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  #21  
Old 08-25-2009, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by maria-olivia View Post
1) Was Christian X faithful to his wife ?
As Archduchess Zelia mentioned, it appears that King Christian was faithful to Queen Alexandrine. At least, there is no evidence to suggest the opposite.
Of course, people were a lot more discreet in those days, so even if the King had affairs, it could well be hidden from public knowledge (note: this does NOT mean he did, it is merely possible, albeit not probable).

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2) Did Christian X know that the heir of Danemark would be Margareta and not Ingolf , Prince Knuds'son ?
King Christian died in 1947. At the time, his eldest son (Frederik IX) was 48 and Ingrid was 37. Their youngest child, Princess Anne-Marie was born just a year earlier. It was well possible they could have another child, a son. Thus, King Christian could hardly be certain that Knud (or Knud's male heirs) would succeed Frederik. That was a definite possibility, however, as the Royal Ordinance of 1853 wasn't cancelled yet: the Act of Succession which established Cognatic Primogeniture was passed 6 years after King Christian's death, in 1953.
From 1947 to 1953 Knud was known as Heir Presumptive (his official title was His Royal Highness The Hereditary Prince of Denmark).

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3) normally Frederic succeeds a Christian , like now . Ingolf was not a heir's surname but Margarete well, the danes venerate their Queen Margarethe I, (Roskild church)
.
Prince Ingolf was born in 1940, two months before Queen Margrethe. There was a definite possibility the baby Princess Ingrid was expecting would be a boy. There were also chances Frederik would welcome sons in future, so there was really no reason why Knud had to name his son Christian or Frederik. Moreover, it is possible that the names were 'reserved' for the possible sons of the Crown Prince.
Ingolf did have 'Christian' and 'Frederik' as his second and third names respectively (his full name is Ingolf Christian Frederik Knud Harald Gorm Gustav Viggo Valdemar), so if he were to succeed to the Throne, he could presumably use 'Christian' or "Frederik' as his regnant name. There were a lot of precedents for this: Frederik IX, for example, was born Christian Frederik Franz Michael Carl Valdemar Georg but chose to reign under his second given name. Frederick VIII was born Christian Frederik Vilhelm Carl and again chose to reign under his second given name.

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4) Did Ingrid and Frederic IX thought they should have only one child ??
Apparently they didn't, as they had 3 - Margrethe, Benedikte and Anne-Marie. I assume they would be glad to have at least one more child, a son. There is really no reason why they should have thought they were limited to one-child only.


Hope this helps.
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  #22  
Old 08-25-2009, 10:44 AM
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Marsel , I appreciate your 4 answers.
You are right later princes may change their names when they are kings : like Georges VI of GB and Haakon VII of Norway.
Hot thanks to you and kind regards - Maria-Olivia.
Is the name of Prince Knud's second son Chistian ?
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  #23  
Old 08-25-2009, 11:15 AM
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Marsel , I appreciate your 4 answers.
You are right later princes may change their names when they are kings : like Georges VI of GB and Haakon VII of Norway.
Hot thanks to you and kind regards - Maria-Olivia.
Is the name of Prince Knud's second son Chistian ?
My pleasure, Maria-Olivia!
Yes, the name of Prince Knud's second son is Christian. His full name is Christian Frederik Franz Knud Harald Carl Oluf Gustav Georg Erik (he thus shares 5 of his names with his brother - Christian Frederik Knud Harald and Gustav).
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  #24  
Old 08-26-2009, 03:59 PM
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I remember reading somewhere (maybe in these forums) that when the Prince Charles becomes King of the UK, there will once again be a reigning monarch with Romanov blood (through his great-grandmother, Grand Duchess Olga Costantinovna). Actually, Romanov bloods runs through the Danish monarchs since 1947. Queen Alexandrine's mother was born Grand Duchess Anastasia Mikhailovna.
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Old 01-22-2010, 10:00 AM
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yes you are correct......also the daugther in law of king christan X (queen ingrid) had romanoff blood, through her grandmother queen victoria of sweden (nee baden) and therefore the same thing can be said of the swedish monarchs since 1950 !!

