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  #261  
Old 06-11-2008, 12:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Adelheid View Post
What they are doing it's not according protocol, Carina Axelsson is only Gustavs mistress , not his wife and they are not engaged.
I wouldn't call her his "mistress", that sounds rather harsh or "bad" to me. Personally, I think that if it were not for that stupid will, they would have been long married by now. It seems like the family loves her and thinks very highly of her, and considers her one of them. It might not be protocol, but they are dealing with the situation very well, IMO.
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  #262  
Old 06-11-2008, 12:31 PM
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There is nothing stopping her from wearing a tiara to a tiara event. If you or I was invited to that wedding and we owned a diamond tiara, or our boyfriend's family owned a tiara and was willing to lend it to us, we would be encouraged to wear it.

Also, I'm not sure if there is a language misunderstanding or not, but Carina is not Gustav's mistress as he is not married to someone else. She is his girlfriend/fiancee/companion. She could be considered the mistress of his home as she runs the household and takes special interest in the affairs of his estate.
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  #263  
Old 06-11-2008, 01:32 PM
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There are two ways to look at the term "mistress.:

First, is considered a big no-no and vulgar to some; others not so much.

Second, the term could also be referred to as being the Mistress of the House and in this case Carina is known around Bad Berleburg as the Lady of the Schloss which can also be stated as the Mistress of the Schloss.

Third, Carina is not the fiancee of Gustav. There is a long explanation as to why throughout this topic. Yes, she has a nice fat ring on her finger for the past several months, but there has been no official statement nor confirmation that the two are engaged. Also, she noted that she wanted to get married in the latest article, but she along with every other royal watcher and Gustav's family know why the couple cannot at this time.

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  #264  
Old 06-11-2008, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by kimebear View Post
There is nothing stopping her from wearing a tiara to a tiara event. If you or I was invited to that wedding and we owned a diamond tiara, or our boyfriend's family owned a tiara and was willing to lend it to us, we would be encouraged to wear it.

Also, I'm not sure if there is a language misunderstanding or not, but Carina is not Gustav's mistress as he is not married to someone else. She is his girlfriend/fiancee/companion. She could be considered the mistress of his home as she runs the household and takes special interest in the affairs of his estate.
Sorry, I was talking about Fredericks birthday party, but I mean Joachim+Maries wedding, I've ready edit it.

But it was not "a tiara event", it was a wedding, where the brides Mom and grandma, were not using tiara because they aren't royals. Prince Nikolaos of Greece and Denmarks girlfriend Tatiana, knows also about protocol and she was wearing no tiara at this wedding.

It was ridiculous that Carina wanted to appear like a royal, she will receive a title if she marries Gustav, but now she is only his mistress, not his fiancée, they are not engaged.

Right GlitteringTiaras, I was writing the same when you sent your message
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  #265  
Old 06-11-2008, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Adelheid View Post
Sorry, I was talking about Fredericks birthday party, but I mean Joachim+Maries wedding, I've ready edit it.

But it was not "a tiara event", it was a wedding, where the brides Mom and grandma, were not using tiara because they aren't royals. Prince Nikolaos of Greece and Denmarks girlfriend Tatiana, knows also about protocol and she was wearing no tiara at this wedding.

It was ridiculous that Carina wanted to appear like a royal, she will receive a title if she marries Gustav, but now she is only his mistress, not his fiancée, they are not engaged.
I have to disagree with you. It was a tiara event as it was very formal. True that the brides mother and grandmother were not wearing tiaras, but perhaps it was because they do not own them, or maybe if they do (it is entirely possible that the grandmother, coming from a noble family, may very well have access to such a jewel) they simply did not want to. I will repeat again very strenuously that the wearing of a tiara is not strictly the provenance of royalty. Non-royal socialites around the world have worn tiaras forever. In the UK, all women who were presented at court were strongly encouraged to wear them. A tiara is a symbol of status, not royalty.

As far as Tatiana not wearing a tiara, I don't think it has anything to do with her knowledge of protocol. More likely, the GRF did not offer to lend her one for the occasion. The difference being that Nikolaos has not yet proposed (that we know of) as opposed to Gustav being unable to. Since Carina wore a tiara from Gustav's family, it was obviously with the family's consent. Princess Benedikte, born the daughter of the King and Queen of Denmark and sister of the current Queen of Denmark would certainly know enough about royal protocol to consent to this loan of a jewel or not. If anything, the fact that it was loaned to Carina in the first place cements her position, official or unofficial, in Gustav's life as far as his family is concerned.
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  #266  
Old 06-11-2008, 02:28 PM
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I believe the reason why many were surprised that she wore a tiara, despite being accepted by Queen Margrethe and the rest of the DRF, the official life companion of Gustav, invited to all the official family events, representing the SWB's at Schloss Berleburg's castle tours and other events around Germany, is that it has never happened before specifically with the very traditional DRF. Second, it's okay for members to question and state their opinions on the matter because, again, the situation has never happened before. Finally, I'm not so sure anymore the tiara was a SWB or the personal property of Princess Benedikte that she brought over from Denmark. As for cementing her position, that was obvious a long long time ago... tiara or not.




