Have the remains of the Imperial Family been found?

[Charlottesville]

Originally Posted by acid_rain3075

Interesting! But I was under the impression that it was not Grand Duchess Anastassia that was missing but instead Grand Duchess Maria! I don't know, this is one mystery that will never be solved!

I reccomend the book "The Fate of the Romanovs" by Greg King and Penny Wilson. It'll demonstrate the Russian agenda to prove Anastasia was in that grave. More:
http://www.peterkurth.com/RUSSIAN%20...ICS%20TEAM.htm
The Russians had been insisting Anastasia was in the grave before any kind of tests were done.
As for more on Anna Anderson
http://www.peterkurth.com/ANNA-ANAST...HANZKOWSKA.htm

Here is more stuff I found casting doubts on the absolute validity of the orginal DNA tests of '93-'94.
http://www.peterkurth.com/KYHX9RBFX82QWTLV.pdf

[Charlottesville]

I was reading the thread "The lost Romanovs 1" and I was kind of shocked at how many things on there are not true. I get the feeling that people on this forum aren't particularly interested in the Romanovs enough to read books about them I guess???

[morhange]

I don't know if this site has been posted before, but it was created in 2001 by some Romanov, well, I hesitate to call them fans because that reminds me of teenyboppers, but I'm not sure about calling them experts because they aren't real scientists, but either way, it's a very interesting read. http://www.livadia.org/missing/

It opened up my thinking about it, and I believe that there is equal possibility than any of the three younger girls is missing. I think what a lot of people seem to forget is that the younger girls were just leaving puberty, and most likely, still growing, especially Anastasia, who was the youngest. I'm going on eighteen now, and I grew two inches between my seventeeth birthday and now, so it's not entirely implausible. Couple that with the fact that the skeletons weren't all whole, so it would still be difficult to determine EXACT heights.

I think the most likely scenario was that the executioners wanted to burn the bodies of Alexei and Alexandra (although why not Nicholas either...) If my memory serves me correctly, all eleven bodies were buried together initially, and acid was thrown on them. Then they were dug up again and reburied. By the time they unearthed, the bodies were probably bloated beyond recognition. Tatiana was said to look closest to her mother, and there could have easily been a mix-up. Maria was almost as tall as Tatiana, so these could have easily been mixed-up, and Anastasia was still in puberty, so she could have had a growth spurt.

Personally, I do think all seven family members died that night, and that for whatever reason, the bodies of Alexei and one of his sisters (Tatiana, Maria or Anastasia, we may never know) are missing. I don't think it's so much of a mystery now, since, regardless of whether or not anyone survived, they're most likely dead now. And as a final note (oh, I know this is soooo long :( I really think it's highly doubtful that the Tsesarevitch survived. I doubt a hemophiliac could have survived, and I don't think any of the girls did either, although I do like the magnificent escape told in the novel, The Kitchen Boy by Robert Alexander, which I highly recommend by the way. Okay, enough of out me!

[Charlottesville]

I agree with the height issue, but it is also important to note that Dr. Maples thought the vertebrae were all too mature to be that of a girl who had just turned 17.

[morhange]

I do agree with that. However, maybe it had something to do with the lifestyle the girls led? I'm not very scientific, but is the maturing of vertebrae influenced by a person's posture? IE, children with poor posture develop this slower than those with good posture? As royalty, the Russian grand duchesses probably had to sit up straight alot and maybe this affected the maturity of their bones? However, I may be wrong, because I have a problem with only remember history and never things like math or science. It amazes me that I know the names of all of Queen Victoria's grandchildren and great-grandchildren, but next to nothing about the periodic table of elements or much of what I learned in Algebra 2.

[Charlottesville]

Originally Posted by morhange

I do agree with that. However, maybe it had something to do with the lifestyle the girls led? I'm not very scientific, but is the maturing of vertebrae influenced by a person's posture? IE, children with poor posture develop this slower than those with good posture? As royalty, the Russian grand duchesses probably had to sit up straight alot and maybe this affected the maturity of their bones? However, I may be wrong, because I have a problem with only remember history and never things like math or science. It amazes me that I know the names of all of Queen Victoria's grandchildren and great-grandchildren, but next to nothing about the periodic table of elements or much of what I learned in Algebra 2.

