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  #181  
Old 08-05-2015, 05:52 PM
Serene Highness
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madame Verseau View Post
Well, it seems it's going against the tide, judging from the public turnouts for the royal weddings from 2010 to 2015. People stood out in the rain to greet Victoria for Victoria's birthday.
Yes, there were a public turnout at the royal weddings, but how many of them had came especially to follow the wedding, and how many were there because they were in the city for other reasons and decided to see the cortege when they were there? To stand and look at a royal cortege doesn't necessarily mean that those spectators are royalists. I've seen a larger turnout of people celebrating in Stockholm when a Swedish athlete or team (or musician) have won something.
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  #182  
Old 08-05-2015, 07:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
I feel Victoria was overly dependent on Daniel at least at some point in her life (when she was younger and still struggling with anxiety issues). I can't tell if that's still the case today, but, if it were, it could potentially be negative for her future role as HoS. I hope it's not the case though. What do the Swedes think ?
Sometimes comments are so out in left field that I am wondering what kind of site I am on. I would guess most Swedes, including me, think that the comment about the Crown Princess is a bunch of bull.
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  #183  
Old 08-05-2015, 07:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grevinnan View Post
Sometimes comments are so out in left field that I am wondering what kind of site I am on. I would guess most Swedes, including me, think that the comment about the Crown Princess is a bunch of bull.
Yes. Correct.
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  #184  
Old 08-06-2015, 07:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grevinnan View Post
Sometimes comments are so out in left field that I am wondering what kind of site I am on. I would guess most Swedes, including me, think that the comment about the Crown Princess is a bunch of bull.
Absolutley..
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  #185  
Old 10-06-2015, 11:31 AM
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This isn't about the popularity but more about the future of the monarchy:

Yasmine Larsson from the Social Democratic Party, Maria Weimer from the Swedish Liberal Party, Niclas Malmberg from the Green Party and Mia Sydow Mölleby from the Left party have done on 2nd October a joint motion to Riksdagen (Parliament) that the monarchy should be abolished. For the first time in modern history Republicans across party boundaries demand in a joint motion in parliament for the monarchy to be abolished.
Yasmine Larsson and Maria Weimer were at Nordegren & Epstein -program on Radio Sweden to discuss about this.
The reporter asked: When we will have a republic with a president?
Answers:
Yasmine Larsson: in 10 years
Maria Weimer: in 15 years
Nytt krav att avsätta kungahuset - Nordegren & Epstein i P1 _ Sveriges Radio

The motion
http://data.riksdagen.se/fil/B0B0826...A-39B5E0A67BD2
Translation
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  #186  
Old 10-06-2015, 11:48 AM
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Think the Swedish monarchy will end within 10 years?
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  #187  
Old 10-06-2015, 11:52 AM
eya eya is offline
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I think that monarchies are not abolished as easily. At least that showed the past.They abolished after wars or coups usual. Now why in Sweden throughout this talk do not know.
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  #188  
Old 10-06-2015, 11:56 AM
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Yasmine Larsson, who made this motion and signed it as first, is the Chairman of the Swedish Republican Association and of course because of that is extremely positive that their work to abolish the monarchy comes true as quickly as possible.
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  #189  
Old 10-06-2015, 12:05 PM
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Well, it seems like a bit of a non-question at the moment and this suprised me alot. But I guess, since there is a bit of unrest and such in the country right now fingers are being pointed left and right.... I doubt that the motion will go through and either way it takes 2 votes separated by a election to change the "constitution" (is that the right translation?), but you never know. This seems a bit out of the blue, I must say!
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  #190  
Old 10-06-2015, 12:21 PM
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The monarchy is the best regime for Sweden. Monarchy forever.
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  #191  
Old 10-06-2015, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hernameispekka View Post
Well, it seems like a bit of a non-question at the moment and this suprised me alot. But I guess, since there is a bit of unrest and such in the country right now fingers are being pointed left and right.... I doubt that the motion will go through and either way it takes 2 votes separated by a election to change the "constitution" (is that the right translation?), but you never know. This seems a bit out of the blue, I must say!
I don't think that those who signed it believe that the motion goes through. But like they said, one more party (or a member of the party) has signed the motion and they hope that by talking with people, and talking at this radio program they will get more members of the parliament to sign the motion next time.
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  #192  
Old 10-06-2015, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyFinn View Post
I don't think that those who signed it believe that the motion goes through. But like they said, one more party (or a member of the party) has signed the motion and they hope that by talking with people, and talking at this radio program they will get more members of the parliament to sign the motion next time.
Considering the gravity of what they are proposing, the motion seems very unconvincing in what it says (the translated version at least) - would such a motion be allowed to go through?

Sweden is renowned for having developed (rather than fought for) its modern and forward-thinking society and democracy. Having a monarchy has been no barrier to that at all.
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  #193  
Old 10-06-2015, 03:08 PM
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I suspect they will be far too busy integrating, and assimilating the large numbers of migrants that are arriving now, to have much time or taste to mess about with a tried and tested political settlement..
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  #194  
Old 10-06-2015, 03:10 PM
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We need to make the distinction in personal popularity and the desire for the best form of state. Who does not like Crown Princess Victoria and her cute little Estelle? However that does not mean someone who likes Victoria as a person is also automatically in favour of a monarchic form of state...

I am a monarchist but I am also a conservative. The only "logic" reason for having a monarchy is sentiment, the living bond with the past, the embodiment of a royal dynasty, the "fairytale" if you want. But the more the Máximas, the Mette-Marits and the Letizias storm into the Royal Houses, the more "normal" these royals become, paradoxically the less my desire to support the monarchist cause. After all, if I want a "normal" gentleman and a "normal" family with a businesslike approach, maybe I can vote for the president of my own choice, please?

