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  #21  
Old 01-05-2019, 02:15 PM
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Multi-millionaire Bernhard van Vollenhoven, with his race circuit and his 350 houses in Amsterdam alone, can buy it without problem. The same can be said about multi-millionaire Mabel, over there in Kensington. Probably both have access to equally valuable artworks, via purchase, as gifts, inheritance or just loans from the Foundation Historic Collections of the House Orange-Nassau. I have no idea if these artworks are offered first to family. I guess so.
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  #22  
Old 01-05-2019, 02:51 PM
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Milliardaires Mr Ch from China , Mr W from Russia or Mr Z from Dallas will buy valuable artworks.
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  #23  
Old 01-08-2019, 08:28 AM
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According to the NRC the items that are being auctioned off indeed belong to princess Christina.

https://www.nrc.nl/nieuws/2019/01/08...stina-a3136062

The first time the princess auctioned things was in 1988. At the time she auctioned 100 historical coins that belonged to her grandmother. She claimed to have little pleasure in these coins due to her limited eye sight. Fred Lammers noted that the costs for the interior decoration of the Eikenhorst were higher than anticipated.
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  #24  
Old 01-08-2019, 09:00 AM
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Marengo , I went to Haarlem with a belgian group in december . We visited the Frans Hals Museum and in the afternoon de Teylers Museum , your oldest Museum . I saw indeed this Battle of Anghiarai Drawing in the Da Vinci Drawings Exhibition without knowing it belonged to your Princess Christina.
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  #25  
Old 01-09-2019, 07:20 PM
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The critics say that Princess Christina should offer her items to Dutch museums because "we" must keep the Rubens drawing.

I do not understand that. That drawing was never public. It has been in Princess Christina's NY appartment. "We" could not see it. Had Princess Christina not offered it fo auction, it would have been inherited by Bernardo, Nicolas or Juliana Guillermo, all of them living in foreign countries. The drawing would have left the Netherlands as well, without one even realizing.

There is some weird thinking amongst the critics. The drawing is not on the list of protected patrimonium but still it should stay in the Netherlands, they claim. The private person Christina wants to get good revenue for it, but no, she should offer it to Dutch museums for "a reasonable price".

The double standards by the critics are unbelievable. Every owner is free to purchase and to sell, but apparently not Christina.
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  #26  
Old 01-11-2019, 07:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
The critics say that Princess Christina should offer her items to Dutch museums because "we" must keep the Rubens drawing.

I do not understand that. That drawing was never public. It has been in Princess Christina's NY appartment. "We" could not see it. Had Princess Christina not offered it fo auction, it would have been inherited by Bernardo, Nicolas or Juliana Guillermo, all of them living in foreign countries. The drawing would have left the Netherlands as well, without one even realizing.

There is some weird thinking amongst the critics. The drawing is not on the list of protected patrimonium but still it should stay in the Netherlands, they claim. The private person Christina wants to get good revenue for it, but no, she should offer it to Dutch museums for "a reasonable price".

The double standards by the critics are unbelievable. Every owner is free to purchase and to sell, but apparently not Christina.
Hear Hear Hear!!

Some,...read..the critics.on fora and boards alike..think Christina needs their approval to sell anything!!Clearly cases of "fan"/ "hobby" deformation!!Who on earth do they think they are??!!gnore them.Too rediculous for words,really,the nerve!
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  #27  
Old 01-12-2019, 07:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
The double standards by the critics are unbelievable. Every owner is free to purchase and to sell, but apparently not Christina.
As i understand it, official art collections are obligated to try to find a way to keep relevant art in the country, big private collectors aren't obligated but often still do adhear to that policy.
The Orange family is legally completely in the right to do what they do, but morally, as a sort of "first family of the country" it's a different matter.

