Restoration of Monarchy in Austria

[Kit]

Archduke Karl never speaks about a possible Restoration?

No! Not even his father the Late AD Otto were thinking of it so why should Karl ? ??? Funny that several posters here cant accept the fact that there is not even the slightest wish for a reinstallment of the monarchy in Austria.

 

[NGalitzine]

If a country has a successful functioning republic why would it was to restore a monarchy that went out of business almost 100 years ago? Few people alive would even remember it, and not necessarily would they remember it fondly.

 

[Kit]

If a country has a successful functioning republic why would it was to restore a monarchy that went out of business almost 100 years ago? Few people alive would even remember it, and not necessarily would they remember it fondly.

Thank you NGalitzine that is exactly the way it is here in Austria. Especially the younger generation doesn't even know that Austria was once a huge monarchy, the older generation doesn't simply care and is happy that the 2nd Austrian Republic works successfully after the disastrous 1st Republic and the few ones still alive don't remember the last days of the monarchy fondly and are glad that these tumultous last years of a dysfunctional monarchy are in the past.

 

[Royal Smurfness]

I am from Austria and I don't see any possibility for restoration of the monarchy.
Otto von Habsburg was in EU parliament, he was educated and very intelligent but his sons are not like him.
The eldest (not even know his name) hit the headliness in connection with a scandal of missabused money from the aid agency World Vision, otherwise I never see him in the media.

 

[Mermaid1962]

I remember seeing a picture of Otto von Hapsburg and his sons in a ROYALTY magazine a long time ago. I remember mentioning to my husband at the time that I thought that the sons looked "odd." I hadn't heard about the misappropriation of funds from World Vision. That was a despicable thing to do. Is that the same son who's separated or divorced from his wife--Francesca? I don't follow this family closely, and so I'm not clear on many details.

The eldest (not even know his name) hit the headliness in connection with a scandal of missabused money from the aid agency World Vision, otherwise I never see him in the media.

 

[Royal Smurfness]

Is that the same son who's separated or divorced from his wife--Francesca?

Yes.

I don't follow this family closely, and so I'm not clear on many details.

Neighter do I.
In Austria we have no great interest in this family.

 

[Kit]

It is Karl who is separated from his wife Francesca, Georg the younger son is married to Eilika of Oldenburg and lives in Hungary. Let's just say in this case it's the daughters who take after their father as far as intelligence is concerned .....

 

[Romanov Princess]

If the crown prince was still alive, RIP, maybe there was a chance but I think that now that he has passed away, the likely hood of the crown going to Karl is very unlikely. If they did bring back the monarchy they should offer it to a member of a reigning house, because the job of emperor is something that a person who has been royal and lived a proper life of service could take and people would know and trust them better.

 

[Kit]

Nobody in Austria will offer anybody the Imperial Crown. Not to Otto even when he was still alive because he renounced his claim to the throne in 1961 not to Karl and certainly not to any other foreign royal. Because there is no wish to return to a monarchy in Austria, not even the slightest. The land is a Republic since 1918 and will remain one. The majority of the Austrian population does not even know that we were a monarchy once ... so please let this topic once and for all rest in peace !!!

 

[Kataryn]

Austria surely is not longer big enough to qualify in any way as an "empire", so the whole world would laugh about the idea - not only the Austrians themselves. Plus in a country that lives from the hope that through ducation and hard work anyone can become someone important there is neither need nor wish for heirediary top positions within the state. But I wouldn't say that the majority of Austrians haven't heard of their Imperial past, when so much of the culture is connected to the fact that Austria used to have a monarchy once. Think alone of the "Kaiserschmarrn"...
.

 

[Kit]

Believe me the grand majority does know nothing about the monarchy except for Franz Joseph and Elisabeth

 

[Kataryn]

Believe me the grand majority does know nothing about the monarchy except for Franz Joseph and Elisabeth

I believe you're right but at least they know these two....Maybe it would have been a difference if a son of Franz Joseph and Elisabeth was emperor in 1918....

 

[Kit]

I believe you're right but at least they know these two....Maybe it would have been a difference if a son of Franz Joseph and Elisabeth was emperor in 1918....

