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  #141  
Old 05-12-2012, 01:03 AM
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Iluvbertie - Do you think it's a conscious thing that Charles is leading always with his totals? I know you don't like to see it as a competition - but it is clear that Charles is carrying the most, albeit by a slim margin. Anne is so close to his total sometimes but she never overtakes him, even for a week. Would this be intentional do you think? In deference to Charles? Do you think they keep track of this kind of thing when planning engagements?
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  #142  
Old 05-12-2012, 02:20 AM
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No I don't think they track this sort of thing at all. Charles has picked up engagements formerly done only by his mother e.g. investitures etc and other things so his totals have been going up for a number of years now. As Philip has stepped back (from highs around 800 his duties have been picked up by Charles and Edward in the main).

Charles has always done a lot but has been doing more than his sister for some years. I actually think that it is more a reflection on the fact that he is settled in his private life and has a supportive wife as well - one who can encourage him.
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  #143  
Old 05-18-2012, 05:52 PM
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Weekly update to 17th May.

A busy week for The Queen and Philip. A couple of days with 10+ engagements and a couple more with no engagements - a sensible approach if you ask me for a couple at their ages. This doesn't include the Jubilee luncheon as that was on the 18th and won't appear on the CC until it is published on Monday.

HM The Queen - 220 (181 - up 39)
HRH The Duke of Edinburgh - 157 (122 - up 35)
HRH The Prince of Wales - 253 (234 – up 19)
HRH The Duchess of Cornwall - 119 (116 – up 3)
HRH The Duke of Cambridge - 9 (8 - up 1)
HRH The Duchess of Cambridge - 33 (32 - up 1)
HRH Prince Henry of Wales - 42 (41 – up 1)
HRH The Duke of York - 198 (190 - up 8)
HRH Princess Beatrice of York - 7 (7 - no change)
HRH Princess Eugenie of York - 3 (3- no change)
HRH The Earl of Wessex - 161 (154 - up 7)
HRH The Countess of Wessex - 149 (144 – up 5)
HRH The Princess Royal - 212 (199 – up 13)
HRH The Duke of Gloucester - 139 (123 – up 16)
HRH The Duchess of Gloucester - 42 (41 – up 1)
HRH The Duke of Kent - 61 (56 – up 5)
HRH The Duchess of Kent - 0 (0 no change)
HRH Prince Michael of Kent – 2 (2 – no change)
HRH Princess Michael of Kent – 2 (2 – no change)
HRH Princess Alexandra - 26 (22 – up 4)


Order from most downwards - the 'league table' if you like. I refuse to calculate how people are moving up or down that list. I do move people around who have moved up or down but I am not putting in how many places they are moving - although usually it is only one place in either direction.

HRH The Prince of Wales - 253
HM The Queen – 220
HRH The Princess Royal - 212
HRH The Duke of York - 198
HRH The Earl of Wessex - 161
HRH The Countess of Wessex - 159
HRH The Duke of Edinburgh – 157
HRH The Duke of Gloucester - 139
HRH The Duchess of Cornwall - 119
HRH The Duke of Kent - 61
HRH Prince Henry of Wales - 42
HRH The Duchess of Gloucester - 42
HRH The Duchess of Cambridge - 33
HRH Princess Alexandra - 26
HRH The Duke of Cambridge - 9
HRH Princess Beatrice of York – 7
HRH Princess Eugenie of York - 3
HRH Prince Michael of Kent – 2
HRH Princess Michael of Kent - 2
HRH The Duchess of Kent - 0

Year to date total - 1835 with 80.5% of those engagements being carried out by The Queen, her children and their spouses. The remaining 19.5% have been done by her grandchildren, first cousins and their spouses. This is a change from last week with The Queen and her children and spouses up 0.5%to 80.5% of the engagements.
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  #144  
Old 05-25-2012, 07:04 PM
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Weekly update to 24th May.

This week saw almost every member of the family involved at least once - with the Jubilee lunch and others who don't usually do much even doing 2 or 3 with the Dinner, the Muster and the Chelsea Flower Show.

With regard to the military muster all royals who attended get credit for an engagement but The Queen and Philip get the credit for all the things that happened e.g. taking the Salute. This is because the CC listed 5 events for The Queen and 6 events for Philip while all the others were simply listed as being present even though they would also have witnessed the flypast and probably attended the Luncheon. The italics shows the engagements credited to The Queen and Philip.