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  #267  
Old 06-11-2008, 03:10 PM
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The tiara Carina was wearing at the wedding has been potentially identified at the RJOTW message board as being the same one that was worn by the late Princess Margareta to Princess Alexandra's wedding in 1998. If that is true, it would make it a SWB heirloom.

Close up photo of Carina:

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h1...006/Carina.jpg

Princess Margareta:

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h1...ng06apl2sr.jpg

IMHO, Carina was not putting on airs or pretending to be something she is not by wearing the tiara. She also looked quite beautiful in it.
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  #268  
Old 06-11-2008, 03:25 PM
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So has it been confirmed? Definitely? Oh and thanks for the links.

Quote:
IMHO, Carina was not putting on airs or pretending to be something she is not by wearing the tiara. She also looked quite beautiful in it.
No one has implied or stated any such thing, Kimebear. If anything, a majority of us support their relationship and are quite fond of Carina.
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  #269  
Old 06-11-2008, 03:47 PM
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Well, actually I was responding to this comment:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adelheid View Post
It was ridiculous that Carina wanted to appear like a royal
Also, the tiara has been potentially identified as I said. It seems to be similar enough in design. No one from the House of SWB has confirmed it though.
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  #270  
Old 06-11-2008, 03:56 PM
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Originally Posted by kimebear View Post
I have to disagree with you. It was a tiara event as it was very formal. True that the brides mother and grandmother were not wearing tiaras, but perhaps it was because they do not own them, or maybe if they do (it is entirely possible that the grandmother, coming from a noble family, may very well have access to such a jewel) they simply did not want to. I will repeat again very strenuously that the wearing of a tiara is not strictly the provenance of royalty. Non-royal socialites around the world have worn tiaras forever. In the UK, all women who were presented at court were strongly encouraged to wear them. A tiara is a symbol of status, not royalty.

As far as Tatiana not wearing a tiara, I don't think it has anything to do with her knowledge of protocol. More likely, the GRF did not offer to lend her one for the occasion. The difference being that Nikolaos has not yet proposed (that we know of) as opposed to Gustav being unable to. Since Carina wore a tiara from Gustav's family, it was obviously with the family's consent. Princess Benedikte, born the daughter of the King and Queen of Denmark and sister of the current Queen of Denmark would certainly know enough about royal protocol to consent to this loan of a jewel or not. If anything, the fact that it was loaned to Carina in the first place cements her position, official or unofficial, in Gustav's life as far as his family is concerned.
Of course kimebear is your right to disagree with me and who else you mind, but where do you acquire your knowledges? Because y read "perhaps" and "I don't think" in your message and those sentences are subjetive but not objetiv.

I write about protocol with insider knowledges, Lady in UK is a nobility title, that's the reason why they use tiaras.

Carina Axelsson was not invited to the recently christening of Alexias daughter, because in Spain, they follow the protocol. (Alexia is the 1st grade cousin of Gustav).

Carinas mistress condition is only tolerate by Gustavs close danish relatives.
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  #271  
Old 06-11-2008, 04:07 PM
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Quote:
Also, the tiara has been potentially identified as I said. It seems to be similar enough in design.
Honestly, in my opinion, it is hard to tell specifically with the second image you posted, Kimebear.


Quote:
No one from the House of SWB has confirmed it though.
Yes, that is true. Furthermore, if it was confirmed would have been posted in this topic some time ago.


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  #272  
Old 06-11-2008, 04:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adelheid View Post
Of course kimebear is your right to disagree with me and who else you mind, but where do you acquire your knowledges? Because y read "perhaps" and "I don't think" in your message and those sentence are subjetive but not objetiv.

I write about protocol with insider knowledges, Lady in UK is a nobility title, that's the reason why they use tiaras.
Tiaras can be worn by anyone, not just aristocrats. In the pre-WW2 days, rich commoners wore tiaras to tiara events, just the same as Lady Whoever. The Queen Mother's honeycomb tiara was a bequest from Mrs Greville, who wasn't Lady anything.

Quote:
Carina Axelsson was not invited to the recently christening of Alexias daughter, because in Spain, they follow the protocol. (Alexia is the 1st grade cousin of Gustav).

