King Juan Carlos Hunting Accident & Trip To Africa: 2012

[An Ard Ri]

I wonder if the King recieved a visit from either of his sisters during his stay in hospital?

 

[genegirl99]

Felipe does the "grin & bear it" version
http://www.vanitatis.com/fotos/album_2011/2012041796felipe_4_g.jpg

That is one terse smile....

 

[Baroness of Books]

WWF - Wildlife Trade - Elephant Ivory Trade FAQs

This article has information on WWF's position on selective culling of elephant herds.

Protecting wild life is not the same as no hunting. Culling of wild animals is a necessary part of protection and conservation.

King Juan Carlos indescretion is more an issue of lack of empathy for his own family and his country. Wealthy people will spend their money in ways that may seem outrageous to some other people and whether he travels with his mistress is not something new to the spanish people and probably not to Queen Sofia and their family either.

Perhaps the spanish people finally had enough of a lifestyle that is perhaps not the best suitable for an official person of today.

Thank you for the article. It seems that the controversy here is two-fold: one for the animal rights groups who are outraged by the images of the king shooting an elephant just for sport and not for culling, and the other the needless and frivolous expense during financial crisis. His lifestyle is definitely not in sync with Spain and he needs to reconsider his attitude, but we can only wait and see what the repercussions of this situation will be.

 

[grevinnan]

Thank you for the article. It seems that the controversy here is two-fold: one for the animal rights groups who are outraged by the images of the king shooting an elephant just for sport and not for culling, and the other the needless and frivolous expense during financial crisis. His lifestyle is definitely not in sync with Spain and he needs to reconsider his attitude, but we can only wait and see what the repercussions of this situation will be.

Culling and shooting for sport is often one and the same. Botswana has been very successful in managing the elephants and the culling is most likely done by issuing permits for the number of elephants needed to keep the herds at ultimate size. Permits usually defines clearly what you may shoot, young or old, female or male, timing during the breeding season and so on.

The photos of the dead animal and proud hunters are unfortunately quite tasteless. However necessary the culling is due to todays reduced native habitat and lack of natural predators for many wild animals it also has become a source of revenue for countries. People are willing to pay substantial permit fees and accompanying guide and often luxury accomodations in order to engage in this type of hunting.

 

[grevinnan]

JC had to apologize for PR reasons. Its a shallow apology though. I dont think for one second that he is sorry for what he did (or actually truly understands what was wrong about it), only angry about his unfortunate fall that eventually disclosed his whereabouts.

Having said that, this is the end of it. "It wont happen again". Enough said and back to normality is the message. He will never step aside. JC commands so much respect because of the old boys' network, all those shady or not shady connections that are or came into place when he took over in 1975. He is still very powerful for his country. Felipe cannot follow the path of his father (because it was a one-off situation) what makes him vulnerable and less influencial in certain aspects of being King.

It appeared to be a very generic apology. What exactly did he apologize for? I have only read translations of the announcement and it certainly seem to lack depth.

 

[Lindy]

It appeared to be a very generic apology. What exactly did he apologize for? I have only read translations of the announcement and it certainly seem to lack depth.

"I'm sorry. I made a mistake. It won't happen again."

Generic, indeed. I suspect it is intentionally vague so that whatever offends you is covered. (e.g., elephant shooting, expensive vacations, foreign holidays, trips not disclosed to the government, secret rendezvous with mistress, having a mistress, etc.)

 

[mtatum]

No decision yet regarding his post in the WWF?

 

[grevinnan]

No decision yet regarding his post in the WWF?

I see no need to resign. WWF is very much involved in elephant management in Botswana and any permits issued are presumably in accordance with proper protocol for maintaining healthy herds.

The King's problem should not be whether the shoot was legal but his lifestyle and timing of such a trip. Big game hunting should not be on anyone's radar that is dependent on public opinion.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

Spanish King Juan Carlos apologizes over Botswana elephant hunting safari | Mail Online

 

[carlota]

"I'm sorry. I made a mistake. It won't happen again."

Generic, indeed. I suspect it is intentionally vague so that whatever offends you is covered. (e.g., elephant shooting, expensive vacations, foreign holidays, trips not disclosed to the government, secret rendezvous with mistress, having a mistress, etc.)

very true.

i find the apology at least something (going out as if nothing happened would have been even worse), although i am not convinced. i translate what the king means to my eyes: "next time it happens, you will not know about it".
he will surely not stop hunting because of this.

 

[dbarn67]

Protesters as JC leaves the hospital

http://i39.tinypic.com/xm8qhg.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/dypx0o.jpg

 

[NGalitzine]

very true.

i find the apology at least something (going out as if nothing happened would have been even worse), although i am not convinced. i translate what the king means to my eyes: "next time it happens, you will not know about it".
he will surely not stop hunting because of this.

