Royals Visiting The Pope

[amedea]

Is it only non reigning and reigning Catholic monarchs or can a wife president of a Catholic country wear white too?

It is only reigning (female) sovereigns of the countries that have the privilege. No president wife has the privilege.

 

[EmpressRouge]

As you can see here (canonization of Charles I) all archduchesses, the princess of Liechtenstein etc wear black. Queen Fabiola is very recognizable for wearing white. I would like to see if Zita used to wear white visiting the Pope. Did Sissi ever visited him?

Are you referring to the photo on the previous page of the thread? Queen Paola is not wearing white but has the privilege, so I wonder if only Queen Fabiola chose to wear white that day?

 

[Lalla Meriem]

Also, certain (non-reigning) families in Italy were granted the rights. Princesses from the House of Savoy can wear white (not just the queens). I'm still am not sure about Hapsburg Archduchesses of Austria. Has anyone seen pictures Princess Astrid of Belgium or Marie-Astrid of Luxembourg visiting the Pope?

Princess Marie-Astrid always wears black. She attended the events around the beautification of Blessed Karl. She also visited numerous times with her bother and parents.

 

[Kotroman]

It is only reigning (female) sovereigns of the countries that have the privilege. No president wife has the privilege.

It's not only reigning female sovereigns whose ancestors were proclaimed Catholic Monarchs that have the privilege. The consorts and widows of Catholic Monarchs can also wear white, and I am quite sure that former female sovereigns can also wear white. Did Grand Duchess Charlotte visit the Pope after her abdication?

 

[amedea]

Oh well yes, former sovereigns will wear white (such as Fabiola now..). I meant that usually the privilege is not used by members of former ruling royal families that had the privilege.

 

[EmpressRouge]

Marina, Princess of Naples wore white to see the Pope in 2003, as a princess of the deposed Savoy family.
http://www.angelfire.com/realm3/casasavoia/nineteen.html (scroll to the last picture)

 

[Kotroman]

Oh well yes, former sovereigns will wear white (such as Fabiola now..). I meant that usually the privilege is not used by members of former ruling royal families that had the privilege.

By sovereign, I meant monarch (as opposed to consort). Anyway, it seems that princesses of Savoy and members of some other deposed royal families wear white, which would make sense, since no government can take away an honour granted by the head of another state (in this case, the Pope).

 

[amedea]

Marina of Savoy wore white once and she was heavily criticized for that.
The honour of the Pope is not granted to the head of families, but to sovereigns. Just as these pretendants don't use the title of king or queen if they were never actually sovereign, they do not have the privilege du blanc.
I don't think there is a difference if the queen or the grand duchess is the sovereign or the consort as far as this privilege is concerned.

 

[Kotroman]

Criticised by whom, if I may ask? Italian republicans? Supporters of the Duke of Aosta? Or Vatican officials?

Anyway, it seems that the Princess of Naples would disagree with your interpretation of the privilege. Someone also said they saw photographs of spouses of French pretendents wearing white.

 

[amedea]

Repubblica.it/Galleria di immagini: Il rientro dei Savoia:
Savoia junior & Bush senior cena d' affari per pochi intimi - Repubblica.it » Ricerca
In the first link above you'll see Marina wearing black visiting the Pope. What's her interpretation??
In the second one there is an article about the time she wore white, it was a Mass in St Peter Square and the Savoys didn't have direct acces to the Pope in that occasion. The article reports that, however, "someone" talked about this as a "gaffe", because even in this kind of occasion she was expected to wear black.
I remember having read at the time some more critical articles, too.

 

[Augusto Saraiva]

Let's answer these questions once and for all. As we know, any woman, noble or commoner, must wear black on a visit to the Vatican, except the Catholic sovereigns, regnants or consorts, whose style of Majesty/Highness Catholic has been conferred by the Holy See
So who have the "privilège du blanc" is the Queen Paola of Belgium and Queen Fabiola, the Queen Sofia of Spain and the Grand Duchess Maria Teresa of Luxembourg.

Moreover, the claimants to the thrones of ancient Catholic monarchies, though deposed, don't lost this right, allowing the Princess of Savoy, the Duchess of Braganza, the Duchess of Anjou (because only the Orléanist branch keeps the Catholic style) and the Crown Princess Regina of Austria (while she was alive) the use of white garments in papal audiences.

I hope I have been helpfull.

 

[amedea]

So can you explain why they (the claimants) don't usually use this right? And why the Italian princesses used to wear white until 1946?

