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  #81  
Old 08-20-2007, 07:10 AM
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And how did Margrethe come across when her father was still alive?
Eager to show her statemanship? Passionately involved with her social patronages? Passionately involved in the upbringing of her children?

In my humble opinion she didn't show and do more than her son and in some respects she showed and did less, she just hadn't to wait that long for the throne.
But she turned out as a great queen as soon as she was on the throne (being the first female monarch after 600 years surely helped) and I have the feeling so will her son when his time will come.


But I agree with your description of the docu-serie. Germans are interested in royals but they don't take them really seriously. Unlike some members on this board they see royals as decorative and perhaps socially but not politically important (with the exception of Juan Carlos and the monarchs during World War II). And that shows in the docus. So they are really not to be taken too seriously. But I guess as a member of a royal messageboard you tend to blow all royal things out of proportion.
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  #82  
Old 08-20-2007, 05:06 PM
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Strange that they ended the Masako-Doku shortly before the little boy of her sister-in-law was born. But in the beginning of the Doku they always again focused on the "giggeling and obviously against-Masako" role of her and showed the press meeting where she announced her pregnancy. That´s another hint that this Doku is made just a little sloppy and careless and only interesting for yellow-press-readers. I couldn´t find anything new or even interesting in one of the Doku´s.
The worse is that they always find all the new crown-princesses just wonderful (in general view) no matter whether they are three times divorced or have three children out of wedlock. If this would happen they´d consider it even better and up-to-date!
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  #83  
Old 08-20-2007, 05:39 PM
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But I guess as a member of a royal messageboard you tend to blow all royal things out of proportion.
What is exactly blown out of proportion? Saying that you are disappointed by the sugar-ness of the documenteries isn´t blowing things out of proportion IMHO, if that is what you meant. Neither is the fact that for many people monarchies are relevant. Perhaps not for Germans but a recent survey in my own country for example shows that the Dutch do think the monarchy is an important institute that we should treasure. I assume that more countries, esp. exsisting monarchies will have surveys with a simular outcome.
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  #84  
Old 08-21-2007, 07:27 AM
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No, the disappointedness is not what I meant.
I meant that for members of a royal messageboard royals are obviously more important than for a lot of other people. We are fans or at least interested and that's why we "discuss" royal things which a lot of people don't even notice. For example, I know Dutch people who don't give a damn about their royal house and I know a lot of people in my own country (Austria) who don't even know the names of the current cp couples, much less their workload/patronages.
And IMHO certain members tend to overrate the political importance of certain royal houses while at the same time underrating the importance of other royal houses.
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  #85  
Old 08-21-2007, 07:47 AM
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Ah, that sounds rather reasonable :). But still I have to make a sidemark. I think locals (in any monarchy) know much better what is going on, what the political power etc. of their royal family is than foreigners. Foreigners usually only tend to see pictures of a happy couple on a balcony, in a carriage etc. while we get more serious articles in newspapers and political magazines.

It seems people are more interested in the sugary side, also here. One picture of Leonor in Mallorca will get a zillion responses while a post about Belgian King Albert II breaking off his holidays to mediate between the parties that have to form a gouverment doesn´t get any attention at all. Now the latter shows the political relevance even in this time, but not many are interested (on this forum, in Belgium the news is much more important of course). That people are more interested in the sugary side is ok, but that doesn´t mean that the political relevance isn´t there.
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  #86  
Old 08-21-2007, 08:39 AM
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I didn't see the program about Felipe and Letizia but I would say the other programs were sugar-y. They reminded me of a children's program here in the States that takes current events and dumbs them down so that children can understand what's going on in the news. Its fine for 12 year olds; a little annoying for adults.
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  #87  
Old 08-23-2007, 01:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
Ah, that sounds rather reasonable :). But still I have to make a sidemark. I think locals (in any monarchy) know much better what is going on, what the political power etc. of their royal family is than foreigners. Foreigners usually only tend to see pictures of a happy couple on a balcony, in a carriage etc. while we get more serious articles in newspapers and political magazines.

