Duke and Duchess of Cambridge Current Events 5: March-December 2013


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I love how some people on here read something and totally misinterpret it.

SisterMorphine NEVER wrote anything about adding anyone to her ignore list or encouraging anyone to ignore another poster. She DID write that for her it would be best not to reply to some posts. There is huge difference between both statements.

I don't have a problem with people's opinions not being the same as mine. I do get sick of having to read the same drivel over and over and over again. We all know Gracie and Kitty don't like W&K. A lot of us are wondering why they even bother reading threads related to W&K.

My mother told me that if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all. Perhaps we ALL should do that.
 
A lot of what you say is guessing on your part. Checking first to make sure you're accurate would prevent people from correcting you. Without doing much searching, I find that William has had several engagements on behalf of this particular charity. From the website:

"The Prince attended the launch of the 'Remember on Mother’s Day' campaign at London’s Sladmore Contemporary Art Gallery on Thursday 12th March, where his patronage was announced. He made a speech and had private meetings with bereaved families who have been supported by the charity.

Since then, the Duke of Cambridge has attended a number of events for us:"


Child Bereavement UK > About Us > HRH The Duke of Cambridge KG, KT

There is a list of engagements at that link if you'd care to peruse it. If you don't like the Cambridges, that's fine. We don't all like the same things or the same people. But if you don't like them because of what you imagine they do or don't do, say or don't say, maybe that's best not told to people who can prove otherwise.
 
I love how some people on here read something and totally misinterpret it.

SisterMorphine NEVER wrote anything about adding anyone to her ignore list or encouraging anyone to ignore another poster. She DID write that for her it would be best not to reply to some posts. There is huge difference between both statements.

You don't understand - it's much better for some people to play the victim and act like they've been wronged than admit that maybe they said something they shouldn't have. No, I didn't tell anyone to put her on their ignore lists, no I didn't tell her to eff off, in fact I said quite specifically that NO ONE told her that, however what I did say is that rather than engage in pointless, futile bickering and arguing with her, it would be best not to respond to it. What that means is, if you don't like her, don't engage her. Don't start arguments, don't argue back. Just move on.

How is that in anyway telling the entirety of this forum to ignore her?
 
...Checking first to make sure you're accurate would prevent people from correcting you. Without doing much searching, I find that William has had several engagements on behalf of this particular charity. From the website:.

Since then, the Duke of Cambridge has attended a number of events for us:"
...
Thank you for showing me that, Cinrit, I will read it, and evaluate it. Obviously I was wrong regarding his overall involvement with the charity.

I still think his PR needs a good boost, whether it is in fact him or his PR.
 
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...Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe this is his FIRST visit to the charity..
This is definitely NOT William's first visit to this particular charity since he was made patron. His first visit was actually in 2009 just after he was named as patron and on that occasion he made a lovely and poignant speech about a child never being able to say the word "Mummy" again and a mother never hearing it. It well and truly stuck in my mind. He has made other visits, including fundraising initiatives. (you can always trawl through the Court Circular for the past 4 years to find out!) There was at least one charity polo
match in the past few years that raised money for this charity.

I don't know where you get this idea that William's popularity is at all this low? Opinion polls consistently rate him highly and both he and Kate attract reasonable crowds (considering it's still freezing in the UK at the moment for people to stand outdoors!) when they make public appearances. Using online tabloid newspaper stories to support the theory that W & K are unpopular isn't an indication of the reality. Online news outlets have a readership that's mainly foreign based, that's the beauty of the internet. Locals can always buy a paper to read on their daily commute.
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One thing has become clear to me. All of us who read this thread and Ms. Whalan's article are now more informed as to what Child Bereavement UK is and what it does and what it is there for.