This just gives more fuel to the idea that the very rich Orange family is primarily interested in money and will do a lot to either get more or not spend it if they can get others to spend.

those were my 2cts

Article about the matter quoting Sjarel Ex, director of Boijmans van Beuningen
https://www.ad.nl/show/oranjes-moete...-weg~a89e868f/
(can't get google translate to take it without cookie trouble)
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  #28  
Old 01-12-2019, 07:29 AM
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The Dutch prime minister stated in his press conference that he would not interfere in this matter.
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  #29  
Old 01-12-2019, 07:33 AM
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as there legally nothing wrong i didn't really expect the politicians to interfere, the Oranges can do with their collection what they want
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  #30  
Old 01-12-2019, 07:52 AM
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SECOND CHAMBER OF THE ESTATES-GENERAL

QUESTIONS by the member Mrs S. Belhaj (D66) to the Minister-President about the sale of a drawing by Rubens ("Nude Study Of A Young Man With Raised Arms") by the royal family.

ANSWERS by the Minister of Education, Culture and Sciences, Mrs I.K. van Engelshoven.

Date: January 8th 2019

----------------------------------------------------

QUESTION 1
What is your opinion about the intended auction in the USA by the royal family of an artwork, which is a pre-study of one of Rubens' most famous works, without offering it to Dutch museums first?

ANSWER 1
The artwork is private property of the royal family. It is to any particulier to decide if, when and how an artwork is offered for sale.

QUESTION 2
Are you of the opinion that it is important to keep this kind of artworks owned by the royal family in Dutch ownership, as much as possible? If no: why not?

ANSWER 2
Fiscal rules and the policy of museums are aimed to encourage voluntary contributions to the public ownership of artworks. The initiative to obtain works of importance lies with the museums. Museums which believe that an artwork on the market could be an important addition to the collection, can request financial support from the Mondriaan Fund. They can also request financial support from the Museal Purchases Fund as well from several private funds to obtain desired artworks.

QUESTION 3
Are you, as Minister-President, willing to make an appeal to the royal family, to inventarize if there is Dutch interest in the artworks? If no: why not?

QUESTION 4
Are you of the opinion, concerning properties of the royal family, that first an inventarisation should be made of interest by Dutch museums, to prevent Dutch artworks disappearing in foreign hands?

ANSWER 3 and 4
In reply I would like to refer to the given answers on the questions 1 and 2. There is no any need to make an exception for the royal family on the usual procedures.

QUESTION 5
Are you willing to answer these questions as soon as possible, seeing the date of the intended auction?

ANSWER 5
Yes.


https://www.tweedekamer.nl/kamerstuk...did=2019D00551
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  #31  
Old 01-12-2019, 01:53 PM
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Willem-Alexander, Máxima and Family, General News Part 3 (May 2017- Present)

The King’s aunt Christina is getting some stick for auctioning off a family Reubens drawing which is being done without consulting appropriate interested parties such as Dutch museums.
Not great press for the Oranges:

Link: https://www.dutchnews.nl/news/2019/0...m_source=email


De arrogantie van de Oranjes https://www.rtlnieuws.nl/columns/col...van-de-oranjes
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  #32  
Old 01-12-2019, 03:34 PM
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The comments in the press are rather acid indeed. As Lee-Z stated above, the crux is that while they legally can sell these items, more is expected from the first family of the country. The distinction between members of the royal house and royal family isn't one that the general public is overly aware of.

The negativity about the auction is in many media outlets coupled to prince Bernhard junior and his real estate empire. It now seems he had to pay a penalty payment last year for some issues around rented out apartments.

