Gay Royalty

[Margrethe II]

Although not English, It was said that Her Majesty the Queen Consort Marie - Atoinette of France conducted a passionate love affair with her close friend and confidante, Madame de Polignac. So, history dictates that such rumours are not uncommon umongst the aristocratic circles of Europe and have been around for many centuries.

There is no doubt that Antoinette loved Madame and Madame her, but the likeliness of the two conducting an active lesbian relationship is most unlikely.

Such a shame that Polignac's influence over "the Austrian" proved to be most catastrophic.....

"MII"

[Smilla]

Originally Posted by grecka

I once read that Queen Mary II (as in the Mary of William and Mary) was actually in love with another woman when she was forced to marry Prince William of Orange and that she maintained a relationship with that woman for the rest of her life.

Apparently King James was also gay - a fact which was publically known to the extent that somebody came up with the quip:
Rex fuit Elizabeth: nunc est regina Jacobus.
(Elizabeth was King; now James is Queen.)

It's wonderful to know that people lived their lives as they wished before stuffy Victorian moral codes shaped the way we look at history.

[acid_rain3075]

Originally Posted by Smilla

Apparently King James was also gay - a fact which was publically known to the extent that somebody came up with the quip:
Rex fuit Elizabeth: nunc est regina Jacobus.
(Elizabeth was King; now James is Queen.)

It's wonderful to know that people lived their lives as they wished before stuffy Victorian moral codes shaped the way we look at history.

I'm sorry but that is so cool! I never knew that King James was gay!

[Queen Mary I]

Originally Posted by Smilla

Apparently King James was also gay - a fact which was publically known to the extent that somebody came up with the quip:
Rex fuit Elizabeth: nunc est regina Jacobus.
(Elizabeth was King; now James is Queen.)

It's wonderful to know that people lived their lives as they wished before stuffy Victorian moral codes shaped the way we look at history.

I am a hetero Latina but I have gay friends. King James I and IV was gay. It is interesting that the most famous, most beloved Protestant version of the Holy Bible bares his name-and yet Christian preachers can wave it around and call homosexuality sin.

One thing I have been wondering about is if conception by artificial means would be permitted for the British Royal family? I mean in all it's forms-test tube babies, surrogate mothers as long as the egg, and sperm come from the Royal parents etc. The Roman Catholic Church forbids it. It is a 'natural' conception or adoption. That's it.

Edited to add this past summer I read about (I think) an Austrian Empress who was gay and desparately in love with a woman. Her letters survive and they are quite passionate. I'll try to find the link.

[Elspeth]

According to a biography of Princess Marina, she had a long-term lover during her widowhood, but nothing was said about marital infidelity on her part. Mind you, she was only married for eight years and had three children in that time, so she didn't have a lot of time for dalliances.

I remember reading that Queen Victoria, when asked why an act of Parliament outlawing male homosexual activities didn't also include female homosexual activities, saying that it wasn't necessary because women didn't do that sort of thing. Apparently when she did her history lessons, the friendship between Queen Anne and Duchess of Marlborough was presented in a very platonic light! I wonder if she was told about "Mrs Freeman" and "Mrs Morley."

[BeatrixFan]

I remember reading that Queen Victoria, when asked why an act of Parliament outlawing male homosexual activities didn't also include female homosexual activities, saying that it wasn't necessary because women didn't do that sort of thing.

LOL! I love that. Maybe that explains the Royal Family's attitudes now. According to Brian Hoey, "The Royal Family are at great ease with their male homosexual staff but are not as accomodating to women of a similar persuasion".

[Idriel]

Originally Posted by Elspeth

I remember reading that Queen Victoria, when asked why an act of Parliament outlawing male homosexual activities didn't also include female homosexual activities, saying that it wasn't necessary because women didn't do that sort of thing. Apparently when she did her history lessons, the friendship between Queen Anne and Duchess of Marlborough was presented in a very platonic light! I wonder if she was told about "Mrs Freeman" and "Mrs Morley."

This remark turned out to be a blessing for lesbians. Their existance beeing totally ignored and their status not legally defined, they did enjoyed more liberty than their male counterparts who were hunted down like witches (see the Oscar Wilde trial).

Originally Posted by BeatrixFan

I think that the upper classes especially are rather stuffy and old-fashioned and of course, in the forces it would be a huge problem. All those butch men laughing in their messes at the gay Monarch. Of Course, they're the biggest hypocrits of them all with 'forced buggery' still being a huge problem.

I remember reading few articles about rapes in posh boy boarding schools (Eton included), but I wonder if it is still a huge issue as you say. I mean, compared to the 60's or 70's when it was nearly some initiatic stuff, a sort of fresher week 'joke':( )

About Kent. I believe homosexuality was the least of his "issues" (not that I suggest homosexuality is an issue, I have my gayfriendly member-card :p ). He was also a drunk and a drug-addict, or am I mistaken.

