Prince Albert's Older Children Part 1: 2009 - 2023

[Duc_et_Pair]

She is not a "new "spouse" in that they are children of previous wives. They never had a relationship as a family. They were never a family. They were children from affairs. As he has acknowledged their being his children, that he provides for them and he doesn't hide the fact, why would you expect anything else.

I agree. The children stayed with their mother, as is almost always the arrangement for children born outside a legal union.

Mette-Marit and Camilla married the Crown Prince of Norway resp. the Prince of Wales and their offspring from an earlier relationship became part of their husband's family.

Tamara Rotolo and Nicole Coste never entered into marriage with Prince Albert. The one lives in Florida, the other is moving between Europe and Africa. They are just no part of the famille princière monégasque.

 

[eya]

I do not think the Charlene to distrurb children of Albert from the past relationships.
Moreover Albert married HER, make HER princess, HER children are princes of Monaco, HER son is the heir.
Honestly does not bother me either

 

[Roslyn]

Tamara Rotolo and Nicole Coste never entered into marriage with Prince Albert. The one lives in Florida, the other is moving between Europe and Africa. They are just no part of the famille princière monégasque.

The nature of the relationship he had with the mothers, and the way the mothers have chosen to live their lives since giving birth to Albert's children, is irrelevant. It is the children we are talking about here. Albert is their father. His elder son and daughter are his children just as much as his two new babies are, and, thus, are must as much a part of his family as they are, whether he, or anyone else, likes it or not. Their lack of "legitimate" status means they cannot inherit any of the incidents of Albert's princely status, but they are his children nevertheless, and they should not be held in any lesser regard than those to whom his wife gave birth after his marriage.

 

[JR76]

The nature of the relationship he had with the mothers, and the way the mothers have chosen to live their lives since giving birth to Albert's children, is irrelevant. It is the children we are talking about here. Albert is their father. His elder son and daughter are his children just as much as his two new babies are, and, thus, are must as much a part of his family as they are, whether he, or anyone else, likes it or not. Their lack of "legitimate" status means they cannot inherit any of the incidents of Albert's princely status, but they are his children nevertheless, and they should not be held in any lesser regard than those to whom his wife gave birth after his marriage.

The princely incidents aside they would both be entitled to a considerable part of their fathers fortune legitimate or not legitimate.


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[Lee-Z]

Dutch gossip press reports today that P.Albert has invited his children Jazmin and Alexandre to a holiday in Monaco
Albert haalt voorechtelijke kinderen naar Monaco|Prive| Telegraaf.nl

/translated

 

[Florestane]

I don't think they are held in lesser regard. They just aren't part of his official life. He has a relationship with them.

 

[RoyalOutcast]

They were not born "from affairs" - Albert was a single man when Jazmin and Alexandre were conceived and born. They have nothing to do with Charlene and she knew about them before she married Albert.

(..)

 

[C4A]

Dutch gossip press reports today that P.Albert has invited his children Jazmin and Alexandre to a holiday in Monaco
Albert haalt voorechtelijke kinderen naar Monaco|Prive| Telegraaf.nl

/translated

How do they know P Charlene is "furious" about their visit? What do they base this on? Jazmin has just recently indicated that P Charlene has welcomed her and acted warmly towards her.


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[Duc_et_Pair]

They were not born "from affairs" - Albert was a single man when Jazmin and Alexandre were conceived and born. [...]

Since the Prince never had any familial or parental relationship with Ms Rotolo (a married lady at the time) or Ms Coste, we indeed may file all this under the A of "affair".

 

[Pranter]

Exactly Roslyn. And any man/woman who would push their children aside for someone else is deserving of no respect.


LaRae

 

[Lee-Z]

How do they know P Charlene is "furious" about their visit? What do they base this on? Jazmin has just recently indicated that P Charlene has welcomed her and acted warmly towards her.

imho that's just something they came up with to get a more juicy story..

but i do like (if it's true ofcourse, you never know) that Jazmin and Alexandre can spemd time in Monaco and with the Grimaldi family

 

[Ish]

They were not born "from affairs" - Albert was a single man when Jazmin and Alexandre were conceived and born. They have nothing to do with Charlene and she knew about them before she married Albert.

(..)

Given as Jazmin's mother was married to another man at the time of her birth/conception, she is the result of an affair.