 

[Lumutqueen]

Visiting the Pope.
Sophia happens to be a Catholic Queen and is allowed to wear white, and Elizabeth is of another religion and has to wear black.
I presume it's Queen Sofia of Spain and Queen Elizabeth II.

 

[Sanneeee]

I have a question about the privilège du blanc. I know you must have been granted the title Catholic Majesties but I've read somewere (can't remember where) that some of the German Fürstinnen and princesses also had the privilège. Is that true and wich princesses had the right!

Thanks!

 

[monica17]

Does the Pope still give the Golden Rose?

 

[icelisou68]

Does the Pope still give the Golden Rose?

Yes, he does but it hasn't been given to people in a very long time ( since it was given by His Holiness Pius XII to Grand Duchess Charlotte of Luxemburg in 1956), it is now usually given to places and shrines.

 

[Emperor Roku XIV]

I wonder how it goes when the British monarch visits the pope, what with Henry VIII and all.

 

[Madame Royale]

I'd very much like to see the Crown Princely couple of Denmark make an official visit to the Holy See. Hope such a visit eventuates in the not so distant future.

 

[NGalitzine]

I wonder how it goes when the British monarch visits the pope, what with Henry VIII and all.

Elizabeth II has visited the Vatican on more than one occassion and been received by Popes, and has received JPII and the current pope during their visits to the UK, so their does not seem to be a problem. The Prince of Wales and the Duchess of Cornwall also visited the Vatican and were received by the Pope a couple of years ago. Both Elizabeth and Camilla wore the traditional balck during their viists to The Vatican. No 500 year old grudges.

 

[jaysonbautista]

privilege du blanc

does some royals still practice the privilege du blanc?

 

[Moonmaiden23]

Yes, the queens of Spain and Belgium as well as the Grand Duchess of Luxembourg have all taken advantage of the privilege du blanc.

 

[Mariel]

I read that Lord Nicholas Windsor and his wife visited the pope at the Vatican, and in fact were married in the Vatican (he is a Catholic convert). He is not a king or prince but he is of the British royal family.

 

[Lumutqueen]

I read that Lord Nicholas Windsor and his wife visited the pope at the Vatican, and in fact were married in the Vatican (he is a Catholic convert). He is not a king or prince but he is of the British royal family.

They married on 4 November 2006 in the Church of St Stephen of the Abyssinians in the Vatican following a civil ceremony on 19 October 2006 in a London register office.

 

[amedea]

Charlene of Monaco visiting the Pope on 12 January 2013 and wearing WHITE.
Image

Was the protocol changed or infringed?

 

[Lumutqueen]

Charlene of Monaco visiting the Pope on 12 January 2013 and wearing WHITE.
Image

Was the protocol changed or infringed?

Protocol was broken.

 

[Charlotte_Aster]

Well, she is Catholic and she is the wife of a Catholic sovereign monarch. (Yes, I'm aware that she not a Catholic Queen). Are we 100% sure that they didn't give her a privilige du blanc? up till now, she was very careful regarding these sort of protocol rules and i seriously doubt she would make such a HUGE mistake. Also, aren't there people whose job it is to make sure such faux-pas don't happen? (if this was one that is?)

 

[An Ard Ri]

Nice collection of photo's of Royals, Presidents,First ladies ,Prime ministers meeting the various Popes.

Politicos and Popes: Mantilla Action in the Vatican


Catholic Mantilla - Will You Mantilla With Me?: Politicos and Popes: Mantilla Action in the Vatican

 

[ANNIE_S]

Maybe she was granted the "privilege du blanc". I don´t think any royal would make such a mistake, protocol in Vatican is very strict. And I guess she has someone near that can tell her that she can´t wear white when visiting the Pope, if that´s the case.

 

[An Ard Ri]

Maybe she was granted the "privilege du blanc". I don´t think any royal would make such a mistake, ANNIE_Sin Vatican is very strict. And I guess she has someone near that can tell her that she can´t wear white when visiting the Pope, if that´s the case.

I'd agree with you ANNIE S I can't see it being an error as I'm sure they were briefed on Papal protocol prior to the visit.It may become more clear in the next few days that Princess Charléne has been granted this Papal Privilege.

 

[NGalitzine]

We know know (see link in the Albert & Chrlen thread) according to The Vatican that the privilege du blanc has been extended to Catholic princesses so protocol was not broken and it was not a mistake for the Princess of Monaco to wear white for an audiance with The Pope.