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View Poll Results: Who is your favourite of King Henry VIII's six wives?
Catherine of Aragon 100 33.44%
Anne Boleyn 100 33.44%
Jane Seymour 34 11.37%
Anne of Cleves 30 10.03%
Katherine Howard 11 3.68%
Catherine Parr 24 8.03%
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  #81  
Old 12-12-2008, 02:42 PM
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Definitely Anne kind of got what she deserved. Losing the head over false charges was alittle dramatic. She was manipulative...but she was being used as well. She couldn't marry who she wanted and she was like Whatever!

There was no need for her to be just plain mean to Mary. What a sad child who ended up being a miserly unhappy woman. I wonder what life what have been for her if she didn't have such a miserable childhood. Its a wonder that Elizabeth grew up to be somewhat okay.
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  #82  
Old 12-12-2008, 04:08 PM
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You have looked at what must have made her the way she was Zonk, she must have had a miserable childhood, sent off to France and from what I read she was sent there as a very small child and not a grown woman as in the film. Then when she fell in love she wasn´t allowed to marry him, whether it was just that she wasn´t thought of high enough birth for him or whether the King already had his eye on her, it was a tragedy for her.
She was not a nice person, wasn´t she the one that wore yellow the day she heard that Catherine of Aragon had died? But she paid very dearly for her sins by being executed for a crime she didn´t commit. Of all the Queens of King Henry VIII she is the one I would like to see a lifelike portrait of, as the one we see so often just doesn´t capture her as the seductive person she must have been.
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  #83  
Old 12-12-2008, 04:40 PM
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I definitely think she was a victim...but some of the things that she did were just mean. Victim or not. Separating Mary from her dying Mother...yes, it was the will of Henry but still. That is just mean.

Women basically, at that time had no value. Simple as that. She was used by her family to get a head and when she needed them, they weren't there. Its a shame that Catherine Howard had no guidance. What where they thinking of letting another female family member marry Henry VIII.

Anne of Cleves definitely ended up a winner.

Catherine of Aragon - used as a pawn by Henry VII. Husband dies...pass her off to the next son
Anne Boleyn - family is looking to move up the food chain
Jane Seymour - same thing. She is somewhat lucky she gave Henry the son he needed but at what cost to her life.
Anne of Cleves - Winner!
Catherine Howard - see Anne Bolyen
Catherine Parr- thinks she is a winner because she survives Henry, marries someone who she really loves and he turns out to be a loser!

Again...I am surprised that Elizabeth turned out as well as she did. Edward IV definitely had the potential not to be so nice.
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  #84  
Old 12-13-2008, 04:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Zonk View Post
Catherine of Aragon - used as a pawn by Henry VII. Husband dies...pass her off to the next son
She was cetainly used as a pawn by Henry VII, but equally so by her father, a master of Byzantine politics and secret and shifting alliances. Two ruthless men with Catherine as a bargaining chip.

From David Starkey, The Wives of Henry VIII p79, 82

As for Catherine, what was she? She was a royal widow certainly. And, at the age of sixteen, might yet be a royal wife again. But whose?

Answering these questions took seven long years as her parents and her father-in-law manoeuvred and bargained. Catherine was the person most concerned with the outcome. But no one thought to consult her. Nor apparently did she expect them to.

In the negotiations between England and Spain, Henry VII held the trump card: he had control of Catherine's person. He played this advantage shrewdly and with increasing ruthlessness...

The Spanish faltered:
Meanwhile, Ferdinand and Isabella tried to regain the initiative in their dealings with Henry VII. Their representatives in England were ordered to put two proposals to the King. The first was to demand that Henry VII send Catherine safely back to Spain. The second was to offer Catherine to him once more as a bride for the new heir to the throne, Prince Henry. The proposals were of course contradictory... Henry VII was well briefed about the real intention of Spanish policy and played his cards accordingly.
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  #85  
Old 12-13-2008, 09:52 AM
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Catherine herself didn't want to go back to Spain unmarried after her first husband's death. She was raised almost from birth to be the Queen of a great King and I daresay she would have thought that returning unmarried to Spain would have labelled her as a failure.

The ones I really feel sorry for are those younger sons and daughters who weren't meant to be married and instead were raised in monasteries and convents in preparation for a religious life. A convent or monastery was relatively more peaceful than the court but some of these children were pulled out of their safe cocoons when an older brother or sister died.

