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  #41  
Old 12-31-2004, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larzen

In Denmark I see the Queen wil host the yearly Nyttårs kur tomorrow, when Sweden and Norway will have a national day of mourning, a big gala party for all the important people in Denmark, I find it tasteless to dress up in big dresses an tiaras when 100s of Danes are missing and even more people looking and waiting for the loved ones. That means that the first pics we will see of the royals seens the tragedy happened is in gala dresses. I sincerely hope they will cancel the party
Actually the party has now been cancelled (likely announced very soon after your post here). If you can read Danish, from the official web page of the royal family:
http://kongehuset.dk/artikel.php?id=66415

Quote:
Originally Posted by Larzen
And according to rumours Haakon and MM is on Vacation in Brazil. Its a Se og Hør rumour only, but they did not attend the service with the King and Queen so I tend to belive it is true. They should have returned at once, I sincerly hope to not see any pictures of them relaxing on some beach in Brazil when people are walking the beaches in Thailand looking for their loved ones. The heir to the throne should be in Norway when possibly 500 norwegians including 100 children are possible dead,
I don't think it matters so much where Haakon and Mette-Marit grieve or show their support for the Norwegian people. If they are in Brazil, I think it is important, even essential, that the CP couple make an appearance at a church in Brazil and release some sort of statement of condolence to their fellow Norwegian citizens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandDuchess
The royal children are all adults, and I have also thought that they know what their role of being a member of the Royal Family – the family of our Head of State’s family – includes. It gives them many benefits and perks, but with their position also comes a great deal of responsibility and an important official public role.

Since all of the royal children have given the impression of accepting their roles and titles by taking on some official duties and attending important ceremonies of state – it also encompasses a role to be leaders and symbols for the country and its people at all times, especially the hard ones.
I agree completely GrandDuchess.

If the royal children were 16 or 17 I could understand a bit the age factor. But the fact is they are adults now, and as they have always given the impression of being mature and responsible adults, now is not the time to make excuses for them about their lack of presence.

About "forcing" them to meet all the people who have lost loved ones. First of all, I'm sure all of those people would rather be meeting the CP, Prince and Princess under more positive, happy circumstances rather than this dismal one. Secondly, on a regular basis they meet strangers all the time. How many hundreds of photos have we seen of Victoria, Carl Phillip and Madeleine shaking hands and making small talk with people of various organizations and that didn't seem to bother them.

While grief and loss are difficult things to deal with, it is also a part of life. While it may be hard for them to look at these people who have lost family and loved ones, think how much harder it is for the six year old child who has lost her mother or father or both?
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  #42  
Old 12-31-2004, 05:03 PM
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I'm not trying to defend Victoria, Carl Phillip, and Madeleine, but with so many dead and missing from Sweden, in a place, that is rather expensive to visit at times, how do we not know that they have lost loved ones of their own and are simply grieving in private? I understand that the nation "needs" to see them at a time like this, but unlike other Royal families, some aren't altogether willing to just put on a happy face or publicly show their grief. It's one thing to be sad when it's someone you know, or many people and you are showing your respect to the families of those who have been lost, and quite another to lose someone yourself and have to put yourself out there on display.
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  #43  
Old 12-31-2004, 07:23 PM
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I'm so impressed with this tragedy... So many people have died! This year was not very happy (March.11 in Spain, now this in Asia, yesterday in Argentina...) so I pray that we all have a better 2005.
I agree it's a shame what is happening with this Royal Families, the Heirs has not shown themselves and they are needed now to support people!! This tragedy could have happened to themselves!!!
This persons have so many titles, are so rich, do what they want... but are very, very insensibles... it's a pity!
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  #44  
Old 12-31-2004, 11:14 PM
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I believe there is a memorial service in Denmark on January 2 and the Crown Prince and Crown Princess will be in attendance.
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  #45  
Old 01-01-2005, 03:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Britters
I'm not trying to defend Victoria, Carl Phillip, and Madeleine, but with so many dead and missing from Sweden, in a place, that is rather expensive to visit at times, how do we not know that they have lost loved ones of their own and are simply grieving in private? I understand that the nation "needs" to see them at a time like this, but unlike other Royal families, some aren't altogether willing to just put on a happy face or publicly show their grief. It's one thing to be sad when it's someone you know, or many people and you are showing your respect to the families of those who have been lost, and quite another to lose someone yourself and have to put yourself out there on display.
& carl philip and madeleine would not be able to make an appearance, even they really wanted to, without victoria, it would make her absence even more obvious.
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  #46  
Old 01-01-2005, 08:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by susanstotz
& carl philip and madeleine would not be able to make an appearance, even they really wanted to, without victoria, it would make her absence even more obvious.
But I think Vicky could have gone from ockelbo to Stockholm and back again. If not, well....
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  #47  
Old 01-01-2005, 12:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by susanstotz
& carl philip and madeleine would not be able to make an appearance, even they really wanted to, without victoria, it would make her absence even more obvious.
But isn't Victoria's absence already quite apparent?