 

[Mirabel]

The nature of the relationship he had with the mothers, and the way the mothers have chosen to live their lives since giving birth to Albert's children, is irrelevant. It is the children we are talking about here. Albert is their father. His elder son and daughter are his children just as much as his two new babies are, and, thus, are must as much a part of his family as they are, whether he, or anyone else, likes it or not. Their lack of "legitimate" status means they cannot inherit any of the incidents of Albert's princely status, but they are his children nevertheless, and they should not be held in any lesser regard than those to whom his wife gave birth after his marriage.

Not lesser regard, exactly.
But his older children were the result of casual flings, while his twins are the royal heirs from his marriage to his consort.
So, in that regard there is a difference.

I'm sure he cares for all his children, but to have his older children at public events might be uncomfortable for everyone, since the press is certain to make a big deal over it.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

They were not born "from affairs" - Albert was a single man when Jazmin and Alexandre were conceived and born. They have nothing to do with Charlene and she knew about them before she married Albert.

(..)

A married woman(as both Tamara Rotolo and Nicole Coste were) who sleeps with a man not her husband is having an illicit affair with him. Children resulted from these adulterous affairs. Albert was a single man but Tamara and Nicole were both technically married to other men and separated from them.

In other words....they were having AFFAIRS with Albert.

Any ruler's official family includes his legal wife and their children. Period.

Royal history is rife with the examples of children that resulted from affairs. Sometimes these children were awarded titles, lavish estates, etc, and sometimes they were simply ignored to fend for themselves.

Albert's children live in considerable luxury and even Nicole Coste admitted that he had been a doting father to Eric. He doesn't see Eric as regularly because the child lives in England.

Jazmin and Eric are neither abused, ignored, nor neglected.

If outsiders are not satisfied with this arrangement and need to see Eric and Jazmin take on a more prominent public role to satisfy their own concept of what is "right" in this situation, it's not Albert's problem nor Charlene's.

 

[melina premiere]

Prince Albert said that he will receive his older children in the interview of people magazine
Jazmin said in her interview that she has good relation with Charlene and Albert that she have barbecue together with Alexandre at roc Agel like, we know that Albert saw hie older children


The king Albert of belgium never recognized her daughter Delphine , he has a process with her


Prince bernard of Netherlands said in a tape before his death , this tape was publisged after his death that he had two daughters with two different wifes. We know that Prince Bernhard saw them and they were received by queen Juliana but we never saw these daughters in public, never saw a photos of them, her daughters did not attend the funeral of Prince Bernhard.Queen Beatrice and her sisters would not want that they attend to the funeral of thir father.
The daughters of Prince Bernhard were part of his privat life, her daughters never complained and were discret
The royal family of Netherland was the daughters that prince Bernhard had with the gueen Juliana and they were not part of the official royal family.
It is the same thing in Monaco, Albert recogniezd his two children he provides for them, he saw them. What do you want more?
To see them together to be sure that he loves his children. it is very vicious.
Albert is an fair man, he is the only royal who recognized his children.
The prince of Parme, the son of princess irene had an illegitimat son , he recognized him but we never saw him at family events of the royal family , he was not at the wedding of his father and nor to the christenings of her half sisters?
If these royals never show their children in official events, why would Albert do it?He already did a lot, he said that he saw his children but it seems not enough. and it gives salt to the tabloid like the dutch tabloid who says that Charlene was furious? How do they know? the family is living in Roc Agel.
As we say in France,
We give a finger, they want the arm.

 

[eya]

And as we say here in Greece "ΓΕΙΑ ΣΤΟ ΣΤΟΜΑ ΣΟΥ" meaning very good you saying

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

The comparison with the daughters of Prince Bernhard indeed is a good one. For Alexia Lejeune Grinda and her mother the Prince purchased a luxe penthouse at the Avenue Raphaël (in the 16e arrondissement in Paris, looking out on the Jardin du Ranelagh, close to Trocadéro and the Bois de Boulogne). Yes, she had no public contact with the Prince but in an interview in the Dutch newspaper De Telegraaf in 2004 her halfbrother Cyril, 7e baron Lejeune told: "My sister Alexia always could rely on the warm attention of her father. The Prince was a good man, both for Alexia as well for my mother. He regularly visited them and cared for their wellbeing. Both feel deep sadness for his passing-away."

According the Baron, the 37-years old Alexia visited Soestdijk Palace last weekend to say farewell to her father and was received with great respect: "Alexia loved her father to bits. She is devastated by his death. For her he was a doting and loving father. That he coincidentally was a royal prince was not important for her."

