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  #2001  
Old 03-29-2013, 08:31 PM
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Well, he's not a Prince of Greece and Denmark since 18 March 1947.

If he divorces the Queen, it would be required Letters of Patent stating what will be his titles (if any). Otherwise, he will stay as HRH the Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh.

If a widowed Duke of Edinburgh ever remarries, his wife will became HRH the Princess Philip, Duchess of Edinburgh, unless new Letters of Patent are passed saying otherwise.
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  #2002  
Old 03-29-2013, 08:31 PM
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Given that his peerages (1947) and princely title (1957) were created by Letters Patent so it would have taken an Act of Parliament to remove them, so in the event of divorce and remarriage I believe he would have continued to be HRH The Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh and his new wife would have become HRH The Duchess of Edinburgh although I suppose it would have been possible to remove the HRH since that is a style and not a title and the Duchess of Windsor would be a sort of precedent for not having HRH and we know the Queen removed the HRH from Diana and Sarah.
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  #2003  
Old 03-29-2013, 08:40 PM
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Also:

If she marries someone who is knighted, she becomes Her Royal Highness Princess X, Lady Y.

If she marries the younger son of a marquess her style is the same as that of if she married the younger son of a duke. Similarly, the styling for marrying a younger son of an Earl is the same for marrying the younger son of a viscount or baron.

If she marries someone completely without title, she becomes Her Royal Highness Princess X, Mrs. y.
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  #2004  
Old 03-29-2013, 08:43 PM
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Originally Posted by royal-blue View Post
Aside from his Greek titles, Prince Philip is a Prince of the United Kingdom, as he is married to the Queen.

If the Queen had ever divorced Philip, would he have remained a Prince in his own right?

Highly unlikely, I know, but likewise, if Philip had ever re-married after either divorce or being widowed, would his new wife have become a Princess?
Prince Philip is not a prince simply because he marrie the Queen. In Britain men do not take on the titles of their spouses. After he married her (long after) he was created a Prince of the United Kingdom of his own right. Divorcing the Queen would not change that unless she issued LPs striping him of his princely title.
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  #2005  
Old 03-29-2013, 08:51 PM
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This is an interesting idea. Would any children from this hypothetical second marriage have been prince/sses?

Obviously, Philip is not the son of a monarch, but when Charles and Anne were born they became prince and princess despite no being male-line grandchildren of a reigning monarch.
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  #2006  
Old 03-29-2013, 08:55 PM
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Originally Posted by royal-blue View Post
This is an interesting idea. Would any children from this hypothetical second marriage have been prince/sses?

Obviously, Philip is not the son of a monarch, but when Charles and Anne were born they became prince and princess despite no being male-line grandchildren of a reigning monarch.
No, they wouldn't be Prince or Princesses.

Prince Charles and Princess Anne were only a Prince and a Princess because King George VI passed Letters of Patent stating that any children born to Princess Elizabeth would be Prince or Princess of the United Kingdom.
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  #2007  
Old 03-29-2013, 08:57 PM
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Originally Posted by royal-blue View Post
This is an interesting idea. Would any children from this hypothetical second marriage have been prince/sses?

Obviously, Philip is not the son of a monarch, but when Charles and Anne were born they became prince and princess despite no being male-line grandchildren of a reigning monarch.
Prince Philip's children from another marriage would not be prince(sse)s, they would be styled the children of a Duke.

Charles and Anne were given their titles at birth because of LPs issued by George V on 22 October 1948 granting the children of the then Princess Elizabeth the title of prince(ss). This is similar to the LPs that the Queen herself issued this past December regarding the children of Prince William.
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  #2008  
Old 03-29-2013, 08:58 PM
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It seems Philip became HRH upon marriage and a Prince later on so as was mentioned, he would probably lose the HRH upon divorce but remain a Prince. I assume he would remain HRH upon widowhood and remarriage, unless the new monarch revoked it.
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  #2009  
Old 03-29-2013, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted by royal-blue View Post
It seems Philip became HRH upon marriage and a Prince later on so as was mentioned, he would probably lose the HRH upon divorce but remain a Prince. I assume he would remain HRH upon widowhood and remarriage, unless the new monarch revoked it.
All depends of Letters of Patent. Without them, he would remain HRH the Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh.
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  #2010  
Old 03-29-2013, 09:05 PM
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Since he is such an advanced age we probably will never have to imagine anything of the sort.
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  #2011  
Old 03-29-2013, 09:06 PM
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Since he is such an advanced age we probably will never have to imagine anything of the sort.
Say this to the Duchess of Alba.
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  #2012  
Old 03-29-2013, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by BrazilianEmpire View Post
Well, he's not a Prince of Greece and Denmark since 18 March 1947.
That issue is debateable and has been discussed in detail here:
Prince Philip's former Greek Citizenship and Greek and Danish Titles

Quote:
If he divorces the Queen, it would be required Letters of Patent stating what will be his titles (if any). Otherwise, he will stay as HRH the Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh.
It would take legislation to change the 1957 and 1947 LPs that created him DoE and Prince of the UK - not LPs.

