The Grimaldi Ancestors

[MarcosFenn]

The title 'principe' was already in any case used in relation to an Italian title for the Grimaldis since the Middle Ages.

 

[An Ard Ri]

After the demise of her father Antoine I, Louise-Hippolyte returned to Monaco alone.
She took the oath of loyalty and was immediately made Princesse de Monaco without any mention of her husband Jacques.
Louise-Hippolyte decreed that she would reign alone.
All documents were to be in her name only.
​

Louise Hippolyte, Princess of Monaco is so far the only Sovereign Princess of Monaco but sadly her reign was brief : 20th of February 1731 –29th of December 1731.

 

[titiromi]

Does the princely family descend from any King or Queen?

(Even from an illegitimate line?)

 

[Vojthas]

Princess Alexandra is a descendant of Queen Victoria through her father Prince Ernst August V of Hannover.

 

[JR76]

Through Marie Amelie of Baden the Grimaldis are descended from Kings of Sweden, Denmark, Norway, Bohemia,Poland, Hungary, Croatia, Germany, France, Jerusalem, Scotland etc... They're also descended from the Habsburg Emperors and the Latin Emperors of Constantinople.


Sent from my iPhone using The Royals Community mobile app

 

[Ish]

Does the princely family descend from any King or Queen?

(Even from an illegitimate line?)

Every currently reigning European monarch is descended from Johan Willem Friso, Prince of Orange and Landgravine Marie Louise of Hesse-Kassel

The line is:

1. Johan Willem Friso and Landgravine Marie Louise of Hesse-Kassel
2. Princess Amalia of Nassau-Dietz and Frederick, Hereditary Prince of Baden-Durlach
3. Charles Frederick, Grand Duke of Baden and Landgravine Caroline Louise of Hesse-Darmstadt
4. Charles Louis, Hereditary Prince of Baden and Landgravine Amalie of Hesse-Darmstadt
5. Charles, Grand Duke of Baden and Stephanie de Beauharnais
6. Princess Marie Amelie of Baden and William Hamilton, 11th Duke of Hamilton
7. Lady Mary Victoria Douglas-Hamilton and Albert I of Monaco
8. Louis II of Monaco and Ghislaine Dommanget
9. Princess Charlotte, Duchess of Valentinois and Count Pierre de Polgnac
10. Ranier III of Monaco and Grace Kelly

 

[melina premiere]

... previous, I agree and the Grimaldi dynasty is the oldest ruling dynasty of Europa

She is 700 years old

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

That is simpy not true: "the Grimaldi dynasty is the oldest ruling dynasty of Europe".

The Maison de Monaco is one of the oldest ruling dynasties and it comprises of the family Grimaldi (until 1731), the family De Goyon de Matignon (until 1949) and the family De Polignac (until present). Yes, yes, they have adopted the surname Grimaldi but that does not mean it is the same family.

When you are neglecting this and start being "creative" then there are much, much older reigning dynasties. Denmark, for an example. The United Kingdom, for an example. Sweden even, since they can also trace back to older Houses than the Bernadottes only...

Does the princely family descend from any King or Queen?

(Even from an illegitimate line?)

The most direct royal line of course is HRH Princess Alexandra of Hannover, daughter of Princess Caroline. Her father is Ernst August, the Prince of Hannover, by direct male line also a Prince of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland, Duke of Cumberland and Teviotdale and Earl of Armagh. (Prince Ernst August has the right to petition his cousine Queen Elizabeth II to use his British titles again but has never done so far). Of course, Princess Alexandra belongs to the Royal House of Hannover.

The Princes of Monaco themselves did not directly descend from a King or Queen but by marriage there are royal connections. The current most close royal connection of Prince Albert, Princess Caroline and Princess Stéphanie goes via their ancestor Lady Mary Victoria Douglas-Hamilton, spouse of Prince Albert I of Monaco and their great-great-grandmother. The mother of this Lady Mary Victoria was a daughter of the Grand-Duke of Baden and via him descended to almost all current royal houses.

 

[titiromi]

Thank you all for your answers

 

[melina premiere]

No need to be connected to queen Victoria to be a great yinasty, each country has a glorious history and big rulers.


