Ali and Rym: their backgrounds and future roles

[bluetortuga]

They seemed to have dropped off the radar. They must be busy with wedding preparations.

 

[papillon]

Originally posted by bluetortuga@Jun 30th, 2004 - 9:50 pm
They seemed to have dropped off the radar. They must be busy with wedding preparations.

They do seem like a very low profile couple. When is their wedding reception? In September?

 

[sommone]

They will probably continue to be a low profile couple, too. Except Prince Ali will be out whenever KA has to leave the country, or attend meetings, etc. However, Rym probably will be seldom seen except for special occations, or when they are abroad. I thought I had read somewhere that Rym would be working as a journalist in Jordan. Does anyone know if this is true or not?

 

[QueenB]

I think Rym retired for good.. Will Ali continue being head of security for KA? Or will he be home more? I've always wondered, does Ali get a regular working man's paycheck for being head of the security force?

 

[sommone]

Originally posted by QueenB@Jul 1st, 2004 - 10:09 pm
I think Rym retired for good.. Will Ali continue being head of security for KA? Or will he be home more? I've always wondered, does Ali get a regular working man's paycheck for being head of the security force?

Maybe I'm wrong, but I assumed he would. I definitely would like to see him do something else. Something that is perhaps a little safer.

 

[QueenB]

IS he the only JRF member that works?

 

[papillon]

Originally posted by QueenB@Jul 1st, 2004 - 11:24 pm
IS he the only JRF member that works?

P. Basma works incredibly hard, but she does it without a lot of hoopla.

 

[Akilah]

Ali's position is nothing more than a "glorified" bodyguard. I hate to say it, but the truth is the truth.

 

[QueenB]

He's in charge of the King's security... hence head of the bodyguards

 

[sommone]

Originally posted by QueenB@Jul 2nd, 2004 - 7:29 pm
He's in charge of the King's security... hence head of the bodyguards

Exactly what I thought. That's why he needs to find something safer to do now that he is soon to be married.

 

[sommone]

Too bad Rym isn't going to be working as a journalist...I have a feeling, but I could be wrong, that it will be rare that we get to see her, or her and Ali together. She is an intelligent woman, and I would hate to see such intelligence not put to some good use.

 

[QueenB]

Did Rym retire? Because I was watching CNNFN a few days ago and during a commercial about their reporters - they showed Rym..

 

[cut1me]

Originally posted by QueenB@Jul 12th, 2004 - 8:35 am
Did Rym retire? Because I was watching CNNFN a few days ago and during a commercial about their reporters - they showed Rym..

they said she handed in her resignation

 

[QueenB]

I read she resignated too.. but I was surprised to see her in the commercial....

 

[sommone]

I read on Salon.com that Rym would be working as a journalist after she got married. Who knows. Different sources say different things. I guess the only thing is to wait and see.

 

[Julian]

Does anyone know, whether any possible future sons of Prince Ali and his new wife will still be eligible for succession to the Jordan throne under the terms of the present constitution? I am just wondering if that's still possible in this case since Ali was passed over as Crown Prince in favour of Hamzah, so does this mean that Ali's descendants are also excluded? Although I realise also that it's unlikely to ever be an issue in the succession, I still wonder about Ali's status and that of any of his future children, even if their being eligible seems to be further down the line from Hamzah, his sons, Hashem, his sons, Prince Hussein, his sons, and so forth.

 

[Safaa Batin]

Does anyone know, whether any possible future sons of Prince Ali and his new wife will still be eligible for succession to the Jordan throne under the terms of the present constitution? I am just wondering if that's still possible in this case since Ali was passed over as Crown Prince in favour of Hamzah, so does this mean that Ali's descendants are also excluded? Although I realise also that it's unlikely to ever be an issue in the succession, I still wonder about Ali's status and that of any of his future children, even if their being eligible seems to be further down the line from Hamzah, his sons, Hashem, his sons, Prince Hussein, his sons, and so forth.

No way, unless KA make p Ali a CP. The succession is only to the first son or to a brother.