It seems people are more interested in the sugary side, also here. One picture of Leonor in Mallorca will get a zillion responses while a post about Belgian King Albert II breaking off his holidays to mediate between the parties that have to form a gouverment doesn´t get any attention at all. Now the latter shows the political relevance even in this time, but not many are interested (on this forum, in Belgium the news is much more important of course). That people are more interested in the sugary side is ok, but that doesn´t mean that the political relevance isn´t there.
I disagree with you – at least with the general way you expressed your opinion. If one is interested in a country, it´s history, culture and political system it is no problem at all to get access to serious newspaper articles etc. from the country in question. One just has to take the effort. And as you came up with Belgium: there are messageboards where “foreigners” show more knowledge and rationality than at least 75% of the Belgian posters at the “Het Laatste Nieuws” forum for example. And sometimes the perspective from abroad also results in a more neutral view on certain aspects/occurrences. That Beatrix´s “De Groene Draeck” is maintained by the army f. e. would have deserved a more extended and critical discussion IMO. This discussion was not carried on here, not even or may I say especially not by Dutch posters. And that nobody is interested in discussing King Albert´s political role during the political crisis in Belgium these days also has to do with the fact that there are just a few people who really feel responsible for the BeRF forum. Just writing down that Albert interrupted his holiday to mediate between the parties is maybe too little effort to stimulate a discussion. Plus many of the oh´s and ah´s about Leonor´s pretty curls and whatnot are written down by Spanish TRF members. So IMVHO it´s unfair to say that royalty watchers from abroad are most of all interested in the sugary side and have no insight. And IMO ricarda is not wrong at all when she senses prejudice (I would even call it chauvinism) in the replies of certain TRF posters.
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  #88  
Old 08-23-2007, 07:43 PM
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Well, has been a source of extensive moderating discussions to get more activity in the Belgian part of these forums, I personally have tried many things to get more replies there (still trying), but without much succes. In the end if our posters are not that interested there isn't much we can do, we can not force people to post there.

--

My point about ´locals´ is that it is easier for a local to be well-informed etc. and hence they usually are. I don´t get the ins and outs about the Belgian formation for example in my Dutch newspapers. I wonder if they are mentioned at all in US newspapers. Likewise I would be surpirsed if any news about the costs of the ´Groene Draeck´ would appear in a foreign newspaper, hence it is more difficult for foreigners to be informed about that. Only a few will know, while almost all Dutch people are aware of the publicity that it caused here.

--

The oh-and ah-remarks didn´t relate to foreigners or not foreigners, as you can read when you re-read my post. It is just an observation that more posters are interested in children, dresses, tiara´s etc etc. than the political relevance of a monarchy. There is nothing wrong with that of course, nothing at all, just an observation.

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If you or any other poster feel that any poster is showing chauvinisim you can easily prove him/her wrong with just telling the facts.
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  #89  
Old 08-23-2007, 09:07 PM
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Unlike some members on this board they see royals as decorative and perhaps socially but not politically important (with the exception of Juan Carlos and the monarchs during World War II).
I can assure you that, constitutionally, the political position of the monarch in the fragmented Spanish State-organization is almost non-existant in terms of political influence. That King Juan Carlos has influence is simply thanks to his long Reign and his positioning in the transformation period 1975-1985 in which Spain began its post-Franco era, left its isolation by joining the EU and opted for democracy and emancipation.

Constitutionally the Queen of the Netherlands (unlike her other colleagues herself an integral part of the Government and also the formal president of the Council of State, which is not only the highest Court of Administration but also the unavoidable institution in the legislative process) has a more outspoken political profile. She is also not 'neutral' between Government and Opposition like in other countries: she is IN the Government.

The King of the Belgians is also formally more infuential than his Spanish colleague. In the divided country he tends to remain a-political, but these days showed the King stepping into the complicated formation of a new Belgian Government, with own initiatives and talks to revive the stuttering process.

The so-called 'Margarita-affair' in the Netherlands (2002-2004) showed the shocking informal influence of the Queen in the machinery of state. It showed that the highest civil servants, military, police and tax services did not hesistate any moment to fulfill wishes from the Palace, even without informing the politically responsible minister.... I would not underestimate Queen Beatrix' influence.

I know that this board tends to have a perpetuum mobile of hairdo, shoes and gowns, but in the meantime it not only are people of flesh and blood but for sure also people with considerable influence. But I agree that the German TV did nothing with it. Rolf Seelmann-Eggebert has an eye for the formal role of the Royal Houses, but indeed this series Königskinder simply was ultralight non-relevant summer-stuffing.

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  #90  
Old 08-23-2007, 10:12 PM
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I am a foreigner and I consider myself knowledgeable about the British monarchy but the other monarchies I would say no.

That is not due to lack of interest but lack of understanding the native languages of the countries. For the British monarchies, I can read first hand accounts of the participants in a situation in their native language. For the other monarchies of Sweden, Norway, the Netherlands, Belgium, and Denmark, I have to go by second-hand translated accounts of what was said and I've found that the material that is translated into English about these monarchies is less than half of the material that is written in the native language. That is a real barrier to understanding what really is going on in a country regarding its monarchy.