This happened to Louis VII of France, Eleanor of Aquitaine's first husband, who was pulled from the monastery when his older brother died. He supposedly longed for the peaceful days at the monastery the whole time of his reign.
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  #86  
Old 12-13-2008, 10:08 PM
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My favorite would have to be Catherine of Aragon. I have read the Constant Princess and it was really good. I always liked Catherine, too bad she didn't have any sons to inherit the throne of Henry VIII. Nevertheless, Mary is ok too.
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  #87  
Old 12-30-2008, 09:24 AM
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My favourite is Anne Boleyn.
She is by far the most interesting and fascinating queen of the six of them. Nowadays she would make quite the amazing queen. And thanks to her the UK got to know the greatest queen in the history; Elizabeth.
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  #88  
Old 12-30-2008, 10:53 AM
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As a child reading Jean Plaidy books & seeing Anne of a Thousand Days made Anne Boleyn an attractive figure to me. I also went to Hever Castle & found it to be a magical place. There seems to have been so many interesting aspects to her - the time she spent at the French court, her interest in Luther, not to mention her wit/intelligence in keeping Henry for so long. Apart from Katherine Parr, I personally don't think the others can shine a light to Anne.
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  #89  
Old 12-30-2008, 12:00 PM
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England should always be grateful to Anne Boleyn for giving them Queen Elizabeth I, a very strong sovereign at a time when rulers had to be very very strong.
Perhaps her dying so tragically when Elizabeth was so small, which meant that Elizabeth had to fend for herself and struggle at times to survive. Anne was vain and thought more of herself than anything or anyone but among the wives of Henry VIII she is the most fascinating. I would love to see what she really looked like and not these strange portraits that have survived, everyone says how bewitching she was and these paintings show nothing of that, in fact in most of them she looks quite plain.
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  #90  
Old 12-30-2008, 04:59 PM
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Too true. The women look so 'weird' in those paintings. Not really human.
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  #91  
Old 12-30-2008, 05:03 PM
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she was responsable for so much more the just giving us Elizabeth I. she was so smart and well read. she was IMO reponsable for sewing the seed of breaking away from the Roman church. she was the one putting in Henry's mind that he should be head of the church and that he should not answer to any one.... she was a women a head of her time... my favorite of the six by far....
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  #92  
Old 12-31-2008, 03:39 AM
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Lady Ann, she did most of these things you say are so smart - unwittingly. She only put the idea that Henry should be head of the church into his head, because she wanted him to abandon his wife of so many years to marry her and make her Queen of England. She got him to completely ignore his daughter Mary, who incidentally at Anne´s instigation was reduced from a Princess to a bastard and made to wait on her baby sister. Anne had absolutely no moral conscience, it is said she treated everyone with disdain. She was not ahead of her time, she was a completely selfish young woman who only thought of herself and how to get what she wanted with no thought to the consequences. She was a great one for intrigue and caused her own brother´s death. She gave birth to Elizabeth but she would have done anything in her power if it were possible to not have her and have a boy.
In the end she was beheaded for a crime she didn´t commit but she was the cause of so much misery, in a way it was not that underserved, by that I mean her downfall not her horrific death.
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  #93  
Old 01-01-2009, 04:00 PM
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Wink

Yes, I know what she did and what she was. I was just smilply stating that IMO she was much more crafty then women of her time ... I do believe she was smart and well read also, I don't think it would have been had any other way by her father...she may have been unwittingly resopnsable but in the end still resposnable ..and shame on Henry for ignoring his daugher and declaring her a bastard, but if I recall he did the same to Elizabeth?? What men will do for the love of a woman in the moment. His morals not questioned by me at all..you have made as always just and wise statements. but who does not like a little adventure in their history she is just a very great part of the story to me .. That is all ... my favorite part of that one ...
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  #94  
Old 01-05-2009, 07:22 PM
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What men will do for the love of a woman in the moment.
More like what wouldn't he do for a male heir.
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  #95  
Old 01-05-2009, 09:22 PM
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My favourirte Queen is Anne Boleyn. I think she was complex and incredibly fascinating.

Anne was a woman of her time but she caused a precedence for woman by causing the divorce of HenryVIII and Catherine, making it possible for Henry to divorce.

Also Anne was the first Queen to be beheaded for adultery.

Anne caused a lot of intrigue which caused her own downfall and the downfall of her family.

Despite this I still like Anne for her passion and her belief in the reformation of the English Church. The effects of this were felt through the ages in England.
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  #96  
Old 01-06-2009, 02:50 PM
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yes, Russphile your statement is very true... lol
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  #97  
Old 01-06-2009, 04:07 PM
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Yes, I know what she did and what she was. I was just smilply stating that IMO she was much more crafty then women of her time ... I do believe she was smart and well read also, I don't think it would have been had any other way by her father...she may have been unwittingly resopnsable but in the end still resposnable ..and shame on Henry for ignoring his daugher and declaring her a bastard, but if I recall he did the same to Elizabeth?? What men will do for the love of a woman in the moment. His morals not questioned by me at all..you have made as always just and wise statements. but who does not like a little adventure in their history she is just a very great part of the story to me .. That is all ... my favorite part of that one ...
I agree with you completely, Anne Boleyn was the most interesting and fascinating of Henry´s queens, I think she is the one that we think of first too. If anyone suddenly asked you to name the queens I think she would appear first and then we would go in the right order afterwards. I have said before I would love to see a real picture of her although most people of the time said it was her charm which made her so attractive and she had a French way with her which was thought interesting. It was said her sense of fashion was wonderful and that even the sleeve she invented to cover a defect in a finger was taken up by all the women in the court - now that was true flattery.
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  #98  
Old 01-06-2009, 06:34 PM
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This is one of my favorite subjects. They all have different aspects. Katherine of Aragon, for the aspect that she was absolutely right that according to the laws of the day they were married. Anne Boleyn for managing to hold Henry off for 7 years, who almost certainly was not guilty of what she lost her head for. Jane Seymour for having the bad luck to not only deliver the longed for male Heir, but then to die of purpureal fever. Anne of Cleves, Highly intelligent she managed to live to tell the story of being 'unwifed' by Henry and live a full measure as 'The King's Dearest Sister', Catherine Howard... teenage slut who had the old man slavering, and most likely did deserve the chop for caryings on. Or Katherine Parr, survived her 3rd marriage to an old man, only do die in childbirth within the year of Henry's death.
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  #99  
Old 01-06-2009, 08:05 PM
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I too loved The Constant Princess!

I realize its based on actual facts with a TON of fictition involved...but I would like to think that Catherine did in fact die knowing that one of her husbands had truly loved her!

That aside.....makes you kind of wonder how British royal history might have been different if Arthur had lived, Catherine had remained his wife and maybe even provided the desired male child?

Okay..I have started a thread for my new obsession. Please free to share your thoughts http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums...ory-19611.html
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  #100  
Old 01-06-2009, 09:11 PM
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Oh that's cool Zonk! I'm there!
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