They know them because of Romy Schneider and Karlheinz Böhm

If a son or grandson would have been Emperor ... I don't know if it would have made a difference. Remember Rudolf was already dead and only had a daughter.

One thing is certain: if FJ would still have been alive in 1918 Austria would have remained a - albeit much smaller - monarchy.
Dr. Karl Renner (chancellor in the 1.Republic, president in the 2.Republic) once said: "we wouldn't have had the courage to do it (to abolish the monarchy) under FJ."
The rest is pure speculation ..... .

 

[Cory]

Archduke Paul George would be more accepted by the Austrians than his elder brother?

 

[Kit]

If you ask Austrians if they know who AD Georg is they will most certainly say they have never heard of him. There is just no interest in a reinstallment of a monarchy here in Austria so nobody cares about the Habsburgs. Karl is just known because of a very short-lived and unsuccessful TV career, a World Vision donation scandal in which he is was involved and an unsuccessful political career. His father was of course known and after he renounced any claims to a reinstallment of the monarchy in 1961 he was at least accepted in Austria. Especially because of his political work in the European Parliament and for the outstanding man he was. That he was also the last crown-prince was not so much of interest for the Austrian people.

 

[Blog Real]

Monarchisten-Partei: "Es gibt uns wieder" - Kleinparteien - derStandard.at

 

[Cory]

It is rather strange the Austrians seem to forget that the Habsburgs built all their history in the last seven centuries.

 

[NGalitzine]

^^^^
Well they have had almost 100 years to move on with their lives and make a new history for Austria. Besides their history under the Habsburgs was not all wine and roses.

 

[Kit]

It is exactly as NGalitzine says. That is the way it is. After 1945 the country became a republic. And even during the reign of FJ I. people were not terribly fond of him despite all the nostalgic Sissi-movies.

 

[SydneyLux]

^^^^
Well they have had almost 100 years to move on with their lives and make a new history for Austria. Besides their history under the Habsburgs was not all wine and roses.

Nobody said that all was good but Cory has a point in Austria often forgetting about their Habsburg history. The family has done a lot for the country but there probably isn't any other country in the European world that de-values their former reigning family as much as Austria does. The thing is that you can't cut a history off in any point in time that you would like to prefer and start all over again. Habsburg will always be part of Austria's history and frankly it is a part that brings in many tourists and a lot of money.

Just to be clear, I'm not advocating for restoration or anything along those lines. (It seems that most of the Habsburg's moved on a long time ago and have made successful livings for themselves.) But the Austrian state should value them and give them back what belonged to their ancestors - I don't even mean the castles or any really valuable property but family photo albums, personal items, letters and such - or take care of it and not sell them off at every chance they get.

 

[Kit]

It is certainly an interesting phenomenon here in Austria. I have often wondered about it myself but there is only one AD who gets really valued here and this is AD Johann of Austria, brother of Franz I. / Ii. and great benefactor of Styria. Empress Maria Theresia as well. FJ Is known because of the Sissi-movies among the younger generation. Karl and Zita are more or less unknown by many Austrians. On a side note the Republic does not have personal things apart from clothes, etc which were regularly distributed by the Imperial Court among the servants. Many of Elisabeth's famous diamond stars are still in possession of the descendants of her close confidantes. Sometimes these things turn up and are auctioned off. All these things are then exhibited in the Hofburg. The Habsburgs still are in possession of all important family heirlooms, especially Otto's branch and the descendants of Marie Valerie. Except for the most valuable jewels which were stolen during the abolishment of the monarchy.

 

[SydneyLux]

After all that I have read and heard from other people who have done research about the matter, I understand that Karl and Zita left Austria with little more than the clothes on their body. Even if they had taking any valuables with them, they were most likely sold in the early years of their exil considering that they were poor and only lived of money given to them by monarchists, family members and the Catholic church. Their situation only improved when their sons started to earn money and that's also the reason why they are wealthy these days.

