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  #1001  
Old 11-19-2018, 04:12 PM
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Originally Posted by eya View Post
I must confess I’m glad that Princess Astrid is wearing her Aosta tiara rather than her mother’s Art Deco. It gives me hope that Queen Paiola will leave it to the main line after all and that Astrid’s previous appearance with the Art Deco was just a loan. Time will tell though.
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  #1002  
Old 11-20-2018, 08:03 AM
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Now we have seen State Visits to the King of the Netherlands, from the German Bundespräsident and from the Président de la Republique, covering the three big Belgian neighbours.

In none of the three State Banquets (elements of) the Spanish Wedding Gift were seen. Also not as a collier, or one of the fleurons as a broche, nothing. Can we conclude it has left the Belgian royal collection?
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  #1003  
Old 11-20-2018, 08:17 AM
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Now we have seen State Visits to the King of the Netherlands, from the German Bundespräsident and from the Président de la Republique, covering the three big Belgian neighbours.

In none of the three State Banquets (elements of) the Spanish Wedding Gift were seen. Also not as a collier, or one of the fleurons as a broche, nothing. Can we conclude it has left the Belgian royal collection?



I don't think we can conclude that yet, but it is looking increasingly likely. One question remains though: if the Belgian royal family no longer owns the Spanish tiara, who owns it now ? Theoretically, it should belong to the "Help Funds of the Queen" if news about Queen Fabiola's will are to be believed. But, as far as I know, Queen Mathilde is the chair of the Help Funds and I doubt that charity organization would sell any of Queen Fabiola's jewels.



Another possibility, of course, is that Fabiola's Spanish family now has it, but I think we would probably know by now if that was indeed the case.



I still hope that Queen Mathilde is saving the tiara for a state visit to or from Spain, but my hopes are fading.


EDIT: A separate question is the fate of the stones that were worn with the tiara, especially the aquamarines from King Baudouin's gift and the Tunisian demi-parure. Are they gone too ? That includes not only the fleuron stones properly, but earrings, necklaces, pendants, etc. that would be of great use to Queen Mathilde. I am not an expert, but I suppose the aquamarines for example could even be reused if the Queen wanted to commission a new small tiara.
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  #1004  
Old 11-20-2018, 08:28 AM
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In 2014 it was announced that all possessions of Queen Fabiola would be left to the foundation Oeuvres de la Reine / Hulpfonds van de Koningin.

In October 2015 Queen Mathilde appeared with the Wolfers tiara in Poland.

In January 2016 we learned from disgruntled members of the Mora family that among her possessions were works of art that the Queen had inherited from Spain, including a Goya and a Tiepolo. A nephew claimed that they could not even get a small momento like a family photograph.

In February 2016 - a month after the nephew complained in the press - in was communicated that the entire inheritance had been transferred to the foundation succesfully.

After that we have had no further updates and we have not seen the Spanish wedding gift tiara either. Neither have we seen any initiatives around Vila Astrida in Motril. Neither have we heard about Goya and Tiepolo paintings being sold of / put on an exhibition. Why would a charity that donates money to Belgian people in need have any use for a tiara, a villa & land in Spain, an apartment on the Rue d'Artois in Paris, a Goya, a Tiepolo etc?

Since it was announced that the inheritance had been transferred we have not heard anything from the Spanish family either... Considering the family is rather large it would not be illogical if they decided to auction of valuable assets if they had received any.

But who knows? Considering the Spanish family remained quiet after the transfer was announced it is tempting to assume that the matter has been settled quietly. Some claim that there is some wiggle room in the statement that she left everything to the Oeuvres de la Reine: it would exclude things that were already transferred to other foundations and thus would legally not belong to the Queen any longer.

If Queen Mathilde will not wear the tiara during a state visit from or to Spain I think we can assume that the tiara will never be worn by her. But perhaps they want to reserve it for the Duchess of Brabant, who will need a tiara in a year. And although the tiara is larger than the Wolfers, the latter will be the more valuable piece due to the quality and size of the diamonds.

We have not seen any other historic Belgian jewelry being re-introduced by Queen Mathilde in recent years. There was always a story floating around that Fabiola owned historic Belgian jewels -such as the emerald brooch of the Empress Carlota- but preferred not to wear them as they were previously worn by the princesse de Rethy. I think we can conclude that these stories were incorrect.
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  #1005  
Old 11-20-2018, 10:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
In 2014 it was announced that all possessions of Queen Fabiola would be left to the foundation Oeuvres de la Reine / Hulpfonds van de Koningin.

