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  #521  
Old 06-25-2017, 02:45 AM
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Originally Posted by LauraS3514 View Post
That wouldn't surprise me in the least - public life was still very formal in Britain during Margaret's lifetime and she was very conscious of her place in the family as The Queen's only sibling. It's only been in the past few years that The Queen's grandchildren have Formality still reigns in public.
but that's referring to her, not speaking to her directly in public. If they were at a public engagement would Charles call out "ma'am" or "YOur Majesty" to the queen or say "Mama, please can I introduce you to..."
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  #522  
Old 06-25-2017, 04:33 AM
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Originally Posted by LauraS3514 View Post
That wouldn't surprise me in the least - public life was still very formal in Britain during Margaret's lifetime and she was very conscious of her place in the family as The Queen's only sibling. It's only been in the past few years that The Queen's grandchildren have started to refer to her as "granny" in public - and that has only been Harry, Beatrice, and Eugenie. Prince Charles will occasionally refer to her informally as "mummy" but only for effect - like at the Jubilee. As we saw in the documentary he made for her 90th he personally calls her Mama - with the emphasis on the second syllable. Anne, Andrew, and Edward refer to her as "Her Majesty" or "The Queen" in public as do Sophie, Peter, Zara, and even William. Formality still reigns in public.
I remember someone, I think it was James Whittaker, saying he was talking to Princess Anne when the butler came in to say the Queen was on the phone, Anne stood up the entire time she was talking to the Queen and only sat back down when she finished. He was made the point Anne was being respectful to HM and did it without even realising, that how ingrained into her it was. I wouldn't be surprised if to members of the public Margaret expected her children to refer to her as HRH
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  #523  
Old 06-25-2017, 06:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
but that's referring to her, not speaking to her directly in public. If they were at a public engagement would Charles call out "ma'am" or "YOur Majesty" to the queen or say "Mama, please can I introduce you to..."
My gut feelings on this would be the rule of thumb that its "Your Majesty" the first time you address the Queen and "Ma'am" after that even with her family in public.

I don't think Charles would call out to his mother but wait for an opportunity and then it would be Charles introducing the person of interest to the Queen first rather than introducing the Queen to the person of interest. Therefore, I believe he'd say something along the lines of "Ma'am, I'd like you to meet xxx". Most likely Ma'am because he's probably already addressed the Queen previously at the event or prior to it.

Margaret was known to be a stickler for protocol and I would imagine this same protocol would be adhered to in public. Anyone meeting Margaret would address her as "Your Royal Highness" to begin with and "Ma'am" after that.
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  #524  
Old 06-25-2017, 07:31 AM
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I suppose, but that is the queen. However, I do find it hard to imagine Margaret hissing at her children "call me Ma'am in front of people". (still she was know for being rude!!).
I mean I wuoldn't expect them to say "Hey Ma" In front of other people, but I cant see anything wrong with a polite "Mummy" in public
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  #525  
Old 06-25-2017, 08:17 AM
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David and Sarah wouldn't really be accompanying Margaret on a royal engagement like we would see with the Queen's family. I can't imagine if Margaret was out to dinner with David and Sarah that her kids would not use Mummy or what ever they called her instead your Royal Highness and ma'am .
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  #526  
Old 06-25-2017, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by tommy100 View Post
I remember someone, I think it was James Whittaker, saying he was talking to Princess Anne when the butler came in to say the Queen was on the phone, Anne stood up the entire time she was talking to the Queen and only sat back down when she finished. He was made the point Anne was being respectful to HM and did it without even realising, that how ingrained into her it was. I wouldn't be surprised if to members of the public Margaret expected her children to refer to her as HRH
I think that was good manners towards Whittaker on Anne's part rather than respect for the Queen on a phone call. It would have been bad manners for Anne to have settled in for a chat with her mother while she had a guest in the room.
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  #527  
Old 06-25-2017, 08:54 AM
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There is a difference between private conversations in a public place versus interacting with others in a public place. I imagine in private conversations Margaret was called "Mummy" by her children, when others were involved she was more formally addressed.
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  #528  
Old 07-01-2017, 07:26 AM
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Mabybe, if she was at dinner with friends, I imagine the children would call her Mummy, maybe if it was a bigger occasion and there were "outsiders" there they wodl say YRH
AS for anne, though I doubt if she was concerned about the feelings of a journalist.. if she stood up to talk to the queen, it was problaby out of an ingrained "My mother is the queen" feeling...
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  #529  
Old 07-20-2017, 01:29 AM
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New files show how Churchill gave money to Royal Princesses who is not able to find wealthy husbands to support them

Churchill gave money to princesses because there were no rich men | Royal | News | Express.co.uk
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  #530  
Old 07-20-2017, 02:48 AM
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New files show how Churchill gave money to Royal Princesses who is not able to find wealthy husbands to support them

Churchill gave money to princesses because there were no rich men | Royal | News | Express.co.uk
I just perused that. He gave a lot more money to the men.