Nice Nofret stated in a previous post "It is their royal duty to care for the sick and destitute and bereaved people in their country - in no other context anyone asked them to be destitute and sick and bereaved themselves. Where is the difference? You do NOT have to know a specific tragedy by own experience to be compassionate and feeling." I'd like to amend that a bit and state that is very well could have been that William and Kate and Harry as part time royals could have very well opted out for "safe" patronages such as "The Tesco Trust for Organic Foods" or "The National Zoo Fund for the protection of the spotted field mouse". These three royals chose what patronages they stand behind and patronages by the royals are issues that we don't commonly hear of in day to day life. Homelessness, support for our wounded warriors, HIV in children in Lesotho (did anyone really know Lesotho existed even before Harry's involvement in Sentabale? I didnt.) Since their marriage, Kate hand picked out the issues of addiction, children's hosptice and fittingly to tag along with it, child bereavement along with interests in art and scouting. Although these royals do keep up on their patronages and work behind the scenes with the organizers, their main focus is to create public awareness of what these patronages are doing and bump up donations so the folks that actually do the work have the means which to do it with. An example is how quickly the EACH bracelets sold out because Kate wore one.

The fact that Kate visited with William while pregnant to me was not some big kind of a faux pas. Just because she is royal and maybe has privileges and opportunities that most of us don't, it doesn't guarantee that at some time in her life, what other parents and children are going through won't be her in the future. I'm sure that William and Harry never expected to lose their mother at such a young age and I feel that perhaps because they did, they can feel empathy for what other people are going through losing family members close to them. When we lose someone close to us, its often the case that we feel alone in our grief but with awareness that there are charities and patronages such as EACH and Child Bereavement gets the word out there that no one has to be alone during troubled times.

Personally I applaud these young royals for their choices in what they support and work for and through watching their involvement over the years, I don't see any indication that there is any reason to believe it is for self gratification or for publicity reasons. Awareness is something they can call attention to. Older folks tend to buy things "sponsored" by people they know and recognize such as Alex Trebek (Jeopardy game show) and Henry Winkler (cool Fonz). Sports fans listen to Michael Jordan and football stars. Children growing up learn from Barney and Big Bird. We all seem to pay more attention to something if someone we recognize is drawing attention to it.

These are my views and how I see it. I don't expect everyone under the sun to see it my way. I do think that the article written by Ms. Whalan was in poor taste but that's just me.

Gracie: I will not ignore you. I need my daily dose of giraffeness and do admire them for the ability to stick their neck out every once in a while. :D
 
...Without doing much searching, I find that William has had several engagements on behalf of this particular charity.
Thanks! It was an enlightening read. I also managed to look more into the website and under the section "press release", I found this:

Young People on Mountain Rescue Challenge

This is another good example of the good work the Princes' and Kate charity foundation has done. They do care, even when there is no media presence!
 
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... I believe this is his FIRST visit to the charity...
As others have already pointed out, this isn't his first visit to the charity.

Royal engagements take a while to plan, so this wasn't just put together at the last minute (to help combat any negative press). This engagement would have been at least a month or two in the making.

As for the brownie comments, I don't see why it's a big deal. William and Kate complimented Mary on her recipes and on the the cake she made for the visit. It was a 20 second snippet in a 5 minute conversation. If you look at video of their conversation (I believe it's been posted), you'll see that the bulk of it focused on the charity. The media is the one that choose to highlight the brownie/cake comments.

And is public opinion on him low? I've not heard that.

Thanks for the links, cinrit and Hollie.
 
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Will is losing popularity? According to who? Forums and the Daily Mail comment section? Truly curious because this is the first i am hearing about it.
 
Will is losing popularity? According to who? Forums and the Daily Mail comment section? Truly curious because this is the first i am hearing about it.

He's not. He and Kate consistently poll as some of the most popular members of the royal family. And yea, all I can think is that posters that feel that way are basing their comments on daily mail comment sections which is not a good way to collect data.
 
The Duke & Duchess of Cambridge remain very popular members of the royal family. Along with Prince Harry. Nothing has changed about that.
 