paul, tsar of russia > maria of russia > augusta of saxe-weimar > louise of prussia > victoria of baden (queen of sweden).
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Old 01-22-2010, 12:13 PM
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Now that you mention it, Jonnydep, I've read about Victoria of Baden being in love with a Russian prince (Could it have been the future ysar Nikolai II?), but she wasn't allowed to marry him, as they were too closely related, so she ended up marrying prince Gustav (future king Gustav V) of Sweden instead.
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Old 01-22-2010, 01:41 PM
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Another Swedish-Russian bloodline ties via the Saxe-Weimar/Prussian line:

Paul I > Maria Pavlova > Marie of Saxe-Weimar > Frederick Charles of Prussia > Louise Margaret of Prussia > Margaret of Connaught, Crown Princess of Sweden

It was another Nicholas, Grand Duke Nicholas Mikhailovich, Victoria wanted to marry. The Russian Orthodox prohibited marriages between first cousins, and Nicholas was the son of her aunt Cecilie of Baden (GD Olga Feodorovna) and GD Michael Nikolaevich.
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Old 01-22-2010, 04:12 PM
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Yes, I found out right after I had written that, that it was another grandduke Nicholai.
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  #29  
Old 01-23-2010, 02:15 PM
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Originally Posted by EmpressRouge View Post
Another Swedish-Russian bloodline ties via the Saxe-Weimar/Prussian line:

Paul I > Maria Pavlova > Marie of Saxe-Weimar > Frederick Charles of Prussia > Louise Margaret of Prussia > Margaret of Connaught, Crown Princess of Sweden
thank you of reminding me of this other bloodline, i had forgotten all about it.... as i was writing my adove post, at the back of my mind, i felt sure there was another link somewhere !!
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Old 01-23-2010, 06:00 PM
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I didn't know Margareth had Russian ancestry too, even though it was rather distant. Thank you for the information.
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  #31  
Old 07-05-2010, 02:17 PM
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Hi, I have a postcard that was identified to me as Alexandrine of Mecklenburg-Schwerin. Is this her?

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Old 07-05-2010, 05:23 PM
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Yes; Alexandrine of Mecklenburg-Schwerin married in 1898 the then Prince Christian of Denmark, who became in 1912 King Christian X.
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  #33  
Old 07-08-2010, 04:06 PM
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Thank you, MAfan.
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  #34  
Old 01-22-2011, 11:27 AM
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This is the story of a traitor, who was connected to the DRF, at the beginning of WWII and the German occupation of Denmark.
I guess this is the appropirate place to post this.

From my archive:
Part one:

Here is a fascinating article about a book about a Danish traitor:

One of the things that really puzzle me is why people embraced an ideology as Nazism and why on earth people chose to fight on the same side of a nation, which had invaded and defeated their own country.
It is very difficult to distance myself from the knowledge I have of Nazism and the war and to try and put myself in the situation people would have been in back then.

I joined the Home Guard a couple of years after having been a conscript, because I believed it would be only a matter of time before the missiles landed or Warsaw Pact forces would roll into Denmark. (*) That attitude was also very much influenced by my knowledge of what happened during WWII. But what would I have done, if I had lived back in 9. April 1940? – I don’t know.

Nyhedsavisen, 25th April, 2008.

Nazist var nær ven af kongehuset – Nazi was a close friend of the DRF. (1).

On the 2nd June 1942 Christian Frederik Schalburg was hit in the forehead by a fragment from a shell, (2) during hard fighting on the Eastern front. He died as a soldier for Hitler. (3)
No one was in doubt that this man was a notorious nazi in Denmark during the occupation. He was a leading figure in the Danish nazi party (DNSAP – Dansk Nationalsocialistisk Arbejderparti (4), talked about racial-purity and after his dead was the inspiration for the name of Schalburgkorpset (5), which liquidated Danish resistance fighters.
Yet still King Christian X’s brother, Prince Harald and his wife Princess Helena (6) in the memorial service in his honour, stood side by side with the Danish Prime minister and the minister for Foreign Affairs. (7)
400 guests were gathered in the Odd Fellow mansion in Copenhagen where black and white drapes adorned the hall. On both sides of a tribune fire lit up from big sacrificial-bowls, while a military band played Beethoven’s funeral march Eroica.
- “The official Denmark gathered for the memorial for the greatest Danish traitor”, tells historian Mikkel Kirkebæk. (8)
Today more than 60 years later he is behind the to this date most comprehensive research about Christian Frederik Schalburg. He has spent three years digging into the police intelligence archive, (9) archives in Germany, England and Denmark. Mikkel Kirkebæk have dragged out Schalburg’s old diaries and letters from the dust and scrutinized them so thoroughly that he on the 6. May publish the book “Schalburg – En patriotisk landforrædder – Schalburg – A patriotic traitor”.
A book that among other things lift up the veil for the close relationship of the top-nazi to several members of the DRF.

