Prince Henry, Duke of Gloucester (1900-1974) and Princess Alice (1901-2004)

[Mbruno]

Can anybody tell me some information about him? He's always overshadowed by his older and younger brothers and sister as well as his wife that lived to 100.

Prince Henry, Duke of Gloucester, was the 11th Governor-General of Australia from January 1945 until March 1947.

I suspect the Australians, Canadians and South Africans on the forum will disagree, but I miss that era when the Governor-Generals of the Commonwealth realms were British peers or, more rarely, even members of the Royal Family itself.

 

[Iluvbertie]

After how bad he was as GG it was no wonder that the Australians didn't want another royal. He was high-handed and officious at all times - didn't go down well down-under.

Why would we want a foreigner as GG. South Africa has the right idea - a Head of State who is their own. SA has been a republic since 1961.

 

[Curryong]

Can anybody tell me some information about him? He's always overshadowed by his older and younger brothers and sister as well as his wife that lived to 100.

Baby Prince Henry or Harry as he was known in the family, apparently delighted his brothers and sister, according to his mother. He had many godparents including the Kaiser and the future Queen Maud of Norway, (his aunt.) He was regarded as delicate as a child, susceptible to coughs and colds. Henry also suffered from knock knees like his brother Bertie.

Henry was the first child of a British monarch to go to boarding school, St Peters at Broadstairs and then Eton. It was said that his father wanted him to go into the navy like his brothers, but he chose the army, entering Sandhurst in 1919. After that he went to Trinity College Cambridge for a year, almost certainly not by his own wish.

He later served with the Kings Royal Rifle Corps and the 10th Royal Hussars, before retiring from active service in 1937, presumably to help the new King and Queen with Royal duties. It was during his army career that his reputation seems to have grown as a man with a very quick temper, not super intelligent, hardworking but with a bit of a drink problem.

In spite of this he was created Duke of Gloucester in 1928, years before his marriage, and represented his father the King on several occasions abroad, such as the Coronation of Haile Selassie in Ethiopia. In 1935 he married Lady Alice Montagu-Douglas-Scott, a daughter of the Duke of Buccleuch.

When they first married they lived in York House, St James Palace and also had a country house Barnwell Manor in Northamptonshire they bought from Alice's family. There was a large pack of servants. However both Henry and Alice were fond of country life and the farm at Barnwell was run efficiently and well. It was regarded as the most modern in the country before the war, according to sources at the time.

The Duke served in the army during the war, Alice had two sons, William and the present Duke, Richard, and also undertook a lot of public duties. After the war Henry served as GG in Australia where stories about his drinking problem persist to this day. After the war he and the Duchess took on many public engagements on behalf of the monarch, but Henry had very bad health in his later years and suffered a major stroke that left him speechless shortly before his son William's death.

 

[Ish]

Prince Henry, Duke of Gloucester, was the 11th Governor-General of Australia from January 1945 until March 1947.



I suspect the Australians, Canadians and South Africans on the forum will disagree, but I miss that era when the Governor-Generals of the Commonwealth realms were British peers or, more rarely, even members of the Royal Family itself.

I can understand an argument regarding members of the RF itself acting as GG on occasion. I see it as a possible way to strengthen ties between the monarchy and the realms, and if there were a plan to have one of the Queen's children, or Charles' sons serve as GG in Canada I would support it.

But why on earth should a British peer who has no connection to Canada at all serve as a Canadian GG? That makes no sense. A member of Canada's Royal Family, sure. But a peer of a foreign country? It's the 21st century, and the role should be filled by people who have an actual relationship with Canada.

 

[Curryong]

The Duke was a high-ranking army officer himself. He served in the Army until 1937, becoming Colonel of the Scots Guards in that year. In 1955 he was appointed a Field Marshal, but that was an honorary rank.

 

[CyrilVladisla]

Prince Henry laid the foundation stone of a new library.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exsA3caPGtM

 

[CyrilVladisla]

Princess Alice opened Sydney Street Estate in 1938.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQ5HBXox84g

 

[An Ard Ri]

I've never seen this footage before of the Funeral of the Duke Of Gloucester at Windsor in 1974.

