The Royal Forums Coat of Arms


Join The Royal Forums Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #221  
Old 08-19-2015, 02:33 PM
Osipi's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: On the west side of North up from Back, United States
Posts: 7,320
You make a good, valid point there. Who knows what the future will bring.
__________________

__________________
“In my walks, every man I meet is my superior in some way, and in that I learn from him.”
~~~Ralph Waldo Emerson~~~
Reply With Quote
  #222  
Old 08-19-2015, 04:36 PM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Christmas Island
Posts: 6,304
Apparently the coronets used for Princess Elizabeth and Princess Margaret were just fantasy coronets in mediaeval style and specially commissioned for this event. They do not have any historic relevance and were just meant "to dress up" as the two Princesses were no Peers at all and shoud -normally- not wear anything. I can not imagine that anno 2015 or later Prince George and Princess Charlotte will still wear those fantasy crowns which refer to nothing. At least the crowns of the Duke of Norfolk, or the Marquess of Winchester, or the Earl of Shrewsbury at least refer to centuries and centuries old peerages. These fake crowns only add to the feeling "it is just silly theatre, folks". I would keep it pure and not dress it up.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #223  
Old 08-19-2015, 04:52 PM
Courtier
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 663
Please forgive me if I am going off topic but the whole making things up for the sake of pageantry was arguably a large part of PC's investiture as Prince of Wales was it not?
Reply With Quote
  #224  
Old 08-19-2015, 04:53 PM
Courtier
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 663
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
You make a good, valid point there. Who knows what the future will bring.
Thank you Osipi and may I say how much I like your various smileys. Not that I don't enjoy your informative post's as well...
Reply With Quote
  #225  
Old 08-19-2015, 05:17 PM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Christmas Island
Posts: 6,304
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honeybees View Post
Please forgive me if I am going off topic but the whole making things up for the sake of pageantry was arguably a large part of PC's investiture as Prince of Wales was it not?
Índeed, I can not imagine the new King to invest the new Prince of Wales with such newly invented theatre again.
Reply With Quote
  #226  
Old 08-19-2015, 05:30 PM
Courtier
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 663
One sees it now and it looks so set in the sixties, so of its time and that crown? But Royalty is about Pageantry is it not?
Reply With Quote
  #227  
Old 08-19-2015, 05:59 PM
Skippyboo's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Atlanta, United States
Posts: 3,620
PoW investiture is a made up thing that only has been done for Edward and Charles the last 2 PoWs. No set formula. Charles's was basically a made for TV event designed by Lord Snowdon

The coronation service goes back a 1000 years. The service itself hasn't been changed since 1689.

It's safe to say when Charles is crowned (assuming no doomsday scenario) the grandkids aren't going to be adults. The BRF typically doesn't take really young kids to church services and the coronation is longer than a wedding or funeral would be. So W&K would have to decide if the kids can't handle sitting in the royal box. There is a coronet design for the children of the heir apparent but would they want to make them use it in the part after the crowning when the peers don their coronets.


Sent from my iPhone using The Royals Community
Reply With Quote
  #228  
Old 08-19-2015, 10:55 PM
LauraS3514's Avatar
Nobility
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: San Jose, CA, United States
Posts: 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skippyboo View Post
PoW investiture is a made up thing that only has been done for Edward and Charles the last 2 PoWs. No set formula. Charles's was basically a made for TV event designed by Lord Snowdon

The coronation service goes back a 1000 years. The service itself hasn't been changed since 1689.

It's safe to say when Charles is crowned (assuming no doomsday scenario) the grandkids aren't going to be adults. The BRF typically doesn't take really young kids to church services and the coronation is longer than a wedding or funeral would be. So W&K would have to decide if the kids can't handle sitting in the royal box. There is a coronet design for the children of the heir apparent but would they want to make them use it in the part after the crowning when the peers don their coronets.
Sent from my iPhone using The Royals Community
Exactly - there are specific coronets for the heir apparent, his (and now her) children, other children of a sovereign, and grandchildren of a sovereign - peers or not. Potential royal coronet wearers for Charles's coronation would be William, George and Charlotte (depending on their ages), Harry, Andrew, Beatrice, Eugenie, Anne, Peter, Zara, Louise, James, Edward, Dukes of Gloucester and Kent (if he's still alive, if not, his son will as an "ordinary" duke) Prince Michael, and Princess Alexandra - assuming the Queen's cousins are still alive of course. I'm not sure, but I believe that Catherine, Sophie, Birgitte, Katharine Kent and Marie-Christine would also be entitled as wives, as would the future Princess Harry.
Reply With Quote
  #229  
Old 08-20-2015, 02:54 AM
Stefan's Avatar
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Esslingen, Germany
Posts: 3,565
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honeybees View Post
One sees it now and it looks so set in the sixties, so of its time and that crown? But Royalty is about Pageantry is it not?
Probably they would not use this Crown for William. The one for Charles was made specailly for him as the ral üprince of Wales cvoronet was still with the Duke of Windsor.
Reply With Quote
  #230  
Old 08-20-2015, 07:24 AM
Skippyboo's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Atlanta, United States
Posts: 3,620
Appropriate Age to Wear Jewellery

Quote:
Originally Posted by LauraS3514 View Post
Exactly - there are specific coronets for the heir apparent, his (and now her) children, other children of a sovereign, and grandchildren of a sovereign - peers or not. Potential royal coronet wearers for Charles's coronation would be William, George and Charlotte (depending on their ages), Harry, Andrew, Beatrice, Eugenie, Anne, Peter, Zara, Louise, James, Edward, Dukes of Gloucester and Kent (if he's still alive, if not, his son will as an "ordinary" duke) Prince Michael, and Princess Alexandra - assuming the Queen's cousins are still alive of course. I'm not sure, but I believe that Catherine, Sophie, Birgitte, Katharine Kent and Marie-Christine would also be entitled as wives, as would the future Princess Harry.