Her Majesty and His Royal Highness were received in the Quadrangle with a Royal Salute and witnessed a flypast by a "Diamond 9" formation of Typhoon aircraft.
Detachments from the Royal Navy, Army and Royal Air Force marched past The Queen and The Duke of Edinburgh.
Her Majesty and His Royal Highness then drove through Windsor to the Home Park (Private) to attend a Drumhead Service.
The Chief of the Defence Staff addressed the Parade and The Queen was pleased to reply.
Her Majesty and His Royal Highness subsequently witnessed a Tri-Service flypast of rotary and fixed wing aircraft before attending a Reception.
Afterwards The Queen and The Duke of Edinburgh were entertained to Luncheon by the Chief of the Defence Staff.

We all know that Charles and Camilla were in Canada this past week but how many knew The Duke of Gloucester was carrying out engagements in Sydney? If it hadn't been for the CC I would have had no idea and I live in Sydney. That is the side of the working royals we don't see - the visits the minor royals make that impacts on the lives of people but that most people don't even know happen.

HM The Queen - 243 (220 - up 23)
HRH The Duke of Edinburgh - 175 (157 - up 18)
HRH The Prince of Wales - 281 (253 – up 28)
HRH The Duchess of Cornwall - 140 (119 – up 19)
HRH The Duke of Cambridge - 10 (9 - up 1)
HRH The Duchess of Cambridge - 34 (33 - up 1)
HRH Prince Henry of Wales - 43 (42 – up 1)
HRH The Duke of York - 210 (198 - up 12)
HRH Princess Beatrice of York - 8 (7 - up 1)
HRH Princess Eugenie of York - 4 (3- up 1)
HRH The Earl of Wessex - 180 (161 - up 19)
HRH The Countess of Wessex - 158 (149 – up 9)
HRH The Princess Royal - 233 (212 – up 21)
HRH The Duke of Gloucester - 152 (139 – up 13)
HRH The Duchess of Gloucester - 51 (42 – up 9)
HRH The Duke of Kent - 71 (61 – up 10)
HRH The Duchess of Kent - 0 (0 no change)
HRH Prince Michael of Kent – 5 (2 – up 3)
HRH Princess Michael of Kent 5 (2 – up 3)
HRH Princess Alexandra - 36 (26 – up 10)


Order from most downwards - the 'league table' if you like. I refuse to calculate how people are moving up or down that list. I do move people around who have moved up or down but I am not putting in how many places they are moving - although usually it is only one place in either direction.

HRH The Prince of Wales - 281
HM The Queen – 243
HRH The Princess Royal - 233
HRH The Duke of York - 210
HRH The Earl of Wessex - 180
HRH The Duke of Edinburgh – 175
HRH The Countess of Wessex - 158
HRH The Duke of Gloucester - 152
HRH The Duchess of Cornwall - 140
HRH The Duke of Kent - 71
HRH The Duchess of Gloucester - 51
HRH Prince Henry of Wales - 43
HRH The Duchess of Cambridge - 34
HRH Princess Alexandra - 36
HRH The Duke of Cambridge - 10
HRH Princess Beatrice of York – 8
HRH Princess Eugenie of York - 4
HRH Prince Michael of Kent – 5
HRH Princess Michael of Kent - 5
HRH The Duchess of Kent - 0

Year to date total - 2039 with 79% of those engagements being carried out by The Queen, her children and their spouses. The remaining 21% have been done by her grandchildren, first cousins and their spouses. This is a change from last week with The Queen and her children and spouses down 01.5% to 79% of the engagements. This is probably because the adult royal grandchildren and granchild-in-law all did an engagement each - the Jubilee Luncheon, and all the cousins and cousins-in-law except for the Duchess of Kent also carried out engagements with the Duke of Gloucester picking up a number in Australia - total for cousins for the week - 48 of the 202 or 23.7% of the week's engagements carried out by the really minor royals.
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  #145  
Old 05-28-2012, 01:36 PM
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Some questions, Iluvbertie.

Given the following numbers -
HRH The Prince of Wales - 281 (253 – up 28)
HRH The Duchess of Cornwall - 140 (119 – up 19)

- maybe you've already answered this but since Charles and Camilla are on a tour and one usually sees the couple (whoever they are) usually always together, is the same thing happening for them as for the Queen? Meaning, the Queen is seen to have 4 functions at an event, while all other royals get only a 1 for attending - does this happen on tour? So that Charles attends and gives a speech - garnering a 2, while Camilla would have only attended and so got a 1. (Though I've been at speeches and I think a spouse listening raptly to the speech should count for something. )

I have noted that Sophie, The Countess of Wessex, has been in Monaco, sans Edward. She went down there to attend a Duke of Edinburgh award, and then showed up at the races, clearly the private guest of Charlene and Albert - or we assume as friendship seems to have developed between Charlene and Sophie. Will Sophie's attendance at the Monaco races - as friend but still front and center alongside the Monaco regent, still count as a royal duty for Sophie?

