Bowing and Curtseying


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Rudolph said:
In England morganatic marriage isn't recognised. Under common law a person who marries into the royal family is just as 'royal' as blood royals.

Catherine for example is both a princess and a peeress. So if The Duke of Cambridge is deserving of a bow of the head, The Duchess of Cambridge is equally deserving of a curtsey.
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The same applies to HRH Prince Harry and who ever he marries:flowers:
 
This is a thread about royal protocol, specifically bowing and curtseying. How is it that we are arguing as to whether particular Princes, Princesses, or Queens are deserving of said practice by virtue of their birth?
 
MARG said:
This is a thread about royal protocol, specifically bowing and curtseying. How is it that we are arguing as to whether particular Princes, Princesses, or Queens are deserving of said practice by virtue of their birth?
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I think the conversation applies. It's about shifting protocols.

In this I have to agree with the gist of @Duc_et_Pair 's points. :flowers: The bow and curtsey have a history. It does make sense that the custom applies to those born into that history (when conducting official functions out of that history).

For those not so born, it is not just vaguely, but overtly, strange, to have done to one. It 'makes sense' in other contexts where the action is done to the office held, like with the Pope. Still, it remains a medieval custom, and few moderns would find it comfortable. JMO. :cool:
 
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:previous: I don't know what the context was but even Fred looked funny when he stepped up to shake hands and bow to the Emperor. It looked like he was waiting for a cue and then positively bounced up to take his hand.

Mary showed that even after all this time when the tension and expectations are high, you can still blow it. I think she probably had it all set in her mind and he broke her concentration when he spoke to her. She recovered beautifully when she shook hands, curtseyed and did the double peck to the Empress.

Actually, I think that was a true royal culture crash and I use that word advisedly. Royals generally follow the handshake, bow/curtsey and double peck but when you come to Japan their customary greeting is to bow which is why I think Fred too had the same mindset as Mary but hey, when he correctly bowed European style and shook hands, he got a pass and to be honest, he looked like he was saying "Yeeees!!!!" to himself when he pulled that off. :D
 
They both seemed to let their nerves get to them. Her not bowing, him bowing repeatedly both were a bit odd at best. I'd think a born royal like Fred, who has been doing this for decades, would be a tad less nervous.
 
Lady Nimue said:
I think the conversation applies. It's about shifting protocols.

In this I have to agree with the gist of @Duc_et_Pair 's points. :flowers: The bow and curtsey have a history. It does make sense that the custom applies to those born into that history (when conducting official functions out of that history).

For those not so born, it is not just vaguely, but overtly, strange, to have done to one. It 'makes sense' in other contexts where the action is done to the office held, like with the Pope. Still, it remains a medieval custom, and few moderns would find it comfortable. JMO. :cool:
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The Queen mother was not royal until her marriage when she became HRH The Duchess of York, so to Diana when she became HRH The Princess of Wales. That they came from aristocratic families is irrelevant. The same applies to HRH Queen Silvia, HRH Queen Sonja, HRH Queen Mathilde, HRH Queen Maxima, HRH Queen Letizia, HRH GD Maria Teresa, HRH CP Mary, HRH CP Mette Marit, HRH Prince Daniel, HRH HGD Stephanie, et al.

There would be times when a bow or curtsey is the only polite action to take and there is no way civility would encourage anyone to decide whether the recipient was deserving of that mark of respect to their position. It has been said that true majesty isn’t determined by one’s background, but by one’s character.
 
:previous: Totally off topic...I want her plum coat!:D
 
:previous: That's the FIRST thing I thought when I clicked on the photo too!:lol:
 
In my opinion, curtsies should only be performed when wearing skirts or dresses.


Sent from my iPod touch using The Royals Community
 
I have a question and sorry if it has been discussed or answered earlier in this forum.

A very deep curtsy with the hand held by the person being curtsyed to. Such as the Princess Royal did recently to Queen Letizia.

Is this special type of curtsy? All the pictures I can find show it being done by female royals of one nation to the monarch or spouse of monarch of another nation.

It is not the usual quick bob we see UK citizens doing to their own royalty or BRF members doing to HM.
 
AFAIK it is merely based upon the customs of a particular court. I've observed curtsy that you've described being performed by the royal ladies in Spain and Denmark. The British royals tend to perform a bob. Other royal houses ie: the Netherlands no longer perform them at home, but I've seen it done when they're abroad.

I hope this helps. ?
 
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Members of the Thailand's Royal Family curtsey to Queens Silvia, Maxima, Mathilde & Sofia.

 
the deep one (with or without the hand held) is an official court curtsie - the bob is an abbreviation - which is commenly used.
 
