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  #321  
Old 08-17-2010, 06:23 AM
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jonc93, thanks for the link to the picture. Yes, this is the brooch to which I am referring. If not for the rounded elements on each side, it would be a more defined rectangular shape.

Boris, I remembered about the pink tourmaline parure and before my first post had compared the picture of Queen Sofia with every other pic I have of her and any pictures of jewelry associated with her. The corsage brooch worn by estelle in the pic you posted can't be the same one on Sofia. The central stone on Estelle's brooch is MUCH larger than the one on Sofia and doesn't have the "fullness" of diamonds on the top and bottom. What may look similar is the trio of drops on Estelle's brooch and the three stones under the brooch on Sofia. But if you look closely at Sofia's picture, there is a single pendant from what appears to be a necklace of matched stones that extend to her shoulder area. The poufy sleeves and fur cover the "sides" of the necklace but you can see parts of the stones ascending up her chest area.

Based on jonc93's post, I am even more convinced that the large brooch at Sofia's neck is the one from the emerald demi-parure. It has the same outline and the same shape of central stone. In addition, the central stone is in the same proportion to the surrounding diamond stones. If I am correct, this would be the oldest photograph of the emeralds being worn in the Bernadotte line (unless there is one of which I am unaware).

Thanks for the responses and help. LOL...as usual, more questions/speculation to follow.

Rascal
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  #322  
Old 08-17-2010, 06:50 AM
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Hmmm, I didn't notice that the 'three drops' underneath the brooch worn by Queen Sophia indeed appear to be part of (mostly hidden) necklace.
It does not look like the necklace from the Bernadotte emerald set though (the stones are set in much narrower clusters of diamonds, and I believe there are pendants attached)), but more like the original setting of the emerald necklace which is part of the emerald parure that is now with the Norwegian Royal Family... intriguing.

Btw., regarding the wikipedia site, as great as it is that someone (who...? Might s/he be around here?) put together a lot of correct information, there are quite a lot of unnecessary mistakes too... especially treating 'Svensk Damtidning's' blogger Lotta as a reliable source is not a good idea.
(Her blog, both its fashion and jewelry info, is almost entirely copied from internet MBs, heavily also from The Royal Forums, including every misinformation included by posters. She hardly ever writes or knows anything herself and is no original source.)
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  #323  
Old 08-17-2010, 07:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boris View Post
It does not look like the necklace from the Bernadotte emerald set though (the stones are set in much narrower clusters of diamonds, and I believe there are pendants attached)), but more like the original setting of the emerald necklace which is part of the emerald parure that is now with the Norwegian Royal Family... intriguing.
I agree, the necklace cannot be the one that is in the current emerald demi-parure, stones and settings are too small, as well as there being no pendant. And I didn't consider it before but I believe you are correct in that the necklace Sofia is wearing is part of the emerald parure which is now in Norway. I looked at pictures of Sonja from the Swedish wedding and compared to this one. The stones are equal is size, setting, and number (as much as we can see) and the pendant is identical to the one from the necklace worn by Sonja. In addition, as this parure did not arrive in Norway until the birth of Crown Prince Olav, the timeline would be correct for Sofia to still have and wear them. As this is an emerald necklace, it increases even more my belief that the brooch is the "belt buckle" from the Swedish emerald demi-parure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boris View Post
Btw., regarding the wikipedia site, as great as it is that someone (who...? Might s/he be around here?) put together a lot of correct information, there are quite a lot of unnecessary mistakes too... especially treating 'Svensk Damtidning's' blogger Lotta as a reliable source is not a good idea.
(Her blog, both its fashion and jewelry info, is almost entirely copied from internet MBs, heavily also from The Royal Forums, including every misinformation included by posters. She hardly ever writes or knows anything herself and is no original source.)
LOL, Boris. I agree about the misinformation that wikipedia can provide. Although most of the information seemed correct or close to it, there was some that I question. But I have also learned in my hunt that ALL information is to be questioned, scrutinized and believed at one's own risk. This emerald brooch, for instance. I am now completely convinced that I am correct. And even if I have 100 of the most learned scholars on Swedish royal jewelry in a room and said this, maybe not half, but more than a couple would argue that I am wrong. One thing I do know...I consider the discussion in this forum, while not always accurate, to be more revealing of the truth than what is posted by the royal bloggers for the tabloids.
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  #324  
Old 08-17-2010, 05:47 PM
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Who has worn what? - Updated list 08-17-2010

