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  #41  
Old 06-25-2004, 11:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Humble@Jun 25th, 2004 - 11:38 am
Simply put, this Mo needed a young modern wife to look modern himself in the eye of Westerners...

Haya, on the other hand, found someone to secure her financially and maybe emotionally....

So, both parties are getting a deal from each other...
I agree, but there are plenty of men Muslim and non-Muslim that don't need wives to appear modern when engaging in business deals or for future business investments. What is a few days in Europe away from your wife? Why must you marry a young women to tramps all over Europe with on business. There is something called an escort service. :P
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  #42  
Old 06-25-2004, 11:52 AM
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Originally posted by Akilah@Jun 25th, 2004 - 10:33 am
I have a question. Why is it that Hind cannot be photographed with or without CP Mo? I really confused by this "traditional wife" category that Hind has been placed in because I have read several articles where Hind has been present at an event or had some person to read a statement on her behalf. Now, if Hind is too place the role of the "traditional" wife, then why does she partake in public events in Dubai or release public statements? If Lalla Salma can many "limited" public appears with her husband or with her husband's children why cannot Hind. I am not saying she should tramps around with CP Mo, but I think she could may a public appearance where she is photographed once a year at least. One picture of this women in a years time is not that much in comparsion to some other royal women of the world, regradless of they are Muslim or not. (Note: I am not saying I want her to change her ways because CP Mo's third wife, Haya, is more visible about, but I think it would be nice to see the women publicly photographed if not once every year, but every other if possible). For goodness sakes, she is the mother of his oldest legitmate son, and his first wife.

I also would like to say that I agree with many of you on this board. Haya should have not been at his side for this occasion. If Hind could not have been there than no woman should. CP Mo should have told Haya that she would not be going on this trip, and that it was none negotiable.

Hind, in my opinion, should have been there in some capacity. I don't know how, but she should have. I feel sympathy for this women. I don't see how a woman who has had 12 children with a man has no emotion when she hears he has taken another wife, as though, she was not good enough or not loyal or beautiful enough to keep him happy. I pray that her sons see what she is goinh through and vow to themselves that if and when they take a wife they devote themselves to her and if not, make descretion paramount when engaging in trists or courtship with other women. We generation XY must learn from our predecesors' mistakes.
Hind has never been photographed, even when appearing at official events in Dubai. This is not uncommon in that part of the world.

I think several posters here are being too hard on Haya. First of all, she did not need marry a rich husband. None of Hussein's children were left destitute, and all have more disposable income than most of here will have.

This was not a shotgun wedding. This relationship developed in the past few years, and Haya and Mohammed took time to get to know each other. However, Mohammed seems comfortable with having more than one wife. His religion allows it. He can afford more than one wife. Haya knows the customs and traditions.

Haya will be a public wife and Mohammed has accepted this.
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  #43  
Old 06-25-2004, 12:20 PM
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Marlene,

Fair response, but you have failed to answer my question. What point were you making? However, I have not failed to relies that Haya is a consenting adult. In prior posts, I have said that Haya is not a stupid women. She is Arab through and through. She was raised Muslim; she understands custom and tradition in that part of the world. But does she? Because in my opinion, if she reallllllllllllly understood the custom and tradition of Dubai and the Al-Maktoum family she would not be photgraphed with him and her profile would be much small, which is the custom of the Al-Maktoum women. Haya has chosen not to to follow custom and tradition, which Mohammed has allowed her to do so outside of Dubai an the other Emirates. Haya knew her husband before she married him; they both were very active on the horse curcuit. She knew what she was getting into. I don't feel sorry and never will for this young women. She is getting exactly what she as asking for? Who really knows the reasons why these two have married, but them alone. I want spinned any of my time trying to figure out why either?


As to the money King Hussein had before he died no one on this board knows? It is all speculation. But, if King Hussein had some SERIOUS money like Princess Haya's husband, people in the United States and the Middle East would know. And another thing to note, the only reason the Jordanian family is as high profile is because of two things: the marriage of Queen Noor, an American dipolmat's daughter, and Jordan's money relationship with the United States. If it where not for this two things Jordian would be as unknown as Afghanistan was before the late 1970s (with Carter and Reagan, I know Reagan served in the mid to late eighties, but the crisis in Afg'stan spread through his adminstration) and 9/11 in the United States.
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  #44  
Old 06-25-2004, 12:38 PM
CathyEarnshaw
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Originally posted by Marlene@Jun 25th, 2004 - 10:52 am
[.
Noor's father, Najeeb Halaby, was never a diplomat. As a matter of fact, Jordan has had a higher profile than other Arab nations here in the US since the 50s, and certainly the 60s - long before Noor.