The Duke & Duchess of Cambridge remain very popular members of the royal family. Along with Prince Harry. Nothing has changed about that.
Agree.

Also, the trending increase in engagements by William and Kate should not be interpreted as a response to a minority who gauge the amount or quality of work they do by what appears in the media.

Rather, it should be viewed as the previously announced 2 years of William and Kate being part-time royals is coming to a close. (William and Kate's 2nd anniversary is at the end of next month.)
 
The Whalen article has a very valid criticism, but presents her argument in a juvenile way that is aimed more at attacking William and Catherine than actually critiquing their behaviour. As Whalen is an academic I have even more of a problem with it than I might were she just a blogger, because an academic should know that this is not how you make an argument about something.

Underneath the gimmicks, Whalen's argument is essentially that this engagement can be seen as a publicity stunt aimed at improving Catherine's reputation but fails to take into consideration the tactlessness of bringing a pregnant woman to a charity event for parents who have lost a child. Furthermore, Whalen also criticizes both William and Catherine for their seemingly awkward behaviour, and calls into question some of the things that they said while at this engagement, notably William stating that he's been in a similar situation owing to the death of his mother.

I think on a surface level all of these issues can be seen as legitimate, although Whalen makes assumptions about the circumstances of the engagement, takes some things out of context, and fails to grasp the purpose of the charity. As such, rather than constructing a clear and valid argument, Whalen has essentially written a fluff piece.

The argument that this is a publicity stunt to boost Catherine's popularity is, in my opinion, a bit ridiculous, and doesn't take into consideration just how much Catherine's been doing lately. She has gotten a lot of criticism (at least on online forums) for being seen as not doing enough, especially as unlike William and Harry she's not otherwise employed, but I think that we've seen her doing a lot lately (whether it's a lot more than usual or not I don't know). We could possibly say that the BRF is trying to put Catherine out there more (if she is in fact doing more engagements), perhaps in response to this criticism or perhaps because they're anticipating her to do less as her pregnancy progresses. I don't think this event in itself is a publicity stunt (any more than any engagement with the press involved is one), and I think that this is a cause that really means something to William. Catherine's involvement in it is most likely because of her relationship with William, but I don't agree that we can criticize her for being involved in something simply because it's important to her husband - doing stuff like that is a part of relationships.

If Catherine's pregnancy wasn't taken into account when arranging this engagement and selecting the parents that were in attendence then I do think this is a huge error both on the part of the BRF and the charity itself. Whalen makes an assumption that they didn't take her pregnancy into account, I'm going to make the opposite assumption. I don't think that a charity that deals with grieving people is going to be that tactless and, as far as I understand it's the charity that selects which of its members were there.

I do agree with the general argument that some of what William did there was awkward, but I think that's just him in general. He's prone to being awkward, and I hope that in time he learns to kind of relax a bit in situations like this. I don't think it's inappropriate for William to compare the loss of his mother to the loss that the people at Child Bereavement have sustained. His mother's death is the reason why he chose to be associated with Child Bereavement, and the charity is for both parents who have lost a child and children who have lost a parent or other close relation. If the charity itself is essentially saying that there is an association between the two situations then it's not really inappropriate for William to say so either.
 
Ish said:
....If the charity itself is essentially saying that there is an association between the two situations then it's not really inappropriate for William to say so either.
Child Bereavement UK is not "essentially saying" anything. Their outright, boldly-stated purpose - right on the home page of their website - is the belief:
...that all families should have access to the support and information they need when a child grieves or when a child dies.

Child Bereavement UK's mission statement is not open to interpretation by anyone, including Whalen. It's their mission statement (a mission statement is a statement of the purpose of a company, organization or person, its reason for existing).

As to whether it's appropriate that a pregnant woman attend Child Bereavement UK - if a child has lost a father, or a sibling, it could be that their mother is pregnant. To infer that their mother should not attend Child Bereavement UK because she is pregnant is preposterous.
 