Thank you for any insight you can provide.
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  #146  
Old 05-28-2012, 01:52 PM
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Her attendance at the Grand Prix is not yet mentioned in the Court Circular. She did undertake 5 events in Monaco on behalf of the DoE Awards though.

May 25 Court Circular
BUCKINGHAM PALACE: The Countess of Wessex, on behalf of The Duke of Edinburgh's Award International Foundation, today undertook the following engagements in Monaco.

Her Royal Highness this afternoon attended a Lunch.

The Countess of Wessex this evening attended the Amber Lounge Charity Reception at the Meridien Beach Plaza Hotel.

Her Royal Highness afterwards attended a Dinner at the Caves de l'Hτtel de Paris

May 26 Court Circular

BUCKINGHAM PALACE: The Countess of Wessex, on behalf of The Duke of Edinburgh's Award International Foundation, this evening undertook the following engagements in Monaco.

Her Royal Highness attended a Reception given by Prince Albert II of Monaco at The Prince's Palace.

The Countess of Wessex afterwards attended a Dinner at the Fairmont Monte Carlo
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  #147  
Old 05-28-2012, 02:01 PM
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I think Sophie's Grand Prix events in Monaco are classified as "private".
She was just a guest of the Princely couple, not undertaking any engagements on behalf of the Queen.
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  #148  
Old 05-28-2012, 05:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyger
Some questions, Iluvbertie.

Given the following numbers -
HRH The Prince of Wales - 281 (253 – up 28)
HRH The Duchess of Cornwall - 140 (119 – up 19)
- maybe you've already answered this but since Charles and Camilla are on a tour and one usually sees the couple (whoever they are) usually always together, is the same thing happening for them as for the Queen? Meaning, the Queen is seen to have 4 functions at an event, while all other royals get only a 1 for attending - does this happen on tour? So that Charles attends and gives a speech - garnering a 2, while Camilla would have only attended and so got a 1. (Though I've been at speeches and I think a spouse listening raptly to the speech should count for something. )
Listening to a spouse doesn't count so if Charles gave a speech and Camilla was there he would get a 1 but she wouldn't and the reason for that is that the CC would list Charles as giving the speech but wouldn't list Camilla as listening to the speech.

On the Canada tour there were occasions when Charles was doing two or three shorter engagements while Camilla was doing one longer one - so they weren't always together.

Quote:
I have noted that Sophie, The Countess of Wessex, has been in Monaco, sans Edward. She went down there to attend a Duke of Edinburgh award, and then showed up at the races, clearly the private guest of Charlene and Albert - or we assume as friendship seems to have developed between Charlene and Sophie. Will Sophie's attendance at the Monaco races - as friend but still front and center alongside the Monaco regent, still count as a royal duty for Sophie?

Thank you for any insight you can provide.
Only royal duties listed in the Court Circular count - regardless as to high high profile the event is or how much coverage is given to the event e.g. the recent polo match that garnered a lot of coverage for Kate running around and William and Harry playing didn't count as an engagement for any of them as it wasn't listed in the CC.

Sophie's events listed in the CC will be in next week's count but the Grand Prix won't be amongst them as it wasn't an official engagement.

This is actually an important point as there is often coverage of royals doing things that might appear somewhat official but in effect aren't as they don't make the CC e.g. Beatrice opening the Teen Cancer Unit last week - no mention in the CC so not an engagement for Beatrice and yet if Anne had opened something it would count.

The only thing we can use, to be consistent is the CC and that is what I am using.
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  #149  
Old 05-28-2012, 05:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artemisia View Post

I think Sophie's Grand Prix events in Monaco are classified as "private".
She was just a guest of the Princely couple, not undertaking any engagements on behalf of the Queen.

Just a note: Official engagements aren't always 'on behalf of the Queen' by the way. Overseas trips this year tend to be described that way - but the Duke of Gloucester's visit to Sydney last week didn't get that description or Sophie's to Monaca - on behalf of the Duke of Edinburgh's Award International Foundation.

