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  #1  
Old 08-05-2005, 12:05 PM
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Which Princes of Wales have NOT acceeded to the throne?

I thought it would be fun to see which Princes of Wales didn't quite make it to the top.

The ones that come to mind:

Edward, the Black Prince
Arthur, Prince of Wales, elder brother to Henry VIII and first husband of Catherine of Aragon
Henry, Prince of Wales, elder brother to Charles I

Any others?
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  #2  
Old 08-05-2005, 12:48 PM
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Frederick, Prince of Wales (father of King George III)
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  #3  
Old 08-05-2005, 01:04 PM
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The Duke of Clarence (son of Edward VII) was the most recent one.

According to the Prince of Wales's website, six of them died before becoming king.

http://www.princeofwales.gov.uk/abou...evprinces.html
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Old 08-05-2005, 02:22 PM
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Thanks for the link, Elspeth.

It looks like the others were:

Edward (son of Henry VI and Margaret of Anjou):
Edward (son of Richard III and Anne of Warwick):
James (son of James II and Mary of Modena):

That makes seven. Perhaps the website isn't counting James.

The Duke of Clarence was never Prince of Wales though. He died when his father was still Prince of Wales. Interesting though, I didn't know that Richard III had any children.
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Old 08-05-2005, 05:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elspeth
The Duke of Clarence (son of Edward VII) was the most recent one.
There's a Comic called From Hell which stars the Duke of Clarence. It's an excellent suspense thriller about Jack the Ripper. It has been adapted for screen with Johnny Depp but the book is far better. It's part fictional, part historical and there's a lot of details about the shadiest aspects of the Duke's life. I recommend warmly the book.
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Old 08-05-2005, 09:51 PM
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Henry, Prince of Wales, son of James I of England. Charles, the second son, took his place and went on to become Charles I of England.
Arthur, Prince of Wales, son of Henry VII and Elizabeth of York. His brother Henry went on to become King Henry VIII.
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Old 08-06-2005, 10:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Idriel
There's a Comic called From Hell which stars the Duke of Clarence. It's an excellent suspense thriller about Jack the Ripper. It has been adapted for screen with Johnny Depp but the book is far better. It's part fictional, part historical and there's a lot of details about the shadiest aspects of the Duke's life. I recommend warmly the book.
I like Johnny Depp except when he's in the chocolate factory so I'll have to see this movie.
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Old 08-06-2005, 10:51 AM
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Edward, son of Henry VI and Margaret of Anjou. He married Lady Anne Neville (if the marriage was ever consummated), daughter of the Earl of Warwick, the "King Maker." She eventually became queen when she married Richard III.
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Old 08-06-2005, 03:50 PM
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Here's a book on Henry, Prince of Wales.

Henry, Prince of Wales and England's Lost Renaissance

Apparently, Henry would have made a far different king than his brother Charles I.
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Old 08-06-2005, 04:05 PM
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Would have been hard to be a worse king than Charles I.
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Old 08-06-2005, 04:25 PM
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Oh, I dunno; Edward II was an irresponsible weakling, and Richard II was a psychopath. Charles I was something of a hopeless romantic, but those other two were just hopeless.
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Old 08-06-2005, 04:27 PM
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Oh, blimey, now someone's recommending books. That's a cruel thing to do to an addict, ysbel.
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Old 08-06-2005, 05:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elspeth
Oh, I dunno; Edward II was an irresponsible weakling, and Richard II was a psychopath. Charles I was something of a hopeless romantic, but those other two were just hopeless.
LOL, Elspeth! There was a movie about Edward II. He was so popular when his wife led a rebellion, no one came out to support him. That's really bad! Even Charles I had his supporters. We could probably start a thread 'Kings who made it to the throne but shouldn't have'.

I'll hold off my other book recommendations for now.
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Old 08-07-2005, 04:25 AM
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You want another weak king?? Try Henry VI!! He was definitely not mentally fit for the throne and when his son was born, he didn't understand that he was a father because he didn't think he had sex because of his extreme piety a la Edward the Confessor!

He also made a big mistake marrying Margaret of Anjou who was a cruel, ambitious bully of a woman. But then again, during the War of the Roses, maybe she had to be that way.
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Old 08-07-2005, 11:35 AM
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Yes - she'd probably have been a very effective CEO of a multinational company these days, but her qualities weren't much appreciated at the time. I wonder what her son would have been like as king if he hadn't been killed in the war, since he grew up under the shadow of a father who was so other-worldly and a mother who was so dominant.
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Old 08-07-2005, 12:43 PM
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What about the two young princes who were murdered by their uncle Richard III? Wasn´t one of them the heir to the throne, as well?
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Old 08-07-2005, 12:49 PM
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At the time he was murdered, he was already king (Edward V).

Whether he was murdered by Richard III or one of a number of other possibilities is a different matter, mind. It sort of depends which conspiracy theory you believe.
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Old 08-07-2005, 02:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elspeth
The Duke of Clarence (son of Edward VII) was the most recent one.

According to the Prince of Wales's website, six of them died before becoming king.

http://www.princeofwales.gov.uk/abou...evprinces.html
Mistake, the Duke of Clarence never received the title as Prince of Wales, as his father was still the Prince of Wales, and his Grandmother Victoria still Queen at the time of his tragic death.
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Old 08-07-2005, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ysbel
Thanks for the link, Elspeth.


That makes seven. Perhaps the website isn't counting James.

The Duke of Clarence was never Prince of Wales though. He died when his father was still Prince of Wales. Interesting though, I didn't know that Richard III had any children.
No, the website isn't counting the Duke of clarence, you wrote the answer youself. Look in the list, it goes from Edward VII being Prince of Wales, (son of Victoria)to George V (second son of George and Alexandra). The Duke of Clarence, son to King George and QAlexandra isn't counted as he never received the title
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Old 08-07-2005, 02:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elspeth
At the time he was murdered, he was already king (Edward V).

Whether he was murdered by Richard III or one of a number of other possibilities is a different matter, mind. It sort of depends which conspiracy theory you believe.
I think this is the king you mean, Elspeth.

Edward (son of Edward IV and Elizabeth Woodville): Created Prince of Wales on 26th June, 1471, aged seven months, at Westminster. Acceded as Edward V on 9th April, 1483

But you're right he was already King when he was murdered.
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