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As to whether it's appropriate that a pregnant woman attend Child Bereavement UK - if a child has lost a father, or a sibling, it could be that their mother is pregnant. To infer that their mother should not attend Child Bereavement UK because she is pregnant is preposterous.

I do think that if Catherine's presence at the event had been previously unannounced it would have been at a minimum rude of them. In this case it's not simply a pregnant woman attending an event, it's a pregnant woman who is at least in part the focus of this very publicized event. If she had just shown up without telling CBUK that she was coming with William then it could have been really hard on the parents there.

To just randomly show up, be the focus of the event, hug the parents there, and have the press involved (at least partially) is a lot if the parents who have lost children haven't been previously informed that Catherine would be there. With prior information the parents can decide whether or not this is a type of event they can handle. Without it, they're potentially been thrown into the deep end.

The assumption that Whalen is making is that Catherine just showed up to this event; that she hadn't been invited to it, or CBUK hadn't been informed that she was coming. If that happened I do believe a massive error was made - but I personally see no reason to believe that that's what happened. Royal engagements are planned out well in advance and I really doubt that a royal can go "you know, I'm not doing anything today, let's go to this engagement with hubby." It is highly unlikely that the people attending the event didn't know well before hand that Catherine was going to be there and were unable to make the decision for themselves if they could handle being at such an event around a pregnant woman.
 
Child Bereavement UK is not "essentially saying" anything. Their outright, boldly-stated purpose - right on the home page of their website - is the belief:


As to whether it's appropriate that a pregnant woman attend Child Bereavement UK - if a child has lost a father, or a sibling, it could be that their mother is pregnant. To infer that their mother should not attend Child Bereavement UK because she is pregnant is preposterous.

I've read both sides of the particular argument and my take on it that the charity exists to aid bereaved parents/children to manage their grief and be able to live meaningful lives in the real world. And that includes meeting other parents with children; other children with parents and also pregnant women. The people that they met had been asked if they wanted to be there - if it was painful they would have said no. In laying the "blame" on Catherine, you are saying that the Charity allowed people to be upset or hurt - no way would that happen.

Everyone who attended was there because they made the decision to be there. I don't think that either William or Catherine are insensitive.
 
This engagement was officially announced by the media on March 7th. So everyone knew well in advance that William and Kate would be attending.

I think we should give the charity a little more credit. This organization has been dealing with bereaved families for years, so I'm pretty sure they took into account that Kate was pregnant, and asked those that W&K met if it would be okay.

Also, what awkward behavior did William exhibit during this visit?
 
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The assumption that Whalen is making is that Catherine just showed up to this event; that she hadn't been invited to it, or CBUK hadn't been informed that she was coming...

...It is highly unlikely that the people attending the event didn't know well before hand that Catherine was going to be there and were unable to make the decision for themselves if they could handle being at such an event around a pregnant woman.

Well, then Whalen is a fool for making such an assumption. The BRF is well versed in manners, protocol and diplomacy. Attending an engagement without being invited is the height of boorish behaviour.

Again, Child Bereavement UK's stated purpose is to support when a child grieves or when a child dies. Because of this duality of purpose, there will always be pregnant women, or families that have children that are of age, or look like the one you lost, in attendance at CBUK's programs and services.
 
Part of me wants them to do another engagement so this craziness can end, the other part fears what craziness will erupt from the next engagement.
Btw if this forum is open to discussion and debate then it has to go both ways. If you give your opinion be prepared for people to disagree and state theirs back.
 
Everyone enjoyed Their Royal Highnesses visit and it was also a touching day. I saw nothing but warmth and comfort at the visit.

I think everyone should now move on now.
 
Part of me wants them to do another engagement so this craziness can end, the other part fears what craziness will erupt from the next engagement.
Btw if this forum is open to discussion and debate then it has to go both ways. If you give your opinion be prepared for people to disagree and state theirs back.

Yea, all of this is so out of left field. I'm still baffled that a fairly typical royal engagement inspired so much ugly commentary.