Better for Carl Phillip and Madeleine to make an appearance than none at all.

And this matter, for me at least, isn't about making someone else look bad or worst. It's about showing support for your fellow citizens and grieving with them.
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  #48  
Old 01-01-2005, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexandria
But isn't Victoria's absence already quite apparent?

Better for Carl Phillip and Madeleine to make an appearance than none at all.

And this matter, for me at least, isn't about making someone else look bad or worst. It's about showing support for your fellow citizens and grieving with them.
in the hierarchy of a royal family victoria is more important than her brother and sister and they would try to not to shame her.

It is possible that all 3 of them did not feel like it (not probable) and that gives the 2 younger ones a "way out". we will never know.
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  #49  
Old 01-01-2005, 02:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by susanstotz
we will never know.
IMO so far it´s not too late. Many of the Swedish tourists are still in south Asia, most of the dead bodies aren´t transfered to Sweden. The tragedy is still a big topic in the media and of course in the hearts of the people. Many even so far haven´t realised emotionally what has happened. In other words Sweden still needs the support of it´s leaders. So if the Royal children would appear soon, I would "forgive" them their absence in the first days. But if they indeed make holidays as usual until the 7th of 8th of january, then I wouldn´t mind if someone would contact on the 3rd or 4th of january Aftonbladet´s Daniel Nyhlén and Expressen´s Johan T. Lindwall and would ask them, where the Royal children are and why they don´t help Sweden in those sad times.
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  #50  
Old 01-01-2005, 02:31 PM
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Report from the fundraising broadcast tonight...

As I’ve just watched the first part of the directly broadcasted fundraising evening on SVT, I just wanted to report that the King, Queen, Prince Carl Philip and Princess Madeleine are there in the studio. The King and Queen were known before to attend – but it was very nice to see the two royal children at their parents’ side.

Crown Princess Victoria was not able to attend as she is abroad… (has she heard of airplanes?) *sigh* I think it’s really rotten of her to be abroad (romantic holiday with Danne?… that would be hitting rock-bottom for this time being) at a time of national mourning and Sweden’s worst catastrophe in modern history. I’m hugely disappointed at her.

One of the programme hosts had a short sit-down talk with them.

The King’s opening comment/statement was excellent. He said so many important things in such a good way; I will even confess it made my emotions tremble a bit again.

The Queen also made a good comment/statement, which was good as always – and she pointed out that the best thing she could do was if she could give every affected person a hug (but of course she can’t) – and she stressed how important it is to take care and comfort each other, talk and to never leave each other’s side.

Prince Carl Philip was also made a good comment/statement, and besides some “general” things, he pointed out that there have been many children who have returned home without their parents – and that they might not reach out to adults in the same way as to people in their own age (like friends etc), and that it’s extra important then for adults to take time with the children and support them in their processing of this tragedy, and helping them in helping their friends in the process.

Princess Madeleine didn’t say much, she agreed with her brother and said it’s important to give financial support (they all did - as it's a fundraising evening).

Being the close royal follower I am (not always being happy and content with what the King or other royals say or do) – I must say that the way the King and Queen has handled this time of mourning has been excellent, and it does indeed provide some comfort and also pride.

