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  #241  
Old 11-09-2007, 05:24 AM
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[quote=Duke of Marmalade;690556]What I like a lot about the Spanish forums is that people express their opinions in a very civilized way – unlike in other forums – and the moderators do a great job by allowing the discussion moving ahead. ]


Me too, because it's true work of moderator doing in the aim to keep a pacific and intelligent way of discussion. All the participants to this threads since the oldest ones who want to "survive" in the spanish threads know how to do when some disturbators with theirs own pleasurs are continuing in their very personal negative dialectic! Very easy:for to have a dialectic we have to be at least TWO, if you understand what I mean!

[There are those who praise Letizia, even if there is an obvious reason not to praise her; there are those who critizise Letizia, even if there is no obvious reason to critizise her and there are those – the grand majority of posters – who praise and critizise depending how they see different issues. There is a tolerant atmosphere and a friendly co-existence on the Spanish threads that I have always appreciated very much. I am surprised to see that there is now the need to mock on specific posters and the way they give their opinion, together with the well meant advice: you better stay away if you don’t join the praise instead of daring to express a critical opinion. Isn’t this what this forum is about? Giving an opinion in a civilised way? And if you don’t share it, either start a well argumented discussion or tolerate and respect it?]

Absolutly agree about the necessity of the well argumented discussion with the most possible part of tolerate and respect of the others opinion. But I want to add an immportant thing, when you are criticizing one member of the Spain Royal Family - may be the fact to ention only The princess of Asturias can be considere as an interessant lapsus because Letizia isn't the single member of SRF who can be criticized at least it could be the joke: make critics about Letizia only to make critics and to creat an artificial debat, if you know what I mean also!!!

[Besides, constant praising or creating a worship mentality is as boring as constant critizism and creating negativity; in my opinion only a variety of opinions adds flavour to this forum. It has been possible to respect each other in the past and I hope this doesn’t change, for the good of the forum.

Keep on posting ]

Thanks for your permissivity
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  #242  
Old 11-09-2007, 07:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post
What I like a lot about the Spanish forums is that people express their opinions in a very civilized way – unlike in other forums – and the moderators do a great job by allowing the discussion moving ahead.

There are those who praise Letizia, even if there is an obvious reason not to praise her; there are those who critizise Letizia, even if there is no obvious reason to critizise her and there are those – the grand majority of posters – who praise and critizise depending how they see different issues. There is a tolerant atmosphere and a friendly co-existence on the Spanish threads that I have always appreciated very much. I am surprised to see that there is now the need to mock on specific posters and the way they give their opinion, together with the well meant advice: you better stay away if you don’t join the praise instead of daring to express a critical opinion. Isn’t this what this forum is about? Giving an opinion in a civilised way? And if you don’t share it, either start a well argumented discussion or tolerate and respect it?

Besides, constant praising or creating a worship mentality is as boring as constant critizism and creating negativity; in my opinion only a variety of opinions adds flavour to this forum. It has been possible to respect each other in the past and I hope this doesn’t change, for the good of the forum.