Now that the Swedish wedding has come and gone...and with the discussions of late about the Swedish Royal Jewelry (I'll still be posting other questions), information about who has worn what items in the Swedish collection has changed and needs an update. I've tried to limit it to people with supporting photographic or portrait evidence of the pieces in question as some painters in the 18th and early 19th centuries used artistic license and some of the depictions are questionable. Here is what I can come up with - feel free to add or correct as needed:

Crown Princess Victoria's 18th Birthday Tiara:
Worn only (thank goodness!) by CP Victoria

Princess Birgitta's Diamond Bracelet Tiara (search her on Corbis):
Birgitta, Desiree, Christina

Baden Fringe or Sun-ray Tiara:
Q Victoria, Louise, Christina, Desiree, Margaretha, Lilian, Silvia, CP Victoria

Diamond Buttons later used for Tiaras:
Queen Sophia Dorothea of Prussia, her daughter Queen Lovisa Ulrika of Sweden, Lovisa's daughter-in-law Queen Hedwig Elisabeth Charlotte, King Oscar II of Sweden (King Karl XIV Johan aka Jean-Baptiste Bernadotte left out as no portrait exists of him wearing the buttons either on uniform or on crown)

4-Button Tiara:
Margaretha, Birgitta, Desiree, Christina, Lilian, CP Victoria, Madeleine

6-Button Tiara:
Lilian, Silvia, CP Victoria, Madeleine, Christina, Birgitta

Queen Victoria's Processional Necklace of Ceylon Sapphires, Pearls, & Diamonds:
Louise, Silvia, Lilian, Desiree, Christina, CP Victoria, Madeleine

The Vasa Diamond Earrings:
Louise, Sibylla, Silvia, Lilian, CP Victoria, Madeleine

The Bernadotte Emerald Demi-parure:
Sofia, Sibylla, Silvia, Lilian

Cut-Steel Tiara:
Silvia, Lilian, Christina, CP Victoria

Queen Josefina's Amethyst Demi-parure:
Louise, Margaretha, Christina, Silvia (w tiara), Desiree (w tiara), CP Victoria (w tiara), Margaretha (w tiara)

Queen Josefina's Diamond Stomacher-Necklace:
Josefina, Lovisa, Sofia, Q Victoria, Louise, Silvia, Lilian

CP Margaret's Aquamarine Tiara:
Margaret, Sibylla, Margaretha, Sibylla Ambler

Russian Pink Topaz Demi-parure:
Louise, Sibylla, Silvia, Desiree, Christina

The Bernadotte Rose Brooch:
Silvia, CP Victoria, Madeleine

Empress Josephine's Cameo Parure:
Queen Hortense, Queen Josefina, Sibylla, Ingrid, Birgitta, Desiree (one time in addition to her wedding - see if you can find it ), Silvia, CP Victoria

Queen Josefina's Pearl, Ruby, & Diamond Spray Brooch:
Josefina, Silvia, CP Victoria

Leuchtenberg Parure:
Josefina, Q Victoria, Louise, Sibylla, Birgitta, Silvia

Queen Sofia's Tiara or the 9-Prong Tiara:
Sofia, Louise, Margaretha, Silvia, Lilian, Birgitta

The Braganca Diamond Tiara or the Brazilian Tiara:
Sofia, Q Victoria, Louise (also as Crown Princess), Silvia

Princess Sibylla's Tiara or the Connaught Forget-me-not Tiara:
CP Margaret, Sibylla, Christina, Silvia, Desiree, Lilian, Madeleine, CP Victoria (pendants as necklace only)

Edward VII Ruby Tiara:
Sonja Robbert (2nd wife of Sigvard), Marianne (last wife of Sigvard), Silvia

Queen Silvia's Diamond Fringe Necklace-Tiara:
Silvia, Madeleine, CP Victoria (as a necklace only)

Queen Sofia's Diamond & Pearl Fringe Tiara (now owned by Christina):
Christina

Queen Louise's Diamond Tiara (now owned by Desiree):
Louise, Margaretha, Birgitta, Desiree, Christina

Princess Birgitta's Diamond & Pearl Circle Tiara (now owned by Desiree of Hohenzollern)
Birgitta, Desiree of Hohenzollern, Ute of Hohenzollern

Crown Princess Margaret's Laurel Wreath Tiara:
CP Margaret, Lilian

Crown Princess Margaret's Scarab Necklace:
CP Margaret, Lilian

Queen Louise's Aquamarine Bandeau (now owned by Madeleine)
Desiree, Christina, Madeleine

Don't know if these have a name, so I am giving them a name and, for clarity describing the event as needed:

Mainau Cuff-Link Fringe Tiara:
Countess Sonja Bernadotte, Countess Bettina Bernadotte, Countess Sandra Bernadotte (worn for her wedding)

Mainau Diamond & Gemstone Swag-Fringe Tiara:
Countess Karin Bernadotte, Countess Bettina Bernadotte (worn for CP Victoria's wedding - it looks to be set with amethyst, citrine, and sapphire stones at the top of the spikes)

Countess Sandra Bernadotte's Bracelet-Tiara:
Countess Sandra Bernadotte (worn for her wedding reception and for CP Victoria's wedding)

*Countess Marianne Bernadotte's tiaras (at least two - one pearl and one diamond and yellow gold) are not included with this list because most reports are that they were brought into the marriage to Sigvard by her.

**Countess Madeleine Bernadotte's tiara worn for CP Victoria's wedding is not included in this list. It has been referred to as the von Rosen tiara, a possession of the family of Prince Carl's first wife, Elsa von Rosen, and borrowed by Madeleine for this event.

***There are some items missing from the list (The Bernadotte Diamond Earrings, some of the diamond brooches, bracelets, etc) because I am still researching them and/or they don't have a "name". Please feel free to add or if you have information you would like to share about these or any other pieces, I will be asking questions about specific pieces when I can.

For now, hope this list helps any others. Have a great day, happy hunting, and I hope we can all discover a great deal together.

Rascal
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  #325  
Old 08-27-2010, 12:40 PM
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I found an old edition of "Frau mit Herz" from 1983. They had a special suppliment called "Königin Silvia" and in there they wrote about "Silvia im Glanz wunderschöner Kronen und Diademe". Nice pictures and under the picture of her wearing the Braganza tiara they wrote: "Das Krönungsdiadem weight ein Kilo und ist 12 cm hoch".
Ergo: 1 kilo

And by the way: Whats the english name of these earrings?http://lotta.svenskdam.se/files/2010...9N%C3%A4ra.jpg
(picture from Nobel 1979) In Swedish they are just called "the large brilliant earrings" if Im correct?
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  #326  
Old 08-27-2010, 03:46 PM
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The Vasa Diamond Earrings:
Louise, Sibylla, Silvia, Lilian, CP Victoria, Madeleine

--->it's the same as my image ?
http://a.imageshack.us/img155/8251/earringssweden.jpg

thanks in advance for your reply !
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  #327  
Old 08-27-2010, 04:42 PM
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Hi, Lady H. The earrings in the image you attached have been referred to on some sites as The Bernadotte Diamond Earrings. In the post just above yours, Soli Deo Gloria has attached an image from the 1978 Nobel ceremonies with Queen Silvia wearing these earrings. She refers to them correctly in the same manner in which they are identified on the Swedish Wikipedia website as the "large brilliant earrings", which sounds more like a description but is how they have posted in the description of the Swedish jewels.

I am not sure if these actually have a "name", which may be why the Wikipedia refers to them with a descriptive label. If they had come to Sweden with the French Marshal Bernadotte, it would stand to reason that they would be called the Bernadotte earrings, but they are not depicted on any Swedish royal lady until Queen Lovisa of Sweden, the daughter-in-law of Bernadotte's son, the later Oscar I, and his wife, Josephine.

The Vasa Earrings are longer and have a teardrop shape. They are the ones worn by Madeleine for the gala concert the night before Victoria and Daniel's wedding.

Hope this answers your question!

Rascal
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  #328  
Old 08-28-2010, 10:27 AM
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Rascal: Thank you very much !
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  #329  
Old 08-28-2010, 12:05 PM
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You're very welcome! And may I suggest searching through the postings by Josefine and Boris? They have been a great help to me in this area and I learned a lot.

Have a great day!
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  #330  
Old 08-29-2010, 10:49 AM
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Unfortunately, the link posted by Lady H does not work for me, but I figure that these earrings are the ones being discussed...?

http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/8320/earring2ed6.jpg

This pair of earrings did belong to Queen Désirée indeed, and was made part of the first and original Bernadotte Foundation, established by the first Bernadotte King Karl XIV Johan, aka Jean-Baptiste Bernadotte.
Therefore, it would be quite correct to refer to them as the 'Bernadotte' earrings.
These earrings are the most frequently worn by Queen Silvia for gala events throughout the years.
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  #331  
Old 08-29-2010, 05:36 PM
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Hi, Boris. Thanks for the information. I have looked everywhere for provenance on these and have never seen anything referring to them as belonging to Queen Desideria, only referred to as "The Bernadotte Diamond Earrings". I am curious to the source of your information and does it include other info such as carats, maker, etc.? Thanks again for clarifying the "name" of this pair.

