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  #281  
Old 03-21-2013, 08:13 PM
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Surely Monaco (those who are supposed to know) would be advising Albert and Charlene as to proper attire??


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  #282  
Old 03-21-2013, 08:42 PM
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I think someone is going to have to contact the palace in Monaco or the Vatican to solve the issue once and for all! The Vatican has granted Charlene the privelage du blanc. She therefore wore White when she met Benedict but not so for the inauguration mass. She can't have made an error nor would Paola or Marie-Therese.
Maybe her White outfit is at the dry cleaners or something happened to it that morning or it got stolen or was forgotten to be packed or she just woke up and thought "I feel like confusing everyone at TRF so I'll wear black not White" or simply prefers to wear black at a Mass and White at an audience.
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  #283  
Old 03-21-2013, 09:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Jacknch View Post
I think someone is going to have to contact the palace in Monaco or the Vatican to solve the issue once and for all! The Vatican has granted Charlene the privelage du blanc. She therefore wore White when she met Benedict but not so for the inauguration mass. She can't have made an error nor would Paola or Marie-Therese.
Maybe her White outfit is at the dry cleaners or something happened to it that morning or it got stolen or was forgotten to be packed or she just woke up and thought "I feel like confusing everyone at TRF so I'll wear black not White" or simply prefers to wear black at a Mass and White at an audience.
Why not volunteer and solve this enigma?
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  #284  
Old 03-21-2013, 10:15 PM
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Why not volunteer and solve this enigma?
I must admit that I have lost track of when white was worn, but because the Prince and Princess of Monaco maintain a Facebook site, contact to resolve this contentious issue should be easy for those who REALLY want to resolve the question.
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  #285  
Old 03-21-2013, 10:33 PM
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Why does anyone care?
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  #286  
Old 03-21-2013, 11:50 PM
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Originally Posted by zarzuela View Post

Queen Sofia at the inaugural mass of Pope Benedict.
What does the Queen wear under her veil to hold it high like that?
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  #287  
Old 03-22-2013, 12:05 AM
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I personally think she pulled a "Cherie" and should not have dressed in white for the earlier visit. I can't see any reason why the priviledge would have been granted to her and Albert when it had never been before to the family.
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  #288  
Old 03-22-2013, 11:26 AM
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Charlene was received into the Roman Catholic faith prior to her wedding in 2011. Having the right to wear white does not mean you are obliged to wear white, it is still a personal choice.

Maxima may be a Roman Catholic but she is not a Cathloic monarch nor is she married to a Catholic monarch. According to the Vatican statement when Charlen wore white in January the privilege du blanc was for female Catholic monarchs and the wives of Catholic monarchs.
So one has to be a monarch in her own right and not by marriage (when you're husband is not Catholic). Ok...such a pity, though. I would have loved to see Maxima wearing white.
About Charlene, of course it's a personal choice but if it's called a privilege, I assume it's something you should be happy to show anytime you can. Also, this was a joyful occasion (if it was a funeral I would have understood, no one wore white for John Paul II's funeral mass). anyway, it was her personal choice and I totally respect that
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  #289  
Old 03-22-2013, 11:51 AM
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Was it also a mistake for the late Grand Duchess Josephine Charlotte to appear in black at the Vatican on occassion, or was it simply a choice she made?
If Charlene had made a mistake in January it would have been smarter for The Vatican to issue no statement at all on the matter instead of saying she and the other wives of Catholic monarchs have the privilege du blanc ( note a privilege is not an obligation).
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  #290  
Old 03-22-2013, 12:14 PM
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I think many people participating here would go to great lengths to prove that Charlene does not have the privilege of white, even though the Vatican has confirmed that she does have the privilege.
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  #291  
Old 03-22-2013, 01:00 PM
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I think many people participating here would go to great lengths to prove that Charlene does not have the privilege of white, even though the Vatican has confirmed that she does have the privilege.
I don't think it's a case of we're trying to prove that she doesn't have it so much as it's a case of we're confused as to why she does have it - the requirements are not simply a case of being a monarch/monarch's wife that is Catholic, and beyond the religious connection Monaco does not meet said requirements.
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  #292  
Old 03-22-2013, 01:28 PM
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I don't think it's a case of we're trying to prove that she doesn't have it so much as it's a case of we're confused as to why she does have it - the requirements are not simply a case of being a monarch/monarch's wife that is Catholic, and beyond the religious connection Monaco does not meet said requirements.
Then I suggest you go back and read the statement from The Vatican Press Office in January 2013. They seemed pretty clear that the Privilege du Blanc applied to all Catholic monarchs or the wives of said Catholic monarchs. One assumes that they actually do know what the rules/requirements are or are not being that they do speak on behalf of 'The Vatican".
The rules that may have applied in earlier times are not necessarily applicable anymore. There are fewer monarchs than in the old days and even fewer that are Catholic. Even The Vatican has to change with the times, even though it may take decades or even centuries for them to do so.
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  #293  
Old 03-23-2013, 05:52 PM
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Then I suggest you go back and read the statement from The Vatican Press Office in January 2013. They seemed pretty clear that the Privilege du Blanc applied to all Catholic monarchs or the wives of said Catholic monarchs. One assumes that they actually do know what the rules/requirements are or are not being that they do speak on behalf of 'The Vatican".
The rules that may have applied in earlier times are not necessarily applicable anymore. There are fewer monarchs than in the old days and even fewer that are Catholic. Even The Vatican has to change with the times, even though it may take decades or even centuries for them to do so.
Can you actually quote that statement here? What exactly does it say? Is it true then that the Prince of Monaco was given the very old and special status of, let's name it, Most Catholic monarch (Catholicissimus; the titles vary on certain monarchs)? Because historically, the privilege du blanc (not eiglibility to wear white while visiting the Pope in general) was accorded to the consorts of the said Catholic monarchs (and by Catholic I mean not all those of Catholic faith) and the monarchs themselves if they were females, of course.