PS. Prince Carl Philip really impressed me. It sounded like he had “taken” Victoria’s place in her absence tonight and spoke very wisely in a calm and mature way. DS.
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  #51  
Old 01-01-2005, 02:36 PM
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Thank you very much for giving us an impression, Granny. I´m very very happy, that Carl Philip and Madeleine joined their parents.
But as you´ve already expressed, I´m also very angry about crown princess Victoria!
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  #52  
Old 01-01-2005, 02:40 PM
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i am still wondering if its so that victoria is effected thats why she is not there
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  #53  
Old 01-01-2005, 02:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josefine
i am still wondering if its so that victoria is effected thats why she is not there
I guess, when she would be affected, her parents would have talked about this. Though I can understand, that posters search for excuses for the crown princess´absence, I fear we have to face the facts: For Victoria, holidays with her Daniel are more important than her nation (and many other nations too) suffering from a terrible tragedy of unebelievable dimensions.
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  #54  
Old 01-01-2005, 02:59 PM
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It's a shame that Victoria hasn't made an appearence. But good for Madeline and Carl Phillip for appearing with their parents!
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  #55  
Old 01-01-2005, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by susanstotz
& carl philip and madeleine would not be able to make an appearance, even they really wanted to, without victoria, it would make her absence even more obvious.
Now we have exactly this case...well, done Victoria! *coughing*
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  #56  
Old 01-01-2005, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josefine
i am still wondering if its so that victoria is effected thats why she is not there
There is absolutely no excuse whatsoever for Victoria - the future Head of State for Sweden - not to be in the country at a time of national mourning and the worst catastrophe in modern history (over 3 000 Swedes still missing!). Wherever she is, she could have come home instantly after the “news bomb” of the catastrophe came in Sweden – if there are no regular flights (which of course there are), they could’ve chartered a plane or sent one of the Government’s.

Even if Victoria would know someone affected - it would not be an excuse for a person in her situation. National mourning is national mourning. At these times, the Head of State/The King and the Royal Family are in a position where they are most important – to lead, support and show sympathy in the country’s mourning process.

Just like when a member of a Royal Family dies, the family can of course have an internal process together – but they are also expected to lead the rest of the country in some way when the people mourns that royal.

Bad, bad, bad. Rotten, rotten, rotten. This is my comment of her being abroad.
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  #57  
Old 01-01-2005, 03:32 PM
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Thanks GrandDuchess for your summary of the fundraising event.

The comments of the King and Queen and Carl Phillip seem very moving and poignant indeed. Glad to see Carl Phillip and Madeleine finally have acknowledged this tragedy for so many Swedes, and no doubt no one thought that they were "showing up" Victoria but simply glad to see them finally in joining their parents and offering their sympathy to the Swedish people.

Very disappointing still about Victoria. Being "abroad" -- and it seems for personal reasons rather than for other pre-scheduled royal duties -- is no excuse. In times of emergency and crisis such as these, leaders (and future leaders) should rush to the support of their citizens, not be curled away on holiday with boyfriends or friends or whatever.

As for Victoria possibly not making a public appearance because she may have lost friends -- while grief is a private matter, the (sad) fact that Victoria may have known someone affected by this tragedy could pose a different example of sorts. One, to demystify that royals are "super human" and are as touched and affected by such tragedies as other "regular" humans. Victoria's strength through such a loss could be an example to others on how to cope with such an incomprehensible loss, whether it be talking about how you feel about such a loss, or such a loss encouraging action by oneself whether it's making a monetary donation, reaching out to others or whatever.

One day when Victoria is Queen, and her parents are deceased and aren't around to be such examples (though their example here hasn't seemed much to Victoria), when such crises arise it will be Victoria to whom other Swedes look upon for guidance. If Victoria can't simply follow the lead of her parents now, then how will Victoria lead the masses when the time comes? When she is Queen and crises of a local, regional or national matter arise Victoria can't just hide away in the palace with Daniel or whomever; it will be her that is expected to reach out the Swedish people and make heartfelt gestures to the public as her father has done these past few days.

All in all this is not boding well for Victoria. I wonder if there are public opinon polls at this time and how Victoria fares in them in light of her absence during this time. No doubt the public's opinion of the King has vastly improved and the Queen has remained as popular as ever.
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  #58  
Old 01-01-2005, 03:48 PM
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http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...divided29.html

I cut and pasted some parts of the article. See the whole thing by clicking on the link. These are some stories about four Swedish children:
PHUKET, Thailand — When the raging ocean waters subsided, 7-year-old Karl Nilsson from Sweden thought he had been transported to another city. He was still in the same place, but his parents and two brothers, with him moments earlier, had vanished.

Karl now is being cared for in Phuket by a Swedish family and hoping his relatives are not among the more than 1,500 people killed when a tsunami overwhelmed this tropical paradise Sunday, pushed by an earthquake hundreds of miles away under the Indian Ocean.
Dr. Marie Gulbstrand from Stockholm, Sweden, said her family found Karl at a shelter. He told her he was in a hotel with his two brothers early Sunday while his parents, Thomas and Asa, were outdoors.