 

[Dman]

The Gloucester Wedding Gifts 1935:
Very Impressive.
Jewels in Motion: The Gloucester Wedding Gifts (1935) | The Court Jeweller

 

[burbankstorylady]

Official Princess Alice of Gloucester (Digital Archive)

I noticed that Princess Alice, Duchess of Gloucester is not on the official British royal website anymore. Luckily, all of her pages were archived back in 2009:

Early Life
Royal Family > Memorial sites > Princess Alice > Childhood and early life

Marriage and Family
Royal Family > Memorial sites > Princess Alice > Marriage and family

Charities and Patronages
The Royal Family > Memorial sites > HRH Princess Alice > Activities

Honours and Appointments
Royal Family > Memorial sites > Princess Alice > Honours

 

[Gaudete]

Sadly Princess Alice is now but a distant memory for many. It's a shame because she was a fascinating lady and served her country so dutifully, even though she had quite a miserable life at times. Her memoirs are a joy to read but even though they're very uncontroversial, I got the impression that she was never particularly devoted to her husband who doesn't sound the easiest of men to live with.

 

[burbankstorylady]

Sadly Princess Alice is now but a distant memory for many. It's a shame because she was a fascinating lady and served her country so dutifully, even though she had quite a miserable life at times. Her memoirs are a joy to read but even though they're very uncontroversial, I got the impression that she was never particularly devoted to her husband who doesn't sound the easiest of men to live with.

Yes, I think Prince Henry was a challenging person to get along with. The patience of a saint was needed to deal with his inflexibility, perhaps. I remember the story of her helping with (er, doing for him) the homework he was assigned at the staff college. The teachers even knew he'd received an uneven amount of help and knew it was her doing it for him. ?

 

[CyrilVladisla]

The engagement of Prince Henry and Lady Alice was announced.

 

[Gaudete]

Yes, I think Prince Henry was a challenging person to get along with. The patience of a saint was needed to deal with his inflexibility, perhaps. I remember the story of her helping with (er, doing for him) the homework he was assigned at the staff college. The teachers even knew he'd received an uneven amount of help and knew it was her doing it for him. ?

My favourite story about the Duke (I believe told by AN Wilson) is the one about his strange meal requests. He liked to eat what "ordinary soldiers" were eating. Princess Alice was away and left a menu for a dinner the Gloucesters were giving with the housekeeper. She returned home, changed for dinner, welcomed her guests and then watched with horror as the food was brought in. It was beef stew and rice pudding. The Duke had changed everything in her absence!

 

[Curryong]

Lady Alice doesn't look particularly cheerful in her bridesmaid duties, in fact she appears a bit miserable. I liked her memoirs, it's very clear that she absolutely loved Africa and painting there in the 1930s and even sold a few artworks.

Alice seems to have been more resigned to marrying the bovine Duke rather than welcoming his proposal. She was then in her thirties, 'elderly' for a bride in those days, and looking back she wrote that she had 'had a good run' and so marriage was the inevitable next step. Nevertheless, she knuckled down very well to her Royal duties in spite of shyness at first. (Apparently her mother was a very shy and retiring person.)

There are a few stories still here in Oz of the Duke's time as GG at the end of and just after the war. Most are not exactly flattering to him.

 

[Denville]

Why do it then? I know nothing about her, or him. Even if she was older, she didn't have to marry him if he was so awful.....

 

[Gaudete]

Alice tried to stay unmarried for as long as possible so that she could travel. She was a keen explorer and especially loved Africa. Queen Mary knew Alice’s family well and had already decided that Alice would make a suitable bride for one of her sons.

Henry was unmarried and didn’t seem keen to settle down but his mother felt it was long overdue that he should be married.

