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  #201  
Old 07-09-2011, 04:18 AM
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Here's a question, Charlene had 5 years to improve herself, learn French and she did nothing of the sort.

What makes you think that she's going to start working on improving herself now? She doesn't need a college degree to be a princess but she can't even pull off the bare minimum requirements. What does it matter if she reads biographies if she can't give a decent interview without sounding vapid?

As for comparing her to Diana again, yes Diana wasn't the brightest and she was a high school drop out. Diana on the other hand lived in an English speaking country but made the effort to give a speach in Welsh, when she went on tour to Italy with Charles she spoke some Italian. She was far from fluent and her pronounciation wasn't the greatest but she made the effort. Diana was also able to go out and speak and interact with the people of the country she was a princess of. And let's not just compare her to Diana, how about the Queen, Prince Charles and Prince William who learnt French. How is Charlene going to do her duties in Monaco when she can't speak the language of her people? She speaks English and Afrikaans but the South African newspapers are saying that she seems uncomfortable and uneasy. If she can't get it right in South Africa her country of birth, where she speaks the language, how is she going to fare in Monaco or the rest of Europe?
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  #202  
Old 07-09-2011, 04:19 AM
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Originally Posted by XeniaCasaraghi View Post
I wonder how many people criticizing Charlene's lack of education are fans of Diana who was also a high school drop out/ not to bright woman.

I don´t want to start a discussion that do not correspond to this thread, but how do you know she was not smart? She put everyone around her to shame, especially her husband, with only 30 years.
As fas as I know she finished school in Switzerland, she spoke a little French, having lived there very little time, she could deliver a speeh in Welsh, she played piano, she was a good swimmer, made ballet and diving. She worked in a kindergarden. So, she had done something with her life when she married, only at 19.

edit: we poste almost at the same time sandwichshaik. Well, probably she dropped school, but, yes, she was so easy going, so what counts more?
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  #203  
Old 07-09-2011, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by SandwichSheik View Post
Here's a question, Charlene had 5 years to improve herself, learn French and she did nothing of the sort.

What makes you think that she's going to start working on improving herself now? She doesn't need a college degree to be a princess but she can't even pull off the bare minimum requirements. What does it matter if she reads biographies if she can't give a decent interview without sounding vapid?

As for comparing her to Diana again, yes Diana wasn't the brightest and she was a high school drop out. Diana on the other hand lived in an English speaking country but made the effort to give a speach in Welsh, when she went on tour to Italy with Charles she spoke some Italian. She was far from fluent and her pronounciation wasn't the greatest but she made the effort. Diana was also able to go out and speak and interact with the people of the country she was a princess of. And let's not just compare her to Diana, how about the Queen, Prince Charles and Prince William who learnt French. How is Charlene going to do her duties in Monaco when she can't speak the language of her people? She speaks English and Afrikaans but the South African newspapers are saying that she seems uncomfortable and uneasy. If she can't get it right in South Africa her country of birth, where she speaks the language, how is she going to fare in Monaco or the rest of Europe?
Please provide the links from SA for us to read as we have been asked to do. Charlene has been learning French.
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  #204  
Old 07-09-2011, 12:08 PM
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Learning French for 5 years and she can't even speak it? Making excuses for her is making her look worse than she is. I think Charlene fans just need to accept that's she's pretty, she's nice and stop trying to build her up into something she's not.

beeld.com and news24.co.za has all the news you want from South Africa.

Here are some links to a couple of articles I mentioned, they need to be run through google translator. There are some errors but you get the gist of it. The first one talks about Charlene not given the chance to talk to the press even after they begged. Prince Albert did kiss her for the cameras. It also mentions that at times she looked uncomfortable and distracted.

The second article talks about Charlene meeting Desmond Tutu. Meeting with charities, she had a slight smile, had a few soft words but her signature has quite a flourish. They talk about her being surrounded by a ring of people from her inner cirlce(who are they?), she had to cut her visit short, cancel a third charitable meeting with the WWF. Organizers wouldn't say why Charlene was whisked away. A confidant said that Charlene would be flown back to Durban where she and Albert would depart for Monaco on urgent business.