Christian Frederik Schalburg got to know the DRF through the Russian Tsar family who sought refuge at the Danish court after it was removed in 1917. The revolution also had a decisive influence for the Schalburg-family, who prior to the revolution had lived a priviledged life as nobles in Russia. The rebels raped the mother of the young Schalburg and during the fighting (10) several family members died. The Schalburg family fled to Denmark.
“Pest-vermin” was what the young Schalburg called the Jews hereafter, who according to him was an evil secret empire, who had invented communism in order to destroy Russia.
- “Shalburg swore vengeance. He saw his whole world ruined and that became a crucial point in his life”, tells Mikkel Kirkebæk.
The Tsar-family and the family Schalburg became closely attached in Denmark and through the Tsar-family Schalburg also became a close friend of several Danish royals.
In 1935 King Christian X personally appointed him chamberlain with the greeting “Us lovingly”.
As commanding officer on watch (11) Schalburg often dined with the Danish King and he went to private parties with the brothers of the King, Prince Gustav and Prince Harald. The relationship was so close that Prince Gustav and Empress Dagmar’s daughter Grand Duchess, latter were witnesses at his son baptism. (12)
- “But even though he was happily married and was very dear in the DRF, his mission of live, that of revenge was still not fulfilled”, tells Mikkel Kirkebæk.

When the DRF was so fond of the young Schalburg it was because he was a likable person. The women send him long glances and his subordinates in the army admired him for his love of country. A soldier even wrote: “There was an aura around him”. (13) In the military Schalburg never spared himself, but went in front, also when the going got tough.
Schalburg was articulate and beautiful with his blonde hair, the eagle eyes and the high cheekbones. He wrote passionate love-poems to his wife and bought her expensive gifts, even though the family was very poor. He was also “a terrible snob”, who himself added a “von” to his name, even though he was only christened Schalburg.
- “Schalburg was as a noble raised with the belief that noble blood should not be mixed with common blood. Together with his hatred for Jews and his bitter opposition towards communism, that meant that his values fitted incredibly well with the ideology of the Nazis”, says Mikkel Kirkebæk.

In the beginning of the 1930’s Schalburg joined very right-wing nationalist movements, which were supported by the German intelligence service Gestapo. (14) In 1938 he joined the Danish nazi party and the year after he became national youth leader in the party.
- “But Schalburg was still depressed. He had not yet been out there to fight communists and Jews. To Schalburg communism was a Judaism, which threathned to take over the world and he constantly mixed the two terms”, tells Mikkel Kirkebæk.
When Finland was invaded by Russia in 1939, (15) Schalburg finally found the struggle with the communists, he had been waiting for since the escape of his family in 1917.
Schalburg volunteered to join the war on the side of the Finns. (16)
His friends and family proudly backed him up and from the DRF there was a great understanding for him going. The brother of the King, Prince Gustav wrote in a farewell-letter that he would miss him and thanked for the “never failing friendship”, and Queen Margrethe’s grandmother, Queen Alexandrine send him a fond farewell-note. At that time he had for the last two years been a top-nazi in Denmark and had expressed extreme opinions in public.
- “The friendship of the DRF with Schalburg and the great admiration for him was uninfluenced by the fact that Schalburg at that time was a Danish top-nazi”, tells Mikkel Kirkebæk.
When Schalburg left he left his little son in the care of Grand Duchess Olga. The two of them kept in close touch via letters and in one of the letters it reads about the time the son has spend with her:
- “Sascha (the nick name of the son) drew swastikas everywhere. Now I find them on my papers”. (17)
So Schalburg did not go to war as hated and twisted ideology but as a dear friend.
But the stay in Finland did not go the way Schalburg had hoped. The volunteer Danish soldiers never saw action.
On the other hand another war started.

