Royal Family of Portugal 3: December 2007-

[Warren]

Arms of HRH Dom Duarte, Duke of Bragança​

Welcome to the Royal Family of Portugal 3​

commencing December 2007​

Part 2, covering the period March 2006 to December 2007 can be found here​

  ​

 

[Elsa M.]

Why did the Duke say such a thing? I believe mr. Saramago usually isn´t too positive about Portugal, which might be annoying to many Portuguese.

I just saw the headline (didn't read the article), but it's not surprising, if we consider that Saramago's politic ideas are... how can I put it in a nice way... strange. Recently, he stated that Portugal should be incorporated by Spain!!!!

Anyway, Duarte should not say that Saramago didn't deserve the Nobel Prize. I agree that other Portuguese writers are better (and deserved the Nobel much more than him), but he is a good writer, and the Duke of Bragança should stay way from these polemic statements...

... Like I don't think he should participate in commercial publicities, like he's doing now, in the capacity of Count of Ourém. (He's approved the use of his photo in three-meter-height posters, for an advertising campaign of a new supermarket in Ourém!

O Mirante online - 29-11-2007 - O Cartoon da Notícia - Uma real promoção

By doing things like these, some people could say that Saramago is not the only "senile" person in this fairytale story...

 

[Regina]

I just saw the headline (didn't read the article), but it's not surprising, if we consider that Saramago's politic ideas are... how can I put it in a nice way... strange. Recently, he stated that Portugal should be incorporated by Spain!!!!

According to Causa Monárquica blog, Dom Duarte says "Saramago is a senile man who won a Nobel he didnt deserve". Dom Duarte also said that Portugal won't be incorporated by Spain like the angry Saramago likes to proclaim, but it's Spain who has reasons to be worried with all the Spanish regions, like "Catalunha and our friends from Galizia", that want to become independent.
Dom Duarte seems to be one of those who dream with a portuguese Galizia... only in Dom Duarte's wildest dreams a thing like that could happen.

The blog article ends with a "Saramago, porque não te calas?"

... Like I don't think he should participate in commercial publicities, like he's doing now, in the capacity of Count of Ourém. (He's approved the use of his photo in three-meter-height posters, for an advertising campaign of a new supermarket in Ourém!

O Mirante online - 29-11-2007 - O Cartoon da Notícia - Uma real promoção

By doing things like these, some people could say that Saramago is not the only "senile" person in this fairytale story...

I agree. How embarrassing this is!

 

[Elsa M.]

A União - jornal online

Last December 19th, D. Duarte visited the localities of Praia da Vitória and Angra do Heroísmo, in Terceira(Archipelago of Açores), where he inaugurated the new headquarters of AMI. In the evening, he was offered a dinner in the Hotel Caracol, where nearly 30 people were assembled.


_________________________



Funchal 500 Anos: Presidente da República desloca-se à Madeira a 18 e 19 de Abril - RTP Notícias

In order to commemorate the 500 years of Funchal, D. Duarte de Bragança is collaborating with the Intermunicipal Company that is responsible for the celebrations, as to invite some members of the European Royal Houses to visit the Archipelago of Madeira, in 2008. One of the couples that is expected is the King and Queen of Belgium.

 

[tlg00]

Posted by Elsa in the previous thread:

The Duke and Duchess of Bragança have accepted the invitation sent by the mayor of Rio de Janeiro, in order to attend the celebrations around the 200th anniversary since the displacement of King D. João VI and his Court to Rio. The celebrations are going to start at the Royal and Imperial Cathedral, the Church of Senhora do Carmo.

Any word on if these events will still occur? The 200th anniversary is this month. What was the actual day of their arrival if anyone knows? I've seen January 6th, January 21st, and January 22nd all mentioned before.

 

[Regina]

Dona Isabel, her sons (Afonso, Maria Francisca and Diniz), her sister (Teresa Herédia de Sousa Mendes, a famous Nutritionist) and her nephews (João and Manuel) at the Theatre Politeama, in Lisbon, attending the Play "A Estrela"

Scanned From Caras magazine

All the Group

Isabel with her children

the Infantes with their cousins

 

[Regina]

Genealogy Family Tree of the last King of Portugal, Dom Manuel II

 

[Regina]

Sol newspaper of January 26 2008, gives us an interview with Duke of Bragança, Dom Duarte.