I hope this doesn't become something people do for all of William and Kate's appearances.
 
Whalen got what she wanted didn't she? Oxygen of publicity.

Over here the UK public, who knew about it being a joint engagement, thought that it went very well and so did the charity and the people William and Catherine met. At the end of the day, that is all that counts.
 
Yea, all of this is so out of left field. I'm still baffled that a fairly typical royal engagement inspired so much ugly commentary.

I hope this doesn't become something people do for all of William and Kate's appearances.
Me too.

Although I believe that those who are already antagonistic towards William and Kate might be getting more so. Especially because we are coming to the end of the announced 2 year part-time royal status for William and Kate (their 2nd wedding anniversary is next month) and their baby's birth in July.

With an increased public presence and a babe in arms, the already popular William and Kate's popularity will really take off about the middle of the year.
 
He makes this visit at a time when public opinion about him is falling - he and Kate are being called out on their commitment to the BRF, on their vacation schedule, on Kate's downtime.

Could you please provide a link to the opinion poll that leads you to state this opinion as a fact?

The most recent opinion poll on this subject, that I know of, was in November 2012, carried out by King's College London/Ipsos MORI. KCL is one of the most respected universities in the country and Ipsos Mori is one of the best pollsters around. Their poll found that Prince William is not only popular, he's the most popular member of the BRF by a significant margin, even more popular than the Queen at the end of her amazing Jubilee/Olympic performance year.

Kate is also more popular than all the royals excepting William, the Queen and Harry (who was in Afghan at the time). This was after the French topless photos scandal, and before her pregnancy was announced, of course.

Taking the comments at the end of a Daily Mail article (or any other paper for that matter) as an indicator of the opinions of the British people is a big mistake. The big majority of the DM's readership is from outside the UK, and commenters can claim to be from literally anywhere. On one DM article on the royals it'll be loads of "these people are parasites" comments, then the next day another article will be "we're so lucky to have these people representing our country".

The only people unhappy with William's work ethic are those who clearly don't value the job he does as a SAR pilot, putting his own life in danger to help others. We knew Kate wouldn't be a full-time royal for at least the first few years, BP and CH were open and honest about that at the start.
 
Taking the comments at the end of a Daily Mail article (or any other paper for that matter) as an indicator of the opinions of the British people is a big mistake. The big majority of the DM's readership is from outside the UK, and commenters can claim to be from literally anywhere.

Also, I work for a news website, and while I can't say that this is the case across the board, I know in our case, the stats show only about 3% of the people who read the site are commenting. It really is a very small portion of the population and it's certainly not representative.
 
The only "shift" in opinion re William is that the most recent poll asked about who should become the next monarch (as if there is a choice!). The poll found in favour of Charles over William - something like 42% vs 37% (this is from memory) and the poll before the most recent had that the other way round.

I saw that as a greater acceptance of Charles (and Camilla) following Jubilee Year.

It wasn't a popularity question so I dont think that it counts but the info was posted somewhere on this site.
 
I saw the poll in the DM a little earlier, and it was 51% for Charles vs. 49% for William. Very, very close.
 
As in many situations, the media feels that they are the ones who made a person "popular".
Then once the public likes and admires the person, the media starts a campaign to take down the person --- articles critical of the person - focus on a negative event- use a minor comment to take away from the value of the event. Or focus on a dumb comment as representative of the appearance.

the media has started on Kate --- all the stories on her hatred of the wonderful perfect upper class girlfriend of Harry.
Stories of problems in the Cambridge marriage.

Etc

If a parent who has lost a child has problem seeing a pregnant woman, they are probably staying close to home so not to see any pregnant women as Kate is not the only woman expecting.
 
...the media has started on Kate...
Not in the UK. And believe me there are 1 or 2 papers who would print this if they had the story. The US rags have not the slightest idea about the BRF - they make it up because people buy it and believe it.
 
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