On the 9. April at 04.00 in the morning Germany attacked Denmark. The Danish government surrendered less than two hours later.
To Schalburg that was a shock. To him it was incomprehensible that Denmark didn’t defend itself. When Schalburg, even though he was a nazi, became unhappy over the news of the occupation, it was because he believed that the Danish politicians and the army had acted like cowards by just giving up the fight for the fatherland.
When Schalburg heard the news he wept, “like a man who had just lost his mother”, as one of the soldiers around him later wrote.
- “Schalburg went into a major crisis. Even if Copenhagen were to be bombed to pieces, (18) the fatherland should, according to Schalburg, have been defended, no matter who the enemy was”, tells Mikkel Kirkebæk.
But that was far from all of it. In Denmark most his friends dropped him, because he as a nazi from now on was linked to the occupational power.
Schalburg didn’t understand it. He had for years had the opinions, which now made people turn their backs on him.
- “He wanted to get away from Denmark, where the government according to Schalburg were cowardly “weaklings”, and from the friends who now no longer wanted to greet him or his wife”, says Mikkel Kirkebæk.
The leading members of the DRF also distanced themselves from him, (19) but Grand Duchess Olga kept seeing him as a son. And the brother of the King, Prince Harald and the wife, Princess Helene also remained loyal.
Deeply unhappy of the army and the politician’s lack of will to fight, Schalburg in September 1940 went to Berlin, where he entered Hitler’s elite corps, Waffen SS.
- “By then there was no way back. From that moment Schalburg developed into one of the most hardcore Nazis we have seen in Denmark”, says Mikkel Kirkebæk.
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  #35  
Old 01-22-2011, 11:27 AM
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Part two:

From the front Schalburg wrote home in 1943 to the nazi-newspaper “Fædrelandet – The Fatherland”, that he was joyous “that the time when Germanic blood was lost in Jewish marriages was over”. Schalburg proudly claimed that Germany was the reason why Europe “wasn’t flooded by Negroes, Jews and other sub-humans”.
Schalburg quickly won, as the first Dane, the German medal for bravery, The Iron Cross. Schalburg immediately wrote home to King Christian X and asked for permission to wear the cross on his Danish uniform. The permission was granted.
To Danish newspapers that warmly spoke for the purity of the race and the ailments of the Jews.
In The Fatherland Schalburg later wrote that his innermost dreams had been fulfilled:
- “Now a group of Danish National Socialists goes forward to fight the Jew”.
- “Schalburg finally found a purpose in his life. He was delighted over the fighting at the front and he waged war with a so far unseen vigour and with daring operations”, tells Mikkel Kirkebæk. (20)
Schalburg did indeed advance with lightning speed within the German military and became leader of Frikorps Danmark, (21) which consisted of Danish men who voluntarily fought under Hitler’s banners on the Eastern Front. (22)
But it didn’t last long. On the 2. June 1942, Christian Frederik Schalburg died. Several of his friends had turned their backs on him as he became ever more absorbed by Nazism. But in his own eyes he still did it out of love to the fatherland.
- “To me it was a big surprise to learn that Schaburg was actually a well-liked person. The collective memory in Denmark has made him into the greatest traitor to date. He hated Jews, was a passionate nazi and put on the uniform of the occupiers. That’s why that label is justified. But it is also important to remember that even the most evil have humans traits”, says Mikkel Kirkebæk.

The article was written by Silke Bock, who may be a journalist but certainly no historian and I have had to make additional corrections in the article.

(*) That things changed dramatically within just a few years, leading me to join the regular army again is another story.

(1) Not entirely correct. He became a nazi later on.

(2) I did not use the word shrapnel, as shrapnel is a specific type of balls, from a specific type of grenade. Fragment is the most correct word. Shrapnels were rarely used during WWII.

(3) Members of his regiment formed an attack column in order to retrieve his body.

(4) The nazi party was in many ways considered a right-wing workers party. It put a lot of emphasis on traditional conservative virtues, like duty, discipline, patriotism, nationalism, authority, order, hard work and so on. Combined with a desire to break down the social and class barriers, which were much more evident back then. You could and should rise by merit in the national-socialist society. – Which is also why Waffen SS attracted many who wanted to become officers, but who would face many obstacles within the Wehrmacht, which had a semi-noble officers-caste of its own. – The anti-Semitism was actually to many, if not most, Nazis a secondary issue. There had for many centuries been a considerable animosity towards Jews in especially central Europe, so in that respect anti-Semitism was “normal”. And to that the nazi-movement believed in a strong state-control and in that sense it was in many ways a “socialist” ideology.
- It is important to try and understand why the nazi ideology made sense and why it attracted so many followers.