I was disappointed in the lack of substance of the Königskinder program because I do speak German fluently and I was hoping for an informative series. There were some high points such as the interview with the Nobel prize winner about Victoria's future role with the Nobel prizes but other than that, I was disappointed.

Perhaps the Germans like myself are foreigners to a monarchial system of government and although I don't view the monarchies as great fairytales, I think that in the absence of understanding how a monarchy works as a systerm of government which is harder to understand when one is living outside a monarchy, the tendency is to view the monarchies as a source of fairytales and beautiful princesses.
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  #91  
Old 08-23-2007, 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Henri M. View Post
Constitutionally the Queen of the Netherlands (unlike her other colleagues herself an integral part of the Government and also the formal president of the Council of State, which is not only the highest Court of Administration but also the unavoidable institution in the legislative process) has a more outspoken political profile. She is also not 'neutral' between Government and Opposition like in other countries: she is IN the Government..
Good point Henri. Beatrix is a remarkable public figure. We do hear about Beatrix here in New York because of a wonderful visit she gave to the city awhile back. She is quite a formidable woman. You probably know that New York was founded as New Amsterdam and therefore the Dutch Royal Family keeps friendly ties with the city.

Quote:
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The King of the Belgians is also formally more infuential than his Spanish colleague. In the divided country he tends to remain a-political, but these days showed the King stepping into the complicated formation of a new Belgian Government, with own initiatives and talks to revive the stuttering process.
That is indeed interesting. It looks like not only the Belgian monarchy but the Belgian country is going through massive changes; yet one rarely hears about it outside of Belgium; this program that left off Mathilde and Philippe is a prime example of the inattention the situation is getting and the inattention is not only happening in royal forums but elsewhere in the media.
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  #92  
Old 08-23-2007, 11:23 PM
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I watched the series, except the Mary and Frederik part. I have to agree it was very sugary, and I was somehow disappointed, but I should have expected nothing serious. Yes, there is a fairly big group of royalty watchers in Germany, but somehow royalty watching is considered to be a grandmother's hobby , and the only magazines where you can read something about royalty is the yellow press ( and they are well known for new strange headlines every day: Mette-Marit: twins!, Letizia threatened by the queen, Deadly disease for Màxima, and so on).
The only time you see the royal families normaly on TV is for new babies or weddings. So I think the ZDF thought the sugary part of royal life was the main interest of the German TV viewers, and maybe they are right.

Strangel, the didn't inlude a Belgian part in the series, but also the yellow press never writes anything about them. I don't know why this is the case, before I joined the Royal Forums, I only knew that Belgium had a royal family, but never knew of Mathilde, etc; maybe because I never heard my grandmothers talking about them...
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  #93  
Old 08-25-2007, 11:41 PM
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I was wondering if there is another way to watch the videos because everytime I click on video, it shuts down my internet connection.
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  #94  
Old 06-17-2009, 08:40 AM
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ZDF has a new part of Königskinder. It will be broadcasted on 07-07-2009 at 20:15. It is about William and Kate and called "William and Kate - The prince and the beautiful from the country".

Die Königskinder - ZDF.de
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Old 06-17-2009, 11:41 AM
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As it seems they also got a new part on Victoria & Daniel. It will be aired one week earlier
ZDFroyal - ZDF.de
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  #96  
Old 06-19-2009, 09:07 AM
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There will be two more parts:

21-07-2009; 20:15
Frederik und Mary - Die perfekte Prinzessin (The perfect princess)

28-07-2009; 20:15
Felipe und Letizia - Die gezähmte Prinzessin (The domesticated princess)
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  #97  
Old 06-19-2009, 11:52 AM
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I am curious whether these parts are really new or if they just updated the old serious. No doubt the new parts will be as sugary as the old ones, but I'll watch them anyway!
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  #98  
Old 06-20-2009, 04:24 AM
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Thank you for this information, hoping to be able to see these two series.
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  #99  
Old 06-29-2009, 06:27 AM
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Here are the information about part three and four:

Part 3, about Frederik and Mary
Frederik und Mary - ZDF.de

Part 4, about Felipe and Letizia
Felipe und Letizia - ZDF.de
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Old 06-30-2009, 05:04 AM
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Here is in an interactiv section the possibility to hear the interviews of the last serie (2007). You can click on the question and the answer will be shown in a video.

Here from the part of Felipe and Letizia:
Interviews zu Felipe und Letizia

Here from the part of Haakon and Mette-Marit
Interviews zu Haakon und Mette-Marit von Norwegen

Here from the part of Willem-Alexander and Maxima:
Interviews zu Willem-Alexander und Máxima von Holland
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