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  #21  
Old 06-20-2006, 11:54 AM
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Her name was Lola
She was a dancer...


Sorry, couldn't resist.
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  #22  
Old 06-20-2006, 12:07 PM
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What about Peter the Great and Anna Mons
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  #23  
Old 06-20-2006, 01:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H.M. Margrethe
Hmm i am not to shure about the history of Cleopatra comitting suiside...
Acording to a very good detective in USA ( she was the one to solve the serie killing in Washington for som years ago) She thinks that it migth be Mark Anthony that was the one who had killede Cleopatra,because of her son with Julius Ceasar...We have to think that the offspring from the affair betwen Cleopatra and JuliusCeasar was going to rule the Roman Empire after JuliusCearsar and not MarkAnthony.
(I saw it on a program from Discovery Channel her in Denmark)
I think I heard something about that story being false too. I thought about it when I wrote my last post, but I went along with the suicide story.
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  #24  
Old 06-20-2006, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Furienna
I think I heard something about that story being false too. I thought about it when I wrote my last post, but I went along with the suicide story.
Ok but IF it was a suicide who killede Cleopatra what did she use to do it with?

Acording to the detective it was not a snake,because the poison was not able to go through her body so fast..(a soldier sow her lying on her bed rigth after her (suicide) so he ran over to MarkAnthony who was about 10 min. away)
I cut also not have been a diffrent kinde of poison becaus again it was not fast enough.
Therfor i will go whit the teory about MarkAnthony killing the beautufyl Cleopatra becaus she had made an heir with JuliusCesar.
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  #25  
Old 06-20-2006, 02:27 PM
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Well, maybe. But it was such a long time ago, that's it hard to be sure. That story about the snake is interesting though. I guess that was the way, that a queen should kill herself back then.
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  #26  
Old 06-20-2006, 04:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Furienna
I don't think Cleopatra had a child with Mark Anthony, although I could be wrong. She did have a son named Ptolemaios with Julius Ceasar though. Ptolemaios was the traditional names from the Egyptian kings of Cleopatra's dynasty, and he was supposed to be the Egyptian king after his mother's death, but after Cleopatra's suicide, that dynasty never ruled again, so the last Ptolemaios couldn't have lived long.
Did Ceasar ever know of this child? Did Ceasar have other affairs?
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  #27  
Old 06-20-2006, 04:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laura Elizabeth
Her name was Lola
She was a dancer...


Sorry, couldn't resist.
LOL. I get it...:)

The showgirl
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  #28  
Old 06-20-2006, 04:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Royal Fan
What about Peter the Great and Anna Mons
So who are they?

What did they do?
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  #29  
Old 06-20-2006, 04:52 PM
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Someone said once that there was one monarch somewhere that had over 60 illigitimate children and he actually preferred some of them over his legitimate ones.

Anyone know who that would have been?

Or was that type of things so very common that it could have been any monarch?
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  #30  
Old 06-20-2006, 04:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H.M. Margrethe
Ok but IF it was a suicide who killede Cleopatra what did she use to do it with?

Acording to the detective it was not a snake,because the poison was not able to go through her body so fast..(a soldier sow her lying on her bed rigth after her (suicide) so he ran over to MarkAnthony who was about 10 min. away)
I cut also not have been a diffrent kinde of poison becaus again it was not fast enough.
Therfor i will go whit the teory about MarkAnthony killing the beautufyl Cleopatra becaus she had made an heir with JuliusCesar.
A poison snake? yuk!

Wasn't that Romeo & Juliette or am I getting mixed up?:p
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  #31  
Old 06-20-2006, 05:17 PM
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Romeo drank poison and Juliet stabbed herself in the chest with a dagger. As far I as know, Cleopatra is the only one supposed to kill herself with a venomous snake.

Ceasar was a wealthy Roman, and it seems like they did nothing but have affairs. If later monarchs, who were supposed to be christian, could marry one woman because of affairs and lineage and have a lot of mistresses on the side, why wouldn't a pagan dictator do so? But Cleopatra was the queen of Egypt, so I don't think Ceasar would want to deny having a child with her, even though he already had a wife. I guess he knew about Ptolemaios.
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  #32  
Old 06-20-2006, 06:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lillia
Someone said once that there was one monarch somewhere that had over 60 illigitimate children and he actually preferred some of them over his legitimate ones.

Anyone know who that would have been?

Or was that type of things so very common that it could have been any monarch?
Could it possibly have been King Charles of England? He was married to Catharine Braganza but she couldn't give him any children so he had them all over the place. Especially with Lady Barbara.
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  #33  
Old 06-20-2006, 06:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lillia
Who was Lola Montes?

Has anyone heard of her and how she lived?
She later moved to the USA but died poor and without family.
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  #34  
Old 06-20-2006, 06:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lillia
Someone said once that there was one monarch somewhere that had over 60 illigitimate children and he actually preferred some of them over his legitimate ones.
I read a book by Carolly Erickson on the Kings and Queens of England and I believe she mentions that one of them had many, many illegitimate children -- above and beyond the "normal" philandering that went on in the early middle ages.

As far as Henry VIII's wives and why did Catherine Howard marry him? She may not have had much choice. According to various things I have read, if the King singled you out, you pretty much went -- with no other choices available but to marry him/be his mistress. And a little jingle I learned to remember the six wives and what their fates were, goes:
Divorced, Beheaded, Died, Divorced, Beheaded, Survived.
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  #35  
Old 06-20-2006, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelly
Could it possibly have been King Charles of England? He was married to Catharine Braganza but she couldn't give him any children so he had them all over the place. Especially with Lady Barbara.
Lady Barbara?