According the half-brother both Alexia, his mother and some good friends headed for a foreign country after the visit to the palace. The new media hunt on Prince Bernhard's extramarital daughter and the speculations about her role in the royal family became too much for her. "If it depends on Alexia, no one will ever hear any word anymore. All stories about Alexia demanding her place in the royal family are pure nonsense. The only thing she longs for is to be left alone" said Cyril Lejeune. That Alexia was not welcome at the royal funeral has not hit her. "She had all understanding of the world for that. Her attendance would possibly have stirred an undesirable large media-attention and possibly caused unrest. That is the last what Prince Bernhard and Alexia would have wanted."

After the death of the Prince, both Alicia de Bielefelde as well Alexia Lejeune Grinda equally shared in their father's inheritance with their four royal halfsisters.

 

[Lee-Z]

Well, let's just say it would be nice if all P.Albert's children turn out to have a better relationship with eachother than P.Bernhard's children had/have

 

[Moonmaiden23]

The case of Albert of Belgium's daughter is a good example(to me) of an illegitimate child being treated cruelly and unfairly. Albert simply cut the girl and her mother off without a backward glance. He denies her very existence.

Albert of Monaco's relationship with Jazmin and Eric is a night/day comparison with former King Albert. Delphine Boel has every reason to be bitter imo.

Jazmin and Eric and their mothers do not.

 

[HereditaryPrincess]

Dutch gossip press reports today that P.Albert has invited his children Jazmin and Alexandre to a holiday in Monaco
Albert haalt voorechtelijke kinderen naar Monaco|Prive| Telegraaf.nl

/translated

It would be nice if this were true, but somehow I doubt it is. It would be too awkward for Charlene for them both to be there, especially now that she has Jacques and Gabriella. And I've heard that Albert isn't much in touch with Alexandre, so it seems a bit odd for him to suddenly invite him to Monaco to stay (unless it was a sort of "bonding holiday"...).

I read in the earlier pages of this thread that Alexandre and his mother Nicole live in a villa in Villefranche-sur-Mer, does anyone know if they still live there?

 

[melina premiere]

Jazmin said in the interview that she was invited to the christening of the twins and she has good relations with Charlene, Why to say that Charlene does not want to receive the children of Albert at home?


Here is the interview of Albert to people where he is speaking about the visit of Jazmin and Alexandre


http://www.people.com/people/package/article/0,,20395222_20937095,00.htmlhereditary prince


hereditary princess some resders already said that Nicole Costes moved with her son to London. they lived now in London

 

[rominet09]

As a Belgian and loving King Albert, I think he should have recognized Delphine now BUt the fact that he clearly shows he doesn't want her (cruel but his right) and that she goes to the tribunals IMO shows that maybe she is interested in money. I mean what is the use to do that otherwise ? You cannot oblige someone to love and accept you.

 

[Roslyn]

A married woman(as both Tamara Rotolo and Nicole Coste were) who sleeps with a man not her husband is having an illicit affair with him. Children resulted from these adulterous affairs. Albert was a single man but Tamara and Nicole were both technically married to other men and separated from them.

In other words....they were having AFFAIRS with Albert.

If the women were married to other men and separated from them, I don't regard them as having affairs with Albert, at least not capital "A" affairs. But I am a lot less bothered about adultery than a lot of people, and I don't even consider it adultery if the couple has separated.

But regardless of their mother's situations at the time they were conceived, these children are Albert's as much as his legitimate children are, and are part of his family.

Any ruler's official family includes his legal wife and their children. Period.

Official family, yes. But that's just a construct arising from the social construct of marriage. In these days where about 40% of children in EU countries are born out of wedlock, increasing to over 50% in some countries, illegitimacy is not the social stigma it was even 30 years ago. The various pieces of equal rights/equal status legislation, including the European Convention on the Legal Status of Children Born out of Wedlock, have done away with the legal discrimination against ex-nuptial children.

Royal history is rife with the examples of children that resulted from affairs. Sometimes these children were awarded titles, lavish estates, etc, and sometimes they were simply ignored to fend for themselves.

Albert's children live in considerable luxury and even Nicole Coste admitted that he had been a doting father to Eric. He doesn't see Eric as regularly because the child lives in England.

Jazmin and Eric are neither abused, ignored, nor neglected.