In October 2015 Queen Mathilde appeared with the Wolfers tiara in Poland.

In January 2016 we learned from disgruntled members of the Mora family that among her possessions were works of art that the Queen had inherited from Spain, including a Goya and a Tiepolo. A nephew claimed that they could not even get a small momento like a family photograph.

In February 2016 - a month after the nephew complained in the press - in was communicated that the entire inheritance had been transferred to the foundation succesfully.

After that we have had no further updates and we have not seen the Spanish wedding gift tiara either. Neither have we seen any initiatives around Vila Astrida in Motril. Neither have we heard about Goya and Tiepolo paintings being sold of / put on an exhibition. Why would a charity that donates money to Belgian people in need have any use for a tiara, a villa & land in Spain, an apartment on the Rue d'Artois in Paris, a Goya, a Tiepolo etc?

Since it was announced that the inheritance had been transferred we have not heard anything from the Spanish family either... Considering the family is rather large it would not be illogical if they decided to auction of valuable assets if they had received any.

But who knows? Considering the Spanish family remained quiet after the transfer was announced it is tempting to assume that the matter has been settled quietly. Some claim that there is some wiggle room in the statement that she left everything to the Oeuvres de la Reine: it would exclude things that were already transferred to other foundations and thus would legally not belong to the Queen any longer.

If Queen Mathilde will not wear the tiara during a state visit from or to Spain I think we can assume that the tiara will never be worn by her. But perhaps they want to reserve it for the Duchess of Brabant, who will need a tiara in a year. And although the tiara is larger than the Wolfers, the latter will be the more valuable piece due to the quality and size of the diamonds.

We have not seen any other historic Belgian jewelry being re-introduced by Queen Mathilde in recent years. There was always a story floating around that Fabiola owned historic Belgian jewels -such as the emerald brooch of the Empress Carlota- but preferred not to wear them as they were previously worn by the princesse de Rethy. I think we can conclude that these stories were incorrect.

What about Queen Astrid’s emerald necklace, which could be also worn as a convertible tiara ? King Baudouin is rumored to have inherited it , but Queen Fabiola never wore it ( Princess Lilian did wear it, if I am not mistaken).
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  #1006  
Old 11-20-2018, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
I don't think we can conclude that yet, but it is looking increasingly likely. One question remains though: if the Belgian royal family no longer owns the Spanish tiara, who owns it now ? Theoretically, it should belong to the "Help Funds of the Queen" if news about Queen Fabiola's will are to be believed. But, as far as I know, Queen Mathilde is the chair of the Help Funds and I doubt that charity organization would sell any of Queen Fabiola's jewels.



Another possibility, of course, is that Fabiola's Spanish family now has it, but I think we would probably know by now if that was indeed the case.



I still hope that Queen Mathilde is saving the tiara for a state visit to or from Spain, but my hopes are fading.


EDIT: A separate question is the fate of the stones that were worn with the tiara, especially the aquamarines from King Baudouin's gift and the Tunisian demi-parure. Are they gone too ? That includes not only the fleuron stones properly, but earrings, necklaces, pendants, etc. that would be of great use to Queen Mathilde. I am not an expert, but I suppose the aquamarines for example could even be reused if the Queen wanted to commission a new small tiara.
I have to agree with you. Increasingly, it does not appear that Mathilde has access to the Spanish gift tiara
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  #1007  
Old 11-20-2018, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
What about Queen Astrid’s emerald necklace, which could be also worn as a convertible tiara ? King Baudouin is rumored to have inherited it , but Queen Fabiola never wore it ( Princess Lilian did wear it, if I am not mistaken).
Indeed, that is another missing piece, as is the Stockholm tiara with the upright pearl. I always found it incredible that Fabiola did not wear these pieces because Lilian wore them. The same can be said about the Nine provinces tiara, which she did wear. It is far more likely the pieces have been sold. Considering the modest size of the collection I would be very surprised if they have pieces collecting dust in the vault* as happened in the UK.

It will be interesting to see what will happen if all Filip & Mathilde's children & spouses will be involved in state visits. They will need 5 tiaras while there are only 3 of them (4 if Paola gives her tiara to the main line). Hopefully they will acquire something new or perhaps the Belgian association of nobility can make a generous offer, as they did for Mathilde. Another option would be an agreement with a jewelry house, as happened with the princess of Monaco and the princesses of Denmark.