I really don't know if posture would have any effect on the vertebrae. I wish I could find an unbiased scientist to tell me more.

[Dane]

A young girls fibuler has been foundin the forest where the Romanov's were buiried. The discovery was found in a laod of ash uner the ground. Anastasiya??

[norwegianne]

Originally Posted by Dane

A young girls fibuler has been foundin the forest where the Romanov's were buiried. The discovery was found in a laod of ash uner the ground. Anastasiya??

Do you have a link to the news?

[Danielane]

It's a fascinating matter! I read somewhere (I can't recall where) an article or a theory about the so-called "survivants" of royal family. Survivantism has existed in every royal family, especially in the family marked by tragic events. We have the exemple of Louis XVII, of Kaspar Hauser (said to be heir of the Baden family- by the way, is there a Kaspar Hauser topic? It would be interesting too, royalty-related), of tsarevitch Dimitri long ago. All these stories would be related to the hopes of the monarchist that their "favourite" family is not extincted, that there's still an heir somewhere. I don't know where is the truth in Anna Anderson's story, but I wanted to share the theory I read somewhere with you.

[ortino]

Originally Posted by morhange

I don't know if this site has been posted before, but it was created in 2001 by some Romanov, well, I hesitate to call them fans because that reminds me of teenyboppers, but I'm not sure about calling them experts because they aren't real scientists, but either way, it's a very interesting read. http://www.livadia.org/missing/

It opened up my thinking about it, and I believe that there is equal possibility than any of the three younger girls is missing. I think what a lot of people seem to forget is that the younger girls were just leaving puberty, and most likely, still growing, especially Anastasia, who was the youngest. I'm going on eighteen now, and I grew two inches between my seventeeth birthday and now, so it's not entirely implausible. Couple that with the fact that the skeletons weren't all whole, so it would still be difficult to determine EXACT heights.

I think the most likely scenario was that the executioners wanted to burn the bodies of Alexei and Alexandra (although why not Nicholas either...) If my memory serves me correctly, all eleven bodies were buried together initially, and acid was thrown on them. Then they were dug up again and reburied. By the time they unearthed, the bodies were probably bloated beyond recognition. Tatiana was said to look closest to her mother, and there could have easily been a mix-up. Maria was almost as tall as Tatiana, so these could have easily been mixed-up, and Anastasia was still in puberty, so she could have had a growth spurt.

Personally, I do think all seven family members died that night, and that for whatever reason, the bodies of Alexei and one of his sisters (Tatiana, Maria or Anastasia, we may never know) are missing. I don't think it's so much of a mystery now, since, regardless of whether or not anyone survived, they're most likely dead now. And as a final note (oh, I know this is soooo long :( I really think it's highly doubtful that the Tsesarevitch survived. I doubt a hemophiliac could have survived, and I don't think any of the girls did either, although I do like the magnificent escape told in the novel, The Kitchen Boy by Robert Alexander, which I highly recommend by the way. Okay, enough of out me!

I agree with you Morhange. I checked out the website and they did have a convincing argument. I think one of the 3 youngest is not in the grave but which? I guess Maria (if they did survive) would have been the one who could have survived the most as she did not have jewels on her clothes, which means she could have well just kept quiet and tried to escape-your survival instinct is quite strong and she seems the most earthy, down-to-earth of the girls. Yurovsky writes that Ermakov's bayonet had trouble piercing through the girls who survived the shootings clothes' so we can deduce they had jewels sewn into them.And Maria did not. However.. I remember reading in one of the books written before the remains were excavated that the Swiss Red Cross rep had had his train stoppped and searched for 2 missing Romanov children in Siberia that month, around the time of the murder. Can anyone corroborate?

[Warren]

A general question: Is it really likely that anyone could have escaped from a cellar full of soldiers firing volleys of bullets and wielding bayonets with murderous intent?

