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  #241  
Old 12-30-2008, 05:38 PM
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Claire, I asked my mum on this and she says if a dog eats a bird it kills it can make them very sick. The feathers will make them throw up, but will make them really ill is if the bird was carrying anything in it, such as worms and disease.

I know in the past some of our dogs have eaten pigeons that they have killed without our knowledge, and have thrown up. I dont know what a larger bird would do?

I also think you maybe right in that those may not of been his dogs, because he has been shooting Pheasants for years, and i am starting to have my doubts that he would do that with untrained dogs.

I think the guy is in a no win situation and sadly there are a few who have jumped on him without really knowing what went on.
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  #242  
Old 12-30-2008, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kezza View Post
Claire, I asked my mum on this and she says if a dog eats a bird it kills it can make them very sick. The feathers will make them throw up, but will make them really ill is if the bird was carrying anything in it, such as worms and disease.
I ask again, what do you think wild dogs eat and why have none of my dogs ever been sick after consuming a kill?
Quote:
I know in the past some of our dogs have eaten pigeons that they have killed without our knowledge, and have thrown up.
Then if it was without your knowledge, how do you know it was the pigeon that caused them to vomit, which is unlikely unless they were over faced! We worm our dogs every 3 months, is this not done with show dogs? I can't think what else they might 'catch' from eating their natural prey.
Quote:
I also think you maybe right in that those may not of been his dogs,
Claire admitted she had absolutely no proof of this and that she had made a reflex response, which she came up with.
Quote:
I think the guy is in a no win situation and sadly there are a few who have jumped on him without really knowing what went on.
And some who would defend him without reading the articles, looking at the available pictures or just because.

Whether he contacted the dogs, the pictures IMO clearly show him at the very least taking a swipe at them, the fact that he is a rotten shot and they are good at evading blows does not make it a lesser offence, then again I am astounded at the amount of posters who admit to beating their dogs, so see nothing wrong with it.
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  #243  
Old 12-30-2008, 06:06 PM
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cesar milan is a renowned dog trainer. his philosophy is that dogs are pack animals and in order to have control over your dog you must establish yourself as the "leader of your pack". he does this by bringing the dog to what he calls a state of calm submission which he acheives in various ways but some examples are.... you must ignore the excited state that some dogs get into..say when you walk in the door after having been away, also never allowing the dog to enter or exit a building, etc before you, and never letting the animal walk ahead of you but beside you or slightly behind you. if you notice wild dogs or wolves, the alpha is always in charge and you must make yourself the alpha. obviously edward believes in either beating or scaring his dogs into submission which is sad. a radio show i listened to today was talking about how this should be handled by the RSPCA....it should be investigated and handled in the same way it would be handled if it was anyone else. he shouldn't be made an example of...he should have to answer to the same rules and laws of animal mistreatment that anyone else does.
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  #244  
Old 12-30-2008, 06:09 PM
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Now I dont have to answer that. But you know when a dog tends to throw up a whole bird with feathers intact on it and nothing else then chances are it is the bird that has made them sick. But then I think someone is being delibrately obtuse on this board.

I think Edward is being picked on unfairly.

Does he just let those dogs fight and tear each other to pieces?

Does he let those dogs just eat that bird and allow them to become very sick because of it?
  #245  
Old 12-30-2008, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
I ask again, what do you think wild dogs eat...
Well, I am suprised that you believe he is a rotten shot and that the dogs are simply good at evading ... frankly, I cannot see this in the pictures. Nor do I know whether he inteded to hit or missed the dogs. You see, I cannot read thoughts and I wasn't there. All I have are pictures which show Edward with a stick. Nothing more, nothing less. And if in doubt I rather think the best of a person - not the worst.

Shame on all those people who use this incident for Edward-bashing without knowing the truth
  #246  
Old 12-30-2008, 06:28 PM
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Sorry, but doesn't they (paparazzi) catch it on video?
But in the other hand how we could be sure that this video would be real?
  #247  
Old 12-30-2008, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Avicenna View Post
Shame on all those people who use this incident for Edward-bashing without knowing the truth
And shame on those that will make any excuse!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kezza View Post
Now I dont have to answer that. But you know when a dog tends to throw up a whole bird with feathers intact on it and nothing else then chances are it is the bird that has made them sick. But then I think someone is being delibrately obtuse on this board.
As I didn't have to reply to your 'I don't think you have ever separated fighting dogs or the 'you don't know what you are talking about'. Wild dogs, as you do not seem to know eat carrian or anything else they can get their noses into. Do they die from unknown diseases, no, have any of my dogs died from eating deer carcases, carrion, birds, again no and I have been owned by quite a few of the bounders!

Unless you are being deliberately insulting, I will presume you do not know the meaning of obtuse - lacking sharpness or quickness of sensibility or intellect : insensitive , stupid b: difficult to comprehend : not clear or precise in thought or expression.