Who is Lady Barbara and how many children did they have?



Is there more on Catherine Braganza?

What was her story?
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  #36  
Old 06-20-2006, 07:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emily
I read a book by Carolly Erickson on the Kings and Queens of England and I believe she mentions that one of them had many, many illegitimate children -- above and beyond the "normal" philandering that went on in the early middle ages.

As far as Henry VIII's wives and why did Catherine Howard marry him? She may not have had much choice. According to various things I have read, if the King singled you out, you pretty much went -- with no other choices available but to marry him/be his mistress. And a little jingle I learned to remember the six wives and what their fates were, goes:
Divorced, Beheaded, Died, Divorced, Beheaded, Survived.
Well, I certainly have to wonder about her sensibility, especially given she had to have known about his other wives and what happened to them. Even if she didn't have a choice in the matter of marriage, she may have thought Henry would not be-head another wife, given the scandal the whole thinng cause the first time.

Was Katherine Howard his mistress too, like Ann Bolyn?

Wwhat a saying too!:)

Also, I read that during that time, a woman was treated like a 'trading piece' meaning that women were married off by their families in an attempt to advance the fortunes of the family many times. Of course it was not always the case, but it happened enough and alot of the time the girl had no say whatever in her fate.
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  #37  
Old 06-21-2006, 04:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lillia
Lady Barbara?

Who is Lady Barbara and how many children did they have?



Is there more on Catherine Braganza?

What was her story?
Lady Barbar Palmer nee Villiers, Countess of Castlemaine and Duchess of Cleveland. She had six children with King Charles II. He had more with other mistresses. It is uknown the exact number of his children. Catherine of Braganza was a princess from Portugal.
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  #38  
Old 06-21-2006, 05:56 PM
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I'll try to answer few of the questions that have raised here (it so happened that history is my passion :o ).
About Marc Antony/Cleopatra/Caesar

1. Caesar most certainly did know about his son, moreover, the conservative republicans were very offended, because Cleopatra used to live in Rome (in Caesar's residence) with Caesarion, whom Caesar openly acknowledged.
2. Marc Antony and Cleopatra had children, twins (Alexander Helios and Cleopatra Selene) and a son (Ptolemy Philadelphos). One of the reasons Rome was so dissatisfied with Marc Antony, was that he started giving away lands to his children. Alexander Helios was named Great King of the Seleucid Empire, Cleopatra Selene was called Queen of Cyrenaica and Crete and Ptolemy Philadelphos was named King of Syria and Asia Minor. Antony also proclaimed Cleopatra King of Kings (yes, king). As for Caesarion, Antony openly proclaimed he was to be Caesar's successor as his only son.
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  #39  
Old 06-21-2006, 06:00 PM
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Peter the Great and Anne Mons

Peter the Great is Peter I of Russia; he is responsible for transferring old-fashioned and a bit barbaric Russia into a more or less European country. He also literally built Petersburg (now Saint Petersburg), which was/is called "window to Europe". Anne Mons was the daughter of a vintner. She was initially the mistress of Peter's friend, Frantz Lafort, who introduced her to King. Peter fall in love with her and their affair continued for 10 years. The King was already thinking of making Anne his Queen, but then it turned out she was not exactly "his" Anne but had been betraying him with a German merchant, with whom she even had a daughter. Peter imprisoned Anne but very soon (in a few days) forgave her and even asked to come back to him but Anne (!) proclaimed her intention to marry to the Prussian Ambassador. She was not happy with him, he died early and she lived her life in misery. But the story goes on. Soon Peter fall in love and married Catherine Trubacheva. The Emperor introduced her as the Empress of Russian Empire but a year later he got a report that Catherine was betraying him with Wilhelm Mons (Anne Mons's brother). Mons was imprisoned but he did not tell a word about his connection with Catherine (he was not tortured). Nevertheless he was executed. The court insisted on Catherine's execution as well but Peter knew better. Catherine was the Empress of Russia and mother of his children. He forgave her. Catherine succeeded throne after him as Catherine I (not their daughter but her).

p.s. If you have any question, be most welcomed to aks them. I am not pretending to be an expert (on the contrary, there are loads of things I learn from different forums) but I do know History well because, as I said, it's my passion. :)
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  #40  
Old 06-21-2006, 06:16 PM
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And a little info on Cleopatra’s children. Because Caesarion was Julius Caesar’s son and a possible threat to Octavian’s power, Octavian had the boy strangled by his tutor (he was about 10 then). The rest of the children were sent to Rome to be raised by Octavia (Marc Antony’s legal wife and Octavian’s sister). Cleopatra Selene later married King Juba II of Mauritania and had 2 children, Ptolemy and Drusilla. There are no accurate reports about Alexander Helios and Ptolemy Philadelphus. Some reports suggest Octavian had them married to 2 foreign Princesses. The other report suggests they might have been killed at the order of King Herod I of Judea. Other reports suggest Ptolemy Philadelphus was sent to Armenia (he was proclaimed King of Armenia by Marc Antony though my country never accepted him, as well as the Roman superiority at the time) and Alexander Helios was made a King of a small provincial Kingdom of Rome (not specified). It was known that Octavian intended to do so but whether he did or not, is not known.
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