The article I read had a coronet for the heir-apparent, children of the heir apparent, children of the other sons of the sovereign, grandchildren of the sovereign.

There is a difference of one word between what you and I wrote- a vs the. If it's the , Charles is the sovereign in this discussion and the coronets are limited to Anne, Andrew and Edwards as siblings and then W and H's families.

If a is right, it adds Peter, Zara, Bea, Eugenie, Louise, James, David Linley, Sarah Chatto, DoGloucester, DoKent, Michael of Kent, Alexandra of Kent

The 2 Dukes would had a coronet as dukes.

Which is right?


Sent from my iPhone using The Royals Community
Reply With Quote
  #231  
Old 08-20-2015, 08:53 AM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Christmas Island
Posts: 6,304
Usually (adult) Princes of the blood royal have a coronet. And of course the Peers.
Reply With Quote
  #232  
Old 08-20-2015, 10:17 AM
Commoner
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Dallas, United States
Posts: 34
Appropriate Age to Wear Jewellery

Granted, Peter and Zara are grandchildren of a sovereign; however, they are untitled "commoners." Would they still wear coronets? I don't believe they have a right to bear a coronet of any rank on their coats of arms.
Reply With Quote
  #233  
Old 08-20-2015, 12:26 PM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Christmas Island
Posts: 6,304
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glasshouse View Post
Granted, Peter and Zara are grandchildren of a sovereign; however, they are untitled "commoners." Would they still wear coronets? I don't believe they have a right to bear a coronet of any rank on their coats of arms.
They are no Princes of the Blood Royal and they no Peers of the Realm. So most likely they will wear nothing at the Coronation. The coronets worn by Princes and Peers are derived from their Coat of Arms.

Look at this picture.

From the left to the right:

A Baron (plain silver gilded circlet with six silver balls)

A Marquess (four golden strawberry leaves alternate with four silver balls)

A Duke (eight golden strawberry leaves)

An Earl (eight rays with silver balls with golden stawberry leaves in between)

A Viscount (sixteen silver balls closely set on a circlet)

Reply With Quote
  #234  
Old 08-21-2015, 01:36 PM
Tilia C.'s Avatar
Super Moderator
Picture of the Week Coordinator
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: O, Germany
Posts: 4,560
Actually I wonder if coronets and peer's robes will still be used at all at the next coronation. After all it is more than 60 years since the last coronation, and the pomp and circumstance of monarchy has considerably altered during that period. The role of British peers has quite changed also. So I wouldn't be surprised if the coronets and robes will fall prey to the modernization of the coronation ceremony. Maybe there won’t even be tiaras and long gowns, though I certainly do not hope so.
__________________
Please vote in our TRF Fashion Polls


Reply With Quote
  #235  
Old 08-21-2015, 01:56 PM
Blog Real's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lisboa, Portugal
Posts: 1,631
I hope that the coronation is equal to that of Elizabeth II.

Who were the peers of the realm at the coronation of Elizabeth II?
__________________
Acclamation Manuel II of Portugal: 6 May 1908
Reply With Quote
  #236  
Old 08-21-2015, 02:04 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: *******, Canada
Posts: 5,008
Some hereditary peers by virtue of the their office will be involved. The Duke of Norfolk as the Earl Marshal and Hereditary Marshal of England will oversee many aspects of the coronation.

The Marquess of Cholmondeley as The Lord Great Chamberlain, has charge over the Palace of Westminster and will certainly be there.

Coronets and peer's robes would look magnificent

I think each rank of the peerage will have some representatives in full robes as will life peers.

There are only 24 dukes left so this may be their last 'kick at the can' if you will.
Reply With Quote
  #237  
Old 08-21-2015, 02:27 PM
Dman's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Midwest, United States
Posts: 12,145
I believe the next Coronation will reflect on the previous Coronation of 53.
__________________
"WE CANNOT PRAY IN LOVE AND LIVE IN HATE AND STILL THINK WE ARE WORSHIPING GOD."

A.W. TOZER
Reply With Quote
  #238  
Old 08-21-2015, 03:51 PM
An Ard Ri's Avatar
Super Moderator
Royal Blogger
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: An Iarmhí, Ireland
Posts: 16,518
BBC - Coronation of Queen Elizabeth II

__________________
27 March 1615,Death of Marguerite de Valois,Queen of Navarre
Reply With Quote
  #239  
Old 08-21-2015, 03:52 PM
Osipi's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: On the west side of North up from Back, United States
Posts: 7,320
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dman View Post
I believe the next Coronation will reflect on the previous Coronation of 53.
I really hope it is done up in all the grandeur and splendor that the Queen's coronation was done in. After 62 years, it will be something the majority of UK citizens and global watchers have never seen. Its an actual coronation where the official state regalia is used and the King will actually be crowned rather than just have a crown on display as some other countries have done. Charles is very much a traditionalist and I would imagine he would want things to be as they've been for centuries. No one does pomp and pageantry like the British.

Perhaps a more modern coronation could come into being with the coronation of William. Although its very possible, I don't think William will have such a long wait as his father has had and the grand coronation of Charles will still be remembered by a good percentage of the world.
__________________
“In my walks, every man I meet is my superior in some way, and in that I learn from him.”
~~~Ralph Waldo Emerson~~~
Reply With Quote
  #240  
Old 08-21-2015, 06:01 PM
Iluvbertie's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Bathurst, Australia
Posts: 10,404
One reason why I suspect it won't be as grand is that Westminster Abbey was closed to the public for six months to prepare it for the coronation - to put in all the extra seating etc. I don't see them closing the Abbey for that length of time which would mean fewer guests at the ceremony.