The Hannover family has no more power apart to be connected to the English monarchy, they are princes but they are nothing because Germany is a republic as the Habsbourg, the Romanov and so.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

No need to be connected to queen Victoria to be a great yinasty, each country has a glorious history and big rulers.


The Hannover family has no more power apart to be connected to the English monarchy, they are princes but they are nothing because Germany is a republic as the Habsbourg, the Romanov and so.

Well, well... "they are nothing" is not true. Queen Frederika of Greece was an aunt to Prince Ernst August. Queen Sofía of Spain is full cousine to Prince Ernst August. His uncle Prince Georg was married to Princess Sophia of Greece, a sister of Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh.

Prince Ernst August has fabulous residences like Schloss Marienburg (handed over to his eldest son), the Fürstenhaus (his private residence). Schloss Herrenhausen, the magnificent palace of the Hannovers was bombed in WWII and has been re-build but is now a public building owned by the State of Hannover.

 

[NotHRH]

Well, well... "they are nothing" is not true. Queen Frederika of Greece was an aunt to Prince Ernst August. Queen Sofía of Spain is full cousine to Prince Ernst August. His uncle Prince Georg was married to Princess Sophia of Greece, a sister of Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh.

Prince Ernst August has fabulous residences like Schloss Marienburg (handed over to his eldest son), the Fürstenhaus (his private residence). Schloss Herrenhausen, the magnificent palace of the Hannovers was bombed in WWII and has been re-build but is now a public building owned by the State of Hannover.

True....it matters not how royal the Grimaldi's are - actually they are of nobility (noble, not royal, prince/sses) - they are ranked as 2nd (after another principality, Liechtenstein) as the wealthiest European "royal" families. I think the Netherlands royal family ranks 3rd (actually HRH P Beatrix herself) because of their ownership in Royal Dutch Shell. QEII ranks fourth in the list. So I doubt P Albert and family give two hoots that others do not not consider their family "royal" - they aren't. But they are worth over two billion US dollars, and QEII doesn't even come close to that in wealth. Just as someone made himself The Prince of Monaco long ago, someone long ago also made himself The King of England, and every royal/noble family had someone long ago who made himself a King, Queen, prince, princess, Duke, Earl, etc.

 

[melina premiere]

Grimaldi are royal no need to have royal relatives to be royal , Grimaldi family is a reigning family on the principauty of Monaco since 700 years, Monaco is a principauty and the Grimaldi is a family who is reigning , no matter it is a tiny principauty.


The hannover family is no more reigning , the sons of EA of Hnover sold their résidences and when they come in Hanover, they are Misters Hanover, Germany is a republic, they have prestigious relativs and a good pedigree but they are no more reigning, Plbert II is the prince Sovereign of Monavo governing and reigning on Monaco, when he is also the chief of state of Monaco whar are no more the Habsbourg, the Hanover, the Romanov or the family of Greece.


Prince Albert and Prince Hans Adam of Liechenstein are reigning and governing, the other Kings and Queens are only reigning nothing other. Monaco has a long history with the same family the Grimaldi who are at the head of the principality , it is it is the most aged dynasty reigning in Europa. Th other are no more reigning as the Habsbourg .or Bourbons

Here is thr link of the family of Monaco and the power of the prince sovereign




https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_of_Monaco

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

True....it matters not how royal the Grimaldi's are - actually they are of nobility (noble, not royal, prince/sses) - they are ranked as 2nd (after another principality, Liechtenstein) as the wealthiest European "royal" families. I think the Netherlands royal family ranks 3rd (actually HRH P Beatrix herself) because of their ownership in Royal Dutch Shell. QEII ranks fourth in the list. So I doubt P Albert and family give two hoots that others do not not consider their family "royal" - they aren't. But they are worth over two billion US dollars, and QEII doesn't even come close to that in wealth. Just as someone made himself The Prince of Monaco long ago, someone long ago also made himself The King of England, and every royal/noble family had someone long ago who made himself a King, Queen, prince, princess, Duke, Earl, etc.

Being royal is not expressed in wealth. Princess Margarita of Romania and her sisters have very, very darkblue blood in their veins but are "poor". King Felipe of Spain has very, very darkblue blood in his veins but is "poor". The usual way to "categorize" royals is by their ancestry.

