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  #3781  
Old 10-21-2018, 03:34 PM
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Let's move on and keep race out of this discussion.
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  #3782  
Old 10-21-2018, 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by jacqui24 View Post
I think if they decide in private they will not, it'll be announced now. See my post about concerns when Charles becomes king and the likelihood that he's going to want Camilla as Queen. NOT a good time to announce both issues. Although, can the Queen's Will apply to something that won't happen until she passes?


I believe the discussion between QE2, Charles and the Sussexes as to if and when they are, or are not HRHs and when. I also believe it is the same scenario with Harry not being a Garter Knight, and I think there is an opening, right now. I think the decision was made the Harry would be Charles’s first Garter Knight. So it take 5 or 10 years. What is that time frame in 1000 years of history. These people have the ability to look at things in a picture so big, that many of us just can’t wrap our minds around what they are a part of, and how they view their place in that picture.
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  #3783  
Old 10-21-2018, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by O-H Anglophile View Post
oh for heaven’s sake. Princess Anne never turned down Royal titles for her children-you would think the British Press would be better informed.
Makes one wonder what else they’ve gotten wrong.
I did not realize that Princess Anne did not turn titles down. I know this is not the thread to discuss this, so could you direct me to where I can learn the facts about Peter and Zara not getting titles. I would love to read about it. Thanks.

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Originally Posted by Pranter View Post
I wouldn't believe anything from the media about this.



LaRae
I agree. I read that this morning and said to myself, "Well, that's one more thing they are manufacturing for clicks."
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  #3784  
Old 10-21-2018, 04:56 PM
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Roya Nikkhah and The Sunday Times are royal friendly and usually very reliable. A lot of times Roya’s exclusives come directly from KP.
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  #3785  
Old 10-21-2018, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by jacqui24 View Post
I wouldn't be surprised if the couple chooses to have their kids be styled as that of a Duke. That was always the one reason I thought an LP wouldn't be issued. Due to the wishes of the parents.

Harry has struggled with his role in the past. He's debated whether he wants a royal role for himself. But it was his respect for the Queen, and I do think seeing how much impact he can have, that ultimately led to his decision to stay. It's still a balancing act to this day. Omid and Emily were just talking about how protective he is over Meghan. And I do agree with Omid that it's not just because of the baby. It was obvious well before there was a baby. He's well aware of the downside of the role.
I also think his struggles there had to do with the mental health issues he had due to his mother's death. When he began dealing with those and seeing just what kind of effect his royal role would allow him to have, he embraced it. It will be interesting to see what titles the Sussex children will have, if any. I do harbor a hope that that the Queen will issue LP for them to be Princes and Princesses.
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  #3786  
Old 10-21-2018, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duchessrachel View Post
I did not realize that Princess Anne did not turn titles down. I know this is not the thread to discuss this, so could you direct me to where I can learn the facts about Peter and Zara not getting titles. I would love to read about it. Thanks.
I'll look for something else, but here is a start--

https://www.townandcountrymag.com/so...title-meaning/

Before Princess Anne, her great aunt Princess Mary married Earl of Harewood-their children were only styled as children of an Earl. Her aunt Princess Margaret's children were also only styled as children of an Earl.

I'll private message you any further reading I find.
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  #3787  
Old 10-21-2018, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by American Observer7 View Post
Oh, I don't believe a word coming from the media about this. It's too early for one, and secondly, I doubt they'd discuss this with anyone but the Queen.
Actually I believe that the Sussexes would discuss this topic with QEII and the future monarchs, the Prince of Wales and the Duke of Cambridge.
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  #3788  
Old 10-21-2018, 05:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by padams2359 View Post
I believe the discussion between QE2, Charles and the Sussexes as to if and when they are, or are not HRHs and when. I also believe it is the same scenario with Harry not being a Garter Knight, and I think there is an opening, right now. I think the decision was made the Harry would be Charles’s first Garter Knight. So it take 5 or 10 years. What is that time frame in 1000 years of history. These people have the ability to look at things in a picture so big, that many of us just can’t wrap our minds around what they are a part of, and how they view their place in that picture.
One has nothing to do with each other. The first Garter Knight is always the consort. I do believe Charles would like to at least bestow that honor on one of his own children. And Harry is a royal, so there is no issue of space availability.
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  #3789  
Old 10-21-2018, 05:50 PM
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Originally Posted by TLLK View Post
Actually I believe that the Sussexes would discuss this topic with QEII and the future monarchs, the Prince of Wales and the Duke of Cambridge.
Most definitely as it will be their reigns that this decision will affect the most.
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  #3790  
Old 10-21-2018, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duchessrachel View Post
I also think his struggles there had to do with the mental health issues he had due to his mother's death. When he began dealing with those and seeing just what kind of effect his royal role would allow him to have, he embraced it. It will be interesting to see what titles the Sussex children will have, if any. I do harbor a hope that that the Queen will issue LP for them to be Princes and Princesses.
I wouldn't put that on mental health issues. While it had an impact, I don't believe that's all it is. The fact of the matter is, with or without his mother and what happened to her, there are lot of good and bad things that comes with this role. The intrusion and abuse are real. I think Harry made it very clear the downside of this role when he issued that statement in 2016. I don't believe it was the scenario he wished for when his relationship came to light. However, the situation got to a point where he could no longer just ignore it.
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  #3791  
Old 10-21-2018, 06:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Zaira View Post
Different times, different expectations. It was unthinkable a generation ago that two blood princess wouldn't be working royals, but here we are with Bea and Eugenie. .
Princess Beatrice opened a neonatal ward in Laos today but it won't be in the Court Circular as she's not a "working royal." The people of Laos may disagree: a British Princess opened their hospital.
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  #3792  
Old 10-21-2018, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by RoyalHighness 2002 View Post
So if I'm understanding all of this correctly, the only working royal generation Charles wants to be slimmed down is that which will be under his reign. It is not a system set in stone and will revert back to including collateral grandchildren of the monarch once William ascends?
We don't know. That's the reason why the issue keeps coming up. Andrew's children are HRHs but not working royals. Edward's children aren't even HRHs. So we're all waiting to see what the plan is for Harry's. According to the 1917 Letters Patent they will be Earl/Lord/Lady at birth and HRH when Charles becomes King but the monarch can override the LP as the Queen did with Edward's children and William's too. Stay tuned along with the rest of us....
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  #3793  
Old 10-21-2018, 06:58 PM
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I too wonder if their child(ren) will be styled as that of a child of a Duke for now and then become Prince/Princess after Charles becomes King.