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JSH said:
I have a question and sorry if it has been discussed or answered earlier in this forum.

A very deep curtsy with the hand held by the person being curtsyed to. Such as the Princess Royal did recently to Queen Letizia.

Is this special type of curtsy? All the pictures I can find show it being done by female royals of one nation to the monarch or spouse of monarch of another nation.

It is not the usual quick bob we see UK citizens doing to their own royalty or BRF members doing to HM.
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It's a good question. The very deep curtsey is usually performed by one royal to another. Probably the first curtsey CP Mette Marit made to HM was amazing as was Infanta Elena's.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/--vHtfKKk4...ly+low+to+Her+Majesty+Queen+Elizabeth+II..jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-wyTGLZ7r9...58/HN26r8om8yU/s1600/Infanta+Elena+to+EII.jpg

The very deep curtseys are mostly seen when women are wearing longer skirts or evening gowns. Curtsying low in a very short dress can look really awkward unless you are used to it. HM's daughter and granddaughters all go deep regardless. Camilla and Catherine, not so much. Q Margrethe's daughters-in-law who also go low.
https://www.pinterest.nz/pin/82753711885563875/
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/...mV5M3w5_MuT20U5t2MBe4Xhqi7ilMqGVfs43KeMCJ5WVi

For those who, in the normal course of their lives, would have no need to curtsy, some give it their best shot.
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/...ctj_ZA7ixx_JUsUJtCHEoBvrMcTkLuWBrciDdBKb2rtki
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/...EFn8MBiQXReNGPFKktXg7k50zG5K6Hyf4BXLa_JBZYzdf

And when it's just the cousins . . . https://www.pinterest.nz/pin/417216352952939660/
 
Thanks for your answers. They are very helpful.
 
It seems the British has a different curtsey style? They usually places their right leg behind the left leg (like Sophie's), while the others just put their right leg backward (see Marie's).

It looks quite difficult to balance to me :bang:
 
Not all of the Princesses performed the curtsey to Queen Sofia. Was it because she no longer Queen Consort? As I remember once a monarch, always a monarch.
 
HMQueenElizabethII said:
Not all of the Princesses performed the curtsey to Queen Sofia. Was it because she no longer Queen Consort? As I remember once a monarch, always a monarch.
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Doña Sofía was never a monarch (= a sovereign head of state in a monarchy).
Don Juan Carlos is no monarch anymore.

But they are treated as former monarchs. It is not needed to be King or Queen. See Princess Beatrix (or before her: Princess Juliana and Princess Wilhelmina) who always were treated as a former monarch indeed, despite reverting to their princely titles after abdication.
 
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PHP:
HMQueenElizabethII said:
Not all of the Princesses performed the curtsey to Queen Sofia. Was it because she no longer Queen Consort? As I remember once a monarch, always a monarch.
Click to expand...


And they performed the curtsey as well to the current Governor-General of Australia. :D
 
When I remember the deep curtsey from Princess Mathilde and Princess Maxima at the last Thailand Glittering Event.
Now it is the Royal Family who cutsey the Consort Queens
 
HMQueenElizabethII said:
Not all of the Princesses performed the curtsey to Queen Sofia. Was it because she no longer Queen Consort? As I remember once a monarch, always a monarch.
Click to expand...
My interpretation is that's because Sofia insisted on kissing everyone. Both Princess Sirindhorn and the last lady in line both started curtseying but Sofia bent forward to kiss them while the lady in the back did a deep curtsey.
 
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W.Y.CII said:
It seems the British has a different curtsey style? They usually places their right leg behind the left leg (like Sophie's), while the others just put their right leg backward (see Marie's).

It looks quite difficult to balance to me :bang:
Click to expand...

I am amazed at Sophie's ability to curtsey. I would literally fall down.
 
JR76 said:
My interpretation is that's because Sofia insisted on kissing everyone. Both Princess Sirindhorn and the last lady in line both started curtseying but Sofia bent forward to kiss them while the lady in the back did a deep curtsey.
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That was my reasoning as well. Clearly Sofia is rather close to the family, so it was less formal and she made it hard for the princesses to curtsey to her while she was embracing/kissing them at the same time.
 

Danish royals arriving to the Reformation 500th anniversary event. Typically the Danish royal ladies perform a deep curtsy to Queen Margrethe. Yesterday I noticed that CP Frederik and Prince Joachim do not appear to bow to their mother and that Princess Benedikte does not curtsy to her sister. QM is in the video greeting her family around 9:45. Would Benedikte be excused from curtsying for age related reasons ie: balance/knee strain or do she and Anne Marie not curtsy to their elder sister?
 
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