The fact that illegitimate children of Royal men were treated poorly in the past is irrelevant. There is no reason why, in these days when most of the discriminatory rules and/or laws which used to apply to illegitimate children have been removed, a child born out of wedlock to an extremely wealthy man should live in considerable luxury. That is their right, not a privilege, and the father should not be praised for complying with his legal obligations.

I should jolly well nope that neither Jazmin nor Eric is abused, ignored, nor neglected.

If outsiders are not satisfied with this arrangement and need to see Eric and Jazmin take on a more prominent public role to satisfy their own concept of what is "right" in this situation, it's not Albert's problem nor Charlene's.

Subject to the qualifier that different members here may have different definitions of "public role", I don't think anyone here has suggested that the older children should take on a more prominent public role. The public nature of the role of Albert's "official" children is one of the burdens of their position, not a benefit.

 

[Princess of Durham]

There is absolutely nothing to suggest that Eric and Jazmin are "abused, ignored, nor neglected." And sorry, I don't agree that it is their "right" to live "considerable luxury". It seems that they are quite well taken care of. It seems that there is a dead horse being beaten here and I don't understand the motivation for it. Everything we have heard suggests that these children are well taken care of. Now, is it their "right" to live in the Palace in Monaco? Uh, NO. It might be the wish of one of their mothers or even them, but it is not a right by any means. IMO, of course.

 

[Roslyn]

^^^ I take issue with the suggestion I am beating a dead horse, since that implies it is a hopeless issue and I don't believe it is a hopeless issue. But whether or not what I am doing constitutes beating a dead horse, I find myself compelled to do so whenever I get an inkling that it is being suggested that Albert's two elder children are somehow entitled to less - be it less recognition or concern or less money or less in any other way - than their younger half-siblings who happened to be born after their father married.

And I'm not talking about any of the bells and whistles that follow from Albert's princely status, for that stuff is limited to the children of his marriage by reason of the rules that apply to inheritance of that stuff. At no time have I suggested - nor would I do so - that they have any right to live in the Palace in Monaco. Though maybe, on reflection, I should, since I probably would argue that the child of an ordinary man's previous relationship should not be prohibited from living with its father in the home where the father lives with his second/third/etc. wife or partner and their family, certainly in the case of minor children, merely because they were illegitimate and born of casual liaisons rather than "acceptable" relationships. But I most certainly hope that neither of his elder children is dissuaded from visiting their father there, or made to walk in the back entrance. Charlene knew he had other children when she married him, and the suggestion that she somehow needs to be protected from the presence of her step children causes me to start looking for the flogger again.

But I digress. I am primarily arguing in favour of recognition without discrimination, and certain consequences follow from that.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

It would be nice if this were true, but somehow I doubt it is. It would be too awkward for Charlene for them both to be there, especially now that she has Jacques and Gabriella. And I've heard that Albert isn't much in touch with Alexandre, so it seems a bit odd for him to suddenly invite him to Monaco to stay (unless it was a sort of "bonding holiday"...).

I read in the earlier pages of this thread that Alexandre and his mother Nicole live in a villa in Villefranche-sur-Mer, does anyone know if they still live there?

Princess Charlene is a woman whose love for children is evident. I doubt she'd have any objection at all to Eric and Jazmin spending family time at Roc Agel with she and Albert and the twins, in fact according to Jazmin Grimaldi it has already happened.

Nicole is-or was-pursuing a career as a fashion designer in London as of late last year. She might still keep her villa in the South of France, but her official base is now in London.


[But I digress. I am primarily arguing in favour of recognition without discrimination, and certain consequences follow from that]


Sorry Roslyn, but I genuinely don't follow you here. What specific type of "recognition without discrimination" re: Jazmin and Eric are you suggesting? Taking 11 year old Eric away from his mother and moving him into the Palace? Offering Nicole a room there as well?

Jazmin is an adult. She has already demonstrated by her actions and in her interviews that she is content with her life and the amount of involvement she has with her father and his family.

 

[Roslyn]

[But I digress. I am primarily arguing in favour of recognition without discrimination, and certain consequences follow from that]

Sorry Roslyn, but I genuinely don't follow you here. What specific type of "recognition without discrimination" re: Jazmin and Eric are you suggesting? Taking 11 year old Eric away from his mother and moving him into the Palace? Offering Nicole a room there as well?