A torrent of water suddenly surged into the room.

"He told me: 'I was under the water, but somehow I could breathe. I was just closing my eyes and moving with the waves. Then, suddenly the flood ended and I was in another city,' " Gulbstrand said.

Unable to find his family, Karl wandered alone until he was helped by some local residents. A Swedish couple took him to a Buddhist temple, one of many on the island serving as temporary shelters.

This issue of children being left orphaned, or even just basically misplaced ... is going to be huge, because they obviously have no form of identification."
Confronted with that problem, staff at Phuket International Hospital posted a picture of a blond-haired, 2-year-old boy on the Internet. He had been found along a roadside after the resort of Khao Lak was torn apart, his face reddened by mosquito bites.

All hospital staff could determine was that the boy appeared to respond to Swedish. The posting drew dozens of foreign parents to the hospital, not all of them Swedes, desperately hoping to find missing children.

Little Hannes Bergstroem, of Goteborg, Sweden, was one of the lucky ones: His uncle, whom hospital staff would identify only as Jim, arrived yesterday and collected the boy after seeing his picture on the Web.

"This is a miracle, the biggest thing that could happen," Jim said.

The Swedish newspaper Aftonbladet reported that the boy's mother and grandmother were missing, but later media reports said he was reunited with his grandmother. His father and grandfather were believed to be at another hospital in Thailand, but their exact location and conditions were not immediately known.

The Bergman brothers, 3-year-old Nils and 18-month-old Hannes, survived the disaster in Khao Lak and made it to neighboring Phuket with their father, Carl Michael. But their mother, Cecilia, remained missing.

Hannes Bergman was found unconscious by a tourist near a Khao Lak swimming pool and reportedly was taken by a Thai princess — his father was not told which one — to a local hospital by helicopter.

The broken family was spending time in the Phuket Island Pavilion hotel with other Swedes last night, handing out fliers with pictures of Cecilia. The father said Nils asks whether they will find his mother and Hannes cries out: "Mama! Mama!" when he sees televised images of the waves blasting into the resorts.

Carl Michael Bergman still held hope his wife would be found, but he also had a message for the princess who saved his son: "She has saved his life, but also my soul because I couldn't survive if I lost them both."
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  #59  
Old 01-01-2005, 04:07 PM
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Hmm...I wonder why some people still keep defending Victoria???
Why can't people be objective about her and realize that even though you may like her a lot she has very definitely misstepped with this tsumani situation.
Clearly not the super wonderful princess everyone thought she was.
She is a rather selfish person continuing to holiday rather than be a leader like she should.
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  #60  
Old 01-01-2005, 04:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexandria

As for Victoria possibly not making a public appearance because she may have lost friends -- while grief is a private matter, the (sad) fact that Victoria may have known someone affected by this tragedy could pose a different example of sorts. One, to demystify that royals are "super human" and are as touched and affected by such tragedies as other "regular" humans. Victoria's strength through such a loss could be an example to others on how to cope with such an incomprehensible loss, whether it be talking about how you feel about such a loss, or such a loss encouraging action by oneself whether it's making a monetary donation, reaching out to others or whatever.

One day when Victoria is Queen, and her parents are deceased and aren't around to be such examples (though their example here hasn't seemed much to Victoria), when such crises arise it will be Victoria to whom other Swedes look upon for guidance. If Victoria can't simply follow the lead of her parents now, then how will Victoria lead the masses when the time comes? When she is Queen and crises of a local, regional or national matter arise Victoria can't just hide away in the palace with Daniel or whomever; it will be her that is expected to reach out the Swedish people and make heartfelt gestures to the public as her father has done these past few days.

All in all this is not boding well for Victoria. I wonder if there are public opinon polls at this time and how Victoria fares in them in light of her absence during this time. No doubt the public's opinion of the King has vastly improved and the Queen has remained as popular as ever.
It´s possible she has had close friends but I think the Press would have noted this before. I mean most of her close friends are indeed well-known. From the most famous families in Sweden. Leaders must lead in times of crises. That is when it counts the most. Future and opposition leaders stand next to current leaders and offer the public reassurance for the future. Continuity as well. Otherwise, I agree with Alexandria. Well said.
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