Sol (page #2)

In this interview, Dom Duarte says he never votes on elections for the Government. But he does vote on the elections to elect a Presidente de Câmara (the President of each Concelho). He votes in Sintra, where he lives with his family, except on the last elections where he didn't vote because, in his words, "I was a friend of both candidates".

Dom Duarte also talks about the political situation in Portugal. I think his opinions are correct, but I won't post them here since this is not a political thread and TRF members are for sure not interested in Portuguese politicians!

If he gave consistent opinions about Portugal and its present situation (IMO), he didn't do the same about international affairs.

D. Duarte says he knows Venezuela very well and he believes that the people of this country feel much more represented by Hugo Chavez than by other former presidents. By other side, he says Chavez is doing silly things and maybe he is not a very wise man.

The Duke of Braganza believes Obama is an interesting candidate for the Democrats. And Giuliani would be his choice for Republicans. Now comes the funny part: when the journalist asks him if he thinks the private life of a candidate is important thing to win the elections, D. Duarte says it is good to know their private life because it helps to jugde the personality of the person which is a fundamental thing, in his opinion. The journalist ask him if the sexual life of a candidate is important or not to be known, to what he answers "the people should know everything about a Candidate".
The journalist insists "Is it important to know if the candidate goes to bed with men or women?". His answer is: "That's not important..."

In his interview, he calls "senil" to Saramago, like he did in previous events.
- "Do you like Saramago as a writer?"
- "He writes so badly. I think the Swedish who gave him the Nobel didn't read him at all, or the translation to Swedish was very good. Because in Portuguese, his writings are a disastre".

 

[Regina]

Does anyone knows if D. Henrique is still "dating" Isabel Nogueira?

 

[Elsa M.]

Here are two interviews with the Ducal couple about their Christmas

On January 4th 2008:
YouTube - Entrevista a SS AA RR D. Duarte e D. Isabel (4/1/2008)

In December 2007:
YouTube - D. Duarte, em entrevista ao programa "Portugal no coração" 1

 

[Marengo]

What are they saying Elsa? Funny that they appear in something that looks like an entertainment show btw. Which channel is this?

 

[Marengo]

Does anyone knows if D. Henrique is still "dating" Isabel Nogueira?

I think I saw them together on a picture this january when I was in portugal, no idea what the text said though. What is the backgroung of Isabel? isn's she a socialite or something?

 

[Marengo]

Good news, the Duke and Duchess of Braganca have recieved their own news & events thread, which can be found here. This thread is now reserved for any other family member of the RF, the brothers of the Duke, the van Udens etc.

 

[Elsa M.]

What are they saying Elsa? Funny that they appear in something that looks like an entertainment show btw. Which channel is this?

It's the public channel and yes... those are the entertainment shows that are broadcasted in the mornings and afternoons.
In the first video, they basically talk about their Christmas. This time, the family spent the Christmas Eve in Rome and attended the mass celebrated by the Pope. They returned to Portugal on the Christmas Day to spend it with the rest of te family. D. Duarte also talks about his wishes for the new year and about the projects he's commited to, in Africa, to help the former colonies to produce biologic agriculture that may be comercialized abroad.
The second video is more "small-talk" and he says basically the same.

_______________________


There's a new book aout the wedding of D. Duarte Nuno and D.ª Maria Francisca (D. Duarte Pio's parents) coming to the stores:
GeneAll.net - O Roubo do Príncipe<br>- Salazar e o casamento do Duque de Bragança

João AMARAL, O Roubo do Príncipe: Salazar e o casamento do Duque de Bragança


The author recovers some important historical data to support the idea that, the marriage of the late Duke of Bragança, D. Duarte Nuno, with the Brazilian Princess (thus uniting the two branches of the House of Bragança that were opposed since D. Pedro and D. Miguel) was supported by Fascist regime of Salazar, since the marriage would promote the country's relatios with Brazil.
This book was presented by Prof. Marcelo Rebelo de Sousa, on February 11th, in Lisboa.

 

[Regina]

I think I saw them together on a picture this january when I was in portugal, no idea what the text said though. What is the backgroung of Isabel? isn's she a socialite or something?