 

[suria]

who dose canceled his wedding for poor people, who thought a bout them except of him, and you talking a bout education the degree would never evaluate the human, he is sensitive person know how to talk with people how cotact with them and this is made him a well qaulified one

 

[cut1me]

who dose canceled his wedding for poor people, who thought a bout them except of him, and you talking a bout education the degree would never evaluate the human, he is sensitive person know how to talk with people how cotact with them and this is made him a well qaulified one

I agree with you Suria I think he is a great man and he is my favourite prince, but just one thing, you said he canceled his wedding for poor people. He still had a wedding, noone really knows how big or extravagant it was, the only thing we know is that they had a huge firework display and alot of people were invited. The only thing they did was no publish any pics so we dont know what they did.

 

[suria]

I agree with you Suria I think he is a great man and he is my favourite prince, but just one thing, you said he canceled his wedding for poor people. He still had a wedding, noone really knows how big or extravagant it was, the only thing we know is that they had a huge firework display and alot of people were invited. The only thing they did was no publish any pics so we dont know what they did.

even thought this up to him i mean if he did a huge party or not but the offical one was canceled for poor people and i know that he realy did that beacuse i know people who were benifit of that so if he did a party this was his own party and all the royals made a private party after the official one Hamazh did Abdullah did so what is the problem of making a party he must had many friends who do want to chair it with him so we cant forget that he did canceled his wedding beacuse he made a party this is diferent

 

[sommone]

See this is another one of those "let's get it right people" debates. Did he or didn't he finish school? Whether or not Ali has a degree/degrees doesn't mean a hill of beans to me.

I think I said before that having a degree won't always guarantee success in life. There is much more to judging someone than solely by whether or not he or she is a college graduate.

I think if Ali wants to pursue other goals in life out side of being head of security, he could do so, and be very successful in doing that with or without a degree. So for goodness sake, give the man a break!

 

[shelley]

See this is another one of those "let's get it right people" debates. Whether or not Ali has a degree/degrees doesn't mean a hill of beans to me. I think I said before that having a degree won't always guarantee success in life. I think there is more to judging a person than solely on whether or not they finished school. The ability to obtain a degree doesn't measure the whole man. I think if Ali wants to pursue other goals in life out side of being head of security, he could do so, and possibly be very successful in doing that with or without a degree. So for goodness sake, give the man a break.

You are of course absolutely right that academic qualifications are not everything. ( But I should think that in the uncertain world of royal families it is very important that every young royal person try to equip themselves with internationally recognised qualifications, in cas e the unthinkable happens, and they find themselves having to get a job in the big bad world outside). But as an outsider and a non Jordanian, but with many Jordanian contacts, I have always got the impression, obviously mistaken, that thus far P. Ali has not really done anything very much, in personal capacity, so I am interested to read that " P.Ali is the most qualified prince in jordan beacuse when he start to do something he make it great". I am delighted for him that apparently he enjoys such a huge amount of popularity in Jordan. The contacts I have were generally of the opinion that he had rather a mixed bag of not always very 'suitable' friends, and one of the reasons he was given his
job was to give him a focus and a purpose. But anyone who thinks that he is the one who calls all the shots regarding the king's security is very much mistaken.

I agree that the King has not got a strong academic background but he certainly persued his military training with enthusiam, going to staff college and attending many courses in the UK and the US. I am not aware of P. Ali doing anything further even in the military line after Sandhurst.

And yes, I agree that for the average Jordanian a football team that is making its way to the top is probably of more interest than people who win medals in other sports. Unfortunately, that seems the way of footballers worldwide. David Beckham's exploits always seem to take precedence over everything and anyone. That is the way of the world.

 

[sommone]

You are of course absolutely right that academic qualifications are not everything. ( But I should think that in the uncertain world of royal families it is very important that every young royal person try to equip themselves with internationally recognised qualifications, in cas e the unthinkable happens, and they find themselves having to get a job in the big bad world outside). But as an outsider and a non Jordanian, but with many Jordanian contacts, I have always got the impression, obviously mistaken, that thus far P. Ali has not really done anything very much, in personal capacity, so I am interested to read that " P.Ali is the most qualified prince in jordan beacuse when he start to do something he make it great". I am delighted for him that apparently he enjoys such a huge amount of popularity in Jordan. The contacts I have were generally of the opinion that he had rather a mixed bag of not always very 'suitable' friends, and one of the reasons he was given his
job was to give him a focus and a purpose. But anyone who thinks that he is the one who calls all the shots regarding the king's security is very much mistaken.

I agree that the King has not got a strong academic background but he certainly persued his military training with enthusiam, going to staff college and attending many courses in the UK and the US. I am not aware of P. Ali doing anything further even in the military line after Sandhurst.