For an example: Jean-Christophe Bonaparte, Prince Napoléon and his sister Madame Eric Quérénet-Onfroy de Bréville née Caroline Bonaparte, Princesse Napoléon (picture), have a profit from their prestigious mother, a Princesse de Bourbon des Deux-Siciles. Via their mother they came back in full royal spotlights and are related to the Bourbons in France, the Borbóns in Spain and the Borbones in Italy. Via their mother the Bonapartes are welcome at all these royal houses. Was their mother not a Princesse de Bourbon but just the girl-next-door, then the whole standing of Jean-Christophe would have been lower. No matter how much money they have or do not have.

 

[NotHRH]

Being royal is not expressed in wealth. Princess Margarita of Romania and her sisters have very, very darkblue blood in their veins but are "poor". King Felipe of Spain has very, very darkblue blood in his veins but is "poor". The usual way to "categorize" royals is by their ancestry.

For an example: Jean-Christophe Bonaparte, Prince Napoléon and his sister Madame Eric Quérénet-Onfroy de Bréville née Caroline Bonaparte, Princesse Napoléon (picture), have a profit from their prestigious mother, a Princesse de Bourbon des Deux-Siciles. Via their mother they came back in full royal spotlights and are related to the Bourbons in France, the Borbóns in Spain and the Borbones in Italy. Via their mother the Bonapartes are welcome at all these royal houses. Was their mother not a Princesse de Bourbon but just the girl-next-door, then the whole standing of Jean-Christophe would have been lower. No matter how much money they have or do not have.

By missing my point, you actually backed it up. The Grimaldi's are titled, and worth a couple of billion US dollars. They live very "comfortable" lives and I am sure it matters not to any of them how "royal" people believe them to be. Technically, they are not royalty (=HRH), they are nobility (=HSH). Because their ancestry is not up to par with royal houses, their blood is considered less "blue." So, if were a noble princess (and had hardly any blue-blood ancestors) and I am worth a billion dollars more than you, a king (with prestigious blue-blood ancestry), I would be laughing all the way to the bank as I drive away from my 500-room pink palace in one of my 27 $750,000+ automobiles. BTW, I know it is only an expression to say royals have blue blood, but their blood is no different than mine or yours - genetically they are only human beings, just as is every person in the world. If QEII stood before me, I would not curtsey to her or any other king, prince/princess, etc., because they are only another person - nothing more.
So being royal is not expressed in wealth; wealth - with or without a royal/noble title - makes life a lot more sweeter than being the "very, very dark blue-blood" poor, broke-@$$ (but so good-looking) King of Spain.:sly:

 

[NotHRH]

Grimaldi are royal no need to have royal relatives to be royal , Grimaldi family is a reigning family on the principauty of Monaco since 700 years, Monaco is a principauty and the Grimaldi is a family who is reigning , no matter it is a tiny principauty.


The hannover family is no more reigning , the sons of EA of Hnover sold their résidences and when they come in Hanover, they are Misters Hanover, Germany is a republic, they have prestigious relativs and a good pedigree but they are no more reigning, Plbert II is the prince Sovereign of Monavo governing and reigning on Monaco, when he is also the chief of state of Monaco whar are no more the Habsbourg, the Hanover, the Romanov or the family of Greece.


Prince Albert and Prince Hans Adam of Liechenstein are reigning and governing, the other Kings and Queens are only reigning nothing other. Monaco has a long history with the same family the Grimaldi who are at the head of the principality , it is it is the most aged dynasty reigning in Europa. Th other are no more reigning as the Habsbourg .or Bourbons

IDK for sure, but read that HSH Prince Albert II of Monaco owns all of the casinos in Monaco and reaps most of the profits from casino revenue. Also read that HSH Prince Hans Adam actually "owns" all of the land within the boundaries of his (literally) country of Liechtenstein. This why a recent vote in that country actually gave HA more power. His subjects did not want to disgruntle the powers that be (or in this case, the power that is).

 

[Ish]

True....it matters not how royal the Grimaldi's are - actually they are of nobility (noble, not royal, prince/sses) - they are ranked as 2nd (after another principality, Liechtenstein) as the wealthiest European "royal" families. I think the Netherlands royal family ranks 3rd (actually HRH P Beatrix herself) because of their ownership in Royal Dutch Shell. QEII ranks fourth in the list. So I doubt P Albert and family give two hoots that others do not not consider their family "royal" - they aren't. But they are worth over two billion US dollars, and QEII doesn't even come close to that in wealth. Just as someone made himself The Prince of Monaco long ago, someone long ago also made himself The King of England, and every royal/noble family had someone long ago who made himself a King, Queen, prince, princess, Duke, Earl, etc.

