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  #241  
Old 01-04-2011, 10:07 PM
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I was thinking of this when I asked. It would seem like a former queen would need a lot of security. Also, I know there's certain protcols and tradions. Would it go against that if she lived with nonroyal family? As you said, I suppose they could always live with her.
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  #242  
Old 01-04-2011, 10:20 PM
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Who would live with her? Her children and grandchildren? I think not.

William, Kate and Harry will also most likely not live with Camilla if something happens to Charles.

I agree with HM Catherine that if something happens to Charles you will gradually see less and less of Camilla. Certain events like the Trooping of the Colour maybe Ascot and a couple of patronages that mean something to her. But thats about it. And honestly, I don't think she will be bothered to much from the public. Not a slight against her or her perceived popularity or unpopularity. I just think that there will be a big fuss and than people will let her live out her days in relative peace.
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  #243  
Old 01-05-2011, 08:07 AM
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Thank you all for clarifying - these future titles of the spouses always confused me!
MARG has a very good point. Security will matter a lot from now on.
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  #244  
Old 01-05-2011, 12:08 PM
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I agree, as pointed out above, a dowager Camilla will retire to a relatively quiet life in the country, possibly at Ray Mill House. Her health permitting, she will probably carry out some public engagements, and maintain some patronages. She will maintain offices in London, and probably a small residence in London as well.
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  #245  
Old 01-05-2011, 04:02 PM
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A lot will depend on when she becomes a widow - if she is simply the widow of the Prince of Wales then yes I can see her retiring but if she is the widow of the King the situation will be different and I would expect her to have a home in London appropriate to that position and to appear regularly at royal events and to continue with some royal duties.

She won't live with William and Catherine but she will be included in royal events due to her position as the widow of Charles.
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  #246  
Old 01-11-2011, 11:32 PM
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What will happen to The Duchess of Cornwall if Charles dies?

What would happen to the Duchess of Cornwall if Prince Charles died? Would she still be considered a royal family member? Would she continue to live in Charles' apartments? Would she have any royal responsibilities?
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  #247  
Old 01-11-2011, 11:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Gretijean View Post
What would happen to the Duchess of Cornwall if Prince Charles died? Would she still be considered a royal family member? Would she continue to live in Charles' apartments? Would she have any royal responsibilities?

She will remain a member of the RF just as other widows have e.g. The Queen Mum didn't cease to be a member of the RF when she was widowed.

Where she would live would depend on Charles' will and her own desires e.g. if Charles left her the right to live at Highgrove then I am sure that his family would honour that wish but she mightn't wish to live there.

As for CH I don't think she would continue to live there as I would expect William to move in there but would expect a London apartment to be made available to Camilla - either at BP or KP.

I would imagine that she would continue with her patronages but she would be sidelined as a mainline royal up to a point but she would be the widow of the father of the future king and heir of the present monarch - she simply couldn't be ignored but she may wish to take the opportunity to say 'I am retiring from public life' but...she would still be getting security due to her position.
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  #248  
Old 01-14-2011, 09:20 AM
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The title was not created for the Queen mother. Queen Alexandra and Queen Mary both held the title Queen Mother.

From a publication I had dating from 1953 Queen Mary was listed as HM Queen Mary the Queen Dowager.

It then went on to talk about HM Queen Elizabeth the Queen Mother.

I have never seen it commented anywhere that Their Late Majesties Queens Alexandra and Mary ever called anything else other than the Queen or Queen A or M after their husbands' demise.
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  #249  
Old 01-14-2011, 10:23 AM
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They were both Queen Mothers, but they were not called as such. It would have been confusing for the Queen Mum to have been called Queen Elizabeth since her daughter the Queen has the same first name.
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  #250  
Old 01-14-2011, 06:15 PM
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I have a book from around 1950 that periodically refers to Queen Mary as the Queen Mother, but it uses "Queen Mary" more.
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  #251  
Old 01-15-2011, 08:02 AM
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During the reign of Edward VIII Queen Mary was still referred to as Queen Mary and not as Queen Dowager as the King was a bachelor.
Of course that situation changed with the Abdication but most references to her appear to have remained as 'Queen Mary'.

I've recently been given an Illustrated London News dated 16 February 1952, titled "Special Number - The Death of King George VI". Throughout, Queen Mary is referred to as "Queen Mary", the widowed Queen Elizabeth even at that very early stage is invariably "the Queen Mother" and Elizabeth II is simply "the Queen" with the occasional more formal "Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth".

In short, neither of the widowed Queens was keen on the 'Queen Dowager' moniker while the common use of 'Queen Mother' really came into its own with...the Queen Mother.
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  #252  
Old 04-14-2011, 02:17 AM
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How involved have past dowagers such as Alexandra, Mary, and Elizabeth been in the Royal family and with patronages, charities, and royal events? I don't see it as a necessity for them to have to carry out duties really especially depending on age even if some former queens have done so. I think it's fair to allow them retirement.
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  #253  
Old 04-14-2011, 03:12 AM
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All three continued with their patronages etc after their widowhood with the Queen Mum being the most obvious still doing royal duties well into her 90s.
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  #254  
Old 04-14-2011, 03:54 AM
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In case Charles dies before Camilla, I believe he will leave her very comfortably off as he has amassed quite a personal fortune over the years, so can provide for her in the style he has made her acustomed to as his wife. I say this because I don't think Camilla personally needs that luxurious life she lives due to her husband's wishes and their position in life.