Why should he stop hunting? It is not illegal in Spain.

 

[KittyAtlanta]

He should stop hunting because he appears to have the blood lust, among other lust(s). He, to me, appears too craven to be a 21st century monarch. To me, he's just a "geezer" now.

 

[camelot23ca]

"I'm sorry. I made a mistake. It won't happen again."

Generic, indeed. I suspect it is intentionally vague so that whatever offends you is covered. (e.g., elephant shooting, expensive vacations, foreign holidays, trips not disclosed to the government, secret rendezvous with mistress, having a mistress, etc.)

There's also the fact that, if someone is truly sorry about their behaviour, then direct and to the point is the way to go. So many public "apologies" these days involve public figures expressing their so-called contrition with drama and grandstanding, or even better, some lengthy variation on the "I'm sorry if your feelings were hurt" theme.
I found The King's apology refreshing. He said he was sorry, he said a mess like this won't happen again, then he had the good sense to stop talking!

 

[EIIR]

What was he apologising for, exactly? Getting caught this time?

So one only has to apologise it you've done something illegal? What he did was hugely insensitive, offensive to, it would appear, most Spaniards and incredibly stupid. By accepting huge gifts of holidays from super-wealthy business people he leaves himself open to charges of impropriety or worse.

Can you imaging the uproar in the UK if it came out that Prince Charles had accepted a $60k holiday from some rich friend to kill endangered animals? He'd be accused of all sorts. There were negative press articles here when William and Kate sold tickets to a reception after War Horse to benefit William and Harry's Foundation.

But I suppose it's ok because the taxpayer didn't pay for it.

 

[NGalitzine]

Why apologize at all? Bad PR perhaps but he did nothing illegal. Politically incorrect for some but not illegal. The Spanish PM knew where he was, and he didnt feel the need to question the trip. It didnt cost the Spanish taxpayers as it was funded by the Saudis. He killed an elephant but that to is legal and the culling of the herd in Botswana is even sanctioned by the WWF. He traveled with a woman rumoured to be his mistress, well that is a private matter but it is not illegal.
Anyway he apologized, and now some people are just enjoying piling on a man while he is down.

 

[MissJanet]

I like it.

A monarch does usually not apologize to his/her people. JC aknowledges that he heard the voice of his people, that he is not above making mistakes and not above regreting them.

What more can he do, no matter how wordy and detailed his apology could be, it comes down to what he actually had published now.

 

[NGalitzine]

He didn't kill an endangered animal. Botswana has an over supply of African elephants and the land cannot support them, and the cull is legal.

As far as JC and the Saudis are concerned, to date his association with them has been a positive thing for Spain, see Spanish contract to build highway.

I get that people are sensitive, perhaps overly so, but when you take emotions out of the equation he did nothing wrong or illegal.

Now from a PR point of view it was perhaps not the best decision but that is really all this is about, emotions and PR. He has been a good constitutional monarch and he remains the same person who has reigned since 1975.

Right now its just a case of people getting their jollies piling on a man while he is down. This to shall pass.

 

[fearghas]

He didn't kill an endangered animal. Botswana has an over supply of African elephants and the land cannot support them, and the cull is legal.

I get that people are sensitive, perhaps overly so, but when you take emotions out of the equation he did nothing wrong or illegal.
.

Actually African Elephants are an endangered species, they may be common in Botswana thanks to good conservation methods but as a species through out their range they are endangered. IT also may not be illegal but I question the morality of hunting and killing and extremely intelligent species, just for the fun of it. I am not into bashin JC but his behaviour is questionable of late.

 

[Baroness of Books]

This whole situation just leaves a bad taste for me. I'm not a proponent of big-game hunting, and it's sad that it's a killing field for these gentle giants in approved Botswana since that's the legal hot spot for hunting them, it seems. Elephants still fall prey to poachers in other countries; illegal hunting takes place quite often so elephants among other animals are still endangered. JC's walking a slippery slope in this area, and I have to agree with Fearghas that his behavior, and judgment, is definitely questionable.

 

[RaniaRocks]

I am very disappointed and yet I fail to understand the scandal in a country that kill bulls for pleasure in a plaza full of people clapping and call that massacre a party.

I understand not everybody likes the bullfighting but isn't the whole thing a circus?

However

The circumstances around the whole thing are very bad tolerated nonetheless: he went to kill animals being a honorary for WWF, not compatible no matter what, he went with a mistress who organized everything, the government did not know anything; only lately they said they did trying to help the King, when you accept those types of presents usually you give something back, the costs of bringing him in an special hospital Army plane from Botswana, the luxury he's living in while he asked the people to be austere and "tightened the bell" (more? we'r asphyxiated already!) on his last Christmas speech, he putting his life in danger been more than 70 years old, all together is what has the people extremely mad with him and the Institution.