Reagan was president from January 20, 1981 - January 20, 1989). Nearly the entire decade.

The British were the original players as Britain and France took crayons to draw the map of the mid-east after the first world war. They "created" the Iraqi and Jordanian monarchies --

JOrdan being the neighbor of Israel has largely guaranteed a role with the US. Jordan has been of importance to the US long before Carter.

I would expect that Haya's role as Mohammed's wife is clearly defined in the Marriage Agreement ... it may come to pass that in time, she will be at his side in Dubai as well, as his wife.

I find it strange that a man would have more than one wife at the same time, but hey, whatever floats your boat.

Mrs. Patrick Campbell once said , and I paraphrase ... I don't care what people do as long as they don't do it in the streets and frighten the horses.

As for Mohammed and Lalla Salma -- this is a major step forward ... I don't think his parents were ever photographed together - or the mother named for some years -- But did not become queen - yet - a major step forward to have a public role.
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  #45  
Old 06-25-2004, 01:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Marlene@Jun 25th, 2004 - 12:38 pm
Mrs. Patrick Campbell once said , and I paraphrase ... I don't care what people do as long as they don't do it in the streets and frighten the horses.

As for Mohammed and Lalla Salma -- this is a major step forward ... I don't think his parents were ever photographed together - or the mother named for some years -- But did not become queen - yet - a major step forward to have a public role.
I agree what ever the motive is for their marriage is of little relevance however I do think that it speaks volumes to Mo's character that the woman that has been by his side for 25 years and bared a football team worth of children has little recognition as his wife.

Maybe she (Hind) is a private person. Maybe she doesn’t want a public role. However I can't imagine that she could be very happy with the fact that her role in his life is being minimized by this woman that breaks all the "rules".

Hind has played the role of a "proper Muslim wife" with out question. It seems like kind of a slap in the face to be sitting home alone with no companionship 12 children and every move you make being judged while miss chubby is running around as the proud wife in tacky clothing being able to enjoy what she loves most, (horses).

I don't feel one ounce sorry for Haya. She may have sacrificed some types of freedom but it's not as if she didn't know this would be the case. She went into this knowing damn well what her trade off would be. She is not ignorant or stupid when it comes to what her "obligations" would be and what her "reward" would be.
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  #46  
Old 06-25-2004, 02:20 PM
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I don't feel one ounce sorry for Haya. She may have sacrificed some types of freedom but it's not as if she didn't know this would be the case. She went into this knowing damn well what her trade off would be. She is not ignorant or stupid when it comes to what her "obligations" would be and what her "reward" would be.
I fail to see what the issues are or the problems here. None of us knows how Hind feels. As she is a traditional Muslim woman, she may be totally understanding - and accepting. If HInd were the only wife, she would have remained behind in Dubai when hubby got his lifetime award. (not sure how one can be given a lifetime award when one's life has not ended.)

It is also unfair to Haya or to anyone, actually, to make fun of their personal appearance.

It was her choice - and I think a marriage of love - rather than arrangement. Haya comes from an important royal family, a royal highness. Her husband is the Crown Prince of a teeny nation - and he's a mere highness.

Having more than one wife is not unusual in the Mideast. It is entirely possible that MOhammed also devotes time for the first wife, but her primary purpose was to bear kids and keep the home fires burning. At least, she will be well cared for and protected, far less insensitive than what courts do to women in divorce cases in the USA. Hind and the children are well cared for - and will never be in want. She won't need to go on welfare.