The Duke proposed of his own free will and Alice accepted, so I don’t think it could be seen as a traditional arranged marriage but certainly both parties were left with no doubt that it’s what the Queen wanted and that the King was enthusiastic about the match too. Sadly I don’t think Alice had a very nice life with Henry but she made the best of it.

 

[burbankstorylady]

I think Alice was happy in her mind. Happiness is a state of mind. She liked herself. She made the most of everyday. She loved her sons, her dogs and yes, I think she loved her Henry.

 

[Denville]

It doesn't sound as if she loved him. Liked him, perhaps, grew to be fond of him. Was perhaps pleased to be married and enjoyed the role of A royal duchess....

 

[Gaudete]

If there was anyone less likely to marry into the RF for titles, money and privilege it was Alice.

 

[Denville]

I don't see why else she would have married him, if she didn't seem keen on him. if she just watnted the status of being married, she could have presumably found an upper class well to do man, who would not have minded her leading a separate life to him.

 

[CyrilVladisla]

When and where did Prince Henry first meet Lady Alice?

 

[Gawin]

Apparently Henry and Alice met sometime in the 1920s through Prince Henry's friendship with Lady Alice's brother William who was also Henry's brother officer.

According to an article by Marlene Koenig in the October 2015 issue of The European History Journal, Prince Henry's aunt Princess Alice Countess of Athlone played matchmaker.

Lady Alice had stayed with the Athlones while Lord Athlone was Governor-General of South Africa. Her older sister Margaret was Princess Alice's lady-in-waiting. During that time the two Alices became friends.

In 1935 Lady Alice returned to England due to her father's ill health (he died later that year). Knowing that Queen Mary was pressuring Prince Henry to find a wife, and knowing he was very fond of Lady Alice, Princess Alice invited Lady Alice to stay with the Athlones at Ascot and arranged a meeting with the Prince. A courtship ensued, followed by a proposal within three months, at the end of the summer of 1935.

Marlene Koenig quotes Lady Alice's memoirs: "There was no formal declaration on his part. I think he just muttered it as an aside during one of our walks; nor was there any doubt about my acceptance. I was thirty-four, so I had a few good innings. I felt it was time I did something more useful with my life." She also wrote: "If I married Prince Henry I knew I would have to accept that I was a servant of the Country."

So yes, there wasn't any grand passion on her part, but Alice was fond of Prince Henry and I don't think it's accurate to say she married him for his status. She was a very serious minded individual who had already enjoyed her fun and now she saw membership in the BRF as a chance to do "something more useful with [her] life."

 

[hersparklytiara]

Alice a woman of substance

Why do it then? I know nothing about her, or him. Even if she was older, she didn't have to marry him if he was so awful.....

and

I don't see why else she would have married him, if she didn't seem keen on him. if she just watnted the status of being married, she could have presumably found an upper class well to do man, who would not have minded her leading a separate life to him.

As you said above, you don't know anything about them.

Snipped quote:
Marlene Koenig quotes Lady Alice's memoirs: "There was no formal declaration on his part. I think he just muttered it as an aside during one of our walks; nor was there any doubt about my acceptance. I was thirty-four, so I had a few good innings. I felt it was time I did something more useful with my life." She also wrote: "If I married Prince Henry I knew I would have to accept that I was a servant of the Country."

So yes, there wasn't any grand passion on her part, but Alice was fond of Prince Henry and I don't think it's accurate to say she married him for his status. She was a very serious minded individual who had already enjoyed her fun and now she saw membership in the BRF as a chance to do "something more useful with [her] life."

Alice tells of her near drowning accident when she was younger (a teen if I remember correctly) when she promised to live a life of service if she were allowed to live. She said she saw her life of service to her country by marrying The Duke and being of service that way as being an opportunity to fulfill that promise. For those of us who wish they knew more of her, she was never one to wish for the limelight. She was perfectly content to leave that to other royals while she visited hospitals and military regiments - the non-glamorous assignments. These are not the kind of royal engagements that the press and other photographers would typically gravitate to. The few photos we see are a handful of portraits, family functions, state affairs where senior royals were present, and the like. For her several decades of royal service there are precious few action photographs of her.