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Originally Posted by NGalitzine View Post
The rules that may have applied in earlier times are not necessarily applicable anymore. There are fewer monarchs than in the old days and even fewer that are Catholic. Even The Vatican has to change with the times, even though it may take decades or even centuries for them to do so.
I totally agree with you that today the ancient privilege du blanc is not applicable anymore. Everyone, especially Charlese and other women of her status, can absolutely wear white in the Vatican or any other colour they feel is appropriate to wear in front of the Pope. But if we are talking about the privilege we can't change the ancient rules. The Pope can, of cource, but do you have any proof that he did so? Just because the Princess of Monaco wore white once in the Vatican and that its press officers stated that it was not inappropriate for her to do so, means nothing. Many other high-profile women before her without the privilege du blanc wore dresses in other than black colour while visiting the Pope. Cherie Blair's faux pas from several years ago is well-known. I also remind seeing a picture of Danuta Walesowa, the wife of former Polish President Lech Walesa, wearing white during an audience with Pope John Paul II. Gorbachov's wife wore red. Both female Presidents of the Irish Republic did not wear black while visiting the Pope.
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  #294  
Old 03-23-2013, 06:57 PM
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Can you actually quote that statement here? What exactly does it say? Is it true then that the Prince of Monaco was given the very old and special status of, let's name it, Most Catholic monarch (Catholicissimus; the titles vary on certain monarchs)? Because historically, the privilege du blanc (not eiglibility to wear white while visiting the Pope in general) was accorded to the consorts of the said Catholic monarchs (and by Catholic I mean not all those of Catholic faith) and the monarchs themselves if they were females, of course.


I totally agree with you that today the ancient privilege du blanc is not applicable anymore. Everyone, especially Charlese and other women of her status, can absolutely wear white in the Vatican or any other colour they feel is appropriate to wear in front of the Pope. But if we are talking about the privilege we can't change the ancient rules. The Pope can, of cource, but do you have any proof that he did so? Just because the Princess of Monaco wore white once in the Vatican and that its press officers stated that it was not inappropriate for her to do so, means nothing. Many other high-profile women before her without the privilege du blanc wore dresses in other than black colour while visiting the Pope. Cherie Blair's faux pas from several years ago is well-known. I also remind seeing a picture of Danuta Walesowa, the wife of former Polish President Lech Walesa, wearing white during an audience with Pope John Paul II. Gorbachov's wife wore red. Both female Presidents of the Irish Republic did not wear black while visiting the Pope.
you're grasping at straws. Who cares what these non royal women did? We're not talking about non royalty, we're talking about royals. And so what if they wore other colors? Did the Vatican then release a statement saying they were afford privilege du blanc? No, so it matters not.

the point is that Charlene wore white when meeting with Benedict and the Vatican said she could. Why she wore black to the inauguration of Francis is a moot point. Privilege is a privilege, but it doesn't mean you always have to wear white. As someone else pointed out, Josephine-Charlotte once wore black even though she had the privilege. It is a privilege, not law.
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  #295  
Old 03-23-2013, 10:51 PM
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I will be interested to see if the Queen of Lesotho and/or the Princess of Liechtenstein use their new found ability to wear white. I'm still not buying it.
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  #296  
Old 03-24-2013, 05:51 AM
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I will be interested to see if the Queen of Lesotho and/or the Princess of Liechtenstein use their new found ability to wear white. I'm still not buying it.
Even if you never see them wear white it doesn't "prove" anything...as said many times before, it is a privilige not a 'must'

it seems you only want to hear that Charlene messed up, but obviously she didn't as the Vatican issued a statement that she it was okay for her to wear white.

Whether it was okay because the rules wrre changed or because the rules were the same but she was granted the privilige is another thing, but Charlene did NOT make a mistake in the eyes of the Vatican and that is all that matters in this case...
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  #297  
Old 04-15-2014, 04:40 PM
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King And Queen Of Spain visit the Pope in 1923

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  #298  
Old 04-19-2014, 01:53 PM
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TSH Prince Rainier III & Princess Grace of Monaco visit the Pope in 1957

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  #299  
Old 04-19-2014, 02:01 PM
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King And Queen Of Spain visit the Pope in 1923

Bit of a shame they don't show King, Queen or Pope...but i expect that they didn't realise at the time that 90 years later the whole world could still see the footage
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  #300  
Old 06-20-2014, 10:37 PM
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When Prince Albert and Princess Charlene of Monaco visited Pope Benedict XVI, they gave the Pontiff a book about Cardinal Jerome Grimaldi (1595-1685).
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