Questions about Titles

Kotroman · #1 02-20-2009, 06:32 PM

I hope this thread hasn't been opened yet.

My question: does the The Duchess of Hälsingland and Gästrikland hold two substantive titles or one substantive title? Does she hold one dukedom called Hälsingland och Gästrikland or does she hold one dukedom called Hälsingland and another dukedom called Gästrikland?

rop81 · #2 02-24-2009, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kotroman

does the The Duchess of Hälsingland and Gästrikland hold two substantive titles or one substantive title? Does she hold one dukedom called Hälsingland och Gästrikland or does she hold one dukedom called Hälsingland and another dukedom called Gästrikland?

Princess Madeleine is Duchess of the TWO seperate "provinses" (don´t really know how to translate the swedish word Län...)

lucien · #3 02-24-2009, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rop81

Princess Madeleine is Duchess of the TWO seperate "provinses" (don´t really know how to translate the swedish word Län...)

Provinces is ok rop81.It comes nearest

Soli Deo Gloria · #4 02-25-2009, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rop81

Princess Madeleine is Duchess of the TWO seperate "provinses" (don´t really know how to translate the swedish word Län...)

"Gästrikland" (where I was born

) and "Hälsingland" (where I live

) are two provinces/landscapes in Sweden and together they are united as a county called "Gävleborgs län". The bounds between G and H are strong and I guess thats the reason M got both.... (and our governor (landshövding) Barbro Holmberg is Tiger Wood's mother in law

)

Kotroman · #5 02-27-2009, 04:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soli Deo Gloria

"Gästrikland" (where I was born

) and "Hälsingland" (where I live

) are two provinces/landscapes in Sweden and together they are united as a county called "Gävleborgs län". The bounds between G and H are strong and I guess thats the reason M got both.... (and our governor (landshövding) Barbro Holmberg is Tiger Wood's mother in law

)

Your reply confused me again

rop81 said that The Duchess of Hälsingland and Gästrikland holds two seperate dukedoms. From your post, it seems that Hälsingland and Gästrikland is one dukedom based on a county called Gävleborgs län

Josefine · #6 04-05-2009, 06:21 AM

how many dukedoms title has been used

today there are 4 (5) titles used, madeleine has two
Victoria and Madeleine is the first women to hold their dukedoms title in their own roght and not becouse of thier husbands
The kings sisters do not have any dukedms.

Victoria, Crown Princess of Sweden, Duchess of Västergötland
Prince Carl Philip, Duke of Värmland
Princess Madeleine, Duchess of Hälsingland and Gästrikland
Princess Lilian, Duchess of Halland

The king was once
Duke of Jämtland. he onlu use his duke title when in Jämtland

His dad and mom was Duke and Duches of Västerbotten

Wikipedia

Three men has been Duke of Sweden
Magnus Ladulås 1266-1275
Erik Birgersson 1275
Erik Magnusson 1284-1317

6 people has been duke of Finland
Bengt Birgersson 1284-1291
Valdemar Magnusson 1302-1317
Bengt Algotsson 1353-1356
Johan III 1556-1563
Johan 1590-1604 (tillträdde ej)
Karl Gustav 1802-1805 (storfurste) Grand Duke

Wikipedia

Dukes of Halland

Bengt Algotsson 1353-1356
Bertil 1912-1997 and now Princess Lilian

Dukes of Småland
Erik XIV 1557-1560
Karl Gustav 1782-1783
Lennart 1909-1932 (died 2004) he lost his title prince and dukedom

Dukes of Södermanland

Karl IX 1560-1604
Karl Filip 1609-1622
Karl XIII 1772-1809
Oscar I 1810-1844 King of sweden
Karl Oscar 1852-1854
Wilhelm 1884-1965

Dukes of Östergötland
Magnus 1560-1569 (died 1595)
Johan 1604-1618
Fredrik Adolf 1772-1803
Oscar II 1829-1872 King of Sweden
Carl 1911-1937 (died 2003)

Dukes of Västmanland
Gustav II Adolf 1609-1611
Erik 1889-1918

Dukes of Stenbors län
Johan Kasimir 1651-1652
Karl (X) Gustav 1652-1654
Adolf Johan 1654-1689

Dukes of Värmland
Karl Adolf 1798
Gustaf V 1858-1907 King of Sweden
Carl Philip 1979-

Dukes of Skåne
Karl XV 1826-1859 King of sweden
Gustaf VI Adolf 1882-1950 Present Kings grandfather

Dukes of Uppland
Gustaf 1827-1852
Sigvard 1907-1934 (died 2002) he lost his title prince and dukedom

Dukes of Dalarna
August 1831-1873
Carl Johan 1916-1946 he lost his title prince and dukedom

Duke or duchess of Västergotland
Carl 1861-1951
Victoria 1980-

Duke of Öland
Ingeborg 1318-1356

Duke of Gotland
Oscar 1859-1888 (died 1953)

Duke of Närke
Eugen 1865-1947

Duke of Västerbooten
Gustav Adolf 1906-1947

Duke of Jämtland
Carl XVI Gustaf 1946-1973, uses only the title when he is in Jämtland

Duchess of Helsingland And duchess of Gästrikland
Madeleine 1982- as i understand its two different titles.

Josefine · #7 10-07-2010, 01:03 PM

how was victoria titled before age 18
was she princess victoria in the press and court even if she were the crown princess?

