Portuguese Nobility

[Danny SR]

Yes it does seem they do like younger ladies, but i must say D. Duarte and D. Isable make a much nicer couple....lol At lest you cant notice the gap that much. I dont read much italian but from what I did get its just the same old talk of how he is so badly treated since he is the true hair to the throne, his whining is getting quite old....lol at lest the other pretenders to the throne have a much better case in their favore then he does in his....

[Elsa M.]

A few nobles (attending last week's gala):

Baron of Horta e Costa and Diana Polignac de Barros
Baron Miguel António Igrejas Horta e Costa (*1948) accompanied by the widow of the Italian Count of Nigra, D.ª Diana Isabel de Polignac Mascarenhas de Barros (*1954).

Count and Countess of Albuquerque
D. Augusto Duarte de Andrade Albuquerque Bettencourt de Ataíde (*1965) is the 4th Count of Albuquerque. He's married to the 8th Countess of Azambuja, D.ª Maria Joana Aouad de Mendoça de Siqueira (*1966).

Count and Countess of Calheiros with their son, Francisco
Francisco da Silva de Calheiros e Menezes (*1950) is the 3th Count of Calheiros. He's married to Maria do Rosário Duarte de Sousa Coutinho (*1954).

D. Sebastião de Herédia and his wife, Luísa Albuquerque Bettencourt de Athayde
D. Sebastião Augusto de Castro Curvello de Herédia (*1964) is the eldest brother of the Duchess of Bragança. He's married to Luísa Ana de Andrade Albuquerque Bettencourt de Athayde (*1971).

D. Afonso de Herédia
D. Afonso Miguel de Herédia (*1977) is the youngest brother of the Duchess of Bragança.

[Regina]

Originally Posted by Elsa M.

A few nobles (attending last week's gala):

Baron of Horta e Costa and Diana Polignac de Barros
Baron Miguel António Igrejas Horta e Costa (*1948) accompanied by the widow of the Italian Count of Nigra, D.ª Diana Isabel de Polignac Mascarenhas de Barros (*1954).

Since when Miguel Horta e Costa is a Baron? Elsa, do you know when this title was given to him, or is it a family title? I had no idea he was a Noble...

D. Afonso de Herédia
D. Afonso Miguel de Herédia (*1977) is the youngest brother of the Duchess of Bragança.

Who's the lady close to Afonso?
I always find this brother of Dª Isabel a very joyful person. At least, he is always smiling and relaxed. I can't feel the same about D. Sebastião who seems much more reserved than his younger brother. Dª Isabel has another brother, Manuel. Does anyone has a picture of him?

[Elsa M.]

Originally Posted by Regina

Since when Miguel Horta e Costa is a Baron? Elsa, do you know when this title was given to him, or is it a family title? I had no idea he was a Noble...

The correct title is Baron of Santa Comba Dão. It runs in the family since 1825.
Here's an article (in English) about his profile:
British-Portuguese Chamber of Commerce

Originally Posted by Regina

Who's the lady close to Afonso?

The photo caption says she's Christiane Neuvy... have no idea who the lady is.

Originally Posted by Regina

Dª Isabel has another brother, Manuel. Does anyone has a picture of him?

Only these old ones, from the wedding in 1995:
ImageShack - Hosting :: 187iq.jpg
http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums...5&d=1111775562

[Regina]

Originally Posted by Elsa M.

The correct title is Baron of Santa Comba Dão. It runs in the family since 1825.
Here's an article (in English) about his profile:
British-Portuguese Chamber of Commerce

Well, here at TRF we are always learning. Who would tell that Santa Comba has a Baron? I was quite surprised. Thanks Elsa, for the reply.

Only these old ones, from the wedding in 1995:
ImageShack - Hosting :: 187iq.jpg
http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums...5&d=1111775562

Manuel is quite different from the other brothers. I find a lot of physical similarities between Isabel and Afonso. Manuel reminds me the actor Sean Penn.

[Menarue]

There is a saying in Portugal that "one cannot sell one´s coat of arms" (brasão) and in this case I think we should say that one cannot sell a throne, especially if the seller has no legitimate right to that throne, a throne which incidentally doesn´t exist and hasn´t since the beginning of the republic.

[Regina]

Rosario doesn't care for Portugal, why would he? He cares for himself and his interests. The only thing he is interested are the benefits he would get if the Government recognized him as the Head of the House of Braganza... something that won't happen for obvious reasons.

But I don't take him too seriously since he doesnt have a change to reach anything. I still think he seems to be a smart man and he does have a nice figure, IMO.

We can never be sure if he paid an allowance to Maria Pia. Maybe the old lady really liked him and decided to adopt him as her son... It's kinda weird but it's possible. But IMO it doesn't matter if she had maternal feelings for him or not... Poidimani has no chances. He is only the adopted son of D. Carlos' illegitimated daughter.

[Elsa M.]

D.ª Isabel's sister, Teresa Herédia, is the nutricionist of the new clinic M6, in Lisbon:

http://img192.imagevenue.com/img.php...122_1025lo.jpg
(From Caras)

[Elsa M.]