Carinas mistress condition is only tolerate by Gustavs close danish relatives.
I would agree with kimebear here that it sounds harsh to call her a mistress. This looks like a case where they would be married if not for legal problems surrounding his grandfather's will; it isn't - at least it doesn't appear to be - a case where they've just decided to shack up together for the time being. If they decided, I assume with Princess Benedikte's knowledge, that Carina should wear the tiara as a sign that they're in a long-term relationship that they regard informally as being as close to marriage as they can get under present circumstances, I must say that I for one have some sympathy with them.
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  #273  
Old 06-11-2008, 04:32 PM
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If they decided, I assume with Princess Benedikte's knowledge, that Carina should wear the tiara as a sign that they're in a long-term relationship that they regard informally as being as close to marriage as they can get under present circumstances, I must say that I for one have some sympathy with them.

It was a sign, no question about it.
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  #274  
Old 06-11-2008, 05:59 PM
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Of course Elspeth, tiaras can be worn by anyone, but it depends to which kind of event are you attending.

GlitteringTiaras has ready explain about the meanings of mistress and Carina is not only the girlfriend of Gustav.

Gustav is a german prince, but only his danish relatives tolerate his "way of life". He is out of favor with german aristocrats.
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  #275  
Old 06-11-2008, 10:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Adelheid View Post
Of course Elspeth, tiaras can be worn by anyone, but it depends to which kind of event are you attending.

GlitteringTiaras has ready explain about the meanings of mistress and Carina is not only the girlfriend of Gustav.

Gustav is a german prince, but only his danish relatives tolerate his "way of life". He is out of favor with german aristocrats.
How do you know that he is out of favor with german aristocrats? What inside link do you have? I am sure that he isn't the only german prince that has had a live in companion.

Why would you make such a statement unless you have proof?
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  #276  
Old 06-12-2008, 01:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Adelheid View Post
...Carina Axelsson was not invited to the recently christening of Alexias daughter, because in Spain, they follow the protocol. (Alexia is the 1st grade cousin of Gustav)...
I'd think that Carina wasn't invited to the christening of Amelia (and how do we know for sure she wasn't?) because Gustav himself didn't attend. And what does Spain have to do with the fact? Alexia is part of the Greek royal family, not the Spanish
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  #277  
Old 06-12-2008, 06:01 AM
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Princess Alexia of Greece and Denmark married the SPANISH architect Carlos Morales Quintana, they live in Spain and her auntie is the queen of Spain.


Princess Alexias brothers Prince Nikolaos and Prince Philippos attend christening of Alexias daughter Amelia with their gilfriends Tatiana and Helen, because a girlfiend is not a mistress.


The catholic german prince Christian zu Fürstenberg has also a girlfriend, but those girlfriends are not interlopers who ready live at the family palace or residence, they have their own bourgeois life.


Have you ever seen Carina Axelsson attending an aristocratic event out of Denmark since June 2006?

The rules are the rules, Gustav Frederik Philip Richard, Hereditary Prince of Sayn-Wittgenstein-Berleburg, is not Mr. Müller or Mr. Maier, but he is traying to break the rules since he meets Carina Axelsson, without success, that's the reason why they can't get married.


The materialism is bigger than love, she is not the youngster if she wants to get pregnancy, but love is not enough, they want everything, nobility title, heritage, etc.
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  #278  
Old 06-12-2008, 06:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Adelheid View Post
...Princess Alexias brothers Prince Nikolaos and Prince Philippos attend christening of Alexias daughter Amelia with their gilfriends Tatiana and Helen, because a girlfiend is not a mistress...
Sure, Carlos is Spanish and they live in Spain. Sure, Spain is more traditional regarding girlfriends/in this sense than Denmark - but if what you are saying (that Carina didn't attend the Greek christening because it was in Spain = more protocol), then both Tatiana and Helen wouldn't have attended either.

And how can Tatiana and Helen be counted as 'girlfriends', but Carina not? If you count one as a girlfriend, you have to count them all. Or at least call them all "partners".

And Adelheid, how did you come to the conclusion that Carina is Gustav's mistress? He is not married to another woman, and the only way the term "mistress" can be used in in regards to Carina is, like GT said, as another way of saying "Lady of the House"
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  #279  
Old 06-12-2008, 06:53 AM
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Adelheid aren't you being a bit harsh. I for one would love to see royalty marrying royalty but this is the 21st Century and so why shouldn't they marry whom they want. Gustav is in a really hard position stuck between his duties as the future head of the of his princly house and the person he obviously loves. I have yet to see anything that suggests Carina is anything other than a decent person. Not like a certain woman who married a Hohenzollern- Sigmaringen Prince.
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  #280  
Old 06-12-2008, 06:57 AM
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Princess Alexias brothers Prince Nikolaos and Prince Philippos attend christening of Alexias daughter Amelia with their gilfriends Tatiana and Helen, because a girlfiend is not a mistress.
Was Gustav's other sister at the christening? What about Mary and Frederik, Felipe and Letizia they are also Alexia's cusins yet they were not there. Could it possibly be that they all had things on and couldn't get away for the christening.

Carina is accepted by Gustav's family, she wore a tiara because it was given to her to wear. You may not agree with it, you may not like it but that's the way it is.
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