In the west, the husband divorces the first wife before marrying the second. MOhammed doesn't have to worry about having to pay alimony and child support.
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  #47  
Old 06-25-2004, 02:55 PM
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While polygamy is far more common in the Middle East than any other part of the Muslim world, I think that Haya's marriage still doesn't set a very good example. The Jordanian royal family is supposed to be all for modernization and progress but when a smart young woman like Haya willingly becomes a third wife, its simply not very encouraging. Her own father married four women but atleast he didn't marry them all at once. If Haya was desparate enough to chose money over independence and an equal marriage, Im sorry for her. But then again, we dont know what was truly going through her mind at the time. In the long-term though, she might well have problems with her husband, especially if he marries again.
I dont care what her husband's previous wives did, but as far as Haya's concerned, Im all for her maintaing her public appearances and accompanying her husband overseas. No doubt sheikh muhammad's other wives devoted much of their life and time to him but if they chose not to maintain a public profile, that's their choice. Why should Haya have to remain hidden from view? thats not a pre-requisite for being a good Muslim wife.
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  #48  
Old 06-25-2004, 03:04 PM
CathyEarnshaw
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Quote:
Originally posted by ~*~Humera~*~@Jun 25th, 2004 - 1:55 pm
While polygamy is far more common in the Middle East than any other part of the Muslim world, I think that Haya's marriage still doesn't set a very good example. The Jordanian royal family is supposed to be all for modernization and progress but when a smart young woman like Haya willingly becomes a third wife, its simply not very encouraging. Her own father married four women but atleast he didn't marry them all at once. If Haya was desparate enough to chose money over independence and an equal marriage, Im sorry for her. But then again, we dont know what was truly going through her mind at the time. In the long-term though, she might well have problems with her husband, especially if he marries again.
I dont care what her husband's previous wives did, but as far as Haya's concerned, Im all for her maintaing her public appearances and accompanying her husband overseas. No doubt sheikh muhammad's other wives devoted much of their life and time to him but if they chose not to maintain a public profile, that's their choice. Why should Haya have to remain hidden from view? thats not a pre-requisite for being a good Muslim wife.
Instead of divorcing, Mohammed takes another wife ...the principle is largely the same except the the first wife has better benefits than the divorced wife.

Muslims cannot legally take more than one wife in countries where one can be married to one other person at the same time ... Divorce laws would also apply.


I am fascinated that Haya and Mohammed got married. The marriage contract would set out everything including where she lived, and what she would get in the event of a divorce.

The Walid will be a rather grand affair, again probably in Jordan
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  #49  
Old 06-25-2004, 03:18 PM
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Im aware of King Hussein's reputation, but I wasn't talking about his infidelity. I specifically meant to emphasize polygamy. The fact that he still didn't have any polygamous marriages at a time and in a place where he easily could have, is still quite significant.
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  #50  
Old 06-25-2004, 05:14 PM
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I like that kind of women ( hind ) , she not selfish and she think about happiness of her children and she support mo not just because he her husband but also because he her cousin and father of her children . she realy great and strong woman
it not easy role to play
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  #51  
Old 06-25-2004, 11:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by ~*~Humera~*~@Jun 25th, 2004 - 2:55 pm
While polygamy is far more common in the Middle East than any other part of the Muslim world, I think that Haya's marriage still doesn't set a very good example. The Jordanian royal family is supposed to be all for modernization and progress but when a smart young woman like Haya willingly becomes a third wife, its simply not very encouraging. Her own father married four women but atleast he didn't marry them all at once. If Haya was desparate enough to chose money over independence and an equal marriage, Im sorry for her. But then again, we dont know what was truly going through her mind at the time. In the long-term though, she might well have problems with her husband, especially if he marries again.
I dont care what her husband's previous wives did, but as far as Haya's concerned, Im all for her maintaing her public appearances and accompanying her husband overseas. No doubt sheikh muhammad's other wives devoted much of their life and time to him but if they chose not to maintain a public profile, that's their choice. Why should Haya have to remain hidden from view? thats not a pre-requisite for being a good Muslim wife.
I agree with you, Humera...In fact, I don't think I could have said it better myself.
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  #52  
Old 06-26-2004, 12:32 AM
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I do wonder this marrige agreement thing, if not amicably fulfilled, where to complain?
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  #53  
Old 06-26-2004, 03:03 PM
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oh and another thing. hell will freeze over before Mo rules the UAE.
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  #54  
Old 06-26-2004, 03:16 PM
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silver charm and Noura
I always enjoy reading your comment it just I can't think that all people have the same definition for happiness and freedom even in your house , no one perfect we also should focus in the good side of the person when we took about the bad side .
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  #55  
Old 06-26-2004, 03:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by silver charm@Jun 25th, 2004 - 10:42 pm
I'm so glad I can amuse y'all.

Also at AUD there is a massive portrait of Mo-right as you walk through the front door to the auditorium. It is a collage of other portraits of Mo with different quardrants of his face take from other portraits to be put into this one huge mother of a portrait.

Okay, my point......it is damn ugly. Just thought I would share.
Does anyone find it odd that Mo is ever so present at AUD but his children didn't go to a proper collage. How sad is it that you think that education is good enough for other peoples kids but not your own.

Quote:
Originally posted by houri@Jun 26th, 2004 - 3:16 pm
silver charm and Noura
I always enjoy reading your comment  it just I can't think that all  people have the same  definition for happiness and freedom even in your house , no one perfect we also should focus in the good side of the person when we took about the bad side .
Houri I do appreciate that and you are correct. Everyone's idea of what make them happy does differ. There are some things in life however that are pretty much universal in making people unhappy.