[ortino]

Originally Posted by Warren

A general question: Is it really likely that anyone could have escaped from a cellar full of soldiers firing volleys of bullets and wielding bayonets with murderous intent?

99.99% they did not, but until the bodies are found there will always be speculation

[queenofsheba]

Hi Everyone,

Adding onto the heated discussion, I found this website today:
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexofdenmark/

I am not sure if anyone has already posted this web address. Please excuse me if I am repeating something that has already been done!

Enjoy.

[Vanesa]

I'm one of these crazy creatures that believes that someone could have survived this awful night of 1918 (but I think that THERE WAS a massacre without any doubt and that the bones found at the Pig's Meadow ARE , at least in part, those of the Imperial Family)...However, I think that the link that Queenofsheba posted (thank, by the way, Queen! ) is...how I can said it? a little ridicoulous.

The pics that "Alex of Denmark" compares- those of his family- with the ones of the Romanovs shows NO ressemblance. Not at all. Heino Tammet WAS similar to Alexei . You may believe in his claim or not, but he is similar...But, the woman that "Alex of Denmark" claims it's Alix of Hesse...well...with all my good will, I can't see ressemblance at all. Same for "Anastasia" and "Alexei". The only one who was very similar to Prince Eitel (Wilhelm II's son) was "Alex of Denmark"'s grandfather.

I found this site very similar to another by the family Veres..I can't remember the link, but I think that it was in the links place of the www.romanov-memorial.com

Vanesa.

[acid_rain3075]

Originally Posted by queenofsheba

Hi Everyone,

Adding onto the heated discussion, I found this website today:
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexofdenmark/

I am not sure if anyone has already posted this web address. Please excuse me if I am repeating something that has already been done!

Enjoy.

I was just now reading the contents of that website. And to be perfectly honest, its absolutely ridiculous!!! the person who wrote all that stuff actually believes that the reason the events leading up to the deaths of the Imperial Family happened is because the country lost it's godliness. And most of all, whom ever this person is, also believes that their family are the surviving members of the Imperial family (again ridiculous, to me of course).

Tsar Nicholas 2nd was the Emperor and spiritual Christian Orthodox leader of Russia. Because of his removal, by evil forces in 1918, I believe that Russia has lost its spiritual compass. Russia therefor has been left to wander politically and spiritually, like any other country, without the blessings and guidance of our Lord Jesus Christ. This has led Russia into chaos and the wanton murder of its people by leaders like the madman and murderer Stalin. The re-establishment of the Romanov Tsarist throne is necessary for the sanctification and healing of Russia and its people.

Anyways, since I unfortunately haven't been keeping up with this thread, I just have one question and this might actually be way out of left field but... I was recently watching this show (a rerun, which I've already watch), that people believe that if anyone survived the massacre that killed the family, it would be Marie and Alexis, right. Well, my question is that even IF Alexis didn't die during the shooting round, what makes people believe he would have lived much longer afterwards? I mean he had hemophilia right. Even the smallest injury would have been life threatening. And lets say that for some miraculous reason he wasn't shot (which of course seems doubtful in the least), at the time most hemophiliacs usually didn't live to see their 30th birthdays. So why all the rumors? Why Alexis?

[Val3275]

Hemophiliacs can live old, if they take care of themselves and are aware of all the dangers surrounding them. They can marry and have children.
Sometimes, in their 30s, men are still light-headed, and specially when they've had a very protective childhood.

But in the case of the Romanov, we know for sure that Alexei had a major crisis while in Toblosk and that he was really not well. So his survival is highly hypothetical.

But of course this is only my opinion.

[acid_rain3075]

Originally Posted by Val3275

Hemophiliacs can live old, if they take care of themselves and are aware of all the dangers surrounding them. They can marry and have children.
Sometimes, in their 30s, men are still light-headed, and specially when they've had a very protective childhood.

I was thinking more about the time period. As I understand it hemophiliacs during the early part of the 20th century normally didn't live long enough to reach their 30th Birthdays. Now a days, hemophiliacs live long normal lives just like the rest of us, but this last fact isn't really the point I suppose.