I don't want Felipe and Letizia to be Kings so the later the best but he's offering them the throne wrapped in cellophane with all this silliness in a moment where the Spanish Monarchy is going trough one of their worse periods. The Monarchy in Spain is more "Juancarlismo" than anything, is not solid so with more reason they should measure every step three times prior to actually go ahead with any decision, specially nowadays with the digital world. Just because something is (apparently) legal doesn't make it right.

 

[Madame Royale]

I don't want Felipe and Letizia to be Kings

Dare I ask why?

 

[kathia_sophia]

I don't want Felipe and Letizia to be Kings. The Monarchy in Spain is more "Juancarlismo" than anything, is not solid.

why you dont want that??? i think Felipe is trying really hard for the sake of his monarchy, and Letizia is an excelent lady and supportive consort.
and i disagree with Spain bein' more Juancarlismo, spanish people have a positive support for their princes of asturias, i mean, they are popular.
althought i think its good for Spain if JC stays on the throne until his last breath or until his last mentally capable to rule, the more i think i realize that Felipe is prepared for his role than ever. i think he would be a great King and a great person to look up to.

 

[EIIR]

I think what RaniaRocks means is she doesn't want them to become King and Queen yet.

Personally I think Felipe and Letizia wouldn't want that either given how young their daughters are.

 

[tonytex]

you all written and writte ... about what ??? look the hunting game is the only way to get money to preserve some parks in africa ... hola people thinks that ... about the apologize ... well (ahh aah aah) him ??? apologized who ??? (i dont see, or heard that from is mouth ... just media speculation) even the WWF SPONSORS these natural wildlife parks, and the hunting games ... about the 100.000,00 euros he spent in this hunting ... well i dont see this money came from the Spanish tax ... but i know the King, and is son ... kill a lot of birds for years in the royal parks in Spain ... and they are not the only one ... ahh ahh ahh ahhh See the links news; El Rey obsequia a la infanta Elena con un ojeo de perdices - ElConfidencial.com SORRY I DONT KNOW TO PUT THE LINKS WELL IN HERE ! España, una finca de ilustres. CR266 Another El Confidencial Digital - Prensa digital | Diario actualidad | Noticias internacionales | Economia internacional
Another Carolina caza en Guadalajara - El Confidencial .:. Diario de Informacin y opinin on-line Another Diez dudas sobre la responsabilidad de la Casa Real en el 'caso Urdangarín' - ElConfidencial.com Another

 

[Ephram]

I would like to say that the King is very humble and brave for admitting his mistake and apologising. News about this have been widely spread worldwide even to my part of the world. This is what we want to see from a good King and I appreciate what he did. Everyone makes mistake, hope they learn from their own mistakes and never to repeat again.

 

[grevinnan]

I would like to say that the King is very humble and brave for admitting his mistake and apologising. News about this have been widely spread worldwide even to my part of the world. This is what we want to see from a good King and I appreciate what he did. Everyone makes mistake, hope they learn from their own mistakes and never to repeat again.

What exactly did he admit?

 

[Madame Royale]

As I see it, it's not that the King was partaking in any illegal activity (not that I'm aware of?), but that he was willing to actively participate in a pursuit that is both ethically and emotionally divisive. And the killing of Elephants happens to be one of those; no matter the methods. As monarch, there is the reasonable expectation that he should display an understanding of topical issues and should be resolved to distance himself from matters which are fundamentally emotive.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

As I see it, it's not that the King was partaking in any illegal activity (not that I'm aware of?), but that he was willing to actively participate in a pursuit that is both ethically and emotionally divisive. And the killing of Elephants happens to be one of those; no matter the methods. As monarch, there is the reasonable expectation that he should display an understanding of topical issues and should be resolved to distance himself from matters which are fundamentally emotive.

not to mention the amout of money he spends in times when Spain is suffering from financial termoil & unemployment.

Spanish King Juan Carlos apologizes over Botswana elephant hunting safari | Mail Online
'In Spain, there are two Queens': Calls for King Juan Carlos, 74, to abdicate over rumours he was on controversial elephant-hunt with 47-year-old lover | Mail Online

 

[RaniaRocks]

Dare I ask why?

Hi Madame Royal, its just a matter of a personal preference, there's politicians, doctors, actors you like and others you don't, I just don't like them as the followers of our actual Kings, with all and mistakes Letizia and Felipe are not even close to their statures as the best ambassadors Spain have had in 30 years plus.

I don't beleive they are fit to be King and Queen of Spain but I know is irremediable and I am trying to prepare myself for that day mentally.