Being a Serene Highness instead of a Royal Highness doesn't make the Grimaldi's any less royal than any other royal family. Prince Albert II is a reigning monarch. That's what makes him royal.

Serene Highness, by the way isn't purely a title of nobility. More typically it denotes either a smaller realms or cadet branches of a royal family. Which describes Monaco fairly well - it's a small realm, although the ruler of Monaco holds much more power than other most other European monarchs.

Prince Albert and Prince Hans Adam of Liechenstein are reigning and governing, the other Kings and Queens are only reigning nothing other. Monaco has a long history with the same family the Grimaldi who are at the head of the principality , it is it is the most aged dynasty reigning in Europa. Th other are no more reigning as the Habsbourg .or Bourbons

That's... not accurate. Monaco has a long history with the Grimaldis, yes, but it's not the oldest dynasty in Europe. The Grimaldis have ruled in Monaco since 1297, but for the first 100 years or so it wasn't exactly an undisputed rule, and in 1642 the Grimaldis became vassals of the French. Then in 1793 Monaco was captured by the French, and held for about 20 years. Which means that while the Grimaldi rule of Monaco began about 700 years ago it hasn't been uninturrupted. Furthermore, there is an illusion of the same dynasty having ruled for all that time that isn't entirely accurate. There are several points in Monaco's history when a daughter inherited the throne, married a man who took the Grimaldi name, then abdicated in favour of her husband.

As for other European realms, though... As heirs of William the Conqueror, Elizabeth II's family has ruled England since 1066 - 200 years longer than the Grimaldis have been in Monaco - with one interruption during the English Civil War. As the heirs of Kenneth MacAlpin they've ruled Scotland since 843, with a few interruptions. As the heirs of Gorm the Old, the family of Margrethe II has ruled Denmark since 940. Felipe VI's ancestors have been ruling parts of Spain since 905. Monaco's certainly not got them beat.

 

[NotHRH]

Being a Serene Highness instead of a Royal Highness doesn't make the Grimaldi's any less royal than any other royal family. Prince Albert II is a reigning monarch. That's what makes him royal.

Serene Highness, by the way isn't purely a title of nobility. More typically it denotes either a smaller realms or cadet branches of a royal family. Which describes Monaco fairly well - it's a small realm, although the ruler of Monaco holds much more power than other most other European monarchs.

We obviously have a different reference method for defining "royalty." There are royal princes, and their are noble princes; being born a prince and later becoming a reigning prince does not make you royalty by the definition that I have read, but it does by your definition. Yes, Albert II is the absolute monarch of Monaco and holds more power than ALL European monarchs, except for Hans Adam of Liechenstein (also a noble prince) who basically owns the land upon which his subjects live. Anyway, if you want P Albert II to be considered royalty, then so be it. No matter how you interpret his title, he is still a reigning monarch, filthy rich, lives in a huge pink palace, has a multitude of many other attributes that most associate with "royalty." ????

 

[Lee-Z]

Doesn't "royal" by definition quite simply mean something like "being a king/queen or closely related to one"?

Imo it often gets mixed up with the term "monarch" and that in the case of P.Albert of Monaco he *is* a monarch, but he isn't a royal?

 

[NotHRH]

From Wikipedia:
- His/Her Royal Highness (abbreviation HRH, oral address Your Royal Highness) – other members of a Royal House not including the Head of the House normally the Monarch themselves, reigning Grand Duke, members of some grand Ducal Houses, some Princes consort. For example, sons and daughters of a British Sovereign e.g. HRH The Prince of Wales, HRH The Princess Royal, HRH The Duke of York and HRH The Earl of Wessex. And the current Prince Consort in all but name, HRH Prince Philip, The Duke of Edinburgh; consort to HM The Queen.

-His/Her Grand Ducal Highness (abbreviation HGDH, oral address Your Grand Ducal Highness) – junior members of some grand Ducal Houses.