Zuma laat Charlene-hulle 2 uur wag: Beeld: Suid-Afrika: Nuus

Charlene glimlag darem al word besoek geknip: Beeld: Suid-Afrika: Nuus
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  #205  
Old 07-09-2011, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by SandwichSheik View Post
Learning French for 5 years and she can't even speak it? Making excuses for her is making her look worse than she is. I think Charlene fans just need to accept that's she's pretty, she's nice and stop trying to build her up into something she's not.
I've heard her speak French you must have missed it. No one is making excuses for her, its obvious you dislike her with a passion and you don't even know her. Why is it so important to you that everyone sees the worst and not the good qualities Charlene does have? It isn't harming you that some wish to see good in a world full of hate. And sometimes a childhood dream can become a reality when a commoner becomes a beautiful Princess.
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  #206  
Old 07-09-2011, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by SandwichSheik View Post
Learning French for 5 years and she can't even speak it?
Apparently she understands it better than she can speak it - very common when learning a language. So she can understand the conversations happening around her. She does not speak the language well, I am also given to understand, but she has achieved some ability. Again, learning a language is not easy for some - it seems that may be the case for Charlene but she has certainly made headway and that's an achievement that should be lauded.

Diana not only dropped out of high school, she left the Finishing School in Switzerland early, too, in the midst of the school year. Diana worked as a nursery assistant - not a lead teacher - because she had no qualifications to do anything else. She did not have a choice because she did not have an education that would have made choices possible for her - but she did seek out work, and that is laudable. Diana was not fluent in Welsh and in no way could converse in Welsh. In no way did Diana put Charles to shame in the intellect department - it was one of the problems with the match - Charles is intellectually curious, Diana was not. As she herself said about herself - something about being as 'dull as a plank'? Not sure if I have that right - I do know she admitted to not being very bright by her own estimation. (In fairness to her, she was acutely savvy in other ways - very sharp when it came to managing her own image, for example). None of this matters, though, of course, except that you seem to have been implying that Diana's intellect was superior to Charles' and that Diana's 'education' and intellectual abilities better than Charlene's.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rosana View Post
I don´t want to start a discussion that do not correspond to this thread, but how do you know she was not smart? She put everyone around her to shame, especially her husband, with only 30 years.
As fas as I know she finished school in Switzerland, she spoke a little French, having lived there very little time, she could deliver a speeh in Welsh, she played piano, she was a good swimmer, made ballet and diving. She worked in a kindergarden. So, she had done something with her life when she married, only at 19.
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  #207  
Old 07-09-2011, 04:38 PM
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Originally Posted by LadyMacAlpine View Post
I've heard her speak French you must have missed it. No one is making excuses for her, its obvious you dislike her with a passion and you don't even know her. Why is it so important to you that everyone sees the worst and not the good qualities Charlene does have? It isn't harming you that some wish to see good in a world full of hate. And sometimes a childhood dream can become a reality when a commoner becomes a beautiful Princess.
Please post a video of her speaking French.

Who's full of hate? Why can't we be objective instead of being like you who tries to make excuse after excuse for Charlene. Why not just take what we see at face value? So far in defense of her you've made her look worse than she is.

What we know about her (..) she seems nice and has good intentions. We also know that she's not very bright going by her track record and her disasterous comments when she opens her mouth. They wouldn't let her speak in South Africa, her home country where she actually speaks the language. What does that tell us? By her own admission in the interview with 702 radio she wakes up, has coffee, checks her e-mail and starts going through the protocol files. She talks about there being a lot of protocol to learn about before the wedding and for traveling abroad. Then she checks on what Albert is doing then she spends her evenings at charity events. No mention of tutors or classes as you've bandied about.

You've also talked a lot about their relationship being an open relationship and how it's well known that he dated other women while he was supposed to be in a relationship with her. She has no money of her own, no job and Monaco is expensive.