I don't know much about Isabel Nogueira. Th first time I knew about her was because she was going out with D. Duarte's brother. I think she is elegant and has a good style, I would like to know a bit more about her personality.

It's the public channel and yes... those are the entertainment shows that are broadcasted in the mornings and afternoons.
In the first video, they basically talk about their Christmas. This time, the family spent the Christmas Eve in Rome and attended the mass celebrated by the Pope. They returned to Portugal on the Christmas Day to spend it with the rest of te family. D. Duarte also talks about his wishes for the new year and about the projects he's commited to, in Africa, to help the former colonies to produce biologic agriculture that may be comercialized abroad.
The second video is more "small-talk" and he says basically the same.

It was so funny to hear them talking on the first video, and at same time to read those messages that people send via sms, like "Anabela, send me news!" and another one "You are the love of my life! I love you very much and forever!"
I think the Dukes sould choose another kind of tv shows to give their interviews. Something like a press conference in their home.

I believe very soon we will hear D. Duarte again. Since East-Timor is in crisis again, I am sure he can't wait to come to the press to tell about his favorite subject.

There's a new book aout the wedding of D. Duarte Nuno and D.ª Maria Francisca (D. Duarte Pio's parents) coming to the stores:
GeneAll.net - O Roubo do Príncipe<br>- Salazar e o casamento do Duque de Bragança

João AMARAL, O Roubo do Príncipe: Salazar e o casamento do Duque de Bragança


The author recovers some important historical data to support the idea that, the marriage of the late Duke of Bragança, D. Duarte Nuno, with the Brazilian Princess (thus uniting the two branches of the House of Bragança that were opposed since D. Pedro and D. Miguel) was supported by Fascist regime of Salazar, since the marriage would promote the country's relatios with Brazil.
This book was presented by Prof. Marcelo Rebelo de Sousa, on February 11th, in Lisboa.

Interesting. thank you, Elsa.
The Fascist Regime supported the marriage, and the Couple supported the Regime. Salazar had several meeting with D. Duarte but he never wanted to restaure the Monarchy (although he said once that he was not a Republican).

 

[Regina]

Isabel Nogueira, attending a Fashion Show.

(scanned by me, Caras magazine)

 

[Elsa M.]

Not of particular interest, but I was reading this article, where it's stated that D. Duarte and Infante D. Miguel are passionate readers of comics... I thought it was nice to post this information.

Diario do Alentejo - online

 

[Marengo]

Hmz, Portuguese comics? I can relate to them anyway as I am a huge fan of Corto Maltese and to a lesser extend Tintin and Asterix & Obelix.

 

[Elsa M.]

Hmz, Portuguese comics?

Last year or so, there was a TV show about Portuguese comics... there were focoused some authors (Filipe Abranches, Isabel Carvalho, Diniz Conefrey, José Carlos Fernandes, António Jorge Gonçalves, Luís Henriques, André Lemos, Susa Monteiro, Pedro Nora, Miguel Rocha, David Soares, etc.)... Anyway, comics are not widely celebrated here, l'm affraid...

 

[Elsa M.]

Tomorrow evening, the most important talk show of the public channel, "Prós e Contras", is airing an unusual debate about "Republic vs. Monarchy".

It's gathering the president of the Royal Cause and other prominant monarchist:
http://www.rtp.pt/wportal/sites/tv/pec/index.shtm

 

[Regina]

Tomorrow evening, the most important talk show of the public channel, "Prós e Contras", is airing an unusual debate about "Republic vs. Monarchy".

It's gathering the president of the Royal Cause and other prominant monarchist:
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Yes Elsa, I'll watch Prós and Contras no matter what hehe!!
The presentor, Fátima Campos Ferreira, is great (she allows everyone talk and express their ideas, she is never rude to anyone and she is always very well prepared).

I don't know if you watch these debates every week, Elsa, but the participants get so nervous after the first 15 minutes! I guess tomorrow it will be a hot debate between the two sides, I can't wait for it

 

[Marengo]

It would be interesting to see what advantages the monarchistic sociuety see in a restoration of the Portuguese moanrchy IMO (the contra's are rather obvious). How large is the moarchic association btw? I saw this:

In Lisbon at a square (forgot the name), is this the headquaters?

 

[Elsa M.]

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]

In Lisbon at a square (forgot the name), is this the headquaters?