-His/Her Highness (abbreviation HH, oral address, Your Highness) – reigning Dukes and members of reigning Ducal Houses, members of some grand Ducal Houses, junior members of some Royal Houses, Emirs and Sheikhs, also Princes/Princesses of nobility in several European countries, not belonging to a Royal House. For example, HH The Emir of Kuwait.

-His/Her Ducal Serene Highness (abbreviation HDSH, oral address, Your Ducal Serene Highness – members of some Ducal houses. For example, the House of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha.

-His/Her Serene Highness (abbreviation HSH, oral address Your Serene Highness) – sovereign or mediatized Fürst ("Prince") and his family – this is a mistranslation from German Durchlaucht, the correct form should be His/Her Serenity. For example, Grace Kelly on her marriage to the Sovereign Prince of Monaco became HSH The Princess Grace of Monaco or The Princess of Monaco. Some princely families in Imperial Russia also enjoyed this style.

 

[NotHRH]

Doesn't "royal" by definition quite simply mean something like "being a king/queen or closely related to one"?

Imo it often gets mixed up with the term "monarch" and that in the case of P.Albert of Monaco he *is* a monarch, but he isn't a royal?

If he is a "royal" prince or a "noble" prince is up for discussion. From my readings in this subject, offficially, he is not "royalty" as "royalty" denotes descent from a monarch (His/Her Majesty or Imperial Majesty). P Albert is descended from sovereign princes only. So because he is descended from Sovereign Princes/Princessses (when a Hereditary Princess was to inherit the throne, her husband would change is last name to Grimaldi) and not a "His/Her Majesty," he is technically not "royal." But unofficially as "HSH The Sovereign Prince of Monaco" (Head of State of Monaco) and for all intense and purposes, he and his family are considered "royalty," but officially and actually "nobility" (=not descended from a "royal" or "imperial" majesty).

 

[Ish]

If he is a "royal" prince or a "noble" prince is up for discussion. From my readings in this subject, offficially, he is not "royalty" as "royalty" denotes descent from a monarch (His/Her Majesty or Imperial Majesty). P Albert is descended from sovereign princes only. So because he is descended from Sovereign Princes/Princessses (when a Hereditary Princess was to inherit the throne, her husband would change is last name to Grimaldi) and not a "His/Her Majesty," he is technically not "royal." But unofficially as "HSH The Sovereign Prince of Monaco" (Head of State of Monaco) and for all intense and purposes, he and his family are considered "royalty," but officially and actually "nobility" (=not descended from a "royal" or "imperial" majesty).

What?

Now you're claiming that Albert isn't a monarch?

I'm just going to use Wikipedia here: "a monarch is the sovereign head of state in a monarchy." Furthermore, "a monarchy is a form of government in which sovereignty is actually or nominally embodied in one or several individual(s) reigning until death or abdication."

By which counts, Monaco is a monarchy and therefore, as the sovereign head of state in Monaco, Albert II is a monarch.

If your definition of a "royalty" is being descended from a monarch (your words) then Albert, being both a monarch and a descendant of other monarchs, is royalty.

Now, going back to Wikipedia, the issue of what is a royal family (and by extension royalty) is a bit more complicated - officially, according to them "a royal family is the immediate family of a king or queen regent, and sometimes his or her extended family" in which case, yes, Albert and his family are not royalty. However, it continues, "in common parlance members of any family which reigns by hereditary right are often referred to as royalty or 'royals.'" Which would qualify Albert II et all as Monaco is a state in which a family reigns by hereditary right. On that same page in the list of current royal families there is a link to Monegasque Princely Family.

Back to why I originally corrected you a couple posts ago - you're claiming that the Monegasque are not "royalty" but rather "nobility" because of their Serene Highness status instead of Royal Highness. Serene Highness isn't a style that is strictly associated with the nobility; in German and Austrian houses it is more strongly associated with nobility (although there are many houses who used the HSH that would likely count as "royal", including Liechtenstein), but Monaco isn't a Germanic state. It's a French one. In France, the HSH was used to denote members of the royal family who weren't the children or grandchildren of the monarch. They were still of the royal family, just more distantly. Within English, of course, the word Serene itself in this context means (again from Wikipedia) "supreme; royal; august; marked by majestic dignity or grandeur; or high or supremely dignified."

 

[Rudolph]

But isn't the Monegasque Princely Family by definition not a 'royal family' or am I interpreting this too literally.