Rascal
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  #332  
Old 08-30-2010, 04:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rascal View Post
I am curious to the source of your information and does it include other info such as carats, maker, etc.? Thanks again for clarifying the "name" of this pair.

Rascal
The source of information about the earrings is the book by Cay Bond and Göran Alm about Queen Silvia's Nobel dresses (written by Bond) and the Bernadotte jewelry (the part written by the longtime Stockholm Palace conservator Alm).
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  #333  
Old 08-30-2010, 05:11 PM
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Thanks for the quick answer, Boris. I was going to ask if it was Goran Alm but couldn't remember his name. I hope to start my "royal jewelry" library soon. I see Munn's book referenced quite a bit, but as my interest is primarily with the Swedish (for now), do you think this is a better book to start with?

Thanks again!
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  #334  
Old 08-30-2010, 05:20 PM
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As wonderful as Munn's book is, the author's focus lies very much on British tiaras, and from the Bernadotte collection, there are only the cameo tiara and the two tiaras with a British connection (The Connaught and the Edward VII ruby tiara) included.
Unfortunately, there is only a Swedish edition of the book by Bond and Alm, the fact that Alm is a historian and not a jewelry expert is a disadvantage which shows, and it doesn't deal with every piece we know.
But it is the only really detailed work about the Bernadotte jewels so far, there are a few rare photos and many great ones of the jewels worn by Queen Silvia at the Nobel Prize throughout the years, and if you're particularly interested in the Bernadotte collection, it's certainly worth buying.
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  #335  
Old 08-30-2010, 10:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Boris View Post
As wonderful as Munn's book is, the author's focus lies very much on British tiaras, and from the Bernadotte collection, there are only the cameo tiara and the two tiaras with a British connection (The Connaught and the Edward VII ruby tiara) included.
Unfortunately, there is only a Swedish edition of the book by Bond and Alm, the fact that Alm is a historian and not a jewelry expert is a disadvantage which shows, and it doesn't deal with every piece we know.
But it is the only really detailed work about the Bernadotte jewels so far, there are a few rare photos and many great ones of the jewels worn by Queen Silvia at the Nobel Prize throughout the years, and if you're particularly interested in the Bernadotte collection, it's certainly worth buying.
Thanks for the review. Even though I don't speak or read Swedish, I think I'll get this one and muddle through on-line translators when needed rather than getting Munn's book. I appreciate your help.
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  #336  
Old 08-31-2010, 04:17 PM
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Oh Rascal, Geoffrey Munn's 'Tiaras - A History of Splendour' may not be comprehensive, but it's the best tiara book going. Fabulous photos, 430 pages, and very entertaining to read. Ever heard of spun glass farmyard settings, or models of coaches and horses as ladies hair decorations? Or this, on the fashion for themed head adornments: "In 1778 there appeared a certain headdress of prodigious height which represented precipitous hills, enamelled fields, silver streams, foaming torrents, symmetrical gardens, and an English Park." Camp and absurd or absurdly camp? With diamonds aglitter, definitely both!

Have a second look at Mr Munn, you won't be disappointed.
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  #337  
Old 08-31-2010, 05:05 PM
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Hi, Warren. Thansk for your inputs as well. I didn't mean to exclude Munn's book, only that my initial purchase will be the one specific to the Swedes, as that is where my greatest interest is.

I definitely will be looking to add Munn's book in the future as I know there is a great deal of information (some of it possibly incorrect but most of it useful) as well as the aspects you described.

Thanks for the suggestion and helping me (and others) become more knowledgeable in our royal discussion.
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  #338  
Old 09-01-2010, 12:53 AM
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Cool

Oh Rascal, don't discount the Munn "bible", I understand your interest in Swedish jewels, but Munn is fabulous and it doesn't contain incorrect information to the extent that some other jewel books have. Please consider it. You won't regret it.
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  #339  
Old 09-01-2010, 05:23 AM
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Please don't get me wrong, everybody: Munn's 'Bible' is an absolutely fabulous must-buy for everyone interested in (royal) jewelry.
But the point here is that someone like Rascal will find virtually nothing about the Bernadotte collection in the book which he doesn't already know.
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  #340  
Old 09-02-2010, 09:02 AM
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At the polar prize silvia wore a modern thinn diamond necklace
Glitter & lavender drottning Silivas melodi! | Lottas kungliga modeblogg

a goldnecklace
http://svenskdam.se/2010/09/drottnin...elson-mandela/
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