Not surprising, for the son of a Buccaneer.
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  #531  
Old 08-15-2017, 03:25 PM
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Found this on Youtube:

"In the 1970's HRH Princess Margaret used to regularly pop round to my Mums 3 bed terrace. They would sit in the kitchen and talk about what was happening on the telly. Margaret absolutely loved Emmerdale Farm and she had been offered the chance of a cameo role. All it entailed was Margaret riding past on a horse as a few of the regulars stood talking.
The Queen forbade her to take part.
"Margaret. It is below the royal dignity.....".
Margaret was saddened and annoyed by this and she would often say that 'Liz' was jealous because Phil had a 'thing' for her.

Margaret stopped coming round after a slight tiff with my Mum.
For years she came round and ate all the chocolate digestives but never brought a packet round. One day my Mum served the tea but made a point of NOT handing out the biscuits. You could have cut the atmosphere with a knife.
That was February 11th 1980 and it was the last time she ever visited my Mum."


Of course we don't know if any of this is true but it certainly fits Princess Margaret and goes on to show how rude and entitled she was.
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  #532  
Old 08-15-2017, 03:57 PM
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Why wasn't Princess Margaret's husband made a duke, instead of just an earl?

I can't think she was too pleased about that.
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  #533  
Old 08-15-2017, 04:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Kronprinz View Post
Found this on Youtube:

<snipped>

Of course we don't know if any of this is true but it certainly fits Princess Margaret and goes on to show how rude and entitled she was.
Could you at least post a link so people interested can check out how credible this is, before we accuse P.Margaret of something?
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  #534  
Old 08-15-2017, 07:55 PM
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Why wasn't Princess Margaret's husband made a duke, instead of just an earl?

I can't think she was too pleased about that.


Had he been royal, or a peer, he may have been upgraded to a Duke, but as a total commoner, it was probably too big of a jump. Outside of the royal family, when was the last hereditary Duke created? Other than the Thatchers, have there been any other hereditary peers created at all?
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  #535  
Old 08-15-2017, 08:10 PM
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The YouTube extract about Prss Margaret sounds extremely unlikely, not because of Margaret's visiting people in a terrace house, (she may have done that with ex servants etc on occasion) but the whole tenor of the conversation.

Margaret was very loyal to her sister (surely she called her sister Lilibet not Liz) and I can't imagine in a million years her sitting gossiping about the Queen's relationship with her, or her brother in law's for that matter. "Phil has 'a thing' for me." Really! I can't imagine that she called Philip 'Phil' either. Margaret could be imperious and would often correct people if they spoke in an informal way about herself or her relatives. So, sorry, but it just reads like a load of rubbish to me.
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  #536  
Old 08-15-2017, 08:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
The YouTube extract about Prss Margaret sounds extremely unlikely, not because of Margaret's visiting people in a terrace house, (she may have done that with ex servants etc on occasion) but the whole tenor of the conversation.

Margaret was very loyal to her sister (surely she called her sister Lilibet not Liz) and I can't imagine in a million years her sitting gossiping about the Queen's relationship with her, or her brother in law's for that matter. "Phil has 'a thing' for me." Really! I can't imagine that she called Philip 'Phil' either. Margaret could be imperious and would often correct people if they spoke in an informal way about herself or her relatives. So, sorry, but it just reads like a load of rubbish to me.
Agreed.

I thought it was well known QEII is known as Lilibet among her closest. I cannot imagine Margaret calling her sister anything other than Lilibet.

And that Prince Phillip had a thing for Margaret? I doubt it.
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  #537  
Old 08-15-2017, 08:30 PM
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The last hereditary peerage given by this monarch was to the ex Prime Minister Harold Macmillan in 1984. It wasn't a dukedom. I believe the Queen had earlier asked Winston Churchill to accept a Dukedom when he last left office as PM, but he declined, as he didn't want to go to the Lords. I suspect King George VI had also offered a peerage to Churchill at the end of WW2, declined for the same reason.

The last non Royal Dukedom given was by Queen Victoria to the Earl of Fife who had married her granddaughter Louise (the eldest daughter of the future King Edward VII.) That was adjusted in 1900, just before Victoria's death, to allow the Duke's elder daughter to inherit the Dukedom as there were no surviving sons.

A Rare Species: Britain's Non-Royal Dukedoms | History Today
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  #538  
Old 08-15-2017, 11:41 PM
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Why would he expect to be made a duke? I think he wasn't too pushed at all, and just accepted it so that his son, the queen's nephew would not just be plain Mr Jones.. whch seemed "odd" at the time. When Anne was married, it is said that the queen wanted her to accept a title for Mark, because she was expecting a baby and it would be plain Master Phillips.. but by the 1970s it did not seem so "offbeat" for the queen's grandson to be just "master" - it seemed more egalitarian.
And Mark P didn't want a title, nor did Anne want her children to be titled so they never received any
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  #539  
Old 09-09-2017, 05:14 PM
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Her Rude Highness: Beautiful, yes, but not particularly charming, CRAIG BROWN on how Princess Margaret turned pickiness into an art form as she went out of her way to put ruffle feathers and put strangers at unease

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  #540  
Old 09-10-2017, 01:00 AM
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I don't think this is a great revelation to any Royal watcher. It's well known that this woman could turn the charm on full blast when she wanted to, but also at times froze people out, imperiously demanded that they do things like hold her ashtray while she smoked, and was very inconsiderate of other people's feelings when she wanted to enjoy herself at the piano until the early hours of the morning.
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