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  #181  
Old 02-07-2007, 02:39 PM
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Surely Her Majesty's intelligence is undoubted seeing as how she's reigned over the people of Great Britain for over 50 years? Did we need Helen Mirren to show us this side to the great lady?
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  #182  
Old 02-07-2007, 07:28 PM
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i enjoyed the movie, helen mirren was wonderful, the look on her face when she was reading the cards on the flowers was right on, you could read the pain and shock in her eyes. it made me love and respect the queen even more.
one question my friend and i are arguing about. i think the stag was a metaphor of diana, a beautiful creature, cruelly hunted down, he thinks it's supposed to show the queen cared more about an animals death than dianas. does anybody have an opinion about it. thanks
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  #183  
Old 02-07-2007, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fandesacs2003
No I think it made her look clever
I'm curious. How do you think the movie made her out to be clever?

I must have missed that part. I thought it made Tony Blair look really clever.
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  #184  
Old 02-07-2007, 07:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbb
i enjoyed the movie, helen mirren was wonderful, the look on her face when she was reading the cards on the flowers was right on, you could read the pain and shock in her eyes. it made me love and respect the queen even more.
one question my friend and i are arguing about. i think the stag was a metaphor of diana, a beautiful creature, cruelly hunted down, he thinks it's supposed to show the queen cared more about an animals death than dianas. does anybody have an opinion about it. thanks
I think the Queen saw the stag as a symbol of what Diana went through. If that stag had escaped and not been killed I think that the Queen felt like Diana in a way hadn't really died somehow. However, once the stag was killed I think that for her Diana was finally dead. I also think she wanted to believe that there was hope despite all that had happened.
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  #185  
Old 02-07-2007, 07:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbb
i enjoyed the movie, helen mirren was wonderful, the look on her face when she was reading the cards on the flowers was right on, you could read the pain and shock in her eyes. it made me love and respect the queen even more.
one question my friend and i are arguing about. i think the stag was a metaphor of diana, a beautiful creature, cruelly hunted down, he thinks it's supposed to show the queen cared more about an animals death than dianas. does anybody have an opinion about it. thanks
I think the filmmakers could well have had both meanings in mind. That scene didn't work for me. I liked it up to the point right before the hunters came and shot the deer but after that it was a bit too melodramatic for my tastes. Like skydragon said earlier, the Queen is an experienced hunter so it didn't ring true that she would think the stag's death was tragic and unfair.
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  #186  
Old 02-07-2007, 08:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ysbel
I think the filmmakers could well have had both meanings in mind. That scene didn't work for me. I liked it up to the point right before the hunters came and shot the deer but after that it was a bit too melodramatic for my tastes. Like skydragon said earlier, the Queen is an experienced hunter so it didn't ring true that she would think the stag's death was tragic and unfair.
Certainly, but at the time it was a fairly traumatic time and I'm sure she wasn't looking at things so clinically and humdrum.
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  #187  
Old 02-07-2007, 08:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Tzu An
Certainly, but at the time it was a fairly traumatic time and I'm sure she wasn't looking at things so clinically and humdrum.
That's true. I think though the scene was stretching it a bit to suggest the not-very-literary-minded Queen would have made the connection between the stag and Diana. The stag was a literary reference to Diana, the huntress goddess who often took the shape of a deer.

The Queen played by Helen Mirren appeared incredibly pragmatic rather than fanciful minded which is how I see the Queen in real life.
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  #188  
Old 02-07-2007, 09:01 PM
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Oh, I didn't think of it in terms of the mythical figure of "Diana." The Queen saw a stag and thought of him as beautiful and at the time didn't want something that was also beautiful to die. She was, right before she saw the stag, crying a bit.
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  #189  
Old 02-08-2007, 03:33 AM
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I just finally saw and loved the film, and I tell you what, it made me think a little better of Tony Blair (and reminded me how much I dislike Alastair Campbell!).

The best bit was when the crowds at the front of the barriers curtsied to the Queen.

What a wonderful woman she is.

And you know, I always rated Mirren as an actress but this is astonishing. The first time she opened her mouth I was in shock, the imitation of the voice, accent, speech patterns, was just uncanny.

Certain things were in there for drama, like the totally fake, I'm sure, conflict between the Queen and Charles, but I loved it. A real ex-equerry said that that is exactly what life is like in the royal Household and that is the closest I'll come to seeing the Queen in her daily life. Fascinating stuff.
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  #190  
Old 02-08-2007, 04:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeatrixFan
Surely Her Majesty's intelligence is undoubted seeing as how she's reigned over the people of Great Britain for over 50 years? Did we need Helen Mirren to show us this side to the great lady?
No we did not. However, maybe we could all do with an occassional reminder that she has a pulse! There is a tendency for the media to portray the Qeen as 'The Queen', graven in stone, unchangeable and inflexible, not a living breathing 'person' in her own right.
She may be the Queen, but she is also Elizabeth, Lillibet, Aunty, Grandma, etc.
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  #191  
Old 02-08-2007, 12:06 PM
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I finally was able to see this movie three weeks ago. I was both looking forward to it and also fearing seeing it because Elizabeth II has been my lodestar since 1957. I was very relieved that Helen Mirren's portrayal pretty much matched what I would have wanted. It was honest and sympathetic and as true to life as we can know, being in a position only to guess. (She was brilliant as an actress in this; I agree with everyone who says she deserves all the recognition she gets).


To me Alastair Campbell was the villain of the piece. He was so ridiculously awful that I dind't know whether to laugh or boo!