Keep on posting
Giving one's opinions in a civilized way and civilized discussions are great - makes this forum interesting. However, there are a few posters who are downright mean and unreasonable in their posts.
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  #243  
Old 08-07-2008, 07:12 AM
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The attitude of Spanish Moderatoring team is so childish and ridiculous to limit freedom of speech. I don’t understand why they closed the thread what is about Letizia’s first marriage when it is FACT not speculation. I have always wondered why the thread Felipe’s ex girlfriends is closed while CP Frederik and Haakon same thread is open and the posters are allowed to talk about their ex-partners openly. WHY DO THEY MAKE EXCEPTIONS WITH THE SPANISH FORUM? Why aren’t we permitted to discuss about anything without restriction on this threads? The Spanish moderators should not be too prejudiced. Just because you don’t agree with someone ,it’s not reason to close a thread immediately. IT IS LIMITATION ON FREEDOM OF SPEECH. They are not willing to accept that there are different points of view. Such is life! We have to accept it. But it seems that some people would like to wipe Letizia’s past as if Felipe would have invariably existed in her life. NEVER NOBODY will not able to wipe her previous marriage. Letizia and Felipe had numerous ex-partners, it is fact what we have to accept it. Nobody can’t change the past. DIFFERENT POINTS OF VIEW IS PART OF FREEDOM OF SPEECH. People can see, hear and have the right to speak as well. We can not always wait until someone confirms each royal news if true or not. It seems that some people are not able to think alone until they get confirmation and proofs. A forum won’t be trustworthy if is too controlled. We live in democracy where we have the right the freedom of speech. THE COIN HAS TWO SIDES.
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  #244  
Old 08-07-2008, 10:42 AM
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Guido, it is the habit of the moderators and administrators of these forums to immediately close any thread that could prove contentious and controversial as soon as it is open in order to allow time for the moderators and admins, who are spread around the world, to consult with one another and come to a consensus as to whether the thread is needed, or if the subject is served already by another thread, and if the thread is to remain open, to establish some ground rules before re-opening the thread in order to make posting a pleasure for all involved.

All threads regarding ex-partners have been treated in this manner, and in fact, the moderators of the Spanish Forum had nearly decided to re-open the thread with some basic ground rules in place. Had you bothered to contact a moderator with your concern before immediately jumping on a high horse about your 1st ammendment rights, which as a matter of fact, since you reside in Italy, aren't applicable to you, but only to the board, you would have found that we were discussing it, and would get back to you as soon as possible.

Instead you have made a mountain out of a mole hill, where there was no need. The Spanish moderators are not prefudiced, just following established forum practice. Restrictions are in place throughout the forums to limit the exposure of the forums to lawsuits of libel, copyright, and speculation. As we are incorporated in the USA we must follow established USA law, which we must apply to all of our posters.

Quote:
We can not always wait until someone confirms each royal news if true or not. It seems that some people are not able to think alone until they get confirmation and proofs. A forum won’t be trustworthy if is too controlled. We live in democracy where we have the right the freedom of speech. THE COIN HAS TWO SIDES.
There is a difference between thoughts, and harmless talk, and libelous speculation which might shut the board down. SPECULATION, whether forbidden or not by the constitution of the USA, is not the issue. Libelous specualtion is forbidden by the forum rules, which you agreed to when you became a member of this forum.