How is that anywhere close to be a fairytale or a princess dream come true.
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  #208  
Old 07-09-2011, 09:21 PM
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While I agree that Princess Charlène could have used her time in Monaco better to master French by now and to take advantage of other educational privileges like private tutoring, there are a couple of points I would like to make:

• She is fluent in Afrikaans. Many years back I saw an interview with her on an Afrikaans TV news bulletin in SA, related to a swimming event she had participated in. As I mentioned before, speaking Afrikaans gives her an advantage to be able to communicate with Dutch- and Flemish-speaking folks too. (Sorry, I cannot find a link of this – it was a long time ago before she moved to Monaco.)
• The reason why she was 'not allowed' to answer questions from the media last week in SA is possibly because they (the media) can be very insensitive, and would no doubt have questioned her on her feelings about the latest scandal. It takes a very media-savvy person to deal with such a, erm, 'delicate' situation – and she certainly lacks skills in that department, admittedly.
• She does seem to be able to at least understand some French. In my own experience, while traveling in France, I was better off sticking to English because my bad, broken French did not go down very well. Imagine practicing your French in the media spotlight! I hope that she makes an effort though, and that her French will improve to a level where she would feel comfortable speaking it in public situations.
• Indeed, she can certainly not be considered as an intellectual. But the experience and know-how she acquired from many years of traveling internationally while competing in swimming tournaments – not to mention the dedication it takes to be an Olympian athlete – provided her with a different kind of skills set that will come in very handy.
• Although there's no black-on-white evidence that she has had cosmetic surgery, I believe that she has. But she was always pretty, and really didn't need it. Whatever her reasons, it was her choice. But she certainly isn't only pretty now as a result of it, as implied.
• I think (hope) that now that they're married and her role is defined, she will use her time better to not only be considered is Prince Albert's 'arm candy'... Apart from producing an heir she has to dedicate time to become fluent in French, enrich herself with knowledge in many other areas, build relationships, continue with her commitments to various charities, hopefully launch Monaco's first Fashion Week – all the while behaving like a worthy role-model and dress for/look the part.

For those of us who do like Princess Charlène and believe she has potential, it is important to not be oblivious to her shortcomings, as pointed out by SandwichSheik. She is certainly not the fairytale princess some make her out to be. But she also doesn't deserve some of the cruel criticism. I wish her all the luck in the world. She's going to need it!
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  #209  
Old 07-09-2011, 09:28 PM
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I think Charlene and Diana have a lot in common, certainly more than other Princesses. Diana was not a smart or intellectual person, when she dropped out of high school, and finishing school, she had no plan on what to do. From what I can tell Charlene dropped out because she felt she could better serve her time preparing for the Olympics. Just because Diana was good at manipulating the media doesn't mean she was somehow a smart person or in any way better than Prince Charles.
Both of CnD are blonde, blue eyes, pretty, younger than their husbands, and good dressers. Anyone who dislikes either of them will just harp on the bad things they have or haven't done.
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  #210  
Old 07-09-2011, 11:16 PM
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This discussion is quite interesting, but more so I can't wait to see how it will all play out for her. Her background as an Olympic medalist does show admirable personality traits, it takes a lot of discipline to get to the Olympics and win. Not all of us are meant to be intellectuals. I would think that in 5 or 10 years which she has been around Monaco they must have figure out she has the capacity to fill the role? The people of Monaco seem to have displayed much affection for her despite her inability to communicate in their language.
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  #211  
Old 07-09-2011, 11:52 PM
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Big deal she isn't speaking in French, as yet. She will. She isn't a Rhodes scholar, neither is Camilla. Charles isn't either. He is stuffy and expounds what he likes, knowledge or not. Elizabeth is a nice woman but not a scholar either. Charlene is an Olympic Athlete, takes great performance and focus. Her new sistersin-law, seem to like her, the local population seems to like her. She is doing her job, if one calls anything a royal does a job. She is lovely and stop with the cosmetic surgery thing. you have no validation and even so, so what.
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  #212  
Old 07-10-2011, 03:26 AM
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Originally Posted by COUNTESS View Post
Big deal she isn't speaking in French, as yet. She will. She isn't a Rhodes scholar, neither is Camilla. Charles isn't either. He is stuffy and expounds what he likes, knowledge or not. Elizabeth is a nice woman but not a scholar either. Charlene is an Olympic Athlete, takes great performance and focus. Her new sistersin-law, seem to like her, the local population seems to like her. She is doing her job, if one calls anything a royal does a job. She is lovely and stop with the cosmetic surgery thing. you have no validation and even so, so what.
Her not speaking French is not only a big deal but a demonstration of her lacking interest in her new country.
How do you know the population likes her? I read some comments of monegasques and they do not share your opinion.
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  #213  
Old 07-10-2011, 04:08 AM
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Rosana, I still agree with you regarding Charlene's tardiness in learning and practising the French language.
She owes it to the Monegasque people who have allowed her into their land.

