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  #61  
Old 11-12-2009, 08:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Connie Cutmantle View Post
I quite understand what you are saying Skydragon, and I do concede that I grudgingly understand why so many of the 'people' do regard MC as a bit of a hanger on....but Prince Michael was not a fully 'paid up' salaried 'working' member of the firm even before he married MC. !
I do understand the point you are making. It is unusual to ever find this couple in the media, unless M-C shows symptoms of foot & mouth (opened mouth, put foot in). No her past didn't help, many have long memories and hurts to live with, the SS are still revilled and rightly so, but more than that her problem seems to be the arrogance, to the point of bullying, she displays. He didn't confound his lowly position, to many he betrayed it. He is everything a royal should be, quiet, discreet, his wife sadly is not.

Whether someone is a stunner or not, surely is in the eye of the beholder, I have never found her to be attractive and less so now.
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  #62  
Old 11-12-2009, 08:34 AM
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Thank you Skydragon for your response! I shall never defend MC on account of a single one of her attributable or proven lapses into Foot in Mouth.....she sometimes seems to have been her own worst enemy and far more acutely afflicted than the DOE has ever been! Yet I can't help but defend the underdog!

I know that beauty is in the eye of the beholder...or comes from within or such like....but in this eye MC was and is rather beautiful!
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  #63  
Old 11-12-2009, 03:52 PM
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They are my favoroute Royals too. In reference to an earlier point I think that Prince Michael HAS confounded his junior position in recent years. Unlike everyone else in the family he had to carve out his own role but he has proved himself to be a great asset to the Monarchy which the Queen herself acknowledged when she made him a Knight Grand Coss of the Royal Victorian Order. Twenty years ago I would never have imagined him receiving this simply because the fact that he wasn't a full-time working Royal denied him the opportunities that the others got to prove their worth to the Firm. That he has achieved this off his own bat says a lot. I also think that is why the Queen has bestowed so many high-ranking honorary military positions on him in recent years.
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  #64  
Old 11-12-2009, 04:13 PM
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I hope that we, as adults, realize that there's nothing wrong with a person whose father was an SS officer-MC wasn't even born back then-or a criminal or whatever.
Princess Michael shouldn't be judged by her father's profession or beliefs, imo.
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  #65  
Old 11-12-2009, 04:23 PM
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Originally Posted by MelinaB. View Post
I hope that we, as adults, realize that there's nothing wrong with a person whose father was an SS officer-MC wasn't even born back then-or a criminal or whatever.
Princess Michael shouldn't be judged by her father's profession or beliefs, imo.
There are many who will believe 'like father, like daughter', there is nothing that can be done to change that. Whether she was born at the time is immaterial, because a parent influences the child.
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  #66  
Old 11-12-2009, 04:30 PM
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"Like father, like daughter"...Right, I've heard that before, but come on, dear! You've got to be over 200 years old to believe that
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  #67  
Old 11-12-2009, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
There are many who will believe 'like father, like daughter', there is nothing that can be done to change that. Whether she was born at the time is immaterial, because a parent influences the child.
I doubt that there was much influence from her father as Baron von Reibnitz left the family when Marie-Christine was just 5 years old. The first time she saw him again she was 17 and she pointed out that she never had neither a good nor close relationship to him in later years...
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  #68  
Old 11-12-2009, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by MelinaB. View Post
"Like father, like daughter"...Right, I've heard that before, but come on, dear! You've got to be over 200 years old to believe that
< ed: removed aggressive response >

I think it is a worthwhile observation made by many, from 20 year olds to 80 - 90 year olds. It is as relevant when talking about MC as it is about anyone and sadly in many cases turns out to be true. Children learn a great deal in the first 7 years and of course MC would suggest she barely knew him. She is unlikely to say we were extremely close, I learned a lot from him.
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  #69  
Old 11-12-2009, 05:04 PM
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Unless MC has done, said or published something anti-semetic that can be documented and proven, then I can't, in good conscience, make a judgement about her. If others do, then that's their short-sidedness.
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  #70  
Old 11-12-2009, 05:11 PM
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Skydragon I think it is absolutely tragic but inevitable that some would and do judged a child upon the track record of a parent! 'What's bred in the bone will come out in the flesh' etc! Interestingly it is appears to be all about intolerance and prejudice in the case of MC! Her comments about the Colonies made at that restaurant in New York some years ago and the others including the one about breeding and genetics etc in monkeys were most unfortunate coming from someone in her position and with her parentage! But I remember seeing a documentary where the POW extolled the virtues of consistent good breeding practices in the animal kingdom and seemed to me anyway, to allude to his own position and the principals of heredity in the same light, so MC is not the only one who appears to hold such lofty views!

With regards to Prince Michael......i can't ever remember him making a gaffe. It will be wonderful one day to read a balanced assessment of just how important and effective his role has been in the development of relations between Britain and Russia as I understand he works tireless in this particular arena!