In the future, should you have a problem with a moderator decision, please take the time to discuss it with the moderators in question before jumping to conclusions that might be wrong.
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  #245  
Old 08-07-2008, 10:51 AM
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It may be helpful to approach these discussion forums the same way as if one has been invited to a nice dinner party. The discussions can be heated and spirited but one will watch the language one uses and how different opinions are expressed. It is always possible to have interesting discussions without being rude, overly negative or use trash talk. After all - when the dinnerparty is over you want all guests to be friends and respect each other. To approach a discussion board with the same attitude works.
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  #246  
Old 08-07-2008, 12:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guido View Post
The attitude of Spanish Moderatoring team is so childish and ridiculous to limit freedom of speech. I don’t understand why they closed the thread what is about Letizia’s first marriage when it is FACT not speculation. I have always wondered why the thread Felipe’s ex girlfriends is closed while CP Frederik and Haakon same thread is open and the posters are allowed to talk about their ex-partners openly. WHY DO THEY MAKE EXCEPTIONS WITH THE SPANISH FORUM? Why aren’t we permitted to discuss about anything without restriction on this threads? The Spanish moderators should not be too prejudiced. Just because you don’t agree with someone ,it’s not reason to close a thread immediately. IT IS LIMITATION ON FREEDOM OF SPEECH. They are not willing to accept that there are different points of view. Such is life! We have to accept it. But it seems that some people would like to wipe Letizia’s past as if Felipe would have invariably existed in her life. NEVER NOBODY will not able to wipe her previous marriage. Letizia and Felipe had numerous ex-partners, it is fact what we have to accept it. Nobody can’t change the past. DIFFERENT POINTS OF VIEW IS PART OF FREEDOM OF SPEECH. People can see, hear and have the right to speak as well. We can not always wait until someone confirms each royal news if true or not. It seems that some people are not able to think alone until they get confirmation and proofs. A forum won’t be trustworthy if is too controlled. We live in democracy where we have the right the freedom of speech. THE COIN HAS TWO SIDES.
Freedom of Speech does not give one the right to lie and start rumors without any facts to support about ANYONE. People think that is funny [just to start a debate or put someone down] when actually quite low class. A different point of view is always wonderful, but not if done for spite or because one doesn't like the person being talked about. There is something extremely wrong with a person that dislikes another person [especially when not personally known] that they find NOTHING right about them. Even if a person has an opinion, they should beable to correctly give the reason for the opinion. I know there are quite a few well known people in American that I can't stand and no matter what they do, I can't give them the benefit of the doubt [my ex president for one] but I just don't enter into mudd slinging and lies without proof. The coin does have two sides, but the person yelling about it should see first why they are making such a fuss about something that has no importance [or makes no difference] to their lives on that specific subject.
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  #247  
Old 08-07-2008, 12:50 PM
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As a guest at this dinner party, I would never like to be thought rude, perhaps I didn´t understand properly but wasn´t Guido saying that the Spanish forum hasn´t been able to discuss the former husband of Princess Letizia. That is not speculation is it? I think that it is unfair to attack the mods, and I think they have been very fair in all the threads I have been on and I think that Guido should have toned his language or at least they way he said what he did.
It seems from what Empress said that the mods are discussing this and will soon come to a conclusion. No one wants anyone to have a libel suit thrown at them.
Are we going to have the thread again? To tell you the truth the ex husband of Princess Letizia doesn´t interest me at all, but obviously some people think it an interesting subject. I was always rather fond of Isabel Sartorius though.
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  #248  
Old 08-07-2008, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Menarue View Post
As a guest at this dinner party, I would never like to be thought rude, perhaps I didn´t understand properly but wasn´t Guido saying that the Spanish forum hasn´t been able to discuss the former husband of Princess Letizia. That is not speculation is it? I think that it is unfair to attack the mods, and I think they have been very fair in all the threads I have been on and I think that Guido should have toned his language or at least they way he said what he did.
It seems from what Empress said that the mods are discussing this and will soon come to a conclusion. No one wants anyone to have a libel suit thrown at them.
Are we going to have the thread again? To tell you the truth the ex husband of Princess Letizia doesn´t interest me at all, but obviously some people think it an interesting subject. I was always rather fond of Isabel Sartorius though.
I believe that you are correct in the fact that any subject can be discussed if kept to facts and not "made-up" lies. When someone gets nasty because their opinion [not entirely true facts, just 'gut' feelings] are questioned by someone with a different opinion, that is when the mods have done a wonderful job of shutting down the thread until they can come to a correct conclusion. I have had things deleted [ and believe me they should have been as I was in a temper] so I know for a fact that the mods look out for the integrity of the forum.
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  #249  
Old 08-07-2008, 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Winnie View Post
I believe that you are correct in the fact that any subject can be discussed if kept to facts and not "made-up" lies. When someone gets nasty because their opinion [not entirely true facts, just 'gut' feelings] are questioned by someone with a different opinion, that is when the mods have done a wonderful job of shutting down the thread until they can come to a correct conclusion. I have had things deleted [ and believe me they should have been as I was in a temper] so I know for a fact that the mods look out for the integrity of the forum.
Thanks Winnie, it is nice to know that the mods will delete me if they sense I am throwing a tantrum.
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  #250  
Old 08-08-2008, 05:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winnie View Post
I believe that you are correct in the fact that any subject can be discussed if kept to facts and not "made-up" lies. When someone gets nasty because their opinion [not entirely true facts, just 'gut' feelings] are questioned by someone with a different opinion, that is when the mods have done a wonderful job of shutting down the thread until they can come to a correct conclusion. I have had things deleted [ and believe me they should have been as I was in a temper] so I know for a fact that the mods look out for the integrity of the forum.
This is just my view, but I think your point is certainly critical in opening a thread discussing Letizia's first husband. With their divorce papers sealed from the public by the Royal House itself and with many articles saying all things, plus the the fact that no one from their closest circles ever talk about it anymore, we'll be bound to discuss things based on personal opinion and speculation. And frankly, we'll be basing replies on not-too-solid references...and what kind of discussion will we have with that?