(5) Wonder what he would have said about the Schalburg corps? Labelled them criminals and thugs?

(6) I have written about Princess Helena in another thread. King Christian X shipped her right back to Germany after the war.

(7) The forming of Danish volunteers to fight under German command, in the Waffen SS, was officially sanctioned by the Danish government by this time. The Foreign Minister was Scavenius. Ex-Foreign Minister Uffe Ellemann, said about ten years ago that the diplomatic dealings of Scavenius during WWII was masterly and almost unsurpassed in Danish foreign diplomatic history. The aim here naturally being to keep Denmark out of trouble as much as possible and at the same time preserving DK’s independence, and also try to convey the impression to the Allies that DK wasn’t too much a German ally. – Well, it was to a large extent a success, but the shame of this policy lingers on to this day. It can very much be compared to Petain’s France.

(8) Mikkel Kirkebæk’s aim is to sell a book based on his indignation of the Danish official policy during WWII. Whether he truly is indignated is anyone’s guess. I find it less than serious when a historian passes such a black-and-white sentence.

(9) Not PET. Rigspolitiet = the central police authority. However PET is a part of Rigspolitiet.

(10) During the civil war after the revolution.

(11) Schalburg was an officer in the Royal Lifeguards. And as officer one of his duties would have been to attend some official dinners with the DRF. That is still so today, as it indeed is at the British court.

(12) Often, but erroneously, called godparents. A “fadder” is witness, who is obligated to ensure that the child is brought up in the Christian faith. A “gudfar/mor” is a godfather/mother. (2011 note: FasterB has explained thoroughly the church does not distinguish between a “fadder” and a godfather/mother. I left my initial note unaltered as this is a very common perception among Danes).

(13) He was also very admired by his men in Free-corps Denmark too. Which is of course why they fought to retrieve his body. Frikorps Danmark became SS-Grenadier Regiment 1 Danmark. Which again was part of SS-Freiwilligen Panzer Grenadier Division Nordland.

(14) Not correct. Gestapo = Geheime Stats Polizei, was an investigative branch of the German police, which dealt with investigating “subversive criminal activities”, including resistance in some occupied countries. Gestapo was not a part of Abwehr or similar German intelligence organisations.

(15) An extremely dramatic story in its own right.

(16) There was a considerable aide to Finland from the rest of Scandinavia, both in material and men. Alas most of it arrived too late to having any real impact on that war.

(17) The Swastika being an ancient symbol was back then a Finnish national symbol. The Finns still occasionally use the Swastika.

(18) German bombers circled menacingly above Copenhagen that morning.

(19) King Christian considering the occupation as a personal affront.

(20) SS Division Nordland did indeed distinguish itself during WWII.

(21) At the very early stages before the Free Corps became a regiment.

(22) Few of the volunteer SS units consisting of central European volunteers fought Western allies. The Germans knew perfectly well that one of the main reasons why people joined SS and Germany was fanatical anti-communism.
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  #36  
Old 03-24-2011, 12:35 AM
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An image of Christian X and Queen Alexandrine with their six grandchildren from Getty Images.

(L-R) Prince Christian, Queen Alexandrine holding Princess Anne-Marie, Princess Elisabeth (standing behind the Queen), Princess Benedikte (front), Prince Igolf, Princess Margarethe and King Christian X.
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Old 09-22-2011, 02:35 PM
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I was researching the history of the house or glucksburg- the royal family of Denmark and came upon this king that when the Nazi occupied Denmark as well as the Netherlands and norway, king haakon vii of Norway and queen Wilhelmina went into exile and I believe it was Christian X? That instead of fleeing stayed in Denmark and would go out riding by himself on the streets and the Danish people saw him as a symbol of hope and independence and got hitler mad during a telegram incident. I love this king's courage to stand up to the nazis. And the DRF must be proud of such an ancestor.
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Old 05-02-2014, 05:46 PM
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Silver Jubilee of King Christian X in 1937.

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