As to the Michaels positions within the family....I often wonder how things would have played out for the present Duke and Duchess of Gloucester had Prince William of G. not died in that plane crash! I was under the impression that Prince Richard would have continued to strive toward a career in architecture......and that he and Princess Richard as Birgitte would have remained, would have lead more or less private lives. I wonder if they would have been labelled 'lazy free-loader wastes of space' had the fates not allowed the dice to fall otherwise? I wonder if like Prince Michael, Prince Richard was excluded from the annuities list prior to the death of his brother? Just some thoughts to ponder....hmmm?
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  #71  
Old 11-12-2009, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
< ed: removed aggressive response >

I think it is a worthwhile observation made by many, from 20 year olds to 80 - 90 year olds. It is as relevant when talking about MC as it is about anyone and sadly in many cases turns out to be true. Children learn a great deal in the first 7 years and of course MC would suggest she barely knew him. She is unlikely to say we were extremely close, I learned a lot from him.
I see your points. I agree that she would have been unlikely to say that she had a close relationship with her father after it was known that he was a member of the SS. Nevertheless I still think her fathers influence cannot have been THAT great in her life. And as her father is always mentioned, we shouldn't forget that her mother was a well known Nazi-opponent/enemy, who was redbaited in that time for refusing the Hitler-salute and other things. If I'm not mistaken Marianne Countess Szapary, Marie-Christines mother, spent a few days in prison therefore.
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  #72  
Old 11-12-2009, 05:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
< ed: removed aggressive response >

I think it is a worthwhile observation made by many, from 20 year olds to 80 - 90 year olds. It is as relevant when talking about MC as it is about anyone and sadly in many cases turns out to be true. Children learn a great deal in the first 7 years and of course MC would suggest she barely knew him. She is unlikely to say we were extremely close, I learned a lot from him.
< ed: removed response >

Your last sentence is mere speculation. I'm sorry for pointing this out, it doesn't prove anything.
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  #73  
Old 11-12-2009, 06:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Patra View Post
Unless MC has done, said or published something anti-semetic that can be documented and proven, then I can't, in good conscience, make a judgement about her. If others do, then that's their short-sidedness.
I suggest you use google to find the gaffs regarding race/breeding she has made.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Connie Ctmantle View Post
Skydragon I think it is absolutely tragic but inevitable that some would and do judged a child upon the track record of a parent! 'What's bred in the bone will come out in the flesh' etc! --- edited --- But I remember seeing a documentary where the POW extolled the virtues of consistent good breeding practices in the animal kingdom and seemed to me anyway, to allude to his own position and the principals of heredity in the same light,
I also think in many cases it is unjustified, IMO there are more children who have ignored the influence of the parent, good or bad. It was merely a reason that I believe leads many to dislike her, it is not my reason at all. I don't recall Charles saying anything of that sort but MC is correct when she says we take more care when breeding our horses and dogs, (rightly so), who would want a totalitarian state dictating who we could and couldn't marry/breed with?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MelinaB View Post
< ed: removed response >
Your last sentence is mere speculation. I'm sorry for pointing this out, it doesn't prove anything.
< ed: removed response > I was suggesting nobody in their right mind, when questions are asked about such a parent, would say 'we were close'.
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  #74  
Old 11-12-2009, 06:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
There are many who will believe 'like father, like daughter', there is nothing that can be done to change that. Whether she was born at the time is immaterial, because a parent influences the child.
I can't agree with that. As someone with german ancestry (my mother is part german) I can only say my grandfather was "involved" in this sad and horrible decade in history. He wasn't one of the worst but you could call him an opportunist. My mother and her silblings had a very bad relationship with him, especially because of his past.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
I suggest you use google to find the gaffs regarding race/breeding she has made.
But they weren't antisemitic nor that serious IMO. I don't know why so many people on the opposite find Prince Philips quotes always that witty and funny, they're sometimes on the on the verge of racism too! Maybe a woman earns more envy......
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  #75  
Old 11-12-2009, 06:44 PM
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I am sure that Prince Charles mentioned the breeding ethics and heredity in the program 'Prince Charles at 60'.

With regards to MC.....it is extraordinary just how incendiary and provocative as a topic she is!!!!As none of us here has I believe, ever had the chance to sit down and have a cosy fireside heart to heart with MC about her deepest and most revealing feelings pertaining not only to her relationship with her father and mother, but her views on the Baron's activities during the war, I think it safe to say 'speculating' is a rather dangerous tactic to play with here!