The Duke, from all reports, had a difficult temperament, liked his drink far too much, had a history (and I only know it to predate his marriage) of keeping the company of a married woman which he paid for the remainder of his life, among other unsavory attributes. He was more a labor intensive project than he was a good catch. He wasn't even particularly well-off financially. Apparently even Archbishop Lang who married the two said "I have joined a very fine jewel to a very rough diamond." presumably in reference to The Duke's lack of polish.

I have read several reports of Alice's dedication and attention to the Duke especially as his health faltered. I believe she had grown to care very much for him over the years, warts and all. I doesn't sound like the courtship ever was very passionate, the proposal certainly was not, the marriage probably wasn't either. But for two people who were "supposed" to be married, they probably worked well enough for each other. They remained married for nearly 40 years. I think they both loved their sons, and Alice her grandchildren.

Alice was not a gold digger by any stretch of the imagination, no matter how some people would like to paint her that way.

If there was anyone less likely to marry into the RF for titles, money and privilege it was Alice.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

 

[CyrilVladisla]

Princess Alice spoke about the WAAF in 1941.

 

[hersparklytiara]

When and where did Prince Henry first meet Lady Alice?

In addition to what Gawin wrote earlier, their fathers were good friends in the military and that went back many, many years. Their children played together both in England and at Balmoral in Scotland. Alice and The King's children were in each other's orbits for most of their lives. Whether or how long they knew each other especially well is hard to say. Alice was one of eight children who lived a "nomadic" lifestyle traveling between her father's many large properties (manor houses and castles) with a massive staff and "eight tons of luggage". Other than the monarch himself (King George V), her father was the largest land owner in Great Britain at the time. Her family was wildly wealthy. She had no interest in the royal or society life. Being royal gave her a real opportunity to be of service. And she was. For over six decades. Hers was a life well lived.

I felt heartily sorry that they were not well off enough to be able to keep her at Barnwell Manor that she and Henry grew to love so - and the vast outdoors of it compared to Kensington Palace with her son and his family. The palace is nice, but London is not the country to an old soul. She was 93 when they moved her back to London for her final decade. We all wish to die at home...that doesn't mean we all get to.

Princess Alice spoke about the WAAF in 1941.

Thank you. I'd not heard her speak.

 

[CyrilVladisla]

Hersparklytiara, I am glad that you enjoyed hearing Princess Alice giving a nice speech. I wonder if she had done public readings before she married Prince Henry.

 

[cepe]

Yes, I think Prince Henry was a challenging person to get along with. The patience of a saint was needed to deal with his inflexibility, perhaps. I remember the story of her helping with (er, doing for him) the homework he was assigned at the staff college. The teachers even knew he'd received an uneven amount of help and knew it was her doing it for him. ?

I dont know your source for doing his work at the staff college but he didnt marry until he was 35 and was undertaking royal duties. So doubt it was him.

Prince Henry of Wales (Prince Harry) is known to have needed help with exams/course work whilst at Sandringham notably from Jamie Lowther Pinkerton.

Perhaps your source muddled the princes.

 

[Countessmeout]

I dont know your source for doing his work at the staff college but he didnt marry until he was 35 and was undertaking royal duties. So doubt it was him.

Prince Henry of Wales (Prince Harry) is known to have needed help with exams/course work whilst at Sandringham notably from Jamie Lowther Pinkerton.

Perhaps your source muddled the princes.

Not sure if Alice helped him, but there is truth to the story.

While Henry had served in the royal Hussars for some years previous, it was not until January 1936 that he entered the staff college at Camberly. He married Alice in November 1935. The couple lived in a small cottage close to the barracks during that time. It wasn't until after Edward abdicated, that Henry was forced to leave his military days behind, and take on royal duties.

https://books.google.ca/books?id=KA...f gloucester army staff college 1930s&f=false

 

[CyrilVladisla]

Princess Alice opened the new Charter House for Rheumatism.