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  #761  
Old 11-26-2018, 10:27 AM
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BTW, all this suggested drama because The Sussexes chose to live in Windsor rather than London and living literally next to the Cambridges. Was there the same supposed drama and tension when Cambridges made Anmer their primary residence and left poor ole Harry in London?
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  #762  
Old 11-26-2018, 10:38 AM
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BTW, all this suggested drama because The Sussexes chose to live in Windsor rather than London and living literally next to the Cambridges. Was there the same supposed drama and tension when Cambridges made Anmer their primary residence and left poor ole Harry in London?
Thatís how it all got started. Everyone knows that William and Harry are extremely close brothers. The Dukeís are grown men; one with a large family and one just starting his own family. It was obvious from the very beginning that Harry and Meghan was going to move from their small cottage to their own family home. Itís perfectly natural for them to establish their own official residences.
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  #763  
Old 11-26-2018, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by jacqui24 View Post
I do have to chuckle at the fact that some detractors pointed out that someone like Anne who is no nonsense would have no patience of Meghan from very early on. Yet, it seems to me now that Anne, who is very much a hard worker and takes no nonsense, seem to get along quite well with her nephew’s new wife. It’s an interesting thing to see Meghan being labeled “demanding and difficult” and someone like Anne who has been labeled negatively in her own way until quite recently for daring to be no nonsense.

As for Meghan and Kate being different and not close. No ****. Two different women who had completely different lives and different outtakes aren’t besties? I’ve always found the narrative that Meghan is going to Kate for all kinds of advice and Harry needing Kate’s approval being he moves forward with Meghan to be laughable. Meghan and Kate met when they are in their mid thirties having had very different experiences and their own close circles. They’ll obv be cordial as they are married to two brothers, but expecting them to be BFFs is just some fantasy that some cooked up.
I agree with you.
And especially I also found that narrative that Harry needed Kate's approval before moving forward with Meghan quite laughable ...
  #764  
Old 11-26-2018, 01:54 PM
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I really do wish sometimes that we could have a thread where we all just lay out our opinions and impressions of each member of the royal family. In many threads but especially this one there are so many thinly veiled jabs and references...it would be nice to just sort of lay it all out there. But I digress.

I don't honestly believe that William and Harry are anywhere near as close as many people would like to believe they are. For what it's worth, I wish they were because I would love to see the interactions that we see in the Swedish RF with aunts, uncles, siblings, nieces/nephews, etc. but that just simply isn't the case and I don't really think it has been for a very long time. I will say that I miss the interactions between Harry and Catherine because I do think they genuinely enjoyed each other's company and it was nice to see a giggle, a joke, etc. but I think we can probably all agree that those days are gone. I also don't think that Meghan and Catherine are particularly close. Cordial, yes but not close. I think many of us would love to see a tight knit foursome with lots of public interactions, time in private and public with the children, etc. but I just really don't get the impression that that is ever going to happen. It's nice to get the glimpses of the Cambridges with the Phillips and Tindalls and the photographs for the PoW's birthday were really, really lovely and let us in on a side that we don't often get to see between Charles/Camilla and the children but sadly, I just don't really ever think we'll get to see the Cambridge/Sussex children or wives playing, visiting, enjoying each other's company.

Now, that's not all said to lay a rift at Meghan's doorstep like I'm sure I'll be accused of doing, but the truth is that her presence changes the nature of the relationships between the Cambridges and Harry and while I very much hope that Harry is blissfully happy, some of those changes are maybe not for the better. Those relationships were bound to change no matter who Harry ended up with but I think that's probably amplified a bit considering that Meghan appears to be used to being on her own and not close with her family vs. Catherine being very close to her family and therefore Meghan may not see the value or feel the need for close family relationships the way that the Cambridges might. Simply my two cents and really more an observation than anything but I think people really are going to be sorely disappointed if they continue to hope for "happy families" types of interactions at public events or snapped pictures of cozy little foursome dinners in pubs or playdates at polo matches.
  #765  
Old 11-26-2018, 02:02 PM
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It’s a little early to write off the possibility of interaction between the Sussex and Wales families. It’s only 6 months post wedding, and there are no Sussex kids available for play dates yet.
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  #766  
Old 11-26-2018, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by _Heather_ View Post
I don't honestly believe that William and Harry are anywhere near as close as many people would like to believe they are. For what it's worth, I wish they were because I would love to see the interactions that we see in the Swedish RF with aunts, uncles, siblings, nieces/nephews, etc. but that just simply isn't the case and I don't really think it has been for a very long time. I will say that I miss the interactions between Harry and Catherine because I do think they genuinely enjoyed each other's company and it was nice to see a giggle, a joke, etc. but I think we can probably all agree that those days are gone. I also don't think that Meghan and Catherine are particularly close. Cordial, yes but not close. I think many of us would love to see a tight knit foursome with lots of public interactions, time in private and public with the children, etc. but I just really don't get the impression that that is ever going to happen. It's nice to get the glimpses of the Cambridges with the Phillips and Tindalls and the photographs for the PoW's birthday were really, really lovely and let us in on a side that we don't often get to see between Charles/Camilla and the children but sadly, I just don't really ever think we'll get to see the Cambridge/Sussex children or wives playing, visiting, enjoying each other's company.