To celebrate the canonization of D. nuno Álvares Pereira, the Count of Ataíde, D. Augusto de Albuquerque Athayde, hosted a dinner in the Circolo Caccia (a roman private club for nobles). Among the 50 guests assembled on Saturday night, there were nearly 50 Portuguese knights, as well as the Grand Master of the Order of Malta, Prince Charles-Phillippe d'Orléans.

Please find the article here:
http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f201/royal-family-of-portugal-3-december-2007-a-15170-5.html#post926341

[Alberto2244]

O drama dos Távoras - dn - DN

[MAfan]

Originally Posted by Alberto2244

O drama dos Távoras - dn - DN

What does this article say?

[Alberto2244]

I will let Elsa M. do a summary....her English is better than mine!

[Elsa M.]

Originally Posted by Alberto2244

I will let Elsa M. do a summary....her English is better than mine!

Ah, you shouldn't my English is far from being reasonable, but let's see...

The article talks about one of the eldest families in the Kingdom: the Távoras, which, according to genealogists, descend from D. Afonso Henriques, or even from Ramiro II (son of the king of Léon). During the 18th century, this family achieved both the peak and the most violent collapse of their ascendance. Powerful and arrogant, the Távoras were hated and envied, even by the King and his Minister, the Marquis of Pombal. So, on January 13th 1759, the most powerful family in the country was summarily executed, for attempting against King José I.

After the macabre executions, the grandchildren of the Marquises of Távora were recovered by King D. João VI, and today there are hundreds of Távoras in Portugal, even though the power was never recovered.

[amedea]

does someone can give some info on the Horta e Costa family? they are related to the Calvi di Bergolo (does Vittorio Calvi di Bergolo live in Portugal?)

[Elsa M.]

Originally Posted by amedea

does someone can give some info on the Horta e Costa family? they are related to the Calvi di Bergolo (does Vittorio Calvi di Bergolo live in Portugal?)

The family Horta e Costa helds the title of Barons of Santa Comba Dão since 1825:
GeneAll.net - Barões de Santa Comba Dão


Vittorio Calvi di Bergolo Rocca Saporiti is married to Ana Rita Leite de Faria Horta e Costa (who descends from the 2nd Baron of Santa Comba Dão) and they live in the outskirts of Lisbon, where their son Rodrigo was born.

[JSP]

Marina Arnoso's father was the late Baron de Beck.

They have a great house in Cascais so no surprise of her tan.

Her husband´s family has a large tradition on sailing and indeed it K.Juan Carlos used to sail with them when he lived in Estoril.
Jorge Arnoso is linked to the very posh Cascais Sailing Club.

One of her Arnoso brothers-in-law Maná Arnoso sailed with the Count of Barcelona when he made his around the world (or just to America ?) voyage.

Baron de Beck was not a sailor but a hunter.
He ran horse-carriage (the way the Duke of Edinburgh) and hunted foxes at Benavente at Equipagem de Santo Humberto.

[Regina]

For a picture of the king Juan Carlos with Jorge Arnoso please see my post

Marina's father was Friedrich Berthold, the late baron de Beck, as JSP said.
Marina's real name is Marina Beck d'Orey Pinheiro de Melo. Her husband, Jorge Pinheiro de Melo is the Count of Arnoso.

Marina's father had 3 children: Martin, Marina, Christopher.

JSP, do you know why all his children have the title of "baron of Beck" (in the case of Marina, she has the title of baroness of beck)? It seems they share the same title... See this...

[JSP]

Hi Regina

I've seen that page before and I was puzzled with the way that Marina was styled .
As you know, women are banned from succeeding titles in Germany/Austria, under the Salic Law, so I am not sure why Genea credits her such style.

Jorge Pinheiro de Melo is NOT the current Count of Arnoso, AFAIK .

See the descendance of the 1st Count:

GeneAll.net - Bernardo Pinheiro Correia de Melo, 1º conde de Arnoso

I guess the title will pass to a younger branch of the Lafões House.

The last Countess was D.Maria José Pinheiro de Melo who died unmarried in 2002.
Her sister D.Mariana (if she is still alive) was married to D.Telmo de Bragança (Lafões), and they had two sons.

Marina de Beck's husband is the 2nd son of the 2nd son of the 2nd marriage of the 1st Count, so very far away from the Comital title.

Marina's brother Christopher de Beck is involved in the BCP scandal.
He was one of the members of the Jardim Gonçalves board.

José

[Regina]

Hi,

Thank you very much, José for your last post! Very interesting as I expected

I really enjoy searching all these portuguese families geneology because in that search you always find someone you know. Then you can relate one family with another and at the end... this is indeed a small world lol

Anyway, maybe we can continue this conversation in the Portuguese nobility thread

[JSP]

As to Marina and her brothers being styled as barons, I did some research mainly at Genea Forum and at the European Royal MB and the answer I got is that every child of a baron is entitled to the baron title.

I suppose Marina might have lost hers when she married her husband and became Mrs Jorge Pinheiro de Melo, although she is better known as Marina Arnoso, the family title's name.