Quote:
If a widowed Duke of Edinburgh ever remarries, his wife will became HRH the Princess Philip, Duchess of Edinburgh, unless new Letters of Patent are passed saying otherwise.
Correct - if Charles decided that his step-mother wasn't to share his father's titles and styles he could limit the LPs to apply to Philip only and not to a second wife or any subsequent children - I doubt that he would do so, or that it would even be necessary.
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  #2013  
Old 03-29-2013, 10:10 PM
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It would take legislation to change the 1957 and 1947 LPs that created him DoE and Prince of the UK - not LPs.
Why? The Queen was able to went against the Letters of Patent of King George V, why she can't do the same with Letters of Patent that were passed by herself?
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  #2014  
Old 03-29-2013, 10:17 PM
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Originally Posted by BrazilianEmpire View Post

Why? The Queen was able to went against the Letters of Patent of King George V, why she can't do the same with Letters of Patent that were passed by herself?
When did she go against George V's LPs?
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  #2015  
Old 03-29-2013, 10:29 PM
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When did she go against George V's LPs?
When she stated the Wessex children would be styled as children of an Earl and all of the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge's children would be Princes and Princesses of the United Kingdom.
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  #2016  
Old 03-29-2013, 10:35 PM
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NGalitzine, BrazilianEmpire, Ish: THANK YOU SO MUCH!

It's all very clear to me now. Just one doubt remains: what happened in 1989 that changed the style of Princess Alexandra from "The Hon Mrs Angus Ogilvy" to "The Hon Lady Ogilvy"?

And I thought that "The Hon" and "Lady" would never be used together... Sometimes I feel
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  #2017  
Old 03-29-2013, 10:41 PM
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The Honorable Angus Ogilvy was made a Knight Commander of the Royal Victorian Order in 1988, so his wife became Lady Ogilvy.
She's "Honorable" because her late husband was the younger son of an Earl, and a Lady bacause he was a Knight.
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  #2018  
Old 03-29-2013, 11:16 PM
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Originally Posted by BrazilianEmpire View Post

When she stated the Wessex children would be styled as children of an Earl and all of the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge's children would be Princes and Princesses of the United Kingdom.
She didn't go against the LPs there.

The Wessex children hold the titles of male-line grandchildren of a monarch. They also hold the style of children of an earl. The Queen issued no LPs denying the Wessex children this right, she merely stated that as per their parents' wishes they will use their style instead of their titles. This is similar to Camilla using the title Duchess of Cornwall as her primary title instead of Princess of Wales, despite the latter being the higher title.

The Queen also does not go against George V's LP regarding the HRH status and princely titles in granting said status to the children of the Cambridges (nor did George VI's LP regarding the HRH status and princely titles regards to the then Princess Elizabeth's children). George V's LPs grants the use of the style/title to the monarch's children and male line grandchildren, and revokes the use of such styles from other individuals, as well as the other princely titles and related styling within Britain. It does not say that the only people who can use the style/title are those covered in the LP, and even states that those who have been granted titles will be allowed to continue to use them. The Queen's and George VI's LPs do not go against this, they merely grant additional style/titles to people born under circumstances that George V likely didn't predict.
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  #2019  
Old 03-29-2013, 11:34 PM
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George V changed the LPs of Queen Victoria from 1898 when he denied the HRH to all children of the eldest son of the Prince of Wales except the eldest son. What QEII has done is simply take George V's LP in regard to the children of the eldest son of the Prince of Wales back to what they were under QV.

With regard to Louise and James there are two interpretations - one that they still are HRHs and the other that all that is needed to change the situation is that the Queen's will be made known - which it has been - and so they aren't so entitled anymore. As they are highly unlikely to ever use the HRH we will probably never know the true situation there.
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  #2020  
Old 03-29-2013, 11:38 PM
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Originally Posted by BrazilianEmpire View Post
Why? The Queen was able to went against the Letters of Patent of King George V, why she can't do the same with Letters of Patent that were passed by herself?
She didn't 'go against' the LPs of George V - she added to them.

There is also a difference between the issuing of LPs to create a styling - such as HRH Prince/Princess - non-substantive words for commoners and those creating a peer of the realm, or LPs that create a noble such as the ones creating Philip a Duke - taking him from commoner status to that of a peer (as she did in 2011 with William when she made him a Duke - changed his status from commoner to peer - Kate remains a commoner).
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