Now, that's not all said to lay a rift at Meghan's doorstep like I'm sure I'll be accused of doing, but the truth is that her presence changes the nature of the relationships between the Cambridges and Harry and while I very much hope that Harry is blissfully happy, some of those changes are maybe not for the better. Those relationships were bound to change no matter who Harry ended up with but I think that's probably amplified a bit considering that Meghan appears to be used to being on her own and not close with her family vs. Catherine being very close to her family and therefore Meghan may not see the value or feel the need for close family relationships the way that the Cambridges might. Simply my two cents and really more an observation than anything but I think people really are going to be sorely disappointed if they continue to hope for "happy families" types of interactions at public events or snapped pictures of cozy little foursome dinners in pubs or playdates at polo matches.
What adult siblings are attached at the hips? Seriously. And I'm not understanding the narrative that somehow Meghan is not for familial closeness. The fact is, since she's been in the picture, Charles and Harry seemed much closer. And by all accounts, Charles and Meghan get on fabulously. William and Meghan also seem to get along perfectly fine although they might not be a goofy as Kate and Harry might have seemed when they were at a younger age. It's different dynamic when one is playing third wheel. Think back to when William played third wheel for a couple of times after Kate had Louis. Meghan and William greeted each other warmly when they arrived in separate cars to WA for ANZAC service day. They kissed each other on the cheeks as they walked in. They also did the third wheel thing when three of them shared a car to Queen's birthday concert. Just because there are now fewer opportunities for someone to tag along to a couple, doesn't mean Meghan is separating Harry from his family.

The fact of matter is, Harry is establishing his own family like William did. And somehow that means Meghan doesn't see the value of familial relationships.

ETA: One thing that is different is that Harry is doing a lot less of third wheeling on engagements, which is a natural progression in his role. The BRF seems to treat marriage as some kind of coming of age event. QEII has given him more appointments and responsibilities this year. And even the engagements for the Australian tour is different. I believe the RRs actually flat out asked how come there weren't more rugby or sporting event as there was in his past tour to Australia. Their response was that this is a tour for a newly married couple, obviously it's going to be different than a tour for a young bachelor. I think that pretty much sums up the changes.
  #767  
Old 11-26-2018, 02:26 PM
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One thing that stands out for me is that both William and Harry are both adamant at keeping a moat around their private lives and, to be honest, I don't blame them one bit. Their childhood made a deep impression on them on just how the media can be and witnessed a very public War of the Wales between their parents in the public eye. With this in mind, they are going to do their utmost to assure that when they're on engagements or at public events, they realize that they have to cooperate with the media and they will. In private though, they'll do all they can to assure that family events and family interactions are not in the public eye. The privacy that their goldfish bowl affords them is going to be protected like Fort Knox.

We will never know the extent of any of the British royals true relationship with each other one on one and that's the way it should be. When we do see them out and about, we need to remember that they have their "game" faces on.
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  #768  
Old 11-26-2018, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by _Heather_ View Post
I really do wish sometimes that we could have a thread where we all just lay out our opinions and impressions of each member of the royal family. In many threads but especially this one there are so many thinly veiled jabs and references...it would be nice to just sort of lay it all out there. But I digress.