Is that a foregone conclusion that they automatically become HRH once Charles is King? Are Edward and Sophie's kids HRH's?
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  #3794  
Old 10-21-2018, 07:04 PM
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Originally Posted by FashionMaven View Post
Is that a foregone conclusion that they automatically become HRH once Charles is King? Are Edward and Sophie's kids HRH's?
The LP in 1917 says they are. Edward and Sophie's children were made as an exception, which was announced on their wedding day.
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  #3795  
Old 10-21-2018, 07:12 PM
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Originally Posted by wyevale View Post
I do chuckle when Americans, often SO keen on 'equality', and from a country where Titles are 'verboten' have a hissy fit at the mere possibility that a child of [part] American descent might [just] be denied a 'Royal Highness'..
I chuckled when I started discussing the BRF with a co-worker from England and quickly discovered (1) he was a republican and (2) I knew (and cared) much more about them than he did. Almost as if we were switched at birth....
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  #3796  
Old 10-21-2018, 07:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FashionMaven View Post

Is that a foregone conclusion that they automatically become HRH once Charles is King?

Are Edward and Sophie's kids HRH's?
Unless new Letters Patent are issued, yes any children of Harry's will automatically become HRH Prince/Princess the moment Charles ascends the throne.

No, because at the time of Edward & Sophie's wedding it was made known that any future children would use the courtesy titles of the children of an Earl.
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  #3797  
Old 10-21-2018, 07:58 PM
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What Would Camilla Title BE

Full disclosure, I love history and Jewelry, that being said I became interested in the BRF when Diana, Princess of Wales married Charles. When they divorced, I was not a fan of Prince Charles and Camilla. However with age and life experience I am so glad that Charles and Camilla were finally able to marry. He, she, they are so right for each other I would wish they were able to marry when they met except for the fact the William, Harry, Tom and Laura would not exist nor their children which would be a tragedy.

Being that Prince Charles implied that Camilla would be Princess Consort instead of Queen Consort which she should be, what would be her title if Queen Elizabeth died, Charles became King and Camilla died shortly afterward but before Charles was Crowned.

What would her title be, in that Charles had not been crowned and BP had not made any statement regarding how she would be addressed?
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  #3798  
Old 10-21-2018, 08:04 PM
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Its simple. Charles becomes King at the moment Queen Elizabeth draws her last breath and with that, his wife becomes Queen Consort legally. Even should it be deemed that Camilla would be known as Princess Consort, legally, she would still be Queen Consort. Just like Camilla is now legally The Princess of Wales but has been chosen to be known as The Duchess of Cornwall.

The coronation is the affirmation and blessing of a King and his consort (if applicable) but kingship starts at the very moment of the death of the previous monarch.
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  #3799  
Old 10-21-2018, 08:10 PM
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Osipi, I know legally that she would be Queen Consort, what I'm asking is if she were to die before BP had put out a statement regarding her title what would she be called in death, by the Monarchy King Charles, the papers tabloid included and the public?
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  #3800  
Old 10-21-2018, 08:12 PM
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When Charles becomes King - which as Osipi has said will be the instant the Queen dies - Camilla becomes Queen.

At his accession council, later that day or the next day, he may ask the government of the day to pas the necessary legislation to strip her of that title so he can issue LPs for her to be Princess Consort - or use some other mechanism.

Her only title, as the wife of the King, is Queen.

As the wife of the Prince of Wales she had a choice of may titles but as the wife of the King there is only one title for her.

Mr Blair made it clear, in 2005, that she would be Queen and the only way to deny her that title was by legislation. That means that the first thing that has to happen once Charles is King is for the parliament to pass legislation demoting his wife. It may even need legislation in all the realms that have to pass their own legislation which could be fun.
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