I saw the scene with the stag as representing "beleaguered Monarch meets beleaguered Monarch of the Glen ".

Helen Mirren was quoted in Time magazine as saying in regard to how she developed her interpretation of the Queen for this role: "As I watched her, I saw that although she has an extremely composed exterior, there's an incredible beat of energy within,"
and "To her, it would simply be rude to impose your emotions on others."

Luckily, I never fell far enough into the story to forget that it was fiction, although based on real people and events. And I could see that, although the story was told via this particular event and these particular people, the real underlying theme of the film was the "modernization" of Britain; that is, the study of the interrelationship of tradition and change.
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  #192  
Old 02-09-2007, 01:48 PM
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DAME HELEN TO TAKE TEA WITH THE QUEEN
quote from article * in Hello
*Helen, Queen director Stephen Frears and screenwriter Peter Morgan are, according to the Daily Mail, all due to receive the regal invitation after the Academy Awards on February 25
*Originally the invitation was to be issued only if the film won, but now it seems the monarch will meet them either way. Apparently the Queen has not yet seen the movie,
*Despite the fact she was brought up a staunch anti-royalist, Helen admits making the film changed the way she views the Establishment. "I fell in love with her and never thought that would happen," she says.
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  #193  
Old 02-09-2007, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ysbel
I'm curious. How do you think the movie made her out to be clever?

I must have missed that part. I thought it made Tony Blair look really clever.
Because, despite that she had a completely different opinion in the beginning, she has been able to "think" and to hear others opinion. This is a sign on intelligence.
Prince Philip has been shown stupid and egoist, from the beginning to the end. He had an old fashioned opinion, and during the whole story, he was fully stubborn.
The Queen tried to understand others opinion, and also, she behaviored in a way to satisfy her people's wishes, despite that she had another position. She is a Queen of a people, she has to try to "hear" people's wishes.
Considering the fossilized and for centuries old fashion mentality according to it she has been grown up, it looked impossible to behavior like this, but she managed.
For me this is an intelligent modern Monarch.
As for Tony Blair, he was clever and he saved the Monarchy this moment, but THIS was not the main point of the story...
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  #194  
Old 02-09-2007, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by selrahc4
......Luckily, I never fell far enough into the story to forget that it was fiction, although based on real people and events.
You are it seems, one of the few, who is able to realise this was a work of fiction.

It is Morgan and Frears interpretation of what they thought might have happened.

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  #195  
Old 02-09-2007, 03:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon
You are it seems, one of the few, who is able to realise this was a work of fiction.

It is Morgan and Frears interpretation of what they thought might have happened.

Sorry, but ALL this has been told and known before. Since the real events we ALL knew that it happened like this.
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  #196  
Old 02-09-2007, 03:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fandesacs2003
Sorry, but ALL this has been told and known before. Since the real events we ALL knew that it happened like this.
No you don't, unless you were at Balmoral and with the royal family when all this happened. Neither the writer nor the director have had any contact with any members of the royal family, or afaik, any of their friends or servants that would have 1st hand knowledge.

This whole film is a work of fiction based on the writers thoughts on how things might have happened or what might have been said.
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  #197  
Old 02-09-2007, 04:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon
No you don't, unless you were at Balmoral and with the royal family when all this happened. Neither the writer nor the director have had any contact with any members of the royal family, or afaik, any of their friends or servants that would have 1st hand knowledge.

This whole film is a work of fiction based on the writers thoughts on how things might have happened or what might have been said.
Of course I have not bee there. But the whole way thinks happened confirms the film. The Royal family was fully absent for the first days, and people's rection was growing and growing.
And finakl the family changed her behavior.
These ARE THE FACTS.
Of course we do not know the discussions, be the events are known. And do not forget that among Tony Blair's environment, things should have been discused.
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  #198  
Old 02-09-2007, 05:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fandesacs2003
Because, despite that she had a completely different opinion in the beginning, she has been able to "think" and to hear others opinion. This is a sign on intelligence.
Prince Philip has been shown stupid and egoist, from the beginning to the end. He had an old fashioned opinion, and during the whole story, he was fully stubborn.
The Queen tried to understand others opinion, and also, she behaviored in a way to satisfy her people's wishes, despite that she had another position. She is a Queen of a people, she has to try to "hear" people's wishes.
Considering the fossilized and for centuries old fashion mentality according to it she has been grown up, it looked impossible to behavior like this, but she managed.
For me this is an intelligent modern Monarch.
As for Tony Blair, he was clever and he saved the Monarchy this moment, but THIS was not the main point of the story...
Ah, thanks for explaining your point of view, fandescas. I must say I didn't see the Queen change her fundamental values and opinions in this movie that much. It reminded me of Cate Blanchett's version of Elizabeth I, a movie that showed the education of a young Queen in the lessons of poltical manoevering for survival.

I thought of Tony Blair was the central character because on the contrary his internal values and opinion about the Queen seemed to change the most. At first he appears as a flippant, very smooth politician who says the right things and shows emotion but who can be lying. At the end, he really starts to see the Queen as a human being with a sense of dignity and feeling despite the fact that the Queen's manner hasn't changed a lot.
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  #199  
Old 02-09-2007, 07:40 PM
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I haven't seen it yet but I've read the screenplay. I don't know how it is in the flesh, but on the written page Cherie Blair comes across as a real shrew.
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Old 02-09-2007, 08:26 PM
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Oh indeed she does.

In fact, she and Prince Philip appear as polar opposites in politics but totally alike in personality-very contemptous of the other side.
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