It was Zita's decision that Otto would go into politics and it were his brothers who supported him financially during times that he could not earn a lof of money giving presentations and such about the political situation in Europe. Most of the sons Karl and Zita married very well and their wives brought money and heirlooms into their new families. It is my understanding that most if not all of the tiaras and jewels that are owned by the different descendants of Karl and Zita are either heirlooms from other families (for example the Este branch has lots of Savoy-Aosta jewellery which were brought into the family by Archduchess Margherita) or have been purchased with the money they earned (or inherited in Francesca's case).

About every ten years there have been auctions by the Austrian state of Habsburg valuables. A friend of mine has seen one of the catalogues and they include such personal items as family photo albums, letters and jewels. (Also a lot of other stuff like paitings, furniture, etc.) I have read interviews of many family members in which they told that they are trying to purchase the most important personal items at auctions.

Of course, there were a lot of archduchesses who married into other families before the monarchy was abolished and had substantial dowries including jewels and such. That's one of the reasons why Prince Sophie of Windisch-Graetz, née Archduchess of Austria has a collection of Habsburg jewels to wear but they aren't owned by the Habsburg family.

 

[Kit]

As I said jewels like Elisabeth's diamond stars were gifts from the Empress to close confidantes after CP Rudolph's death. Valuable jewels were stolen after the abolishment like the yellow FLORENTINER in that we absolutely agree with each other. Also FJ distributed personal things like letters, combs, pictures to his servants. But these things were given to the Republic by the descendants of said servants or bought by the Republic at auctions. I am not saying the Habsburgs were treated correctly by the Republic. But I know that OTTO's branch and also Marie Valerie's branch still have a lot of personal memorabilia. What the main branch does not have are the really valuable things: the family jewels, paintings, the castles, hunting lodges, property, etc. in that case I agree with you. Yet the other minor branches like the FJ- branch through Marie Valerie and the Hohenbergs still have several family heirlooms, buildings like the Kaiservilla, hunting lodges, etc. As I said I have often wondered about the harsh treatment of the Habsburgs myself. It is an interesting topic.

 

[Stefan]

After all that I have read and heard from other people who have done research about the matter, I understand that Karl and Zita left Austria with little more than the clothes on their body. Even if they had taking any valuables with them, they were most likely sold in the early years of their exil considering that they were poor and only lived of money given to them by monarchists, family members and the Catholic church. Their situation only improved when their sons started to earn money and that's also the reason why they are wealthy these days.

But she keept her Wedding tiara which was later giiven to daughter-in-law Regina who wore it at her Wedding Day. In one book i also read that around 1920/21 one of ther trusted sold some old Family Jewels (going back to Maria Theresia) which they wanted to keep, and went away with the Money.

 

[Kit]

Yes Stefan that is right. Zita and Karl were also betrayed by a close confidant. They sold important jewels but said confidant kept the money and left without a trace.

On a side note: who is Sophie Windischgrätz ? Do you mean CP Rudolf's daughter Elisabeth Marie Henriette Stephanie who married Prince Otto Windischgrätz?

 

[Stefan]

On a side note: who is Sophie Windischgrätz ? Do you mean CP Rudolf's daughter Elisabeth Marie Henriette Stephanie who married Prince Otto Windischgrätz?

Probably the daughter of Archduke Ferdinand and Archduchess Helene, née Countess zu Toerring-Jettenbach is meant as her name is Sophie and she is married to Fürst Mariano Hugo zu Windisch-Greatz.

 

[MAfan]

Is it possible that those heirlooms which the main line of the Habsburgs still own were given back to them only in the 1930s? If I don't mistake in these years they were allowed to return to Austria and some properties were given back to them, until they lost them again with the Anschluss.

 

[Kit]

More likely after 1961 when Otto renounced his rights to the throne and was therefore given permission to enter Austria. And Zita was allowed to return for a few days in 1981 because PM - or Kanzler in German - Bruno Kreisky allowed it. They even met each other and were on very good terms with each other.

 

[Cory]

HIRH Archduke Karl has given up his rights too?

 

[MAfan]

No he didn't - he didn't have to do, because Archduke Otto had renounced to all claims to the Austrian throne for himself and his descendants, Karl included.