I don't honestly believe that William and Harry are anywhere near as close as many people would like to believe they are. For what it's worth, I wish they were because I would love to see the interactions that we see in the Swedish RF with aunts, uncles, siblings, nieces/nephews, etc. but that just simply isn't the case and I don't really think it has been for a very long time. I will say that I miss the interactions between Harry and Catherine because I do think they genuinely enjoyed each other's company and it was nice to see a giggle, a joke, etc. but I think we can probably all agree that those days are gone. I also don't think that Meghan and Catherine are particularly close. Cordial, yes but not close. I think many of us would love to see a tight knit foursome with lots of public interactions, time in private and public with the children, etc. but I just really don't get the impression that that is ever going to happen. It's nice to get the glimpses of the Cambridges with the Phillips and Tindalls and the photographs for the PoW's birthday were really, really lovely and let us in on a side that we don't often get to see between Charles/Camilla and the children but sadly, I just don't really ever think we'll get to see the Cambridge/Sussex children or wives playing, visiting, enjoying each other's company.

Now, that's not all said to lay a rift at Meghan's doorstep like I'm sure I'll be accused of doing, but the truth is that her presence changes the nature of the relationships between the Cambridges and Harry and while I very much hope that Harry is blissfully happy, some of those changes are maybe not for the better. Those relationships were bound to change no matter who Harry ended up with but I think that's probably amplified a bit considering that Meghan appears to be used to being on her own and not close with her family vs. Catherine being very close to her family and therefore Meghan may not see the value or feel the need for close family relationships the way that the Cambridges might. Simply my two cents and really more an observation than anything but I think people really are going to be sorely disappointed if they continue to hope for "happy families" types of interactions at public events or snapped pictures of cozy little foursome dinners in pubs or playdates at polo matches.
I agree with a lot of what you said especially "I don't honestly believe that William and Harry are anywhere near as close as many people would like to believe they are." I have long argued that point (way before Meghan came on the scene), so no, I don't blame the wives for that.

I do think this expectation is laughable that Catherine and Meghan should be best friends and if not, something sinister is at play. Nobody expects Camilla and Sophie to be two peas in a pod, and attached to the hip, though they're married to brothers too. I don't see anyone whining that William and James Matthews aren't best friends even though they're married to sisters. It's just an unrealistic expectation that's being used to bash two women, by a media that wanted any farfetched excuse to bash them.
  #769  
Old 11-26-2018, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by _Heather_ View Post
I really do wish sometimes that we could have a thread where we all just lay out our opinions and impressions of each member of the royal family. In many threads but especially this one there are so many thinly veiled jabs and references...it would be nice to just sort of lay it all out there. But I digress.

I don't honestly believe that William and Harry are anywhere near as close as many people would like to believe they are. For what it's worth, I wish they were because I would love to see the interactions that we see in the Swedish RF with aunts, uncles, siblings, nieces/nephews, etc. but that just simply isn't the case and I don't really think it has been for a very long time. I will say that I miss the interactions between Harry and Catherine because I do think they genuinely enjoyed each other's company and it was nice to see a giggle, a joke, etc. but I think we can probably all agree that those days are gone. I also don't think that Meghan and Catherine are particularly close. Cordial, yes but not close. I think many of us would love to see a tight knit foursome with lots of public interactions, time in private and public with the children, etc. but I just really don't get the impression that that is ever going to happen. It's nice to get the glimpses of the Cambridges with the Phillips and Tindalls and the photographs for the PoW's birthday were really, really lovely and let us in on a side that we don't often get to see between Charles/Camilla and the children but sadly, I just don't really ever think we'll get to see the Cambridge/Sussex children or wives playing, visiting, enjoying each other's company.

Now, that's not all said to lay a rift at Meghan's doorstep like I'm sure I'll be accused of doing, but the truth is that her presence changes the nature of the relationships between the Cambridges and Harry and while I very much hope that Harry is blissfully happy, some of those changes are maybe not for the better. Those relationships were bound to change no matter who Harry ended up with but I think that's probably amplified a bit considering that Meghan appears to be used to being on her own and not close with her family vs. Catherine being very close to her family and therefore Meghan may not see the value or feel the need for close family relationships the way that the Cambridges might. Simply my two cents and really more an observation than anything but I think people really are going to be sorely disappointed if they continue to hope for "happy families" types of interactions at public events or snapped pictures of cozy little foursome dinners in pubs or playdates at polo matches.
I do know what you're talking about, because in Sweden, there has always been reports in several different boards of tensions in relationships between Victoria & Sofia or Madeleine & Sofia.
  #770  
Old 11-26-2018, 03:07 PM
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The media like the idea of a good cat fight between female members of the royal family. I’m not sure this ever happened to the Kent’s and Gloucester’s; both past and present. It’s like the media want royal watchers to think Meghan and Catherine aren’t capable to act like mature and respectable women and sister-in-laws and have a good working relationship.