And yes, I agree that for the average Jordanian a football team that is making its way to the top is probably of more interest than people who win medals in other sports. Unfortunately, that seems the way of footballers worldwide. David Beckham's exploits always seem to take precedence over everything and anyone. That is the way of the world.

Well if the unthinkable should happen, not that I am wishing that, and Ali needs to gain employment, then in some capacity he still should be able to do that. If he wanted to obtain a job that qualifies that he have a certain degree then he can always go back to school. I think I said it before...It's never too late to go back to school if that is what a person wants or needs to do. Then again, he could start a business that may go on to be successful, etc. etc.

 

[shelley]

I wonder what's his goal, is he happy doing this job he's now ? That's the only question which should matter us- me myself don't care a bit if he's got 3 degrees or no1- does a Royal Prince really need a degree ? What for- he must learn everything concerning his country's affairs and be very skilled in it- I think most of the Royal Princes ,except for P Charles of UK, have no degree at all, but they can serve their country alright-

I think you have an important point here ....does he want to spend the rest of his working life doing the job he is doing now, where he is neither security officier nor prince ? It must be very confusing, and not make for easy working relations with his colleagues. I once watched on television when it was K. Hussein's death anniversary ceremony and say his four brother lined up praying at their father's grave, and on that occasion, he was working. and then suddenly he is regent when the king is out of the country. And your remark asking if a Royal Prince needs a degree -I don't think they must have one but I think in this cut throat world they must have some form of specialisation in some field. You are wrong about only P. Charles having a degree. Off hand, so does P.Edward, all the Dutch Princes, all the Luxembourg princes, the crownprince of Belgium, the crownprince of Monaco, the crownprince of Japan, the crownprince of Bahrain, the king and the Moroccan princes, the crownprince of Norway. Crownprince Felipe went to university in the US as did princes Pavlos and Nicolas. I am pretty sure the Danes are well educated as Q. Margaretha is one of the best educated monarchs. And amongst his own brothers, P Feisal has a good degree and Princes Hamzah and Hashim also will soon. He will be in a minority even in his own family, and so if I were him, which I am glad I am not, I would at least go and do some more military training if that is where he plans to stay in his present job.

 

[sommone]

I think you have an important point here ....does he want to spend the rest of his working life doing the job he is doing now, where he is neither security officier nor prince ? It must be very confusing, and not make for easy working relations with his colleagues. I once watched on television when it was K. Hussein's death anniversary ceremony and say his four brother lined up praying at their father's grave, and on that occasion, he was working. and then suddenly he is regent when the king is out of the country. And your remark asking if a Royal Prince needs a degree -I don't think they must have one but I think in this cut throat world they must have some form of specialisation in some field. You are wrong about only P. Charles having a degree. Off hand, so does P.Edward, all the Dutch Princes, all the Luxembourg princes, the crownprince of Belgium, the crownprince of Monaco, the crownprince of Japan, the crownprince of Bahrain, the king and the Moroccan princes, the crownprince of Norway. Crownprince Felipe went to university in the US as did princes Pavlos and Nicolas. I am pretty sure the Danes are well educated as Q. Margaretha is one of the best educated monarchs. And amongst his own brothers, P Feisal has a good degree and Princes Hamzah and Hashim also will soon. He will be in a minority even in his own family, and so if I were him, which I am glad I am not, I would at least go and do some more military training if that is where he plans to stay in his present job.

As long as KA is in charge, PA will have that job...I can't fathom anything other than a really bad disagreement of some kind, or PA's decision to leave on his own would be the reason for him to leave the position. However, should the unthinkable happens then he does have the option to return to school if he didn't finish to pursue his degree in whatever interests him so that he can get gainful employment. Also, I'm sure he has some connections, so that's optional as well, not saying he wouldn't or would ever use them if the need arises....Remember I don't know him personally.

 

[shelley]

As long as KA is in charge, PA will have that job...I can't fathom anything other than a really bad disagreement of some kind, or PA's decision to leave on his own would be the reason for him to leave the position. However, should the unthinkable happens then he does have the option to return to school if he didn't finish to pursue his degree in whatever interests him so that he can get gainful employment. Also, I'm sure he has some connections, so that's optional as well, not saying he wouldn't or would ever use them if the need arises....Remember I don't know him personally.