* except the demi-parure that Queen Paola received from president Kabila of the Congo, which rightly never was worn in public and probably never will be.
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  #1008  
Old 11-20-2018, 11:42 AM
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While Fabiola was within her rights to dispose of her jewelry as she did, I can't express how sad it makes me that all these beautiful pieces are lost to the Belgian royal family, and by extension, the Belgian people. If they have been sold, as appears increasingly possible, then they are either hidden away in some wealthy collectors private vaults, or have been broken up for the gemstones to be reset. That seems almost wasteful to me, but then, I find historic jewelry fascinating not just for the value of the materials, but for the history, and the artistry took to create them. It seems like a real loss to history to me.
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  #1009  
Old 11-20-2018, 11:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
What about Queen Astrid’s emerald necklace, which could be also worn as a convertible tiara ? King Baudouin is rumored to have inherited it , but Queen Fabiola never wore it ( Princess Lilian did wear it, if I am not mistaken).

Omce there was a discusion on the Royal Jewels MB about a luxemburgian neckalce from Grand Duchess Josephine-Chalrlotte which as sold or included at the cancelled auction. it was never seen worn by her but it looked like it could be the emerald necklace from her mother with the emerald's removed.. So perhaps this one did not go to Fabiola but to Joséphine-Charlotte insteed. Have also read that it was said that she inhertied most of her mother's emerald jewels.
Yes it was last seen on Princess Lilian.
As for the stockholm diamond and pearl tiara it was only worn a few times on Queen Astrid. Later the pearl was worn by Princess Lilian. Since then nothing of it has been seen.
As for the spanish Wedding gift tiara perhaps the Queen waits for a speciail occasion like a State Visit to or from Spain.
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  #1010  
Old 11-20-2018, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
Indeed, that is another missing piece, as is the Stockholm tiara with the upright pearl. I always found it incredible that Fabiola did not wear these pieces because Lilian wore them. The same can be said about the Nine provinces tiara, which she did wear. It is far more likely the pieces have been sold. Considering the modest size of the collection I would be very surprised if they have pieces collecting dust in the vault* as happened in the UK.

It will be interesting to see what will happen if all Filip & Mathilde's children & spouses will be involved in state visits. They will need 5 tiaras while there are only 3 of them (4 if Paola gives her tiara to the main line). Hopefully they will acquire something new or perhaps the Belgian association of nobility can make a generous offer, as they did for Mathilde. Another option would be an agreement with a jewelry house, as happened with the princess of Monaco and the princesses of Denmark.

* except the demi-parure that Queen Paola received from president Kabila of the Congo, which rightly never was worn in public and probably never will be.



I am pretty sure the Duchess of Brabant will be given a wedding gift tiara as it was the case with her mother. I don't know if Élisabeth will attend state dinners before she gets married, but that is likely considering that people nowadays tend to get married only in their late twenties or early thirties. If Élisabeth requires a tiara before she is married, the natural choice for me would be her grandmother's Deco bandeau and that is why I think it is important that Queen Paola doesn't leave it to Princess Astrid, even if it is not a major tiara.



Princess Eléonore, who is less likely to attend state banquets before she is married, might also get her own wedding tiara considering that Princess Claire for example was given one. Otherwise, assuming Élisabeth gets the Art Deco, she could borrow the Laurel Wreath from her mother whenever required as Mathilde would be probably wearing the Nine Provinces anyway.



On the question of borrowing jewelry, there are rumors that Cartier would be willing to loan Queen Élisabeth's diamond tiara to Queen Mathilde, but I don't know if that is true. Even if it is true, I supect Queen Mathilde would not be interested or wouldn't take the offer. The Belgian queens seem to manage well with three working tiaras only.
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  #1011  
Old 11-20-2018, 12:46 PM
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Apart from the ri-di-cu-lous price paid for Queen Marie-Antoinette's pearl collier, purchasing a diadem is really not that expensive. King Philippe buying a new SUV is more expensive than buying a diadem. The purchases for Princess Claire and Crown Princess Mary were not for shocking prices. The purchase of the tutti frutti necklace and bracelet for (then) Princess Máxima was (in my eyes) not worth the € 51.000 excl. auction fee. For the same money she could have acquired a nice collier or diadem. When the daughters of King Philippe need a diadem, it is really not impossible to buy something reasonable.
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  #1012  
Old 11-20-2018, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno

I am pretty sure the Duchess of Brabant will be given a wedding gift tiara as it was the case with her mother. I don't know if Élisabeth will attend state dinners before she gets married, but that is likely considering that people nowadays tend to get married only in their late twenties or early thirties. If Élisabeth requires a tiara before she is married, the natural choice for me would be her grandmother's Deco bandeau and that is why I think it is important that Queen Paola doesn't leave it to Princess Astrid, even if it is not a major tiara.