[ysbel]

Originally Posted by Idriel

About Kent. I believe homosexuality was the least of his "issues" (not that I suggest homosexuality is an issue, I have my gayfriendly member-card :p ). He was also a drunk and a drug-addict, or am I mistaken.

Yes Idriel, he had a severe cocaine problem at one point which makes me wonder why on earth Parliament would have ever considered passing over the Dukes of York and Gloucester to give him the crown of England. Luckily they rethought themselves and with the passing of the Duke at such a young age leaving young children it was definitely all for the best.

[BeatrixFan]

I remember reading few articles about rapes in posh boy boarding schools (Eton included), but I wonder if it is still a huge issue as you say

Well, I have it on good authority that it still goes on in public boarding schools but only between students and not teachers/students. Not that that makes it right, but you're correct in saying that it's seen as some strange initiation ceremony.

I have a cousin the army (currently in Iraq) who has said that it isn't unususal for someone to be raped in the barracks and it's generally written off as 'very hot, lack of contact with the opposite sex and a lack of sleep' - I wonder if any of the young Princes who attended naval school etc were subjected to the 'ritual'.

[tiaraprin]

It is an unmitigated shame that homosexuals and lesbians are still treated unfairly today. I don't see why everyone gets so upset. They are just like heterosexuals except for one difference.

One of my best friends is gay and when he told his grandfather, OH MY GOD!! The grandfather went crazy and told him he would go hell (the whole Bible thing run amok).

Personally, I think many gays and lesbians are born with this sexual orientation. Most know at a preschool age in some shape or form that they like the same sex not the opposite. I am hoping that someday there will be scientific evidence to prove this and I know it is being worked on.

[susan alicia]

think frederik the great of prussia and ludwig of bavaria too.
Went with a group of arthistorians to Neuschwanstein and was walking next to one male arthistorian with visibly plucked eyebrows and a long cape and a certain way about him. We passed two bavarian young men in lederhosen who looked visibly disgusted at him and I thought they probably do not know about ludwig

[Elspeth]

I also am a firm believer in the gay gene.

So far there doesn't seem to be a gay gene as such; there are several factors including genetic, hormonal, environmental, and bunches of things they haven't come across yet.

[Lady Marmalade]

Wow...this has to be the most...umm..frank forum on the entire site..very interesting to read your posts..:)

The Duchess of Windsor was never HRH...she was few other things I will not type on here, but never an HRH.

I read in a few books and magazines that same sex intercourse and play has a very high rate in the upper class schools of the British aristocracy.

Prince Philip himself has even alluded to such practices...

[Warren]

Yes, this is a fairly frank thread, but it is an adult discussion, and the Forums are broad enough to accommodate it. An alternative to Charlotte Casiraghi's favourite handbag (if you know what I mean). If a member who is likely to be offended by the content investigates this thread, it is easy enough for them to click on the 'Back' or 'Home' buttons and get out fast.
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[Lady Marmalade]

Originally Posted by Warren

Yes, this is a fairly frank thread, but it is an adult discussion, and the Forums are broad enough to accommodate it. An alternative to Charlotte Casiraghi's favourite handbag (if you know what I mean). If a member who is likely to be offended by the content investigates this thread, it is easy enough for them to click on the 'Back' or 'Home' buttons and get out fast.
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You do have an intriguing way with words, Warren...I love it...thank you for the laugh. :)

I can handle it though. I do like the honesty on here..helps people keep things in perspective.

[Royal Fan]

Unsubstantiated gossip

I Think ive heard the rumor about Lord Frederick Windsor

[Warren]

Originally Posted by Royal Fan

I Think ive heard the rumor about Lord Frederick Windsor

Yes, it's RUMOUR only, and follows in the long line of "if he's cute he must be gay" tittletattle. Before Prince Michael of Kent married, the same was "rumoured" about him. Prince Edward ditto. This tendency to claim and label people is one of the more negative and pointless aspects of Gay Gossip.
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[Margrethe II]

Originally Posted by Warren

Yes, it's RUMOUR only, and follows in the long line of "if he's cute he must be gay" tittletattle. Before Prince Michael of Kent married, the same was "rumoured" about him. Prince Edward ditto. This tendency to claim and label people is one of the more negative and pointless aspects of Gay Gossip.
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Very true. I (like everyone else) does not know if infact Lord Freddie is gay or indeed any other person suspected of being gay, but by the look of his profile picture in Wikipedia I think one can safely say he is quite the "indavidual" aristocrat.lol.

"MII"

[msfroyste]

Originally Posted by Royal Fan

I Think ive heard the rumor about Lord Frederick Windsor

i think we all have at one point or another.

[BeatrixFan]

Wikipedia has Frederick down as 'out' and it seemed he was, posing for a gay magazine etc. I suppose that, added to his position on the board of G-A-Y confirmed it in the opinion of those who wrote the article.
Speculation: I think its taken that he is but that he's going to officially remain in the closet.