I do think it is great to focus on the positive things but life is not all good and not all perfect. Sometimes you have to bring the negative to light in order to be the catalyst for change.
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  #56  
Old 06-26-2004, 07:31 PM
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My dislike comes from being a fan of Mo. He is big into judging people by their accomplishments not their title/position.

If a fairly average looking girl with a complicated family and with little to no accomplishments (although she is coming up to her 30th bday) showed an interest in Mo he would of laughed at her interest and walked away.

But ohhhhh noooooooo she is PRINCESS Haya.

I think he could of married someone who is considerably more accomplished and worthy of being Mrs. Mo. Someone who is more comfortable with herself and her new status. Haya is just a spoiled brat.
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  #57  
Old 06-26-2004, 07:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by silver charm@Jun 26th, 2004 - 7:31 pm
My dislike comes from being a fan of Mo. He is big into judging people by their accomplishments not their title/position.

If a fairly average looking girl with a complicated family and with little to no accomplishments (although she is coming up to her 30th bday) showed an interest in Mo he would of laughed at her interest and walked away.

But ohhhhh noooooooo she is PRINCESS Haya.

I think he could of married someone who is considerably more accomplished and worthy of being Mrs. Mo. Someone who is more comfortable with herself and her new status. Haya is just a spoiled brat.
One last question, you said that Sh Mo was into accomplishments and titles, superficial stuff I think, but hey, that's me, then if you feel that Haya isn't up to his standards then why do you think he married her? I'm just trying to see where you are coming from is all. Honestly, Shk Mo could have done much, much worse than Haya.
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  #58  
Old 06-26-2004, 08:16 PM
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In Haya's defense, I don't think she's chubby...Yeah, she put on some weight, but so what. We all aren't born a size O. To me, even when she was smaller, she still had hips. I guess all that matters is Mo happiness. Apparently, if Mo was unhappy, he wouldn't have married her. Not that I agree with the whole marriage thing, but that's another story.
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  #59  
Old 06-26-2004, 08:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by silver charm@Jun 26th, 2004 - 6:31 pm
I think he could of married someone who is considerably more accomplished and worthy of being Mrs. Mo. Someone who is more comfortable with herself and her new status. Haya is just a spoiled brat.
Haya is not a spoiled brat. Nothing about her gives that impression. She lost her mother at a very young age, her step mother wasn't very close to her by all acounts and then she lost her father.
I dont see what standards you're using to judge her accomplishments. Why should her talents be measured more critically than those of any other royal-born princesses?
As for her husband, how "accomplished" were any of his first two wives before they married him? Is it a requirement that his wives all be some sort of super women to deserve him? He's got three of them for heaven's sake! He's got a below average face, but is wealthy and quite respectable, or should I say as respectable as most middle-eastern leader get. I would think that'd be enough for him.
The fact that people are even debating whether or not he should have married Haya or someone more "worthy" is ridiculous to me. He shouldn't have married Haya at all, she deserved a fresh start with someone her own age, not an old married man, no matter how wealthy or respected he is.
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  #60  
Old 06-26-2004, 10:03 PM
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Quote:
Haya is not a spoiled brat. Nothing about her gives that impression. She lost her mother at a very young age, her step mother wasn't very close to her by all acounts and then she lost her father.
I dont see what standards you're using to judge her accomplishments. Why should her talents be measured more critically than those of any other royal-born princesses?
As for her husband, how "accomplished" were any of his first two wives before they married him? Is it a requirement that his wives all be some sort of super women to deserve him? He's got three of them for heaven's sake! He's got a below average face, but is wealthy and quite respectable, or should I say as respectable as most middle-eastern leader get. I would think that'd be enough for him.
The fact that people are even debating whether or not he should have married Haya or someone more "worthy" is ridiculous to me. He shouldn't have married Haya at all, she deserved a fresh start with someone her own age, not an old married man, no matter how wealthy or respected he is.
completely agree, humera, haya should marry someone more her equal. younger more inexperienced-just starting out.

and mo should've married someone more his equal. older more experienced.

but i do believe he could get better. better looking, more accomplished, etc.

actually when i moved to dxb there was a rumor going around that he just hired a linguist to translate his poetry to english for some british lady love. not that many years later he is married to haya. he goes through women quick. i think it is becaues he chooses women who are a bit 'under' him-easier to manipulate and control. but less durable in the long run.
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