Probably she will acquire a suitable residence in London which she will maybe share with her son and his family. As Tom Parker Bowles is a scion of the Parker of Macclesfield-family, I guess it won't take long till the queen or the new king will create him a Knight Commander of the Royal Victorian Order for his services for Camilla - thus creating him "Sir Thomas" Parker Bowles. Which would be entirely suitable for the son of a Royal Lady who takes care of her in service for the souverain.

I personally can see Camilla being as interested in and charming with Charles' grandchildren as she is with her own, thus she probably will become the Royal "Granny" - a somewhat retired and no more really prominent Royal personality, but still present and upholding an image as the kind and loving Dowager of the RF.
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  #255  
Old 04-14-2011, 04:49 AM
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In case Charles dies before Camilla, I believe he will leave her very comfortably off as he has amassed quite a personal fortune over the years, so can provide for her in the style he has made her acustomed to as his wife. I say this because I don't think Camilla personally needs that luxurious life she lives due to her husband's wishes and their position in life.

Probably she will acquire a suitable residence in London which she will maybe share with her son and his family. As Tom Parker Bowles is a scion of the Parker of Macclesfield-family, I guess it won't take long till the queen or the new king will create him a Knight Commander of the Royal Victorian Order for his services for Camilla - thus creating him "Sir Thomas" Parker Bowles. Which would be entirely suitable for the son of a Royal Lady who takes care of her in service for the souverain.

I personally can see Camilla being as interested in and charming with Charles' grandchildren as she is with her own, thus she probably will become the Royal "Granny" - a somewhat retired and no more really prominent Royal personality, but still present and upholding an image as the kind and loving Dowager of the RF.
I really don't see Camilla's children ever being given titles though. Its along the same lines as Carole Middleton as the mother of a future Queen Consort be given a title. I don't think it will ever happen.

Can't remember where I read it but probably in the Charles and Camilla thread on their marriage that Camilla does like to bolt away to Ray Mill and get down and dirty with the grandchildren and play and make noise which is something that Charles isn't too fond of these days. As much as Charles is staid and proper, Camilla is the "lets make mud pies" type of gal. Oh yes.. she'd be a fantastic royal Granny for sure!
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  #256  
Old 04-14-2011, 08:26 PM
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I really don't see Camilla's children ever being given titles though. Its along the same lines as Carole Middleton as the mother of a future Queen Consort be given a title. I don't think it will ever happen.
It's not a title actually but a Knighthood. It's in the personal discretion of the monarch to create a person a Knight or Dame Commander of the Royal Victorian Order as a thank you for personal services to the souverain. As "outer" mark of this position the person may call himself "Sir" or herself "Dame". It's not a peerage and its not inheritable, it's a sign that the person is a higher member of an order of Britain.

Of course William at one point could create Carole Middleton a Dame Commander RVO - thus she becomes Dame Carole. He won't create her a Baroness with the prefix "Lady" - that's for politicians.
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  #257  
Old 04-14-2011, 10:49 PM
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It's not a title actually but a Knighthood. It's in the personal discretion of the monarch to create a person a Knight or Dame Commander of the Royal Victorian Order as a thank you for personal services to the souverain. As "outer" mark of this position the person may call himself "Sir" or herself "Dame". It's not a peerage and its not inheritable, it's a sign that the person is a higher member of an order of Britain.

Of course William at one point could create Carole Middleton a Dame Commander RVO - thus she becomes Dame Carole. He won't create her a Baroness with the prefix "Lady" - that's for politicians.
I doubt that either Charles or William will do this unless either of them actually do something or achieve something worthwhile. Tom could of course, totally change the English way of thinking about food, making some unforseen contribution but just because he "supports" Camilla...I don't think so.

Most Dames from what I understand have made a contribution in the arts and sciences, etc.
For example, Dame Shirley Bassey in Music, Dame Judi Dench in arts (films and theatre), etc.
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  #258  
Old 04-03-2013, 03:13 PM
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I would imagine that if Camilla was widowed while Queen, she would have a pick of where she wanted to retire to. It would depend also on her age and if she was or was not to remain doing royal duties and engagements too. I don't think Camilla would disappear from royal family life just because Charles has passed on. QEQM resided at Clarence House but she also has the Castle of Mey.

From my own perspective of how I see Camilla, I think she would be most content though living at Ray Mill when she's not scheduled for engagements and in that case, she'd reside at Clarence House.
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  #259  
Old 04-03-2013, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
don't think Camilla would disappear from royal family life just because Charles has passed on. QEQM resided at Clarence House but she also has the Castle of Mey.
There will absolutely be no similarity between the lifestyles of "Dowager Queen" Camilla and QETQM.
Camilla doesnt have an ounce of opulence or extravagance The QM had. Leave alone CH and Castle of May, if left to her would have happily had another dozen castles, hosting endless nice parties and lunches, leaving her daughter to break her head over the overdraft
Funny things aside, QM never thought she was 'out of scene', and considered her 'vocation' as important as the monarch herself. She greatly relished being in limelight and drinking in the public and media affection.So there was no question of her ever withdrawing from public life.
On the other hand, Camilla was always a simple woman, maintaining a low profile, all her motive seems to be just stand by Charles' side and make him happy. That itself is her 'calling', for the moment.
And once she is done with her job, I dont think she will be there in public eye.
Of course she will always have precedence and eminence immediately after King and Queen, but apart from reallyimportant weddings/jubilees/funerals, I dont see her in royal scene..
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  #260  
Old 04-03-2013, 03:34 PM
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Most likely Camilla's official London residence will continue to be Clarence House and her country residence, Raymill House.

If Charles is King and passes on, that would make Camilla Queen Dowager & Queen Mother or Princess Dowager or Princess Mother. If she's able, Camilla will continue to carry out royal duties and be supportive of King William & Queen Catherine.
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