I am sure I will see the collapse of the monarchies in my lifetime. And once Sweden collapses, Norway and the Netherlands and other monarchies will follow. Compare it to same-gender marriage: when it was allowed in the Netherlands, suddenly other states followed too. When the monarchy collapses in Sweden, people in Norway, or Spain or the Netherlands see that the President and the First Lady of Sweden do it as good as King Carl XVI Gustaf and Queen Silvia and suddenly all the other thrones will come in danger.
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  #195  
Old 10-06-2015, 03:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyFinn View Post
This isn't about the popularity but more about the future of the monarchy:

Yasmine Larsson from the Social Democratic Party, Maria Weimer from the Swedish Liberal Party, Niclas Malmberg from the Green Party and Mia Sydow Mölleby from the Left party have done on 2nd October a joint motion to Riksdagen (Parliament) that the monarchy should be abolished. For the first time in modern history Republicans across party boundaries demand in a joint motion in parliament for the monarchy to be abolished.
Yasmine Larsson and Maria Weimer were at Nordegren & Epstein -program on Radio Sweden to discuss about this.
The reporter asked: When we will have a republic with a president?
Answers:
Yasmine Larsson: in 10 years
Maria Weimer: in 15 years
Nytt krav att avsätta kungahuset - Nordegren & Epstein i P1 _ Sveriges Radio

The motion
http://data.riksdagen.se/fil/B0B0826...A-39B5E0A67BD2
Translation

Sweden is currently somewhat unique among all European monarchies in the sense that the King effectively has no executive or legislative powers: he doesn't appoint the PM and the cabinet, sign bills into law, call elections, dissolve parliament, or command the armed forces. In fact, his involvement in State affairs is restricted to the right to be kept informed about government policy (whch is exercised both in informal meetings with the PM and in formal Councils of State); the right to preside the Advisory Council on Foreign Affairs whenever that body is convened; opening the annual session of the Riksdag; presiding over a special Council of State when a new government is sworn in; and formally signing the credentials of Swedish ambassadors and receiving the credentials of foreign diplomats.

However, the King remains the constitutional Head of State. As such, he has constitutional immunity against prosecution and can only be replaced by an elected president by a bill passed twice by the Riksdag with a general election (and, most likely, a simultaneous popular referendum) in between. As it was said here, I don't think republicans in Sweden have the numbers right now to overcome that constitutional bar.

Furthermore, assuming that the motion goes through, what kind of republican model is being proposed exactly ? If Sweden had an elected president, would he/she be a purely ceremonial head of state as the King has been since 1975 ? Or would he/she be an all-powerful , elected politician similar to the president of Finland for example? If the answer is the latter, is that something the Swedish people or even the Swedish parliamentary parties would like to have ?

Just as food for thought, here is a link to an English version of the Finnish constitution. Please note the broad powers conferred upon the president.

ICL - Finland - Constitution
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  #196  
Old 10-06-2015, 03:43 PM
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The Republican Association has for the first time over 11 000 members. Ten years ago the association had about 2500 members and five years ago about 5 000 members.
- The fact that more and more people actively take a stand for a democratic, egalitarian and modern polity is amazing. We have for many years seen a strong influx of members and this gives us greater resources to increase the pressure in the campaign for a republic. It's full speed ahead for the Republican movement, says the chairman of the society, Yasmine Larsson.
Medlemsrekord för republikaner - Republikanska föreningen
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  #197  
Old 10-06-2015, 03:45 PM
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The position of the King in Sweden is not that very different from that of his "colleagues". Yes, formally they seem to have more power but when ends meet, they all are as "powerless" as Carl XVI Gustaf. It is Cameron who decides, not Elizabeth II. It is Rajoy who decides, not Felipe VI. Etc.

That King Harald could easily skip a whole page from his Address from the Throne is telling enough: so it is all theatre and means nothing, just pretend the King is telling something and just pretend we are listening?

That then an underwear model as Sofia Hellqvist or even the son of a commoner (Marius Borg) simply becomes part of the royal family is also telling that all hindrances and barrières have disappeared. That might sound pretty nice and egalitarian but at the same time those barrières were part of the "myth", that the royal family was a world apart and that only a select group "equal born" had access to it (on the risk to be morganized).

People see this and realize they are watching an ape theatre: throw a nickel and we perform a dance for you. All distance has gone. And that distance was exactly what a monarchy needs.
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  #198  
Old 10-06-2015, 03:46 PM
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I think we should be careful about underestimating the nationalism in Europe and also in Sweden.

The royals are national symbols and nationalism will be on the rise in the years to come.

As for Sweden: The politicians and the opinion elite, including the media, may very well prefer to ditch the monarchy - but that segments is moving ever further away from the ordinary Svenssons.
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  #199  
Old 10-06-2015, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
I think we should be careful about underestimating the nationalism in Europe and also in Sweden.

The royals are national symbols and nationalism will be on the rise in the years to come.

As for Sweden: The politicians and the opinion elite, including the media, may very well prefer to ditch the monarchy - but that segments is moving ever further away from the ordinary Svenssons.
Do you think the republican French are less nationalist than the royalist Swedes?

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  #200  
Old 10-06-2015, 04:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
Do you think the republican French are less nationalist than the royalist Swedes?

France don't have a monarchy in place. - As a politically neutral symbol for the nationalists. They use other symbols instead.
However, had the French monarchy still been around, I wonder if Front National wouldn't be rallying around it?
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