--
On a tv programme they speculated why the princess is selling the items now. Somebody referred to her bone cancer and her decision not to have it treated. It was suggested that the princess wanted to put her affairs in order, which is very sad indeed.
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  #33  
Old 01-12-2019, 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
The comments in the press are rather acid indeed. As Lee-Z stated above, the crux is that while they legally can sell these items, more is expected from the first family of the country. The distinction between members of the royal house and royal family isn't one that the general public is overly aware of.
Princess Christina, however, is not a member of the Royal House and has been excluded along with her descendants from the line of succession. I don’t think she should be held to the same standards .
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  #34  
Old 01-12-2019, 04:51 PM
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That was indeed my point. But it seems that in the public perception the difference isn't one that is very clear. I suppose that people that the titles 'prince' or 'princess' gives the impression. It was wise that Q. Beatrix decided to downgrade her own grandchildren to counts & thus limit the family in the public perception.
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  #35  
Old 01-12-2019, 05:57 PM
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The people also get mixed signals: the one prince is a multi-millionaire with a race circuit, hundreds of properties in Amsterdam, even a Media Park has been acquired. The other princess is a multi-millionaire thanks to profitable start-ups. And now another princess offers artworks for sale.
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  #36  
Old 01-16-2019, 03:00 AM
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The glass table piece by René Lalique has been withdraw from the auction by its owner, presumably Pss Christina. The table piece was a wedding gift of the Dutch ambassadors to princess Juliana and prince Bernhard in 1937.


The RVD says that only after publication of the item in the auction catalogue it became clear that it was a wedding gift. The table piece was therefore withdrawn by the owner as it has been a good custom for years that official gifts are not sold. The table piece will be added to the Foundation of Official Gifts of the House of Orange-Nassau.

https://www.vorsten.nl/2019/01/15/ko...-niet-geveild/
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  #37  
Old 01-16-2019, 04:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
The glass table piece by René Lalique has been withdraw from the auction by its owner, presumably Pss Christina. The table piece was a wedding gift of the Dutch ambassadors to princess Juliana and prince Bernhard in 1937.


The RVD says that only after publication of the item in the auction catalogue it became clear that it was a wedding gift. The table piece was therefore withdrawn by the owner as it has been a good custom for years that official gifts are not sold. The table piece will be added to the Foundation of Official Gifts of the House of Orange-Nassau.

https://www.vorsten.nl/2019/01/15/ko...-niet-geveild/

That is a nice and good custom, not to auction gifts. No idea what to do with this table-piece from René Lalique, but okay, stack it away in the depôt and maybe so now and then it will be exhibited in a display.


Picture: https://images.nrc.nl/vjH2qy8Zf_QEgb...229-7ba565.jpg
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  #38  
Old 01-16-2019, 06:07 AM
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As Juliana was countess of Leerdam it could be an option to give it as a semi-permanent loan to the glass museum in Leerdam? I agree that hiding it away in a depot serves nobody, but it is what will most likely happen.
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  #39  
Old 01-16-2019, 09:03 AM
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With the division of Queen Juliana's inheritance (it must have been an immense job) the crystalware by René Lalique was correctly filed as private property of the late Queen Juliana. But as it originally was a gift for Juliana's wedding, it was barred from auction, following the own policy of the House. So Princess Christina (or other members of the royal family) can still enjoy the crystalware from René Lalique but then as a loan from the family foundtion Official Gifts of the House Orange-Nassau.

There are two foundations with a different approach:

1. The Foundation Official Gifts of the House Orange-Nassau 2007
All official gifts to the descendants of H.M. Queen Wilhelmina are placed into this foundation, to preserve and manage it for the House Orange-Nassau.

2. The Foundation Royal Gifts 2007
All official gifts to the Bearer of the Crown, acting as head of state, in the framework of State Visits and Official Visits. When this foundation is dissolved, the properties will be handed over to the State of the Netherlands.

So:
King Philippe gives a cadeau to King Willem-Alexander for his birthday: this will be placed in 1.

King Philippe gives a cadeau to King Willem-Alexander as part of a State Visit: this will be placed in 2.
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  #40  
Old 01-30-2019, 07:05 AM
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Despite complaints from Dutch museums the auction of the Rubens drawing of Princess Christina will go ahead today at Sotherby's New York at 16 hrs. The drawing supposedly will collect 2-3 million euros though experts predict it will be sold for much more.

https://nos.nl/artikel/2269696-contr...-de-hamer.html
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