It's very simple. All I mean is that everyone should acknowledge that Albert has four children, not just two babies, and that each of those four children is equal, both in importance as human beings and as his children, regardless of their status with respect to legitimacy.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

By "everyone" do you mean the Press? Some sort of official announcement in Nice Matin that Prince's flings with his lovers produced two children that are of equal importance to the heirs? Or a proclamation from the Palais/Albert demanding that every single mention of the Prince's family public or privately uttered must include his out of wedlock offspring? Seriously?

Because frankly the Monegasques are not likely to agree. They surely know that Eric and Jazmin exist but they are probably not going to be able to be persuaded to manifest the same level of interest and affection for them as they do their future Sovereign and his sister.

As the saying goes....you can pull a horse to the water but you cannot force it to drink.

As for myself, I have and do acknowledge that Albert has four children. I am sure that he loves all of them deeply and wants the best for them. As human beings Eric and Jazmin are just as important as the twins and entitled to the same amount of dignity and respect. They did not choose the circumstances of their births.

But to pretend that all four hold the same level of Constitutional importance, to pretend that their positions in Monegasque society are all exactly the same, is just Kabuki theater.

It isn't true, it will never be true.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

Well, let's just say it would be nice if all P.Albert's children turn out to have a better relationship with eachother than P.Bernhard's children had/have

Well... Alexia Lejeune Grinda was born in the same year Prince Bernhard's eldest daughter gave birth to Prince Willem-Alexander... How can one expect Princess Beatrix to keep a sisterly relationship with a someone in France, 29 years younger than her, with the same age as her own son?

And all this in 1967, in a conservative society and at a conservative Court. It does not depend on the Prince only, it also did depend on the willingness of Queen Juliana, Princess Beatrix and the others how to cope with this. Both Alicia and Alexia have stirred old wounds open in the stormy marriage of Queen Juliana and Prince Bernhard.

By the way: Alexia told about receptions at Soestdijk Palace. Her half-sister Alicia told in media about annual holidays with Princess Juliana and her father at the royal villa Il Elefante Felice in Porto Ercole (Italy) and she described Princess Juliana, the former Queen, as a most warm and loving person. Alicia told she went shopping with her, in Italy. During one of these holidays she also met her other half-sister Alexia.

The story above shows how complicated such relationships can be. While Princess Charlène is nursing her little two babies, her husband already has an adult daughter walking around and seeking media attention (unlike Alicia and Alexia above)... The age difference between Jacques/Gabriella and Yasmin is 23 years... How can these three ever have a normal sisterly relationship? No wonder Princess Charlène is at her qui-vive.

It's very simple. All I mean is that everyone should acknowledge that Albert has four children, not just two babies, and that each of those four children is equal, both in importance as human beings and as his children, regardless of their status with respect to legitimacy.

But Albert has acknowledged he has four children. He is not hiding them. They are just no part of the famille princière. What do we expect Princess Charlène to do? Yasmin is 23 years (!) older than her princely half-siblings. Yasmin already has the age on which normal children leave the parental nest and settle an independent life. Now apparently she still has to make a sort of "family" or something? It would all turn into a cheap vaudeville. It is as it is, Yasmin and Alexandre are very privileged and their lives go as it goes. Soit.

 

[Roslyn]

By "everyone" do you mean the Press? Some sort of official announcement in Nice Matin that Prince's flings with his lovers produced two children that are of equal importance to the heirs? Or a proclamation from the Palais/Albert demanding that every single mention of the Prince's family public or privately uttered must include his out of wedlock offspring? Seriously?

Because frankly the Monegasques are not likely to agree. They surely know that Eric and Jazmin exist but they are probably not going to be able to be persuaded to manifest the same level of interest and affection for them as they do their future Sovereign and his sister.

As the saying goes....you can pull a horse to the water but you cannot force it to drink.

As for myself, I have and do acknowledge that Albert has four children. I am sure that he loves all of them deeply and wants the best for them. As human beings Eric and Jazmin are just as important as the twins and entitled to the same amount of dignity and respect. They did not choose the circumstances of their births.

But to pretend that all four hold the same level of Constitutional importance, to pretend that their positions in Monegasque society are all exactly the same, is just Kabuki theater.

It isn't true, it will never be true.

I mean what I have said on the issue. No more, and no less. I have never suggested the elder children hold the same level of constitutional importance in Monaco as their half brother and sister, and indeed I have distinguished their situations on that point.