'On behalf of the Queen' are those engagements where the Queen was invited to attend herself or to send a representative e.g. the Commonwealth tours this year, but other official engagements can be those where a particular royal for one reason or another has been the one asked to attend.
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  #150  
Old 05-29-2012, 02:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
Listening to a spouse doesn't count so if Charles gave a speech and Camilla was there he would get a 1 but she wouldn't and the reason for that is that the CC would list Charles as giving the speech but wouldn't list Camilla as listening to the speech.
Well, like I said, this seems particularly unfair.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
Only royal duties listed in the Court Circular count - regardless as to how high profile the event is or how much coverage is given to the event e.g. the recent polo match that garnered a lot of coverage for Kate running around and William and Harry playing didn't count as an engagement for any of them as it wasn't listed in the CC.
Oh, Iluvbertie!
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  #151  
Old 05-29-2012, 07:23 PM
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Based on a comment Victoria B made in the Queen's Jubilee thread I thought I would add another statistic to my calcualations - giving the percentage of duties carried out by The Queen, Philip, Charles, Camilla, William, Kate and Harry compared to that done by the rest of the family - so we can see how much the Wales' are going to have to step up their workload as they older generation ages.

The Queen, Philip and the Wales (Charles, Camilla, William, Kate and Harry) - 45%
Everybody else (Yorks, Wessexes, Anne, Gloucesters and Kents) - 65%

So the Queen and the Wales need to more than double their current workrate to cover the work done by the others in the years ahead - of course William's children will have to step up but Harry's will have the same freedom that Beatrice and Eugenie are having as they will only be the children of the second son - as are Beatrice and Eugenie.
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  #152  
Old 05-30-2012, 03:28 AM
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Now that's interesting, and guess which workers are being celebrated this Jubilee weekend?
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  #153  
Old 05-30-2012, 04:49 PM
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A correction to an earlier post of mine.

Sophie's attendance at the Grand Prix ended up being an official engagement and was in the CC for the 27th May along with Dinner that evening so she ended up with 7 engagements in Monaco.
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  #154  
Old 05-30-2012, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
Based on a comment Victoria B made in the Queen's Jubilee thread I thought I would add another statistic to my calcualations - giving the percentage of duties carried out by The Queen, Philip, Charles, Camilla, William, Kate and Harry compared to that done by the rest of the family - so we can see how much the Wales' are going to have to step up their workload as they older generation ages.

The Queen, Philip and the Wales (Charles, Camilla, William, Kate and Harry) - 45%
Everybody else (Yorks, Wessexes, Anne, Gloucesters and Kents) - 65%

So the Queen and the Wales need to more than double their current workrate to cover the work done by the others in the years ahead - of course William's children will have to step up but Harry's will have the same freedom that Beatrice and Eugenie are having as they will only be the children of the second son - as are Beatrice and Eugenie.
Not necessarily - they will just have to support less organisations


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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
Now that's interesting, and guess which workers are being celebrated this Jubilee weekend?
That's a negative way of viewing it - the "7" are not being celebrated more than the others - the Queen is simply emphasising the future of the monarchy and her support of Prince Charles, Camilla etc. This is an important opportunity to do that and (a) stress the importance of the role of Prince Charles (b) continuity and (c) a smaller core team in the mid to long term. Seems the right time to do that.
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  #155  
Old 05-30-2012, 05:03 PM
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Not necessarily - they will just have to support less organisations
That's the choice they'll have to make, reduce the family and reduce the number of engagements they do thereby probably loosing the respect of a lot of people. Nobody's going to be happy when they realise they no longer have a royal patron because someone wants to cut down the family. IF the family is cut down.
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  #156  
Old 05-30-2012, 11:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
That's the choice they'll have to make, reduce the family and reduce the number of engagements they do thereby probably loosing the respect of a lot of people. Nobody's going to be happy when they realise they no longer have a royal patron because someone wants to cut down the family. IF the family is cut down.
Another thing that may occur in the future is that we'll see more and more of the minor royals that actually aren't part of the "firm" still supporting and being patrons of charities such as Beatrice has done lately.
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  #157  
Old 05-31-2012, 02:25 AM
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The problem will be the time that they can put into it - a working royal can devote their entire working life to their charities and organisations while a minor royal who has a real full-time job will only be able to devote limited time to their charity/organisation and will therefore be able to do a lot less for it but if that is what the public want - less contact with royals, fewer charities/organisations (like about half) with royal patrons etc then so be it.