(..)
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  #214  
Old 07-10-2011, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Victoria's Secret View Post
She is fluent in Afrikaans. Many years back I saw an interview with her on an Afrikaans TV news bulletin in SA, related to a swimming event she had participated in. As I mentioned before, speaking Afrikaans gives her an advantage to be able to communicate with Dutch- and Flemish-speaking folks too. (Sorry, I cannot find a link of this – it was a long time ago before she moved to Monaco.)

For those of us who do like Princess Charlène and believe she has potential, it is important to not be oblivious to her shortcomings, as pointed out by SandwichSheik. She is certainly not the fairytale princess some make her out to be. But she also doesn't deserve some of the cruel criticism. I wish her all the luck in the world. She's going to need it!
Thank you for that information supporting her knowledge of Afrikaans. Do you recall when the interview might have been? Year?

I don't think anyone except perhaps the younger members are oblivious to Charlene or even Alberts shortcomings. I agree she doesn't deserve the criticism she gets. The ignore button works great you can tune them right out.
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  #215  
Old 07-10-2011, 11:39 AM
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LadyMacAlpine, my guess is it must have been around 2002. The interview was on an Afrikaans TV news bulletin of the SABC, and although not a native Afrikaans speaker she seemed very comfortable. I remember this pretty well because I was based in Cape Town at the time. Thank you for reminding me of the ignore button!
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  #216  
Old 07-10-2011, 12:58 PM
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Everyone in Monaco speaks English. The whole language debate is getting very boring.
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  #217  
Old 07-10-2011, 01:16 PM
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Everyone in Monaco speaks English. The whole language debate is getting very boring.
And probably now all in Monaco will have to speak in english, because their new princess doesn't know the official language.
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  #218  
Old 07-10-2011, 01:35 PM
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LadyMacAlpine, my guess is it must have been around 2002. The interview was on an Afrikaans TV news bulletin of the SABC, and although not a native Afrikaans speaker she seemed very comfortable. I remember this pretty well because I was based in Cape Town at the time. Thank you for reminding me of the ignore button!
Thank you, and you're welcome.
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  #219  
Old 07-11-2011, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Victoria's Secret View Post
While I agree that Princess Charlène could have used her time in Monaco better to master French by now and to take advantage of other educational privileges like private tutoring, there are a couple of points I would like to make:

• She is fluent in Afrikaans. Many years back I saw an interview with her on an Afrikaans TV news bulletin in SA, related to a swimming event she had participated in. As I mentioned before, speaking Afrikaans gives her an advantage to be able to communicate with Dutch- and Flemish-speaking folks too. (Sorry, I cannot find a link of this – it was a long time ago before she moved to Monaco.)
• The reason why she was 'not allowed' to answer questions from the media last week in SA is possibly because they (the media) can be very insensitive, and would no doubt have questioned her on her feelings about the latest scandal. It takes a very media-savvy person to deal with such a, erm, 'delicate' situation – and she certainly lacks skills in that department, admittedly.
• She does seem to be able to at least understand some French. In my own experience, while traveling in France, I was better off sticking to English because my bad, broken French did not go down very well. Imagine practicing your French in the media spotlight! I hope that she makes an effort though, and that her French will improve to a level where she would feel comfortable speaking it in public situations.
• Indeed, she can certainly not be considered as an intellectual. But the experience and know-how she acquired from many years of traveling internationally while competing in swimming tournaments – not to mention the dedication it takes to be an Olympian athlete – provided her with a different kind of skills set that will come in very handy.
• Although there's no black-on-white evidence that she has had cosmetic surgery, I believe that she has. But she was always pretty, and really didn't need it. Whatever her reasons, it was her choice. But she certainly isn't only pretty now as a result of it, as implied.
• I think (hope) that now that they're married and her role is defined, she will use her time better to not only be considered is Prince Albert's 'arm candy'... Apart from producing an heir she has to dedicate time to become fluent in French, enrich herself with knowledge in many other areas, build relationships, continue with her commitments to various charities, hopefully launch Monaco's first Fashion Week – all the while behaving like a worthy role-model and dress for/look the part.