Princess Eléonore, who is less likely to attend state banquets before she is married, might also get her own wedding tiara considering that Princess Claire for example was given one. Otherwise, assuming Élisabeth gets the Art Deco, she could borrow the Laurel Wreath from her mother whenever required as Mathilde would be probably wearing the Nine Provinces anyway.
That leaves still the possible wives of princes Gabriel and Emmanuel that may need tiaras. We will see.

Queen Mathilde has borrowed necklaces and earrings from jewelers before, for example at the wedding of the Swedish crown princess. But she has done so discreetly. If Cartier lends her the tiara of Queen Elisabeth I am sure they will want to use that fact to generate publicity, as f.e. Lorenz Bäumer and Van Cleef & Arpels are doing with Pss Charlene's tiara's. Perhaps the Belgian court has some problems with that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno
The Belgian queens seem to manage well with three working tiaras only.
Two good marriages and one bad one depleted the vault up to a point that there is almost nothing left. But it is obviously not a priority for the family. Filip did buy a helicopter a few years ago, Albert bought several yachts. If it was they could have found ways to acquire new pieces, as other royal families have.
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  #1013  
Old 11-21-2018, 05:21 AM
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I agree with you that the quality, clarity, cut of the diamonds in the Wolfers collier / necklace do look superior to that of the Spanish Wedding Gift (without knowing anything at all about the stones).

Wolfers: https://www.hellomagazine.com/imagen...irthday--a.jpg

Spanish Wedding Gift: http://www.noblesseetroyautes.com/wp...fimfo1_400.jpg
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  #1014  
Old 11-21-2018, 07:34 AM
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1.
Stockholm tiara of Princess Astrid. She wore it once and later only the pearl. We never saw irs base again. Princess Lilian wore the pearl as brooch and the last time on her hat for Prince Albert's Wedding. We never saw Queen Astrid's emerald tiara/necklace since Princess Lilian wore them.
2.
Donna Paola received earrings from Princess Lilian for her engagement. She wore them her whole life.
Dona Fabiola received from Princess Lilian a Brooch she wore as fiancee for her Visit to Brussels and never wore it during her Wedding
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  #1015  
Old 11-30-2018, 12:34 AM
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Queen Mathilde's tiara appearances of 2018:

1 2 3 4 5 6
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  #1016  
Old 11-30-2018, 07:06 AM
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Wow, six tiara events in a year! That's quite a good haul, isn't it? And she wore all her three tiaras, including both versions of the nine provinces tiara. Additionally she usually had very good tiara hair.
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  #1017  
Old 03-28-2019, 06:45 PM
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Queen Mathilde wore two pairs of interesting earrings this week during the Belgian state visit to South Korea.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D2sApLxXQAUCDAM.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D2sApPTWoAIWAbL.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D2sCtCUXgAAn3xc.jpg
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  #1018  
Old 03-29-2019, 02:02 AM
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It looks like two modern pairs of earrings. Possibly a loan, which she has done before.

Considering the long aquamarine earrings are rather simular -though not as beautiful- as the aquamarine earrings of the late Queen Fabiola it is not likely that these were inherited by the queen/ crown.

The pink earrings may be pink topaz?
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  #1019  
Old 03-29-2019, 03:27 AM
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It looks like two modern pairs of earrings. Possibly a loan, which she has done before.

Considering the long aquamarine earrings are rather simular -though not as beautiful- as the aquamarine earrings of the late Queen Fabiola it is not likely that these were inherited by the queen/ crown.

The pink earrings may be pink topaz?
Both the pair of earrings will not be very expensive, so she could well have bought them. It is a pity that it does not appear that she ended up wit Queen Fabiola's aquamarines.
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  #1020  
Old 03-29-2019, 08:12 AM
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Queen Mathilde wore two pairs of interesting earrings this week during the Belgian state visit to South Korea.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D2sApLxXQAUCDAM.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D2sApPTWoAIWAbL.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D2sCtCUXgAAn3xc.jpg



Are they new ? I don't think it is a loan as they must be relatively inexpensive.
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