What the royal family have to realise is that it would be blatantly unfair to Beatrice and Eugenie to say to them now - get a full-time job and you aren't wanted or needed by us - and then turn around in say 20 years and say 'bad luck we now need you so give up your career and private family life and start working for us'.
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  #158  
Old 06-02-2012, 11:03 AM
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What the royal family have to realise is that it would be blatantly unfair to Beatrice and Eugenie to say to them now - get a full-time job and you aren't wanted or needed by us - and then turn around in say 20 years and say 'bad luck we now need you so give up your career and private family life and start working for us'.
Which brings up the matter of why the two women are being side-lined when they could be doing so much work for the family. Is it truly to do with their mother, Sarah? Is it an attempt of the BRF to distance themselves from the attention-seeking of Sarah? If Sarah were more like Sophie, would her daughters be allowed to be involved?
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  #159  
Old 06-02-2012, 06:51 PM
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Which brings up the matter of why the two women are being side-lined when they could be doing so much work for the family. Is it truly to do with their mother, Sarah? Is it an attempt of the BRF to distance themselves from the attention-seeking of Sarah? If Sarah were more like Sophie, would her daughters be allowed to be involved?

I think it if far more a reaction to the vocal minority who are anti-monarchy and who object to any money being spent on the royal family so the idea is to reduce the visible size of the family and that means fewer royals out and about doing royal duties. This mean that the girls are going to be the first royal cousins to not be required but in the future the children of younger siblings will also not be doing royal duties e.g. Harry's children will be expected to also support themselves and not do royal duties.

The first time a change happens it becomes something on which to comment but in future generations it will be the norm to have only the monarch and the heir doing royal duties and the rest of the family working for their own livings rather than being supported by the state.
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Old 06-02-2012, 07:07 PM
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Weekly update to 31st May.

A quieter week for everyone this week - probably in preparation for the very busy Jubilee Weekend ahead.

HM The Queen - 252 (243 - up 9)
HRH The Duke of Edinburgh - 183 (175 - up 8)
HRH The Prince of Wales - 298 (281 – up 17)
HRH The Duchess of Cornwall - 147 (140 – up 7)
HRH The Duke of Cambridge - 10 (10 - no change)
HRH The Duchess of Cambridge - 35 (34 - up 1)
HRH Prince Henry of Wales - 44 (43 – up 1)
HRH The Duke of York - 224 (210 - up 14)
HRH Princess Beatrice of York - 8 (8 - up 1)
HRH Princess Eugenie of York - 4 (4- up 1)
HRH The Earl of Wessex - 191 (180 - up 11)
HRH The Countess of Wessex - 171 (158 – up 13)
HRH The Princess Royal - 245 (233 – up 12)
HRH The Duke of Gloucester - 160 (152 – up 8)
HRH The Duchess of Gloucester - 53 (51 – up 2)
HRH The Duke of Kent - 80 (71 – up 9)
HRH The Duchess of Kent - 0 (0 no change)
HRH Prince Michael of Kent – 6 (5 – up 1)
HRH Princess Michael of Kent 6 (5 – up 1)
HRH Princess Alexandra - 41 (36 – up 5)


Order from most downwards - the 'league table' if you like. I refuse to calculate how people are moving up or down that list. I do move people around who have moved up or down but I am not putting in how many places they are moving - although usually it is only one place in either direction.

HRH The Prince of Wales - 298
HM The Queen – 252
HRH The Princess Royal - 245
HRH The Duke of York - 224
HRH The Earl of Wessex - 191
HRH The Duke of Edinburgh – 175
HRH The Countess of Wessex - 171
HRH The Duke of Gloucester - 160
HRH The Duchess of Cornwall - 147
HRH The Duke of Kent - 80
HRH The Duchess of Gloucester - 53
HRH Prince Henry of Wales - 44
HRH Princess Alexandra - 41
HRH The Duchess of Cambridge - 35
HRH The Duke of Cambridge - 10
HRH Princess Beatrice of York – 8
HRH Prince Michael of Kent – 6
HRH Princess Michael of Kent - 6
HRH Princess Eugenie of York - 4
HRH The Duchess of Kent - 0

Year to date total - 2158 with 79% of those engagements being carried out by The Queen, her children and their spouses. The remaining 21% have been done by her grandchildren, first cousins and their spouses. This sees no change from last week.

The main line (The Queen, Duke of Edinburgh, Prince of Wales, Duchess of Cornwall, Duke of Cambridge, Duchess of Cambridge, Prince Harry) have remained at 45%.

Next week will see a number of engagements for everyone - even possible The Duchess of Kent at the Thanksgiving Service (that would be the only event I would expect to see her attend - if she attends anything at all this year).
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Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


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