Well, I don't know him personally either, which is in a way what is amusing about these discussions as so many of us get heated about people and situations we can only surmise about! However, I would hope that he has some useful connections to fall back on should he need to. But it is always better to back up the best connection with something substantial as well, but that is only my rather old fashioned view. And I can never understand people who have every opportunity and no financial constraints who do not try and make something of themselves. But he has aquired a nice wife, and we are told the Jordanian football team has improved so radically, all due to his efforts, so there are some pluses on his account. Obviously this is the clue to his tremendos popularity with the youth of Jordan. Perhaps P. Charles should take a leaf out of his book and be seen cheering Beckham on. It might do wonders for his public image !

 

[sommone]

Well, I don't know him personally either, which is in a way what is amusing about these discussions as so many of us get heated about people and situations we can only surmise about! However, I would hope that he has some useful connections to fall back on should he need to. But it is always better to back up the best connection with something substantial as well, but that is only my rather old fashioned view. And I can never understand people who have every opportunity and no financial constraints who do not try and make something of themselves. But he has aquired a nice wife, and we are told the Jordanian football team has improved so radically, all due to his efforts, so there are some pluses on his account. Obviously this is the clue to his tremendos popularity with the youth of Jordan. Perhaps P. Charles should take a leaf out of his book and be seen cheering Beckham on. It might do wonders for his public image !

You have made several good points...I do believe in a college education, but I think part of the reason that is is because I grew up poor. Not dirt poor, because I do realize there are people far worse off than anything that I have ever experienced. However, I knew that if I wanted to get somewhere in life, I was going to have to go off to school to do it. In PA's case, I don't know what his reason or reasons may have been for not finishing school...I mean one can speculate to infiniti, but unless we hear it from the horse's mouth, we will never know so...but as I said, he does have the option to return and complete school if he wants.


Also, I did point out in the past that having a degree doesn't mean anything if your going to use it to judge someone's value or worthiness because there is much more to evaluate if you are going to use it solely for this purpose. (And Shelley, I'm not saying you personally are doing this...I'm speaking in general). However, there have been people who questioned Ali's worthiness based on the fact that he didn't have a degree, and well that's just wrong on so many levels...so that was my reason for stating that Ali doesn't necessarily have to have a degree. Job wise, possibly, but not always the case. It's good to clarify these things because people have been known to take something someone says and imply other things about it, and before you know it, it has been blown completely out of proportion. There are many dimensions to Ali just as there would be to every other human on the planet.


Also, you are right about the heated arguments, which I have been known to be party to on the occasion...Not that I was out looking for an argument. That isn't who I am. However in most cases, I think that I may have tried to get people to keep an open mind about certain issues or other people...especially if, as you have stated, none of us know these people personally. However, I realized that isn't up to me to try to convince anyone to stay open minded about anything. I mean basically it was a total waste of time. I just concluded that if they wanted to do the opposite, then by all means so be it.

So, I am guilty of participating in heated discussions in the past just by contributing to them. So now I try not to even get involved. I hope no one thinks this discussion is heated because it isn't....Actually, IMO, it is far from it. But really PA has several options...right now to my knowledge his position isn't in any immediate danger. If he is happy with what he does for a living then I couldn't be happier. I'm not here to judge him.

 

[shelley]

You have made several good points...I do believe in a college education, but I think part of the reason that is is because I grew up poor. Not dirt poor, because I do realize there are people far worse off than anything that I have ever experienced. However, I knew that if I wanted to get somewhere in life, I was going to have to go off to school to do it. In PA's case, I don't know what his reason or reasons may have been for not finishing school...I mean one can speculate to infiniti, but unless we hear it from the horse's mouth, we will never know so...but as I said, he does have the option to return and complete school if he wants.


Also, I did point out in the past that having a degree doesn't mean anything if your going to use it to judge someone's value or worthiness because there is much more to evaluate if you are going to use it solely for this purpose. (And Shelley, I'm not saying you personally are doing this...I'm speaking in general). However, there have been people who questioned Ali's worthiness based on the fact that he didn't have a degree, and well that's just wrong on so many levels...so that was my reason for stating that Ali doesn't necessarily have to have a degree. Job wise, possibly, but not always the case. It's good to clarify these things because people have been known to take something someone says and imply other things about it, and before you know it, it has been blown completely out of proportion. There are many dimensions to Ali just as there would be to every other human on the planet.