 

[Lee-Z]

The Almanach de Gotha page lists the Grimaldi family in the "royal damilies and houses index"
Royal Families and Houses of the World - Index

( Don't know if this page is officially related to the "real" AdG?)

 

[NotHRH]

What?

Now you're claiming that Albert isn't a monarch?

I'm just going to use Wikipedia here: "a monarch is the sovereign head of state in a monarchy." Furthermore, "a monarchy is a form of government in which sovereignty is actually or nominally embodied in one or several individual(s) reigning until death or abdication."

By which counts, Monaco is a monarchy and therefore, as the sovereign head of state in Monaco, Albert II is a monarch.

If your definition of a "royalty" is being descended from a monarch (your words) then Albert, being both a monarch and a descendant of other monarchs, is royalty.

Now, going back to Wikipedia, the issue of what is a royal family (and by extension royalty) is a bit more complicated - officially, according to them "a royal family is the immediate family of a king or queen regent, and sometimes his or her extended family" in which case, yes, Albert and his family are not royalty. However, it continues, "in common parlance members of any family which reigns by hereditary right are often referred to as royalty or 'royals.'" Which would qualify Albert II et all as Monaco is a state in which a family reigns by hereditary right. On that same page in the list of current royal families there is a link to Monegasque Princely Family.

Back to why I originally corrected you a couple posts ago - you're claiming that the Monegasque are not "royalty" but rather "nobility" because of their Serene Highness status instead of Royal Highness. Serene Highness isn't a style that is strictly associated with the nobility; in German and Austrian houses it is more strongly associated with nobility (although there are many houses who used the HSH that would likely count as "royal", including Liechtenstein), but Monaco isn't a Germanic state. It's a French one. In France, the HSH was used to denote members of the royal family who weren't the children or grandchildren of the monarch. They were still of the royal family, just more distantly. Within English, of course, the word Serene itself in this context means (again from Wikipedia) "supreme; royal; august; marked by majestic dignity or grandeur; or high or supremely dignified."

HSH The Prince Albert II of Monaco is not a monarch; he is NOT the "sovereign head of state in a monarchy." What he IS the "Sovereign Prince" or "the ruling prince" of the "Principality of Monaco." Monaco is NOT a monarchy, but a principality. I am disputing he is descended from from monarchs, just not in direct male (and female) lineage that qualifies him to be considered a monarch - his fate in life has brought him in direct familial and hereditary lineage to be The Sovereign Prince of the Principality of Monaco. Also, Monaco is NOT a French state; it is only a French protectorate - the armed forces of France protect Monaco should it become necessary. France does not have voice or input into the ruling of Monaco - that is Albert's duty as The Sovereign Prince of Monaco. If you would have read my post in its entirety, I also stated the Princely Family of Monaco is often referred to as "royalty," although technically they are not royalty. Maybe you should hone your skills on the intracracies of the wording of specific terms and realize unofficially these terms make no difference, but in an official capacity, especially in the world of royalty/nobility/aristocracy, wording makes a huge difference. For instance, if HRH The Prince of Wales 1st wife was still living and not remarried, she would be officially "Diana, Princess of Wales" - with no "HRH" or "The" in her title. While Charles' 2nd wife would be officially, "HRH The Princess of Wales." Officially, Camilla's name is not in her title, "HRH" and "The" - with a capital "T"; not only would be, but is in fact her official title. She is known as "HRH The Duchess of Cornwall" only not offend the memory and legacy of Diana.
I respect your attempts to correct me, I know you mean well, but it is not necessary. When I am wrong, I always correct myself to always become a better educated person. But I am not wrong in this particular situation. Again, thank you.

 

[Nice Nofret]

Also read that HSH Prince Hans Adam actually "owns" all of the land within the boundaries of his (literally) country of Liechtenstein.

Sorry no - who ever wrote that, has no idea of Liechtenstein. Much of the land is in private hands ... as in Switzerland or Austria or whereever ... Property in Liechtenstein is bought and sold on a regular basis . I know people who own Land there ...

 

[Nice Nofret]

The Almanach de Gotha page lists the Grimaldi family in the "royal damilies and houses index"
Royal Families and Houses of the World - Index

( Don't know if this page is officially related to the "real" AdG?)