That is the royal association of Lisbon (at Praça Luís de Camões)... each district has one, I believe.[/FONT]

All the royal associations are congregated in a national entity called "Causa Real" (Royal Cause), which has about 10.000 members... not much.

 

[Elsa M.]

I guess tomorrow it will be a hot debate between the two sides, I can't wait for it

It was very interesting to hear what both sides had to say... and for the first time in 100 years, we could discuss things as grown ups.

For those who understand Portuguese, here are the video links (see 2008.03.10... it's divided in 3 parts):

PRÓS E CONTRAS - Vídeos Multimédia RTP

 

[Miguel M. Costa]

About the debate, you can get 'ontopic' at www.monarquicos.com :: Exibir tópico - Pros e Contras

Google translation of this pages at Translated version of http://monarquicos.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=312&start=20 (quite acceptable)

---

How large is the moarchic association btw?

I can't provide you real numbers on that. But i can tell you that currently the most visible and active of all the royal associations on the internet and afaik on the field is the Real Associação da Madeira (http://www.realmadeira.com) , The Real Associação de Lisboa, commonly known as RAL : (Real Associação de Lisboa) (really beautiful building - the one from the picture) isn't providing any visible actions... currently. Last month by the occasion of the Centennarium of the Regicide, some actions did took place and some more will occur over this year under the "Dom Carlos 100 Anos" commision (D. Carlos 100 anos) , part of the "D. Manuel II Foundation" (FUNDAÇÃO D.MANUEL II).
The attendance on such celebrations isn't that huge as it may seem or as some may expected. About 100-500 people were reffered to be present on such cerimonies, wich - imho - provides some info on the real number of associates.

---

My first post here. Found the royal foruns while browsing for some Portuguese related forums. I'll start posting here some updates on Portuguese Monarchy issues for those who might be interested.
Hope to find some new info here also.

 

[Regina]

My first post here. Found the royal foruns while browsing for some Portuguese related forums. I'll start posting here some updates on Portuguese Monarchy issues for those who might be interested.
Hope to find some new info here also.

Bem-vindo (Welcome) to TRF, Miguel!!

 

[Marengo]

Welcome to TRF, Miguel, I hope you will enjoy your time here though i have to say that the Portuguese royals just got their own forum so this forum is still developing (with great help of Elsa and Regina). Updates on the Portuguese royals are very appreciated esp. as little of those make it to English-language sites.

Ah, so the picture I made was of the Lisbon association! The building is beautiful indeed, though I have to say most of the center of Lisbon is very beautiful.

A pity that only a small number of people turn up/ are a member, from what I noticed during my short stay in Portugal it seemed that the Portuguese are more royalist than most monarchies. No Dutch child would be able to name any Dutch monarch apart from Beatrix and Juliana for example.

 

[Miguel M. Costa]

Thank you both for your reception.
You'll also be warmly welcomed @ monarquicos.com - an 100% independent/free small portuguese monarchic site/forum where I'm currently one of the admins (portuguese only).

Noticed the PT flag on the smilies list
... can you change/add the monarchic one?

---

First I have to say that the general-popular feeling about Royalty in Portugal isn't quite a good one, people here tend to look at royalists as a sort of underground elite/jet7 (subjugated by the republican government and presidential representatives). Partialy that is true, as you may learn from many sites when people ask: Recently, what good have the royalists done to Portugal/Monarchy?
The answer stills unresolved. Even by those closely related to the royalists.

Though great contrast does exists between the terms Royalty and Monarchy in Portugal. Part of the population still reffers to Monarchy with great hope on this form of non-political representation of the state - and do not relate it directly with the Royality too often... quite strange. On some discussions, when there's the smaller connotation of Monarchy with Royalty/Nobility it tends to get... even stranger = bad.
There's also a great part of dictatorial-born elderly ones for whom the "ghost" of monarchy is the mother of all evils, greatly affected by the missing of real/royal national values and from what was teached in schools under the 40+ years of dictatorial regime. Unfortunately portuguese schools today still instructs some wrong info on what was and is the monarchic regime and the royality itself. Too many misconceptions and an huge amount of 'small innocent' mistakes written by the Republican regime on history books are still beeing teached and passed over generations of well-formed students these days.
Results are those of that by the ocasion of the Centennarium of the Regicide (the killing of the head of state) recently a town called Castro Verde - by the will of its elected Mayor, honoured the King D. Carlos assassins as patriotic heroes (at least hometown heroes). That is to say Liberté, Egalité, Fraternité, using mayor's words.