For those of us who do like Princess Charlène and believe she has potential, it is important to not be oblivious to her shortcomings, as pointed out by SandwichSheik. She is certainly not the fairytale princess some make her out to be. But she also doesn't deserve some of the cruel criticism. I wish her all the luck in the world. She's going to need it!
Again, every white person in South Africa can at least speak English and Afrikaans. When Charlene was in school in South Africa it was compulsory for her to learn both languages. English as a first language, Afrikaans as a second language or visa versa. Then by the time she reached standard 8 at the age of 15/16 that would be the time that you decide on what subjects you're going to keep through your high school career and what you plan to study at university. I was interested in law and my recommended subjects were math, history, accounting and typing/secretarial. I don't know what Charlene picked. To qualify for university admittance, you have to make math and two other subjects at a higher grade level. I assume it's similar to A levels in the UK.

While Dutch/Flemish and Afrikaans have commonalities, Afrikaans also takes from French and Portuguese. Modern Afrikaans also has a lot of slang, a lot of it coming from English. A simple Google search will give you tons of information on the differences in the languages and will also give you first hand experiences from native Dutch speakers talking about how it's hard for them to understand Afrikaans. It's easier for us Afrikaans speakers to understand Dutch. I'm pretty good with languages, I speak English and Afrikaans fluently, some French and even I had difficulties understanding my Flemish neighbor in Belgium.

Again please don't take one thing like Charlene speaks Afrikaans that means she can speak Flemish and Dutch and make it into fact. It will take her time and practise to do so. Dutch and Afrikaans has different grammar, spelling and to our South African ears Dutch sounds quite harsh. Dutch speakers also have a hard time understanding Afrikaans speakers because Afrikaans is spoken at a faster speed. You don't have to take my word on any of this, a Google search will help you out.


There's also no shame in being Albert's arm candy if that's what she's chosen for herself. While some of us might not agree with it it's her choice and I don't think she needs people on the internet making up these elaborate excuses for her.
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Old 07-11-2011, 01:56 PM
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Here's a question, Charlene had 5 years to improve herself, learn French and she did nothing of the sort.

What makes you think that she's going to start working on improving herself now? She doesn't need a college degree to be a princess but she can't even pull off the bare minimum requirements. What does it matter if she reads biographies if she can't give a decent interview without sounding vapid?

As for comparing her to Diana again, yes Diana wasn't the brightest and she was a high school drop out. Diana on the other hand lived in an English speaking country but made the effort to give a speach in Welsh, when she went on tour to Italy with Charles she spoke some Italian. She was far from fluent and her pronounciation wasn't the greatest but she made the effort. Diana was also able to go out and speak and interact with the people of the country she was a princess of. And let's not just compare her to Diana, how about the Queen, Prince Charles and Prince William who learnt French. How is Charlene going to do her duties in Monaco when she can't speak the language of her people? She speaks English and Afrikaans but the South African newspapers are saying that she seems uncomfortable and uneasy. If she can't get it right in South Africa her country of birth, where she speaks the language, how is she going to fare in Monaco or the rest of Europe?
Charlene is Princess of Monaco. If she wants further studies, no one is going to stand in her way. If she does not want further studies, she doesn't have to. It is that way for all of us.

University education is not for everyone.

She's going to do just fine in Monaco. Since she will do just fine, you had better build up your stash of straws so you can continue to clutch at them.
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