I do appreciate that moderators on this board do these reviews. I believe that improves the quality of topics and discussion. However, may I ask, is also standard forum practice to contact members who started the threads that were closed for review to inform them of the action? Or is it considered too cumbersome?
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  #251  
Old 08-08-2008, 07:57 AM
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In my view Letizia for whatever reason, has generated very strong reactions from both sides. I still do not understand why. There are adorers and there are bashers. For some she can do no wrong and is perfect (there is no such thing) and for others she can do nothing acceptable.

The lady is (at least to me) an average looking woman who had the exceptional luck to have a Crown Prince fall in love with her and elevate her from middle class to whatever royalty passes for these days. She bore two beautiful, healthy children but with regard to accomplishments, besides reading the news on TV she did not do much else.

Why do you think people feel so strong about her?
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  #252  
Old 08-08-2008, 11:16 AM
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In my view Letizia for whatever reason, has generated very strong reactions from both sides. I still do not understand why. There are adorers and there are bashers. For some she can do no wrong and is perfect (there is no such thing) and for others she can do nothing acceptable.

The lady is (at least to me) an average looking woman who had the exceptional luck to have a Crown Prince fall in love with her and elevate her from middle class to whatever royalty passes for these days. She bore two beautiful, healthy children but with regard to accomplishments, besides reading the news on TV she did not do much else.

Why do you think people feel so strong about her?
I don't know if, in fact, that it is just Letizia that causes such strong feelings in people. I read the exact same comments about Mary and especially Maxima. Heavens some compare Maxima to Evida P and have no time for that poor woman at all no matter what she does. Others thinks that she is a saint to bring a healthy light into the Dutch "formal" family. So I personally don't think that any of the Princess get a free ride (so to speak). Some of the worse comments I have read on the forums is about Victoria and her ugly chin and small eyes and being mentally deficient when compared to Mary and Maxima. Now she is just a good natured woman that will be Queen of Sweden some day, so people take pot-shots at her all the time.

Don't understand it myself. I just enjoy seeing them and their activities (which all do much more than I do for others in my life) but as none of them can personally affect my life, I can't get emotionally disturbed about any of the world prinesses or princes.

Just would Love to beable to afford and have the figure I had twenty years ago to wear some of their fantastic clothes!!!!
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  #253  
Old 08-08-2008, 12:34 PM
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I don't know Winnie. I responded since this has to do with the Spanish threads and mostly about the reaction Letizia generates.
I have never read the posts (which I would classify them as idiotic) with regard to other ladies' physical appearances. It is shameful anyone would make a derogatory comment about one's appearance or mental abilities since none of us (that I know of) personally knows any of the Royals.
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  #254  
Old 08-14-2008, 03:34 PM
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I have to say that although I follow the Spanish royal family in the news and privately, I have found posting about them here to be utterly fruitless. It appears that rules, deletions, and cleanups are done according to personal preference. I don't even read here much at all, as I could read the same by picking up a copy of Hello. Nothing insightful permitted, it often appears.

I recognize several posting parties, and know that they have much that is both informative and interesting to say in other forums. It makes me wonder why that same level of insight doesn't appear in their posting here...then I realize I've answered my own question.
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  #255  
Old 08-25-2008, 05:24 PM
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Well, fresh out of the posts about Letizia's nose operation since again the conversation took another turn. We were asked to discuss attitudes about the SRF here and leave the nose discussions there.....
I may be totally computer illiterate but when I come on the boards I have to work with whatever posts I find as "todays posts" or "new posts"
Lo and behold the same posts keep coming on over and over again. I learnt a lot from other civilised posts from well educated knowledgeable posters/moderators but they do not come up every day and I do not know how to hunt them down.
So I get tangled with the "popular" posts.........
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