From what we see and understand, everything is fine within family relations. As the royal ‘fab four’ pointed out earlier at their foundation forum, the family disagree with each other from time to time and that’s just natural for all families.
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  #771  
Old 11-26-2018, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Rudolph View Post
The story behind Harry and Meghanís move to Frogmore Cottage? Harry and Meghan spreading their wings. No big fallout but Kate and Meghan not close. No royal properties available in London apparently.

The crazies on Twitter wonít like it but it is clear that Meghan is regarded as difficult and demanding by some in the family and on the staff.

Via Richard Palmer Twitter

https://twitter.com/royalreporter/st...200413696?s=21
Perfect article in response to this! Nothing new by the tabloids! Just a replay of what happened to Diana and Fergie!
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle...ectid=12165804
  #772  
Old 11-26-2018, 03:31 PM
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Well, and the other side of that coin is that royal coverage never seems to allow that the royal family could have the normal little ebbs and flows of tension and happiness that families have and still be well within the bounds of healthy relationships and overall cooperation.

It is normal, very normal, to expect that there will be periods of time where William and Charles are seeing different sides of the coin where something is concerned but Charles and Harry seem to be thinking right in line with each other, and that it might affect their choices for where and with whom to spend their free time for a couple of months. And that might be balanced by other times where the brothers seem to keep spending time together but donít see their father as much. Etc. that can happen without anyone being angry or offices splitting or any other sort of crisis occurring.
  #773  
Old 11-26-2018, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Dman View Post
The media like the idea of a good cat fight between female members of the royal family. Iím not sure this ever happened to the Kentís and Gloucesterís; both past and present. Itís like the media want royal watchers to think Meghan and Catherine arenít capable to act like mature and respectable women and sister-in-laws and have a good working relationship.

From what we see and understand, everything is fine within family relations. As the royal Ďfab fourí pointed out earlier at their foundation forum, the family disagree with each other from time to time and thatís just natural for all families.
It seems like the media thinks two people, especially women, are incapable of anything between hating each other or besties. The reality is, most people are in between those two.
  #774  
Old 11-26-2018, 03:48 PM
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While I like the idea of a thread where posters could give their unvarnished opinions of various royals and their relationships, I can guarantee that it would be shut down in no time flat. It would be interesting, but short-lived.

As far as relationships between William and Harry, or any of the members of a particular family goes, I think it's almost impossible to tell. I don't think there's any evidence of a rift between the brothers, to all appearances they seem to get along fine. Unless someone comes up with evidence more compelling than Harry and Meghan moving to Frogmore Cottage, I'm not convinced.

This could apply to a lot of discussions about royals, but a fair amount of it seems to almost border on fan fiction. It's understandable when we see so little, and are making guesses as to what's really going on, but it's a good idea to remember that guesses are just that, and not to get so invested in something because it makes a good story, and ignore the fact that it is just guessing or speculation.
  #775  
Old 11-26-2018, 03:58 PM
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Originally Posted by miss whirley View Post
I agree with a lot of what you said especially "I don't honestly believe that William and Harry are anywhere near as close as many people would like to believe they are." I have long argued that point (way before Meghan came on the scene), so no, I don't blame the wives for that.

I do think this expectation is laughable that Catherine nd Meghan should be best friends and if not, something sinister is at play..

To be fair, back in the 1980s, wasn't the same thing expected from Diana and Fergie shortly after Fergie married Andrew ?


On your other point, Charles doesn't seem (at least to me) to be particularly close to any of his siblings. Nevertheless, William and Harry seem to have a relationship with their paternal cousins (both Peter/Zara, who are older, and the York girls, who are younger). I would expect the same as far as Harry's and William's children are concerned, even if the brothers grow further apart over time. Family events and gatherings around their common grandfather will make sure that they still meet at least occasionally, as was the case with William/Harry and their respective cousins during the present Queen's reign.