Lumutqueen · #8 10-07-2010, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josefine

how was victoria titled before age 18
was she princess victoria in the press and court even if she were the crown princess?

14 July 1977 – 31 December 1979 – Her Royal Highness Princess Victoria of Sweden
1 January 1980–present – Her Royal Highness The Crown Princess of Sweden, Duchess of Västergötland.

So she turned 18 in 1995 yeah? So she was titled the Crown Princess, i'm guessing?

Esmerelda · #9 10-07-2010, 01:25 PM

Svenska flaggans dag 1983 - del 1 - Öppet arkiv | SVT Play

In this video from 1983 the presenter refers to 'kronprinsessan Victoria'. I'm not sure how she was addressed up to the age of 18. Did her teachers and staff at the Court have to call her 'Your Royal Highness'?

Yennie · #10 11-15-2010, 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esmerelda

Svenska flaggans dag 1983 - del 1 - Öppet arkiv | SVT Play

In this video from 1983 the presenter refers to 'kronprinsessan Victoria'. I'm not sure how she was addressed up to the age of 18. Did her teachers and staff at the Court have to call her 'Your Royal Highness'?

She was adressed "kronprinsessan" at formal occasions but in everyday life at school the teachers called her Victoria.

Josefine · #11 08-31-2011, 02:59 PM

here is a blog post about the future titles of soon to be born baby
Tronds Blogg

Josefine · #12 02-23-2012, 03:50 AM

duchess of Öland maybe

Hans-Rickard · #13 02-23-2012, 09:38 AM

Skåne, Småland, Öland, Östergötland, Södermanland, Västerbotten is likely dukedoms i think. It has already been decided and i'ts known to the closest family and we will know tomorrow. I'm glad we don't have to wait until the christening like in Denmark

principessa · #14 02-25-2012, 08:07 AM

Will Carl-Philips children also get a duchy? Are there any "laws" concerning this?

I guess that they will be H(R)H Princes/ses of Sweden.

With Madeleines children, I think they will "only" be NN name-of-her-husband (currently O'Neill).

Hans-Rickard · #15 02-26-2012, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by principessa

Will Carl-Philips children also get a duchy? Are there any "laws" concerning this?

I guess that they will be H(R)H Princes/ses of Sweden.

With Madeleines children, I think they will "only" be NN name-of-her-husband (currently O'Neill).

No one knows for sure. There is no rules regarding this so it is up to the king and the government to decide. Carl Philips eventual children will be descendants through a male line so i would be surprised if they didn't get the title H.R.H Prince/Princess of Sweden. Don't know if they will be given a dukedom. The latest example of a children to the brother of a monarch was
"the mainau prince" Lennart Bernadotte, born as H.R.H Prince Lennart of Sweden. He was created Duke of Småland. Lennart was the son of Prince Wilhelm who was brother to Gustaf VI Adolf.

Don't know if Madeleines kids will have any princely titles. I don't think so. Maybe she will give up her H.R.H title upon marriage and then they won't be in line of succession to the throne.
They must be restrective with the titles. If not, we will have lots and lots of Princes and Princess'es in a few generations.

Artemisia · #16 02-26-2012, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by principessa

Will Carl-Philips children also get a duchy? Are there any "laws" concerning this?

I guess that they will be H(R)H Princes/ses of Sweden.
With Madeleines children, I think they will "only" be NN name-of-her-husband (currently O'Neill).

Unlike most European Royal Houses, the line of the succession to the Swedish Throne is very limited. Originally determined by the articles of the 1810 Constitution (which included all agnatic Bernadotte descendants), the 1980 changes limited the succession only to the descendants of the current king, Carl XVI Gustaf, excluding all other Bernadotte branches. Thus, there are currently, there are only four people in it - Crown Princess Victoria, Princess Estelle, Prince Carl-Philip and Princess Madeline.

Even if the Crown Princess goes on to have 2-3 more children, Prince Carl Philip will still be very high in the succession line; as such, it is extremely likely that his children will be Royal Highnesses. They will also most probably be given titles, though not Dukedoms - Earldoms are much more likely.

Princess Madeline's husband is likely to have titles jure uxoris (though his wife), thus becoming Duke of Halsingland and Gastrikland, just as Prince Daniel is Duke of Vastergotland. Their children will likely be nobles but not royals; in other words, they won't be Royal Highnesses but will probably have courtesy titles of counts and countesses.

Esmerelda · #17 02-26-2012, 10:10 AM

In Belgium, Princess Astrid's husband and children were given the titles after they changed to absolute primogeniture so all King Albert's grandchildren are Princes and Princesses of Belgium. I'm not sure about Madeleine's future children, though. When she was engaged to Jonas Bergstrom, Jonas was to be Duke but not Prince.

fearghas · #18 02-26-2012, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esmerelda

In Belgium, Princess Astrid's husband and children were given the titles after they changed to absolute primogeniture so all King Albert's grandchildren are Princes and Princesses of Belgium. I'm not sure about Madeleine's future children, though. When she was engaged to Jonas Bergstrom, Jonas was to be Duke but not Prince.

But Princess Astrids children were the only granndchildren for a long time and it seemed likely that they might eventually inherit the Belgiun throne. Hence they were made Princes and Princess of Belgium. They were already Imperial Highness through their father.