Royal Cyphers, Arms and Monograms

[Glasshouse]

Originally Posted by donothorpe

We have a British cane handle with an insignia on it that was handed down to us from a French family. We don't know the origen of the insignia. Can anyone help us identify it?

That's the cypher of William and Mary of Great Britain, from the 1690's.

[Glasshouse]

The Royal Cyphers project on Wikicommons is really taking off. There is a general category, and subcategories for individual countries are created as enough cyphers are posted to create a new country subcategory. Right now, we have cyphers from Austria, Germany and the various German houses, Italy, Mexico, Brazil, Portugal, Yugoslavia, Bulgaria and Albania, all of which are mostly from historical figures. The subcategories contain just under 200 cyphers for Russia, France, UK, Belgium, Denmark, Greece, Hawaii, Monaco, Norway, Romania, Spain, Sweden, and the Netherlands, which have more contemporary cyphers. Again, the link is Category:Royal Cyphers - Wikimedia Commons.

On the “wish list” is a monogram for the Duke of Brabant. I have found a couple of previous postings on the forum for his monogram, (a combination “PF?”) but the images are no longer there. Also, individual cyphers for the Prince and Princess of Asturias, Queen Anne-Marie, Crown Prince Pavlos and Crown Princess Marie-Chantal of Greece are needed, but anything you could provide that we don’t yet have would be greatly appreciated. And finally, I’m hoping someone can confirm the cypher below. I am assuming that it’s for Prince Amadeo of Belgium, or is it for his mother, Princess Astrid? It looks like a royal proclamation of some kind regarding Prince Amadeo, but since his mother is also listed on the document and she’s the senior royal, it could be her monogram. We could also use cyphers from the other members of the Belgian royal family.

[Glasshouse]

The Royal Cyphers project Category:Royal Cyphers - Wikimedia Commons now has almost 400 royal monograms including the entire family of Tsar Nicholas II of Russia, and this one of his mother, Empress Maria Feodorovna



and these two from Queen Marie of Romania:




Prince Amadeo of Belgium's monogram was recently uploaded:



As was Queen Sofia's of Spain:



Still on the wish list is a monogram of Prince Philippe of Belgium and those of any other minor Belgian royals, as well as monograms of the Spanish and Luxembourg royals. If anyone has any images that they could post, it would be greatly appreciated!

[Lord Sosnowitz]

It's really great news, that the Wikipedia published these monos

[Alexander II]

Dear All,
I have a painting dated 1914 with a Royal monogram on the reverse, in Cyrillic or Greek which reads "ΜΠ". I would be very grateful if you could help me finding information about this monogram.

Best, Alexander II

[Glasshouse]

Possibly Grand Duchess Maria Pavlovna of Russia (1890–1958)? That's definitely the Russian crown surmounting the monogram.

[Alexander II]

Dear Glasshouse thank you very much, I really appreciate it. I was thinking that this monogram could also be referred to Grand Duchess Maria Pavlovna of Russia (b.Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin, 1854-1920). Could it be possible?

[Comte de Hainaut]

Originally Posted by Glasshouse

And finally, I’m hoping someone can confirm the cypher below. I am assuming that it’s for Prince Amadeo of Belgium, or is it for his mother, Princess Astrid? It looks like a royal proclamation of some kind regarding Prince Amadeo, but since his mother is also listed on the document and she’s the senior royal, it could be her monogram. We could also use cyphers from the other members of the Belgian royal family.

Good morning Glasshouse,

Sorry for the very late participation in this topic.

I'm not that sure it's the personnal monogram of Prince Amedeo. Couldn't it be the monogram of Prince Lorenz and Princess Astrid. I see 2 "L" and a "A". In anycase it is the very first time I see it.

The image shows the page written in French and Flemish of a golden book (I suppose) of the Royal Military School of Brussels when prince Amédéo took the Oath as Army officer on the 27th of September 2007.

Bruxelles, 27 septembre 2007

En présences de Leurs Altesses Royales,
la Princesse Astrid et le Prince Lorenz

Prestation de serment de Son Altesse Royale le Prince Amédéo


Astrid - Lorenz
Amédéo

[Glasshouse]

It's very possible, Alexander. I've even found some monograms "recycled," such as Princess Alexandra of Great Britain using the same monogram as Queen Alexandra of Great Britain , though with different crowns.

[Glasshouse]

I'm sure you're absolutely right. I'll correct the image. Thank you very much for your assistance here. I've been asking if anyone has images of Belgian monograms that they could share for posting on Wikimedia Commons. I'd like to find a monogram for Prince Philippe, a dual cypher for him and Princess Mathilda, and monograms for all of the junior royals. A dual cypher for Boudouin and Fabiola would be nice as well.

Thanks again.

[Glasshouse]

The wedding monogram for Prince Albert and Charlene of Monaco.

[manper86]

Hi there,

I have recently come across this cypher and I have looked everywhere but cannot find who it belongs to. Can you please help me?

Many Thanks,


M

[Glasshouse]

It looks like the Tudor Crown commonly used by the British since the 19th Century and it looks like a woman's monogram since it's inside a diamond shaped losenge. I wonder if it's Queen Elizabeth, the Queen Mother while she was Queen Consort. Do you have any background on where you found it? Is it engraved on silverware?

[manper86]

Hi Glasshouse,

Thanks for your reply. I have done a little research and found the Queen Mother's cyphers online and they seem to be different to the other one:











I saw the other cypher on a silver cigarette case with a date 1914 also engraved on it. At first, I thought that it was a British too, because of the crown, but cannot think of anyone that it might have belonged to. Could it be continental?

Many thanks,
M

[Glasshouse]

I'm stumped. The crown definitely looks Tudor, but that's not to say that it couldn't be stylized.

[manper86]

Hi Glasshouse,

My sentiments exactly...

I thought it was very interesting what you mentioned earlier about the diamond shaped lozenge, so I went online again and found that they were mainly used by single women.

Wikipedia says:

"The lozenge has for many centuries been particularly associated with women as a vehicle for the display of their coats of arms. In modern English and Scottish, but not Canadian, heraldry, the arms of an unmarried woman and of widows are usually shown on a lozenge rather than an escutcheon"

I agree that the crown might be stylised, the whole cypher seems to be (to me even looks a little Art Deco-ish) so maybe it is not British at all.

Also, the exact date engraved is “4. Juni 1914” (in German)

Thanks,

M

[Glasshouse]

The dual cypher of Prince Charles and Princess Diana of Wales.

[Comte de Hainaut]

Originally Posted by Glasshouse

The dual cypher of Prince Charles and Princess Diana of Wales.

Good evening Glasshouse,

I found this cypher of the Prince and Princess of Wales. I know that very small... Sorry. Anyway enjoy !

[Glasshouse]

Thanks to fellow forum member, Comte de Hainaut, we have added cyphers for Prince Philippe and the dual cypher for Philippe and Mathilde to Wikimedia.

[spikedhope]

I have this monogram on a knife handle from 1900.
Any ideas anyone??

7 Pointed Crown, and the letters D.E.T....I think...