, however is all over it and doing with it what they do best. Getting the public in an uproar over how the BRF is "acting".

To me, this has the kind of feeling from the press that we saw in the aftermath of Diana's death that was aimed at the Queen. Ye olde "show us you care" kind of bleating from the press in screaming letters. With no response from the BRF, the thinking is then again aimed to how *awful* the BRF are and there's some kind of inside familial war going on. This is what the press wants you to focus on and wants you to talk about. Not how awful and degrading and pushing their own agendas that has been happening for far too long.

Perhaps we're not seeing the solidarity of the entire BRF as a silent and strong wall against these stories because they're staying strong, staying together and not giving an inch and doing what they do best. Continuing their public roles, never explaining or complaining and let the lawsuits speak for themselves from here on out.

Lets face it. We only get our information on all this from the press and they're not really in good favor right now and *need* to redirect attention from what the MoS is facing and the group action suit against the others. Remember too when Diana died, it was the Queen that personally aired a speech honoring her. I don't believe she'd do this because of a lawsuit. In fact, I'd not be surprised if attorneys have actually advised the BRF to keep quiet about all this and let the justice system do their jobs.

 

[muriel]

The BRF welcomed her with open arms but they aren't being supportive of her and Harry, publicly now. Why not? We will probably never know but the fact that not one of them have spoken out in support suggests that she and/or Harry is doing something wrong in their eyes.

Families don't have to support each other all the time. Families fall out all the time, all over the world. Why should be BRF be any different?

If they aren't showing 'love' there will be a reason. They aren't a fairytale - they are real people. They know Meghan and Harry. We don't. We shouldn't try and expect them to behave as if they always are lovey dovey with each other when, like other families, they will argue, fight, support each other etc. When someone stuffs up they will let them know and when someone does something well they will let them know.

I do see the lack of public support as a sign of a lack of private support as well. If the rumours are true that Harry didn't even consult with The Queen, Charles or William then that would explain why they aren't coming out and supporting him now.

I tend to broadly agree with you. Some thoughts:

> Personally, I do not see why the family have to publicly support H&M in any way in relation to the lawsuits. Support can and should be private, IMO. The family does not put out public statements typically in similar situations.

> Perhaps the family do not approve of the lawsuit or the way H&M are conducting themselves. Whilst the Queen, Charles and William are family to H&M, in a hierarchical organisation, they are also the "Bosses". Therefore, the relationship between H&M and the Queen, Charles and William is not just familial, but also "professional", and it is entirely possible the "Bosses" disagree with or disapprove of some of what or how H&M have done some things, whatever they may be.

> If it is true, as rumoured, that the Queen, Charles and William were only informed shortly before or worse, after the publication of the public statement from Harry, I can see grounds for displeasure.

 

[Ista]

I tend to broadly agree with you. Some thoughts:

> Personally, I do not see why the family have to publicly support H&M in any way in relation to the lawsuits. Support can and should be private, IMO. The family does not put out public statements typically in similar situations.

> Perhaps the family do not approve of the lawsuit or the way H&M are conducting themselves. Whilst the Queen, Charles and William are family to H&M, in a hierarchical organisation, they are also the "Bosses". Therefore, the relationship between H&M and the Queen, Charles and William is not just familial, but also "professional", and it is entirely possible the "Bosses" disagree with or disapprove of some of what or how H&M have done some things, whatever they may be.

> If it is true, as rumoured, that the Queen, Charles and William were only informed shortly before or worse, after the publication of the public statement from Harry, I can see grounds for displeasure.

These are good points, but the one that especially giving me food for thought is the last one. The odd timing of the release of the letter and announcement of the lawsuit (yes, I know that apparently it was done to make sure the suit was heard in a favorable court) which could be seen as unprofessional since it came before the end of the official tour, had all the signs that BP and CH were taken by surprise. That does seem to point to the fact that the Sussexes had not consulted with "the bosses" in advance, about the letter and perhaps the timing of the annnouncement of the suit. The lack of any kind of official statement that definitely squashed that speculation would seem to corroborate the notion that it all came as a bit of a surprise.

I really don't know what to make of all this, but when you consider it in conjunction with other decisions that the Sussexes have made over the last year and a half, it is beginning to seem as though there is a definite pattern emerging, and I'm also beginning to wonder if it is sustainable in the long term. If the working members of the BRF are "The Firm," you cannot have members of a firm who don't work within the rules of the organization, and one of those rules has always been that you don't blindside the Queen and now Prince Charles. We have no idea if that is what happened, but some of this does seems suggestive that that is exactly what may have occurred.

 

[muriel]

These are good points, but the one that especially giving me food for thought is the last one. The odd timing of the release of the letter and announcement of the lawsuit (yes, I know that apparently it was done to make sure the suit was heard in a favorable court) which could be seen as unprofessional since it came before the end of the official tour, had all the signs that BP and CH were taken by surprise. That does seem to point to the fact that the Sussexes had not consulted with "the bosses" in advance, about the letter and perhaps the timing of the annnouncement of the suit. The lack of any kind of official statement that definitely squashed that speculation would seem to corroborate the notion that it all came as a bit of a surprise.

I really don't know what to make of all this, but when you consider it in conjunction with other decisions that the Sussexes have made over the last year and a half, it is beginning to seem as though there is a definite pattern emerging, and I'm also beginning to wonder if it is sustainable in the long term. If the working members of the BRF are "The Firm," you cannot have members of a firm who don't work within the rules of the organization, and one of those rules has always been that you don't blindside the Queen and now Prince Charles. We have no idea if that is what happened, but some of this does seems suggestive that that is exactly what may have occurred.

I think that is right. Habitually stepping outside "the rules" is not going to be looked upon favourably by the "Bosses" ad infinitum. Then again, none of us really know what is actually going on, and to that extent, this is speculation.