I can't provide much info about Royalty - the actual one. I'm not realy used to read pink mags nor tabloids where the Royalists can usually be found here in Portugal - that is where we can get lots of unuseful quotes from. Though I do respect the ones who read and do have genuine and personal interests about that.
I will try to bring some updates on Portuguese Monarchy related issues.

It would be interesting to see what advantages the monarchistic sociuety see in a restoration of the Portuguese moanrchy IMO (the contra's are rather obvious).

Currently we have:

- Semi-presidential state that often confuses the public oppinion about "who's the boss?" - leads to instability.
- Bad income. No expectations over outcome. - generates insecure people and fragile social order.
- Lack of interest/investment over social care, education, values, identity and national pride may lead over time to the revolution/change of at least the organisation/representation of the state.

- And really great wheater, vacation resorts, beaches, water and sun! Great food and liquors

Talk to you later about all that...
Cheers.

P.S. pardon my poor english... is that i've been enough time in France to have ruined it completely.

 

[Regina]

Noticed the PT flag on the smilies list
... can you change/add the monarchic one?

At least we have this one

First I have to say that the general-popular feeling about Royalty in Portugal isn't quite a good one, people here tend to look at royalists as a sort of underground elite/jet7 (subjugated by the republican government and presidential representatives). Partialy that is true, as you may learn from many sites when people ask: Recently, what good have the royalists done to Portugal/Monarchy?
The answer stills unresolved. Even by those closely related to the royalists.

Though great contrast does exists between the terms Royalty and Monarchy in Portugal. Part of the population still reffers to Monarchy with great hope on this form of non-political representation of the state - and do not relate it directly with the Royality too often... quite strange. On some discussions, when there's the smaller connotation of Monarchy with Royalty/Nobility it tends to get... even stranger = bad.
There's also a great part of dictatorial-born elderly ones for whom the "ghost" of monarchy is the mother of all evils, greatly affected by the missing of real/royal national values and from what was teached in schools under the 40+ years of dictatorial regime. Unfortunately portuguese schools today still instructs some wrong info on what was and is the monarchic regime and the royality itself. Too many misconceptions and an huge amount of 'small innocent' mistakes written by the Republican regime on history books are still beeing teached and passed over generations of well-formed students these days.
Results are those of that by the ocasion of the Centennarium of the Regicide (the killing of the head of state) recently a town called Castro Verde - by the will of its elected Mayor, honoured the King D. Carlos assassins as patriotic heroes (at least hometown heroes). That is to say Liberté, Egalité, Fraternité, using mayor's words.

I can't provide much info about Royalty - the actual one. I'm not realy used to read pink mags nor tabloids where the Royalists can usually be found here in Portugal - that is where we can get lots of unuseful quotes from. Though I do respect the ones who read and do have genuine and personal interests about that.
I will try to bring some updates on Portuguese Monarchy related issues.

Well, in my opinion, the problem with the Monarchy in Portugal is that the few royalists are not united. They are in minority (maybe 5 to 10% of the population) and they don't even agree about who is the right Pretender to the Throne. I think we could all start to seat and talk about this, because this is the real problem. Who is our 'King'?
Even the President of Partido Monárquico (Monarchist Party), Nuno da Câmara Pereira, is against D. Duarte!... With this strong division between royalists, we won't achieve anything, imo.

The Portuguese people love royalty from abroad, especially the Spanish Royal Family. Mathilde of Belgium is very known here too. And we love to watch royal weddings. Apart from this, I think most people in Portugal don't spend a minute thinking about Monarchy: Yes or No?

 

[Menarue]

I agree absolutely with what D.Duarte said. If you don´t I suggest you read the most boring book, in my opinion, ever written, Memorial do Convento by José Saramago. It might have been slightly more readable if he had put even one comma or any punctuation mark at all.
D. Duarte knows what he is talking about.
There have been many really deserving Nobel Prize winning writers, how could anyone compare Saramago to Winston Churchill or Pearl Buck just to name two.
Menarue