It should be noted though that George for example is already 5, turning 6 by the time Harry's firstborn arrives, so there will be a considerable age difference between him and any future Sussex kids.
  #776  
Old 11-26-2018, 04:05 PM
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To be fair, back in the 1980s, wasn't the same thing expected from Diana and Fergie shortly after Fergie married Andrew ?
Although I think the situation there is quite different. Diana and Fergie were friends well before her marriage to Andrew. In fact, didn't Sarah sit with Diana's old flatmates at Diana and Charles' wedding? It's one thing to say they are very close and perhaps closer than other friends of Diana's since they married into the same family and faced some of the same pressures. It's entirely different when you have to women who have never met each other before this.
  #777  
Old 11-26-2018, 04:18 PM
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Originally Posted by MaiaMia_53 View Post

In earlier times, British kings and queens were interested in maintaining their power, position, and colonial holdings. Today, its probably more a matter of not dismantling something that they are the stewards of and have become deeply accustomed to upholding.

I am not so sure that is no longer the case.Judging by the number of tours of members of the RF to Commonwealth countries, especially Commoinwealth realms, it seems that maintaining their constitutional position in those countries is still a very high priority. Furthermore, the Queen's insistence that Prince Charles succeeds her as Head of the Commonwealth was particularly striking to me.
  #778  
Old 11-26-2018, 04:24 PM
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I am not so sure that is no longer the case.Judging by the number of tours of members of the RF to Commonwealth countries, especially Commoinwealth realms, it seems that maintaining their constitutional position in those countries is still a very high priority. Furthermore, the Queen's insistence that Prince Charles succeeds her as Head of the Commonwealth was particularly striking to me.
There is a difference between Commonwealth Realms and Commonwealth of Nations. The leadership role in Commonwealth is different than being the monarch of some of the Commonwealth Realms. There are other implications here than holding on to being Queen of other countries.
  #779  
Old 11-26-2018, 04:35 PM
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I do know what you're talking about, because in Sweden, there has always been reports in several different boards of tensions in relationships between Victoria & Sofia or Madeleine & Sofia.
Yes, there have been rumors of tensions but what I'm talking about is the fact that we often are treated to pictures of Victoria, CP, and Madeleine holding and playing with each other's children, pictures of them very casually and naturally interacting with each other as a lot of regular families do. In contrast, though we've heard that Harry has fun with the Cambridge children or that Charles was close to Peter and Zara, etc., I've never once seen a picture of Harry actually interacting with any of the Cambridge children. Not so much as even speaking to them, let alone holding them or playing with them. The closest we've come is Harry and Meghan's wedding pictures and those were simply pictures of them with their attendants not pictures of them interacting as family like we get to see in Sweden or even occasionally in Denmark. I'm reminded specifically of the pictures following Prince Henrik's funeral of Josephine and Athena holding hands or the pictures of Madeleine helping Estelle pour the water in the christening font or CP holding Estelle on the balcony of the palace or even of Victoria holding one of her nephews during Adrienne's (I think it was Adrienne's) christening. It would, in my opinion, be lovely to get to see these types of interactions in the British RF.
  #780  
Old 11-26-2018, 04:54 PM
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Yes, there have been rumors of tensions but what I'm talking about is the fact that we often are treated to pictures of Victoria, CP, and Madeleine holding and playing with each other's children, pictures of them very casually and naturally interacting with each other as a lot of regular families do. In contrast, though we've heard that Harry has fun with the Cambridge children or that Charles was close to Peter and Zara, etc., I've never once seen a picture of Harry actually interacting with any of the Cambridge children. Not so much as even speaking to them, let alone holding them or playing with them. The closest we've come is Harry and Meghan's wedding pictures and those were simply pictures of them with their attendants not pictures of them interacting as family like we get to see in Sweden or even occasionally in Denmark. I'm reminded specifically of the pictures following Prince Henrik's funeral of Josephine and Athena holding hands or the pictures of Madeleine helping Estelle pour the water in the christening font or CP holding Estelle on the balcony of the palace or even of Victoria holding one of her nephews during Adrienne's (I think it was Adrienne's) christening. It would, in my opinion, be lovely to get to see these types of interactions in the British RF.
I think context is very important here. The Swedish royals are much more open with the relationship between the extended family in public than the BRF. How much exposure do people get to Estelle and Oscar versus the Cambridge kids? The BRF just acts differently in public with other people's children. We've all heard the story about when the Obamas visited Cambridges and Harry. George was asking why Uncle Harry was being so different. What was later explained was there Harry is usually all over the place playing with his nephew when he's visiting. But when have we ever seen that in public? Never pretty much. Yet it doesn't mean it's not happening. It's just the way BRF acts at formal engagements like TTC.
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