Yes it is the 'real' Almanach - and it is the Bible of the european royalty, aristocracy, noble houses etc. - they are never wrong.

Even if Monaco is called a Principality and Liechtenstein is called ein Fürstentum - but as they are ruling houses they are considered 'ebenbürtig' equal to the other royal houses in Europe. And as such they are listed with other monarchie, it is a constitutanal monarchy.

 

[NotHRH]

Yes it is the 'real' Almanach - and it is the Bible of the european royalty, aristocracy, noble houses etc. - they are never wrong.

Even if Monaco is called a Principality and Liechtenstein is called ein Fürstentum - but as they are ruling houses they are considered 'ebenbürtig' equal to the other royal houses in Europe. And as such they are listed with other monarchie, it is a constitutanal monarchy.

Yes, they are principalities equal (or comparable) other European ruling royal houses. I guess I am speaking more of the forms of governments - Monaco and Liechenstein are officially principalities, Luxembourg is a grand duchy, and Great Britain and Belgium are 2 countries that are constitutional monarchies. Maybe email them and they can explain the official differences between them - it is all in the terminology, and placement/spelling of words in the titles, and official forms of government, which has been my point all along. Cannot understand why a few of my fellow posters have gotten so offended over this subject. Again email the 'almanach' and let them explain it all to you. No offense meant to you or to anybody else. Good luck on your research in this subject matter. ???

 

[Ish]

But isn't the Monegasque Princely Family by definition not a 'royal family' or am I interpreting this too literally.

I would say you're interpreting too literally. It's a Princely Family because Monaco is a Principality. Just like it's the Imperial House of Japan (or Japanese Imperial Family), as Japan is an Empire. It's more denoting that it's a different type of monarchy than not a royal family.

 

[Ish]

HSH The Prince Albert II of Monaco is not a monarch; he is NOT the "sovereign head of state in a monarchy." What he IS the "Sovereign Prince" or "the ruling prince" of the "Principality of Monaco." Monaco is NOT a monarchy, but a principality. I am disputing he is descended from from monarchs, just not in direct male (and female) lineage that qualifies him to be considered a monarch - his fate in life has brought him in direct familial and hereditary lineage to be The Sovereign Prince of the Principality of Monaco. Also, Monaco is NOT a French state; it is only a French protectorate - the armed forces of France protect Monaco should it become necessary. France does not have voice or input into the ruling of Monaco - that is Albert's duty as The Sovereign Prince of Monaco. If you would have read my post in its entirety, I also stated the Princely Family of Monaco is often referred to as "royalty," although technically they are not royalty. Maybe you should hone your skills on the intracracies of the wording of specific terms and realize unofficially these terms make no difference, but in an official capacity, especially in the world of royalty/nobility/aristocracy, wording makes a huge difference. For instance, if HRH The Prince of Wales 1st wife was still living and not remarried, she would be officially "Diana, Princess of Wales" - with no "HRH" or "The" in her title. While Charles' 2nd wife would be officially, "HRH The Princess of Wales." Officially, Camilla's name is not in her title, "HRH" and "The" - with a capital "T"; not only would be, but is in fact her official title. She is known as "HRH The Duchess of Cornwall" only not offend the memory and legacy of Diana.
I respect your attempts to correct me, I know you mean well, but it is not necessary. When I am wrong, I always correct myself to always become a better educated person. But I am not wrong in this particular situation. Again, thank you.

Again, Albert is still a monarch. I think you've got what monarch means wrong - you seem to think that only Kings and Queens are monarchs, but that's not accurate. A monarch is (from the dictionary) "One who reigns over a state or territory, usually for life and by hereditary right". That describes Albert. That he is a Prince in a Principality doesn't mean he's not a monarch - a Principality is a form of a monarchy, as is a Kingdom, a Grand Duchy, an Empire.

As for Monaco being a French state you misunderstood what I was saying, for which I apologize - I should have been clearer. Yes, Monaco is not at this time a state controlled by the French government. It is, however, a French speaking state, and so using the German definition of HSH is inaccurate. Albert is formally Son Altesse Sérénissime le Prince Albert, Alexander, Louis, Pierre, Prince Souveraign de Monaco. That is the French royal style Son Altesse Sérénissime, not the German noble title Durchlaucht.