I believe I have been very clear in my feelings on this matter and why. On the other hand you do not appear to know what dogs will and will not eat without causing themselves major problems!
Quote:
Does he just let those dogs fight and tear each other to pieces?
They were not fighting with one another, so the liklihood of them tearing one another to pieces, seems to be remote.
Quote:
Does he let those dogs just eat that bird and allow them to become very sick because of it?
Sick with what, any disease would have been passed to the dog, if it was going to be when the dogs pick the carcase up. We have already been through the 'very sick' because they pulled at it or do you really think they have cans and can openers in the wild?
  #248  
Old 12-30-2008, 06:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Duchess View Post
cesar milan is a renowned dog trainer...
Thank you Duchess, all I know is that the chap is very, very good and does not believe in threatening or hitting a dog and I believe he has a great many.
  #249  
Old 12-30-2008, 07:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
Do they die from unknown diseases, no, have any of my dogs died from eating deer carcases, carrion, birds, again no and I have been owned by quite a few of the bounders!
Actually our family beagle died (very painfully I might add) after being found eating deer entrails. While I am grateful that you have never experienced this, it is incorrect to assume that it does not happen at all.
  #250  
Old 12-30-2008, 08:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
And shame on those that will make any excuse!...
Well I guess we have different opinions on the matter, but I know from plenty of people and given what I have seen. That if a dog or a cat eats something it catches they usually bring it back up. I own enough dogs and cats and have seen it happen enough times to know. Please dont insult my intelligence on the matter.

Plus you add the worms and stuff other animals can carry. I have heard of people developing a slow growing cyst caused by the worms being carried by something a dog has killed and eaten getting the worms and then passing the worms onto the human which then over time causes cysts. Those cysts can be fatal to a human if they rupture somewhat and the chances of that happening are high because most of the time people dont know they have been infected by worms which come from their dogs.

But then I think you are being difficult because deep down you know Edward has done nothing wrong, but you wont admit it because judging from some of your posts in the past you dont like the man.

Not everyone is a perfect dog owner or trainer like youself, and please dont pontificate how my family or how he handles his dogs. Everyone has different methods.

I have been very clear on the matter myself, the point is Edward has done nothing wrong, and it is a case of beat up the Royal, because he is a member of the Royal Family.

I think thats all i'm going to say.
  #251  
Old 12-30-2008, 10:27 PM
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As far as the RSPCA investigation goes...

If they do find evidence of animal cruelty, Prince Edward should be treated like anyone else who misuses an animal. But if there's no evidence, that information should be made available as well.
  #252  
Old 12-30-2008, 10:56 PM
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Well if they do then he should just pay the fine.

Playing devils advocate here. What if Prince Edward was walking his dogs through a park and his dog's discover some meat in the park. He does not want them to eat that meat, because the meat could be baited by someone who doesn't like dogs. In order to discourage his dogs from eating it he is then forced to give them a tap on the head with the walking lead or a stick. He also just happens to be photographed right at that very moment he gives them a tap, it then makes the headlines and he is branded a dog beater by the press. Despite the fact further tests conducted on the meat does indeed show he was justified in stopping his dogs from eating it, because the test on the meat shows someone had put anti-freeze on the piece of meat.

Would he be guilty of Animal cruelty then towards his dogs.

I know a lot of dog owners and including my family who dont allow their dogs if they can help it from eating stuff if they know potentially if it is not safe for them to do so. I know a lot of people stop their dogs from eating what they catch if they know about it at the time.
  #253  
Old 12-30-2008, 11:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kezza View Post
Well if they do then he should just pay the fine.
Playing devils advocate here. What if Prince Edward was walking his dogs through a park and his dog's discover some meat in the park. He does not want them to eat that meat, because the meat could be baited by someone who doesn't like dogs. In order to discourage his dogs from eating it he is then forced to give them a tap on the head with the walking lead or a stick.

If they were well trained dogs, Edward would only need 2 words "leave it".
  #254  
Old 12-31-2008, 12:45 AM
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Yes he could just say leave it I have said that to my dogs and tapped them on the head at the sametime. But the thing is it can be a bit hard to make them do so when food is involved, more so if it is raw meat.
  #255  
Old 12-31-2008, 12:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Kezza View Post
Would he be guilty of Animal cruelty then towards his dogs.
If the "tap" came from him holding a stick well over his head and bringing it down with apparent force, yeah, I hope so.
  #256  
Old 12-31-2008, 06:14 AM
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I can´t find a reason where a human being would beat or tap or hurt a dog. If the person in not able to be a "leader" when handling hunting dogs, then he shouldn´t even think of going hunting. If Edward has erred, he should be treated the same way as anybody else would. I lived many years in England and one of the many things I admired there was the way people treated their animals and how protective they were of them.
  #257  
Old 12-31-2008, 08:26 AM
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http://http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/77758/Prince-Edward-rides-out-dog-cruelty-claim

It's an article about prince Edward ridding with her sister,and he don't seem worry about the polemic of the dogs...
  #258  
Old 12-31-2008, 10:06 AM
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IMHO the RF is decent bunch - apart of this Peter Philips of course who sold out his relatives to finance his marriage . No reason to hide anything.

And frankly I still cannot see anything apart of a stick waving in the air in all these pictures.

Don't you think there would be some kind of proof had he really hit the dog? Don't you think a vet would have been involved had one of the dogs been hurt? Since I have seen neither a photo-proof nor any other hard evidence I still prefer to be in doubt for Edward.
  #259  
Old 12-31-2008, 10:30 AM
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[quote=QUEENECE29;873188]Prince 'struck dog' claim inquiry

BBC NEWS | UK | England | Norfolk | Prince 'struck dog' claim inquiry


Do any of the pictures actually show him hitting the dog?? If so I can''t see it, perhaps one dog was being violent to the other and he was warning it.

I am a complete animal lover and cruelty is a big no-no in my eyes but is he really beating the dog or just warning it?
  #260  
Old 12-31-2008, 10:31 AM
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The extended and seemingly never-ending personal bickering had passed its "enough already!" stage and has been removed.

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