There is a perceived discomfit that is the same with many Germans born post 1945 to parents who lived during the Nazi regime.........even in the late 1990s when I was teaching exchange students as young as 14....they used to pretend to be Dutch when out of class and in town, because they were frightened of what would happen to them in small town Little Britain'....One child who was confronted by an elderly couple was actually spat upon when his nationality was discovered!!!!. I wanted to cry when when I discovered this, and used to discuss this issue with all my classes thereafter, and not one child could bring themselves to say that they were proud of their country as it was in the 90s or of themselves as Germans! Collective guilt appeared to have endured three generations beyond that which was responsible for electing Hitler in 1933 and I do wonder about it! Are we saying that every German whose grandparents or parents was not a proven resistance fighter is subsequently of questionable character apropos the 'Bred in the bone..' or 'like father, like daughter' and 'tarred by the same brush' perceptions! It seems a revoltingly prejudice and abhorrently bigoted perception if this is the case!

We have strayed off MC - it always seems to come down to her parentage, I for one find it dreadful that it causes such strife!
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  #76  
Old 11-12-2009, 07:06 PM
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Here's a vid of Princess M. speaking about her father - Princess Michael Ref 06166
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  #77  
Old 11-12-2009, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Connie Cutmantle View Post
... [snipped]With regards to MC.....it is extraordinary just how incendiary and provocative as a topic she is!!!!As none of us here has I believe, ever had the chance to sit down and have a cosy fireside heart to heart with MC about her deepest and most revealing feelings pertaining not only to her relationship with her father and mother, but her views on the Baron's activities during the war, I think it safe to say 'speculating' is a rather dangerous tactic to play with here! ... [snipped and my bolding]
I fully agree with you. People, who met Prince and Princess Michael in person, never fail to mention how much they liked the couple and enjoyed conversing with them. The rest tend to parrot a strong, shall we say, dislike certain member of the British royal family have for Princess Michael and note only negative things in her behaviour. At this point in time, I would say that Princess Michael never minds about the little things such as negative press coverage, etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Connie Cutmantle View Post
...[snipped] Good old MC always manages to carry off even the most 'challenging' of frocks and gowns! Even dots on an evening gown!!!!! She never fails to look the part! As for Prince Michael...well he even looks old school Royal with huge regal R to me for obvious reasons and he always looks very well groomed. Lovely dinner suit from Savile Row, Geo. F Trumper for a trim to the hair, 'tache and whiskers with a finishing splash of some lovely Floris or Creed cologne I shouldn't wonder....the whole caboodle!!!!

For all the catty little comments that have been heaped upon these two since their marriage, some based purely on speculation and probably motivated by a little envy I shouldn't wonder.....I think they add a much needed and appreciated panache and style to the RF. The Windsors would be a shade duller without them!!!!!

This couple are my secret, after dark with the curtains drawn tight favourite contemporary British Royals! Ever since dear 'Ma'am darling' went off upstairs on that sad grey February morning back in 2002 I have discovered solace and comfort in the goings on the household at 10 Kensington Palace....these two old troopers really do know how to play the part with aplomb! I wish the Queen had used there services a bit more in an official capacity....they would have been marvelous as roving Commonwealth and particularly European representatives or something!!!!! Such a waste!!!!
It is really nice to read such a great opinion about Prince and Princess Michael. In my personal opinion, the Kent clan is far more regal looking than the Windsor clan.
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  #78  
Old 11-12-2009, 09:48 PM
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As far as I am concerned, when it comes to royals whether of the first, second or third tier, the less they say the better they seem.
Unfortunately Princess Michael has said a few things and did a few things totally unroyal, regardless of how regal she may look in a gala gown or how noble her ancenstry may be or impeccable her manners are, at a face to face meeting.
It is a sad sign of our times when we can see half naked royal breasts shaking, married women holding strangers' hands walking at faraway beaches or insulting those who think they belong with the great unwashed...
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  #79  
Old 11-12-2009, 10:00 PM
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Originally Posted by angela View Post
They are my favoroute Royals too. In reference to an earlier point I think that Prince Michael HAS confounded his junior position in recent years. Unlike everyone else in the family he had to carve out his own role but he has proved himself to be a great asset to the Monarchy which the Queen herself acknowledged when she made him a Knight Grand Coss of the Royal Victorian Order. Twenty years ago I would never have imagined him receiving this simply because the fact that he wasn't a full-time working Royal denied him the opportunities that the others got to prove their worth to the Firm. That he has achieved this off his own bat says a lot. I also think that is why the Queen has bestowed so many high-ranking honorary military positions on him in recent years.
Spot on Angela!!!! It is lovely to see his manifold contributions being acknowledged! And his tireless Anglo-Russian relations work has also been rewarded by the Russians too....with the awarding of their Order of Friendship which he truly deserves!!!
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Old 11-13-2009, 01:46 AM
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Thanks so much for this, Westminster. I'd been looking for this interview for awhile.

Had she done another interview on the same topic? I seem to remember her facing in the other direction while being interviewed.


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Here's a vid of Princess M. speaking about her father - Princess Michael Ref 06166
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