Also, you are right about the heated arguments, which I have been known to be party to on the occasion...Not that I was out looking for an argument. That isn't who I am. However in most cases, I think that I may have tried to get people to keep an open mind about certain issues or other people...especially if, as you have stated, none of us know these people personally. However, I realized that isn't up to me to try to convince anyone to stay open minded about anything. I mean basically it was a total waste of time. I just concluded that if they wanted to do the opposite, then by all means so be it.

So, I am guilty of participating in heated discussions in the past just by contributing to them. So now I try not to even get involved. I hope no one thinks this discussion is heated because it isn't....Actually, IMO, it is far from it. But really PA has several options...right now to my knowledge his position isn't in any immediate danger. If he is happy with what he does for a living then I couldn't be happier. I'm not here to judge him.

Hey, Sommone, I don't think we are having a heated discussion on this occasion at all. Please don't think I am thinking that. I was just making a general remark that I guess it is rather amusing that we all on certain occasions are so convinced of our point of view, and guess most of us are often quite quite wrong ! I certainly do not think that one can judge someone only on the basis of their academic qualifications.I can line up ten people instantly who have good academic credentials and I would not want them to come through my front door. But I suppose what I have found interesting about the discussion about P. Ali is that here we have a young man who has had many opportunities in life, along with some blows as well, the worst being the loss of his mother, ( possibly the one person most people can rely on although I can think of people who have been hugely let down by their mother, or pushed around by step parents, and this has actually been a spur to encourage them to make something of their lives, so you cannot generalise about this) but who has really not made anything thus far of his life, by my rather old fashioned perception. And I am amazed that he is held in such high esteem by young Jordanians as the Jordanian friends I have, admittedly older people, but with children and grandchildren P. Ali's age, have commented rather negatively on his circle of friends , their propensity to drink too much and get into fights. Many people I believe will give a restaurant or cafe a wide berth if they know he is inside. And although some may consider it loyalty of a sort, he still mixes with many of these people even though he now holds a hughly responsible job. ( Many of them have benefited financially with contracts etc through him, but I guess that is normal for most Arab princes )Although there are those who will say that it is an attempt to bismirch his reputation, you do not hear the same crticism of the other princes' friends. So I wonder how much is truth , how much exaggeration and if indeed he is such a hero, what exactly do the Jordanian youth want from their princes ? Delivering the goods on football cannot be the only reason .

 

[sommone]

Well Shelley, I can't speak about the choice of company Ali keeps...You obviously have friends or people whom you know that may know of these things...I remember growing up and having a questionable friend of my own. To say that my mom was unhappy would be an understatement. However, I didn't let her behavior influence mine. I used my own mind, and thought for myself. I'm sure other people thought the same negative things about my friendship with her, but then I am not a prince whose life is constantly under the microscope.

As far as his popularity in Jordan, maybe he's popular because he's kind, considerate, etc. etc. Maybe he's popular because people pity the fact that he grew up without his mother, whom I think it is safe to say was a good mother and person in her own right. Maybe he is popular because of other things...go figure. He could be popular for a number of reasons. I do have questions though...When he was made regent, what does that mean? And is he still regent?

 

[shelley]

Well Shelley, I can't speak about the choice of company Ali keeps...You obviously have friends or people whom you know that may know of these things...I remember growing up and having a questionable friend of my own. To say that my mom was unhappy would be an understatement. However, I didn't let her behavior influence mine. I used my own mind, and thought for myself. I'm sure other people thought the same negative things about my friendship with her, but then I am not a prince whose life is constantly under the microscope.

As far as his popularity in Jordan, maybe he's popular because he's kind, considerate, etc. etc. Maybe he's popular because people pity the fact that he grew up without his mother, whom I think it is safe to say was a good mother and person in her own right. Maybe he is popular because of other things...go figure. He could be popular for a number of reasons. I do have questions though...When he was made regent, what does that mean? And is he still regent?

No, he is only regent occasionally, when none of the other brothers are around, and beign regent is normally only for a few days at a time. But it is odd that at this moment he reverts to being a prince and not security officer even though his 'principal' is travelling which is potentially a dangerous situation. Which is why I wonder how much actual guarding responsibility he has. And I am still not convinved how popular he actually is across the board.....maybe with a certain number of teenage groupies. Now I sound very middle aged as indeed I am.