I am not sure it will be anything like 1953 - certainly it will be simpler. One reason will be Charles' age. He will probably be in his late 70s at the time and so the ceremony will need to be shortened for him so he can simply survive it - it would be awful if he couldn't last through the ceremony due to health issues. The Queen was a young woman in her 20s while her son will be in his 70s and he isn't as fit now as he was even 10 years ago. Camilla's health will also be a factor as she also has to make it through the ceremony - whether she is going to be crowned as Queen or simply take the title of Princess Consort she still has to be there for the entire ceremony.
__________________

Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
british monarchs, ceremonies, coronation, king george vi, regalia


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Unexpected Monarchs auntie Royalty Past, Present, and Future 85 09-26-2016 04:37 AM
What Would You Wear To Your Own Coronation?! constance Royal Chit Chat 25 12-09-2015 07:43 AM
Worst British Monarchs Kurenai British Royal History 169 10-24-2013 01:03 AM




Popular Tags
albania ascot 2016 best gown best gown 2016 best gown september 2016 best hat best jewels best outfit best outfit june 2016 countess of wessex's eveningwear coup d'etat crown prince crown princess mary crown princess mary eveningwear crown princess mary fashion cymry denmark duchess of cambridge duke of cambridge e-mail fashion poll jew kate middleton king abdullah ii king carl gustaf and queen silvia king philippe king willem-alexander member introduction monarchy new zealand norway november 2016 october 2016 opening of parliament picture of the week prince charles princess beatrice eveningwear princess marie princess mary princess mary casual style princess mary daytime fashion princess mary fashion princess mary hats princess mary style princess sofia queen letizia queen letizia casual outfits queen letizia daytime fashion queen letizia fashion queen margrethe queen mathilde queen maxima queen maxima casual wear queen maxima daytime fashion queen maxima fashion queen maxima hats queen maxima style queen rania queen rania casual outfit queen rania daytime fashion queen rania fashion september 2016 state visit succession sweden the duchess of cambridge the duchess of cambridge casual wear the duchess of cambridge daytime fashion the duchess of cambridge fashion the duchess of cambridge hats


Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:11 PM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2017
Jelsoft Enterprises